General Diet Plans and Questions General diet questions, support for various diet plans other than those listed below.

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Old 12-28-2011, 03:42 PM   #106  
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Good afternoon everyone
I just watched forks over knifes, and Dr Fuhrman on you tube, Great info.
Was very glad to see this thread. I am wanting to go more to a plant base diet, but I have a problem with getting rid of some of the foods in my diet, so I well go at a pace that I won't drive myself nuts with, and then drop the whole thing.

For the next week or so (until what processes food) I have on hand is out of the house and can get to the grocery store, I will be following vegan before 6 then go from there. Watched and read about it.

All of this is so interesting, and I for one was a deep believer in eating meat and cutting down on carbs. I love meat but welling to put aside my normal way of life and give this ago. I am also tired of counting this and that.

Had all my blood work done a few months ago and well have to do it again in about 6 weeks, so I well be able to compare (old eating new eating).
Right now at 53 the only thing I have issues with is low D and taking a high does of d once a week. 4 more weeks to go before going back to the doc.
also had a bone density scan and all is good there.

I am over weight current weight is 179.2 I put on 50 lbs in over a 2 year period and its really bugging me that I'm feeling way to old and moving like I am 90. Maybe this will be my key to getting rid of some of this weight and feeling and moving better.

So again I am really happy I found this thread, and looking forward to learning more and changing my lifestyle. 1 step at a time
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Old 12-28-2011, 06:55 PM   #107  
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Greetings everyone! I am "diet shopping" right now and I am a vegetarian so I am looking for a plant-based diet that my husband will also be receptive to ( he is not a vegetarian). I tried to read through everything but would anyone be willing to list some good books for must read, plant based diets?

I look forward to talking with all of you more. It looks like some amazing work is happening!

Christine
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Old 12-28-2011, 09:24 PM   #108  
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All of this is so interesting, and I for one was a deep believer in eating meat and cutting down on carbs. I love meat but welling to put aside my normal way of life and give this ago. I am also tired of counting this and that.
I really am enjoying this way of eating, perhaps because of not counting this or that, and eating when I get truly hungry, and stopping when satisfied (not full). Easy to say, hard to learn. At least for me. I believe I have finally found a diet that is both extremely healthy, relatively good to eat, and will allow weight loss. And I don't even consider it a diet, just how I now eat.

As to animal products, I still eat them. I don't do the 'till 6pm', but rather here and there during a day, or not. It has been my impression that the upper limit of suggested animal product intake is about 10% of calories. I would guess mine is about 15%, though maybe not. I do seem to keep cutting back. If I had to give up all animal products, however, I doubt I could stick with this.

I eat a bit of strong hard cheese grated on things occasionally, though not too much, and some chicken or turkey or fish, and rarely (Christmas day) a bit of nice beef. Not much, and not daily. I also make soups with chicken or beef broth just for the meat flavor - that really helps, especially if you can find good ones. I used to make my own, but Trader Joe's has a very good organic chicken broth in one of those box containers.

The only book I can recommend is Dr. Fuhrman's Eat to Live. It's the only one I have read - from the library. I also have watched various videos at YouTube as well - most of the names in the title of this thread have some there. Dr Fuhrman also has a blog with extensive articles and testimonials. You'll find it with a search.

Today I've eaten quite well. Throughout the day - Veggie/bean soup made with chicken broth (two bowls), a nice salad with lots of avocado, some fruit, and now a cup of hot cocoa.
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Old 12-28-2011, 10:06 PM   #109  
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Welcome surfnmom and christineen!

I really enjoy Michael Pollan's books. Pollan is not a doctor, nutritionist, or dietitian, he's a journalist. But that's what makes his books so appealing. He approaches food broadly by incorporating cultural, social, and health perspectives. He's a very in-moderation sort of person. Omnivore's Dilemma and In Defense of Food are both good.

In addition to my protein sources, lunch yesterday was soy milk, a banana, baba ghanoush (roasted eggplant dip with seasoning) and carrot slices. Dinner was mung bean dal (Indian-style lentils). Anyone who thinks lentils are gross needs to try dal. I could it eat almost every day.

I'm having a stare-down with the zucchini in my fridge right now. The last one I just sauteed in a pan with a bit of olive oil and spices. It was fine, but it's really a stretch for me to enjoy plain old sauteed peppers, zucchini, and eggplant. I need to figure out what else to do with it today before it goes bad.
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Old 12-28-2011, 11:17 PM   #110  
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Thanks for the book ideas!

Indiblue, I haven't tried it but I've heard of zucchini boats where you scrape out the inside of the zucchini and saute it with onion and spices. Fill up the two empty halfs, add a little vegan parm and bake it. Might be good...
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Old 12-29-2011, 04:13 AM   #111  
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I love this thread! I'm going to subscribe to it.

