As to everyone knowing and having the resource to lose weight. I don't buy it. If I had had the resources when I was younger I would have done it. If I had stacked the bc and followed a low carb diet I know that I would have lost weight and kept it off. I know it because I have always known my enemy, hunger. I just never knew how to control it and prevent it from controlling me.
I had desire when I was younger, and it was often enough a powerful enough weapon to help me win battles with Hunger, but never the war. I had lost most of my desire and most of my hope that it was possible by the time I found the weapons I'm now using, and I think it is reflected in how quickly I am losing. If I ate what I am eating now when I was 20, I would probably be underweight. My metabolism, through aging and dieting is ridiculously low. Twenty, even ten years ago, I would have told you it was impossible for a person my size to eat what I do and not lose weight. What did I know?
My concern is that with enough failure, desire and motivation can be easily trampled. I'd like to get to people while their motivation and desire is strongest, because the infomormation part can be easily shared. the desire and motivation, that's up to each of us individually. We've got to get to kids early, before they try their first crash diet. Because I truly believe the crash diet does more to fuel obesity than it does to weight control.
So, I think that you are saying, and please forgive me if I'm wrong, that the reason you could not lose weight, is because of your extreme hunger, correct? Not that your body was simply incapable of shedding pounds. But because of your extreme hunger, you ate more calories then your body burned and therefore you couldn't lose the weight? So for you, it boiled down to finding something to curb the hunger? Am I correct? That's interesting. For me, that was not the case. Well, helloooo, we're all different. I ate even when I WASN'T hungry. But that's a whole other thread...... . Finding something to curb my hunger was just the tip of the iceberg.
Anyway, I see you once again talking about desire and motivation. And I agree with you 100%, you're so right, it CAN easily get trampled. So they're STILL not enough. And that's why I believe commitment plays a huge role in weight loss too. HUGE. IMO, commitment takes one a lot further then motivaton and desire. A lot. Because once you make that commitment, that pledge , that vow, THAT'S what ensures you, that gives you that "no matter what attitude". You've made the lasting commitment, you no longer rely on the motivation or even the desire.
So many factors. So, so many.
Last edited by rockinrobin; 07-13-2008 at 11:07 PM.
.......Anyway, I see you once again talking about desire and motivation. And I agree with you 100%, you're so right, it CAN easily get trampled. So they're STILL not enough.
But isn't that the point of the discussion? If your desire and motivation crumble at the first hurdle then surely you didn't "want it bad enough" in the first place?
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And that's why I believe commitment plays a huge role in weight loss too.
I agree, but the commitment comes after the "want it it bad enough" stage, it is one of the ensuing processes that are fuelled by the initial desire.
But isn't that the point of the discussion? If your desire and motivation crumble at the first hurdle then surely you didn't "want it bad enough" in the first place? I agree, but the commitment comes after the "want it it bad enough" stage, it is one of the ensuing processes that are fuelled by the initial desire.
Oh I agree. Surely. For me anyway, the "want it bad enough" stage DID happen first. Upon hitting THAT stage though a few things happened. The first being that I made a binding commitment to do whatever it takes (using healthy measures) to get me there.
I still hold that motivation alone is most definitely NOT enough to "get you there". Motivation peaks and wanes and is not always around when there's chocolate and cheesecake around. So you need something to fall back on. That's where the commitment comes into play. Because when you want that fill in the blank so badly, but you've made yourself a promise not to, well then it doesn't matter that you want it. Because you've commited to a better, healthier life. You've commited to get the weight off. And eating that so and so at that particular time won't get you to your goals, hopes and dreams.
Another thing happened for me. I made the decison to lose the weight. Okay. Now what? I got a little panicky. How was I going to GET what I so badly wanted, what I so badly desired? I needed to figure out an intelligent way to get me there. So that's when I went over my obstacles and devised a plan to follow. A food plan first and foremost, a way of dealing with social occasions, weekends, emotional eating, the whole kit and caboodle. I told you, I was very methodical. I couldn't just say -BOOM- I want to be thin so badly and it would happen. Lord knows I had tried that in the past and lo and behold, duh it DIDN'T. I had to make it happen.
