3 Fat Chicks on a Diet Weight Loss Community

3 Fat Chicks on a Diet Weight Loss Community (https://www.3fatchicks.com/forum/)
-   General Diet Plans and Questions (https://www.3fatchicks.com/forum/general-diet-plans-questions-10/)
-   -   Plant Strong (not necessarily vegetarian) Fuhrman McDougall Pollan Ornish Bittman etc (https://www.3fatchicks.com/forum/general-diet-plans-questions/247081-plant-strong-not-necessarily-vegetarian-fuhrman-mcdougall-pollan-ornish-bittman-etc.html)

indiblue 11-14-2011 09:49 PM

Plant Strong (not necessarily vegetarian) Fuhrman McDougall Pollan Ornish Bittman etc
Welcome! This thread provides support for anyone following- or interested in learning about- a plan-strong diet.

Everyone, including vegetarians, vegans, flexitarians, and omnivores, is welcome to participate in the discussion!

Some of the specific plans some of us are following include:

Dr. Furhman's Eat-to-Live Program: Plant-centered: calls for at least 1 lb fresh vegetables, 1 lb cooked vegetables a day, plus soy/beans, nuts, fruit and soymilk each day.
McDougall Diet: Low-fat, high carb plan focusing on nutrient-dense complex whole grains and vegetables as the center of meals.
Forks Over Knives/Esselstyn Diet: Plant-based, whole-foods diet focusing on vegetables, fruits, whole grains, legumes.
Michael Pollan: NOTE: Pollan is not a nutritionist or doctor, but a journalist and author who advocates general eating "guidelines," such as his famous "Eat Food. Not Too Much. Mostly Plants" mantra.

No need to participate in a specific program- many of us are tweaking, modifying, and combining plans to create sustainable, healthy lifestyles.

So come chat about your experiences, ask questions, swap recipes, and share support!

indiblue 11-15-2011 09:51 PM

So I've been using a lot of recipes from Fat Free Vegan and came across this one:

Chickpea burgers with Tahini Sauce

The burgers are good but the sauce is AMAZING. Even my fiance gobbles up any sort of vegan burger I put in front of him as long as it has that sauce! Haha.

I also did a lentil burger last night with tomato paste as the "glue" instead of egg, diced onions and garlic, oats for bulk, and Old Bay seasoning. YUM!

Suzanne 3FC 11-16-2011 01:02 AM

For anyone interested, ETL is not just a vegetarian diet. There are variations in the book for those who still want to include lean meats and animal products in their diets :) We are also not a hard-core support group and we encourage reasonable tweaking if you need it. You'll still eat a ton of healthy vegetables that offer so much more nutrition than many or most other diet plans offer!

Indieblue, I love the Fat Free Vegan Blog! I've been happy with just about every recipe I've tried. I noticed that her recipes from her own blog are better than the ones on the main site. There are really just two food blogs that I turn to time and time again. FF Vegan, and the Gluten Free Goddess. GFG isn't ETL but many of her recipes will work. She offers some pretty amazing quinoa recipes.

jansan 11-16-2011 10:13 AM

As mentioned in the previous thread here (see link below), I've been following my version of Eat to Live for about 3 months and not only am feeling great, satiated, but am losing weight without much pain.

I first heard Dr Joel Fuhrman on a pbs special, and what he said made a great deal of sense to me. And from that day, I began implementing my version of his approach.

If you didn't see his pbs special but are interested in what he has to say, there is a similar talk he gave posted at You Tube. It's about an hour long. There are also books, which most libraries have.

YouTube video of Dr Fuhrman. There are other, much shorter snippets of him there.

I have more to say, but my time is limited this morning. But as gov. Ahnold said: I'll be back. ;)

blkbarbie25 11-16-2011 06:06 PM

i plan on doing my version of this program until newyears day ...
its the basic plan with 2 servings of gluten free grains perday ...

rdw1 11-16-2011 08:09 PM

I do a variation of Dr.F's plan... A combo of his and McDougall. I do a vegan diet but eat more starches... Plant Strong! :)


Today I made the Hippie loaf from the Happy Herbivore and it was delish! The only thing I added was a bit of worcestershire sauce to it and I prefer mine patted out into burgers to get more crisp...so good! I recommend you try it!