Okay - I was so fixated on calorie counting that I was losing, but slowly forgetting the importance of nutrients. That means: eating too much choco, cheese, bread, and lean meat. Basically, things with almost zero nutritional value and little color. I need to get back to being focused on plants AND calorie count. I wish I could just eat plant strong and lose, but I seem to have a natural tendency to overeat still - a problem I am working on.

I was reading through the past posts and one was from indiblue - ways to get your fiance to eat more veggies. I love this topic - I'm always working on this as well. My boyfriend definitely tends towards the meat, potatoes, bread, and dairy (those are his four major food groups). He is also slim, so doesn't think of nutrients. I have succeeded in getting him to crave a spinach/blueberry fruit smoothie after quite some time. Also, I don't make tofu everyday, but I have shown him that there are some interesting tofu/veggie dishes that are yummy. He also craves salads now. His mother makes the most basic, boring salad. Thus he thought he didn't like it. But, I mean, does anyone really enjoy a head of iceberg?

I think you can get anyone to eat more veggies. It all depends on good, innovative recipes. I once did a healthy, whole grain breaded eggplant dish in the oven. Super healthy and crunchy. We both loved it.

My Mother tended to just put out the can of green beans, peas, or corn - depending on the day, as I was growing up. As stated earlier in the thread, everything was white and brown! So, I never had an affinity to good veggies or fruits (if you were lucky, you ate a banana or apple a day). I never even craved them.

But, the good thing is, our bodies eventually learn to start craving the right things if we give it the right things. I think this also helps me not dread maintenance. If I were to lose on unhealthy calories, then I would constantly be struggling in maintenance - always limiting myself and measuring perfectly. But, with plants, they are so low in calories, you really don't have to count every gram. Lets just say, it is super hard to gain on broccoli and spinach and apples!

Anyway - hello everyone! Today I'm going to experiment with chickpea/brown rice burgers in the oven today. I found the recipe on martha stewarts 'whole living' website. She also does an interesting sweet potato hummus I'd like to try soon.

Indiblue: I thought "dal" was simply the hindi word for lentils? Or do you mean the larger lentils we typically eat in the west are not the best kind?

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Old 12-29-2011, 04:38 AM   #112  
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Welcome Unna! Glad you are joining us ^_^

I really love Furhman's WOE. Right now I'm not practicing it as much because I'm aiming for 80+ g of protein a day and I wasn't able to do it with just tofu, broccoli/peas, almonds and one cup of soy milk. I look forward to returning to it when I'm not lifting/return to maintenance calories.

Haha, glad someone can relate to my struggle of getting an SO to eat fruits and veggies. My fiance has great portion control... it's just that it's pizza and macaroni and cheese he's controlling haha. Sometimes he's down for a good salad, but not always. He loves sliced carrots dipped in baba ghanoush, which I've had around recently. Sweet potato fries (just baked in the oven with salt and pepper) are some of his favorites. Soups are usually fine- roasted red pepper and cream of broccoli. And he LOVES sliced eggplant breaded and covered in marinara, similar to the eggplant you mentioned.

I guess all in all he does alright. I guess he just likes his veggies in small amounts (like in soups), or roasted/sauteed, which I really don't like. Different strokes for different folks!

Sorry, I mean lentils prepared Indian-style (with tomatoes, cilantro, onions, and all the spices). Dal is the word for the actual dried lentils (what you'd look for in the grocery store) and it's also the word for the dishes you prepare with lentils (what you'd order in a restaurant). I actually am not sure of the relative size of lentils here versus the US. I just know I need to learn how to cook different varieties before we move back to the US in a few months, I will seriously miss it otherwise!

Christineen Thank you for the recipe! I've wimped out and decided to make it into a zucchini/bean dip instead. I'm trying to learn to love sauteed veggies though so I will try to make it soon... it's literally the only food (besides black olives) that I don't like!
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Old 12-29-2011, 11:33 AM   #113  
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Good morning all
Yesterday went very good. after 6pm I had my cream in coffee and mixed in 2 cups spinach in my Alfredo noodles TV dinner. I never ate spinach except in a green smoothie and was surprised that it was good.

jansan would love to get the eat to live book, Have been to the website looking.

indiblue haven't heard of Michael Pollan and well look into his books as well.

I only have all the low carb books lol.