And then I got incredibly, incredibly EXCITED. I didn't plan it that way obviously, but that's what happened. I was EXCITED because I knew, I knew deep down that if I STUCK with my plan, that an end to my misery WAS indeed in sight.
Last edited by rockinrobin; 07-14-2008 at 07:08 AM.
This is EXACTLY, word for word, what I tell people when they ask me what the 'secret' is to my weight loss.
The desire to be thin has to outweigh the desire to eat the bad stuff. Without that, there is no hope, because you will never stick to it.
Oh Rosbia, that's why I LOVE this site! So many people who we can relate to.
I thank AJ for starting this. He made me think about this long and hard and those words came to mind.
I think that line may now be my "definitive line" to use as well. It used to be the "want it badly enough" line, but I think this one might describe it better and hopefully without hurting anyones' feelings.
I'll tell you though, I really, really used food for soooo long in so many wrong ways that when I finally got to the "my desire to be thin OUTWEIGHED the desire for the food at this point" stage, I had to really, really, REALLY DESIRE to be thin. So yup, oh G-d, I gotta say it - I really wanted it, to be thin, badlly enough. Oh gosh, I may have to use the combination of the 2. Yikes.
Another thing, I don't think I would have known this, had I NOT lost the weight. The "wanting it badly enough", and the "desiring to be thin outweighing the desire for food" stage. Or rather I should say, that I didn't know that that was the "secret" until I actually got to that stage. That's a big thing right there, if you ask me.
Last edited by rockinrobin; 07-14-2008 at 07:27 AM.
....... A food plan first and foremost, a way of dealing with social occasions, weekends, emotional eating, the whole kit and caboodle. I told you, I was very methodical. .........
That's precisely how I did it too.
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my desire to be thin OUTWEIGHED the desire for the food at this point...
...and that's precisely what I say when people ask me how I did it. It all boils down to this one crux: as you are about to devour that candy bar, pause for a moment just before eating, and ask yourself what you want more - the candy or the slimmer figure. At that point, there can be no excuses, because if you go for the candy, it will be a conscious sentient decision, preferring candy over weight loss, and in that case................you can't want it bad enough.
It is possible to lose weight and still have some treats though.
Last Wednesday was our works summer night out to celebrate the end of term. I went there in a new floaty shorty summer dress and collected lots of compliments.
However I ate garlic mushrooms for starter, pizza for my main course, AND tiramisu for dessert. With cream. And chocolate sauce.
I made the decision that I was going to enjoy my night out and enjoy my food - and I did. It doesn't mean that I don't still want to be slim - but I wanted to enjoy my meal.
Next day - yes I was up a bit (not as much as I expected however) and the day after I was back down again - and I still lost a pound for the week!
So it is completely possible to have treats and nights out so long as you think of the bigger picture. Don't think of the odd candy bar or 3-course meal as a failure - it's just a sidetrack on the road to being slim and healthy. It takes a tiny bit longer if you choose to take that sidetrack and look at the scenary. But so long as you don't turn around and start going back the way you came, you'll still get there in the end.
LOL - I wonder how many more analogies we can fit into this thread.
So, I think that you are saying, and please forgive me if I'm wrong, that the reason you could not lose weight, is because of your extreme hunger, correct? Not that your body was simply incapable of shedding pounds. But because of your extreme hunger, you ate more calories then your body burned and therefore you couldn't lose the weight? So for you, it boiled down to finding something to curb the hunger? Am I correct? That's interesting. For me, that was not the case. Well, helloooo, we're all different. I ate even when I WASN'T hungry. But that's a whole other thread...... . Finding something to curb my hunger was just the tip of the iceberg.....
So many factors. So, so many.
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SO many factors. And that's what constantly amazes me, is how DIFFERENT many of our circumstances are, and yet most of the dieting and weight loss research spends little time investigating those differences, instead trying to find some universal diet that is "best" for everyone. I think because of the factors of obesity are so diverse, the treatments have to be as well.