Look forward to chatting with yall on this thread :)

indiblue 11-16-2011 09:48 PM

Suzanne thanks for reminding us that ANYONE is welcome on this thread- most of us are not following the E2L plan to a T. Most of us are modifying and tweaking.

jansan Thanks for sharing that YouTube clip! I watched almost all of it and was surprised at the following points Furhman made:
- His no-holds-barred adamant rejection of Atkins
- His harsh criticism of saturated fat, as the prevailing opinions these days is that "fat doesn't make you fat"
- His harsh criticism of dairy as a food group.
- His criticism of an animal-product-based diet. In In Defense of Food Michael Pollan (a supporter of plant-based diets) argues against the opinion that animal products are linked to obesity and health problems; he cites numerous traditional societies who ate mostly meat (those in Africa and those at high, cold elevations) and didn't have the same rates of heart disease and obesity that America does.

I think he made some great points, I was just surprised at how adamantly opposed he was to animal products and Atkins.

I did love how much he emphasizes the nutritional density of vegetables. Most people only eat 10 calories worth of spinach (a small side salad) and think anything bigger is just overkill. I love how he challenges our notion of vegetable portion sizes.

barbie glad you are joining us! How is the challenge going?

rdw Thanks for the recipe! I like veggie-loafs :) I'd love to hear more about your modified McDougall/Furhamn hybrid plan! I don't know much about McDougall at all. Could you post some sample menus?

jansan 11-16-2011 10:05 PM

Nice to see more people participating. :)

Thanks indiblue. I need to read the Pollan book I think. I don't want to be a vegan, nor even a vegetarian. I need to find my own happy medium. And I'll tweak it till I do. In the end I want to be able to flavor some my foods with meat, but not down chunks of it anymore. A good example would be something like a stirfry with lots and lots of veggies with a bit of chicken.

I think some of these authors - Fuhrman, McDougall - are offering solutions of last resort to people with major health problems who do not want to continue taking meds, nor have surgery. And it works for a great many if you read the success stories. My guess is doing it less than 100% will still yield extremely good results. Less than perfection is what I am aiming for. Right now, I'd guess I follow the guidelines most days around 80%.

What I do know is I'm eating more vegetables than I ever dreamed, and feeling great. And losing weight without pain - either physical or emotional. I feel satisfied and not deprived.

jansan 11-16-2011 10:09 PM

opps dup...

jansan 11-16-2011 10:31 PM

From a post in the old thread:

Originally Posted by suzanne
I'm in it for heart health Long boring story - I've been very concerned about my health lately due to a heart condition. (I've had it for 25 years but I'm getting ready to turn 50 and realize I'm not as invincible as I might have hoped )

I don't have any specific conditions that I know about, but I am in my later 60s, and don't want to hit 70 like a bug hitting a windshield.

I am fat - about 220, and while physically active, full well know that being a short female at this size is not conducive to a long life. I too was not feeling invicible and feared something bad any day. Not a good way to live. So when I heard Dr Fuhrman on pbs early one morning.. it was like hearing a solution.

I watched Forks over Knives and learned about Dr. Esselstyn and also watched the Dr. Gupta's special on CNN with Bill Clinton and learned he followed Esselstyn's plan.
I think the CNN special is still available to see at their site. I did not see it. At the time even watching something like that was too frightening.


I bought his book but it is far too restrictive for me to follow I know from experience that if I try to force a drastic lifestyle change that I won't be able to stick to it, and I have found that easing into a new lifestyle works better for me.
Same here. I eased into it so slowly, most would not have recognized that I was following any plan. All I had was the verbal directions from the pbs special. I have since checked out the book from the library.

Dr Fuhrman does have a good site. Lots of stories and articles to read. Unfortunately his forum is expensive, and I've heard not very good. Too many food ****s. Shudder. Not good for someone with an 80% goal. :lol:


At one time, I had the same thought about ETL. My food patterns evolved over time as I eliminated first land animals then sea animals. By the time I finally tried ETL, I was ready and it was easy to follow.