I have been looking around and doing a lot of reading and watching you tube vids

I did notice a lot of the vegan and vegetarian recipes have sugar, flour, oil. I was really surprised. I did come across oat milk and rice milk which I am going to try today.

re-watching forks over knifes. Spent a lot of time at the engine 2 site. I basically trying to figure out what is except-able (eating wise) Im leaning more toward the starch/plant based diet. For now will still stay with the veg till 6 as that for me is a good learning and changing slowly to perhaps all plant diet, I'll just have to see were the road leads

Can't wait to shop my list is growing

Have a great day everyone
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Old 12-29-2011, 12:28 PM   #114  
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I did notice a lot of the vegan and vegetarian recipes have sugar, flour, oil.
There are vegans and then there are Vegans. Not all are created equal, and some are considered unhealthy. It's been my impression, at least my Fuhrman impression, that the things you mention are not encouraged and considered unhealthy.

The taste of 'sweet' is often achieved via whole natural foods such as dates. (I still use splenda). And ground flours are generally not advocated by any of the plant-strong diets I've read about. Expressed oils such as olive oil are also 'not on the list'. (I currently use 2 tsp olive oil in some salads.) But, depending on which plan you follow, oils in the form of nuts and seeds, and also avocado, are encouraged/accepted, within limits (it depends on if you want to lose weight).

There is a lot to absorb in the beginning. When I started I only had seen a pbs special with dr fuhrman, and did not know most of what was advocated. I did know I liked what he was saying, but when I started that very day, my emphasis was on greatly increasing all vegetables and beans, and decreasing meats and dairy. And I did pretty well. I was losing weight, was less tired, my bp went down noticeably, and I felt great. And for the first time in a long time, I had hope. And now several months later, things are still getting better.

Over time my eating has transitioned more in line towards 'Fuhrman', who IMO, is the best of the bunch in terms of being on top of the latest research. But I don't do it near 100%, and likely never will. And other authors have merit too. IN fact, any of the Plant-strong approaches are better (IMO) than the standard way most Americans eat, even when on diets.

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Old 12-29-2011, 12:30 PM   #115  
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Originally Posted by surfnmom View Post
I basically trying to figure out what is except-able (eating wise)
I know how you feel. It's a bit confusing at first to figure out how to reconfigure a diet towards a plant-based one.

I'm a bad example right now, as even though I eat a ton of grains I'm intaking fish, dairy, and whey protein. But when I was on a more Furhman-esque diet it looked like this:

Bfast: None

Lunch: Veg meal-- fresh and cooked veggies. (ex: bowl of 200 g of lettuce/spinach with 150 g chopped up veggies in it, drizzled in balsamic, AND 2 roasted beets OR 1 bowl baba ghanoush- roasted eggplant- with carrot sticks and minimal oil OR 300 g roasted pumpkin with cinnamon)

Snack: 20 almonds + 5 dates OR banana

Dinner: Protein meal. (ex: tofu stir fry with more veggies, small piece of fish with side of veggies and pomegranates, chickpea burgers with tahni sauce and no bun, dal, lentil chili, etc)

Dessert: Fruit, soy milk latte or soy milk hot chocolate.
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Old 12-29-2011, 12:48 PM   #116  
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Today was pretty good. Here is a run down, should anyone like to read about others' everyday eating (ca. 1500):

b/l: 4 figs, smoothie (blueberry/kale/banana/flaxseed oil/soy milk)
snack: persimmon
banana
d: pumpkin puree soup, whole grain bread roll, fresh parmesan cheese, cottage cheese.

And coffees sporadically throughout the day: with a splash of organic whole milk, small teaspoon honey.

How I felt: Really great, although I was obviously a bit fruit-heavy today. I think my moods and cravings are slowly improving. My stomach is a tad bit bloated - but its not too noticeable. We are walking to the movie theatre tonight on the other side of the city, so jogging was foregone today - just did some cleaning. One thing I noticed is that I'm obviously filling up on fewer calories. Normally, I would have had 1700 by this time.

indiblue: Indian food is my absolute favorite. I've never been to India, but have learned the names of lots of indian dishes from friends. One thing I noticed about traditional indian cooking is the extreme amount of oil or ghee that is used as a base for the dishes. In my opinion, it is entirely unnecessary and ruins the health the dish could have offered. I'm not sure why so many indians overdue it with the fat - they seem to have no idea how many calories are in that 1/2 cup oil.

I think their use of lentils and chickpeas as primary sources of protein is actually quite forward thinking. I wish the west could see how normal it is to eat beans without the ham. I'm not sure how much longer you are going to be there - but watch out, I may just show up at your door and expect the full-tour!