I think that if go back to ETL for a while that I can gradually evolve into Esselstyn's plan. Right now I eat too much oil (actually not much but Dr. E allows none), more grains and starchy vegetables than I should, and I do eat some sweets. I eat mostly vegetables but my balance is still all wrong. ETL should help me get it back in check and then I hope to keep evolving towards Esselstyn's program.
You might want to also check out Dr McDougalls program. Though his books are harder to find. I think he has a new one coming out. His belief is most large human populations with good health have followed a starch-based diet. He allows more grains and starches such as potatoes, and the results seem to be the same. Still low fat,vegan. There are some good video talks of his available on computer. Can't tell you where exactly, but I could refind them if you like.

Suzanne 3FC 11-17-2011 02:25 PM


I think the CNN special is still available to see at their site. I did not see it. At the time even watching something like that was too frightening.
Jansan, I'm glad to know the CNN special "The Last Heart Attack" is online. I just watched it again, it was good to have a refresher. (commercial free, 45 minutes long) I understand it does sound frightening. I've avoided even thinking about the topic because in my opinion, I felt that if I needed bypass surgery that I would just have to die. I'm uninsured and underemployed, so surgery just wouldn't be an option. However, as frightening as the information in this documentary was, I walked away feeling very empowered because I learned that there is a lot I can do! I have more control than I realized :yes:

I think one of the best things about diet plans like this - for everyone of all ages - is the focus on real food, and foods high in vitamins and phytonutrient content. I'm guessing all of us feel so much better when we eat large amounts of vegetables, even with different ratios of grains, healthy fats, and even lean meats.

Maybe we should rename this thread to something that includes not just ETL but similar diet plans?

wife2abadge 11-17-2011 03:43 PM

I think renaming it "plant strong diet support" would be appropriate. I've been trying to follow a combo of Dr F and Dr McDougall.

jansan 11-17-2011 04:47 PM

Title suggestion:

Eating to Live (Fuhrman, McDougall, Esselstyn, Ornish, Pollan, etc)

Or whatever names that would inform people of the gist of the thread, and that it's not just one narrow plan.

My eating currently is also a combo of Fuhrman and McDougall *******ized by JanSan, ...and whoever was talking on the last video I watched on YouTube.

Opps- Another starred-out word, lol.

Suzanne 3FC 11-17-2011 07:25 PM

I wish we had more characters for the titles! I edited it a little, wish I had room for more but I think it gets the point across :) I considered adding a snippet to Indieblue's post but I'm only used to editing when someone has been bad so I didn't feel comfy jumping in there :lol:

I ran out of fresh leafy greens last night and I've been under the weather with the flu and didn't want to go to the store today. So most of my veggies came from the freezer today. I don't feel complete without some fresh spinach, it's become such a habit! Even my strawberry banana smoothie tasted too sweet without the spinach.

jansan 11-17-2011 09:34 PM


Originally Posted by Suzanne 3FC (Post 4111875)
I wish we had more characters for the titles! I edited it a little, wish I had room for more but I think it gets the point across :)

I think the title looks good. I am book-marked straight into this thread, so when I looked on the 'general plans' index page, I was surprised to see it as long as it is, lol. But good job. I think you covered the most important things, especially the names since there is also a McDougall thread here too. And Pollan is a popular author. And Fuhrman was on pbs very recently. People who are familiar with the general program recognize the main names.


I ran out of fresh leafy greens last night and I've been under the weather with the flu and didn't want to go to the store today. So most of my veggies came from the freezer today. I don't feel complete without some fresh spinach, it's become such a habit! Even my strawberry banana smoothie tasted too sweet without the spinach.
I just went to costco and trader Joe's yesterday and my freezer and fridge are stuffed to the gills with veggies. It's amazing how many I go through. I also use lots of frozen ones. It's just so easy to pour already washed and cut out of a bag. I have a tendency to not eat as many raw veggies as I would like. Perhaps that's something to concentrate on the coming week. They are in the fridge waiting...

I've done fairly well today, except for lunch. I was in a rush for an appointment, didn't have anything fast to eat, was hungry, so just grabbed some salted cashews. Guess that's not really so bad, but my 'official' weekly weigh-in is tomorrow, and salt never helps. Oh well.

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