What do you do there all day? Are you working too? Do you hang out with other indians or americans? I'm so jealous!
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Old 12-29-2011, 03:50 PM   #117  
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jansan
I totally agree that any plant based diet is better then the current American diet To much processed foods. Yep it is confusing in the fact that who do you believe anymore when it comes to healthy eating. one side of the table tells you we were caveman hunter gathers and on the opposite side is the plant base diets. And both have the science to back them up. I.. at this point am confused as who is right.
I do know for a fact That I can not live low carb. I do love meat but I cant live off it. When I try I start craving salads and fruit, So that there is telling me something.
I feel kinda lucky to have my blood work done so I will be able to see if there is a difference. Granted I have all good numbers so I well have to go on how I feel.
And yes I do want to get rid of these extra pounds. My big abuse is deserts and junk snacks and butter (real butter)

indiblue Just watched a few vids of Michael Pollan on youtube. I do like his ideas about basically getting back to basics of eating before all the processed foods hit the stores and drive thurs took over real estate.

In fact I like all the stuff I have been reading and watching. I will just have to give it time and trying new things to replace some of my junk habits.

Unna I had the bloats yesterday also, the added fiber got me. And my calories were down from my norm, just changing out some of my food choices.
I do like to feel full and that takes a lot. But seeing the diagrams on how the stomach worked was a AHHHHA moment for me. yes 400 calories in veggies and fruit well make me feel full and tell my brain enough, but the same 400 calories in chips is telling my brain where's the rest lol So I am learning and that's a good think

kk that enough jabbering for one day and thank you all for the great info, keep posting it as I for one look forward to reading it.
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Old 12-29-2011, 07:34 PM   #118  
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Short Mark Bittman article in today's NYTimes:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/01/ma...uxKw9fYZbMHePw

"No Meat, No Dairy, No Problem"
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Old 12-29-2011, 10:21 PM   #119  
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surfnmom One of my favorite websites for recipes is http://blog.fatfreevegan.com/. She has a lot of Eat to Live recipes which don't call for lots of processed flours and oil. I have really liked most of the recipes I've tried from her.

Mark Bittman's How to Cook Everything Vegetarian is a great guide for learning about new vegetables, spices, and legumes that are less common in the SAD.

Unna Yes the oil is insane here. We have a housekeeper (like most middle class families) who cooks 1x a week. I've been fascist about how much oil she is allowed to use in dal, chole, etc. I know she goes over it though. It's a common problem among many foreigners who do everything they can to limit the amount of oil their housekeepers put in food- hide the rest of the oil, only give them one tbs designated for oil, etc. The requests are all ignored. One time our housekeeper was really excited and told me she didn't use ANY oil at all for one dish. I was so happy until she excitedly told me "I used butter instead!" as if that was a very clever way of still making the food taste good but complying with my request. I have stopped pursuing the conversation, haha. Anyway, all that to say our homecooked Indian food is much less oily than in restaurants, but it's still a bit more than I'd like.

I agree with you that the many ways of using beans and legumes is terrific. I also think Indians do a better job than any other cuisine of seasoning vegetable. I just love palak (spinach), gobi (cauliflower), (okra) bhindi (and peas (mutter) seasoned Indian style.

I work here, as a consultant for organizations here and in the US. Work ebbs and flows depending on what projects I'm doing. Right now it's in a lull but will pick back up again when I have to start writing some reports next week. I work from home which gets a little dull, but the whole idea of working in coffee shops hasn't really picked up in the city where I live so I make do

Will be here until July. Let me know if you come through! Or if you come through later and want tips and travel advice.

jansan Thanks for the link! I'm off to read it right now...
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Old 12-30-2011, 04:32 AM   #120  
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surfnmom: I also see the dilemma - whether one follows a "hunter-gatherer" diet or a plant-based diet.

Personally, I believe the hunter-gatherer paleolithic diet is somewhat exagerrated. For example, there are still some communities in the world hunting and gathering (for example, some eskimo/indian tribes in northern Canada and Alaska/Russia) Due to the cold climate, their diet does contain a large amount of meat they have hunted. However, their diet is also largely made up of potatoes and other root vegetables that grow in the wild.

And in warmer climates, of course, varieties of wild plants/vegetables/fruits are abundant.

What I do agree with in regards to the paleolithic diet is that the human has not had enough time to adapt to handle the large amount of plants, particularly wheat, soy, and corn, which began in the age of industrialization.

But, a plant-based, whole foods diet does not typically include a large amount of wheat, soy, and corn - as it eschews processed products.

In that way, I think the two diets can be linked.

However, then you still, obviously, face the meat dilemma. To be honest, I don't think meat is "toxic". It can carry harmful hormones/antibiotics. But meat, in itself, is not toxic.

The quantity of meat one eats, from what I understand, can have harmful effects on your body (heart, colon, for example) and the production of hormones. This is where the paleolithic diet seems to forget moderation - as meat is their main staple.

To be continued!

I have to run for now......

Someone else chime in -
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