All those factors could be used as excuses, and I'm not meaning to go there. I'm not saying that I couldn't have lost weight AND maintained it if I had more rigorously endured "tooth and nail" dieting and might have been able to achieve a normal weight, if I had been willing to give up my masters' degree or time with my family or any of a thousand things that competed for my time and attention.
I've many times felt that "if I had nothing else to do," I could lose weight more succesfully. And as far as it goes, that's probably true. We all have limited resources and many things pulling at us for our attention, but it is our choice as to which get the attention. And my career and education had more pull than weight loss. I don't even completely regret that, as I can't say that I would trade my education and job experiences for weight loss. If I had done so, I would be a different person than I am today, so how can I regret that.
As for hunger being my largest obstacle, I would definitely say, yes. Curbing the crazy hunger for me was the largest obstacle. I've known since I was small that I was VERY different from everyone in my family and everyone else I knew. I was ALWAYS thinking about food, almost every waking minute, and often waking in the middle of the night as well.
I've always liked low calorie, healthy food (very few foods I didn't like). When I was younger, I was fairly active (not as active as I needed to be, but not a complete couch potato either). Portion control has always been my problem, because of my hunger having had no "off" switch.
I've always had better luck with fasting (no food at all) than with portion control. Mindful eating doesn't work for me, because my hunger signals don't work right. Full is my stomache hurting (and sometimes still then I felt an indescribably "urge" to eat). Well "fasting" doesn't work for the long haul, because at some point you have to start eating again.
Looking back, I think it was my response to high carbohydrate food (even healthy carbs).
I cannot describe how differently I felt since changing the bc and the carb content of my diet. I feel like I've been let out of food jail. I can go about my day and forget about food for hours. I've never, never, never been able to do that. I'm not sure if I ever went more than a single waking hour in which the thought of food did not at least cross my mind, and while dieting, it was probably more like 5 minutes.
Even as a kid, I knew that I was even different from most other fat people. My mom and grandma were fat (as adults, they had not been during childhood) yet I was the only one OBSESSED with food.
When I was in college and first read of the genetic condition of Prader Willi Syndrome, I thought that except for the mental ******ation, it sounded so much like me (these kids are so obsessed with food that they will become extremely obese if the food in the house is not locked up). I wondered whether there was a similar genetic condition that occurred without the ******ation (I still wonder, as I was adopted, and don't know much about bio-parents).
I can't tell you how much my life would be different if I hadn't been constantly obsessed with food. Or even how much it has changed since I found out. It's only been a year since I started the bc and carb changes. I need to be alot more committed than I have been. But to be honest, it has been such a liberation to NOT have to think about food in order to maintain my weight that it is hard for me to get the motivation to pay attention to it in order to lose weight. That probably makes no sense at all to anyone who hasn't been through it.
I really do feel like I had a lion with me (like those lap band ads, where the lady has a big lion wandering the house with a chain around its neck labeled hunger - after her surgery it turned into a kitten). Well, my lion wasn't just calmly wandering around my house (or my head), it was a rabid, angry lion roaring in my ear during most of my waking hours (and often even my dreams). The lion is pretty much not only tamed, but in a coma, unfortunately if I eat too many carbs he comes out of the coma and rears his ugly head, but at least I now have power over him.
I watched an Intervention program last night. One guy, Ben was addicted to DXM (OTC cough medicine) and another Josh, weighed 576 lbs. - both "legal" addictions. The intervention guy said that food addiction was similar to heroine addiction, in that many people used food to "numb" themselves.
I'm not sure that I really used food intentionally that way, but after having experienced the effects of narcotic pain medication, I can say that there are some similarities.
I've found that on a reasonably low carbohydrate's I definitely feel more alert and more in control of my behavior, more "sober" if you will. In many ways, I feel like a completely different person. I can't believe that food controlled mostof my life during the last 35 years. The time I didn't spend eating, I spent thinking about eating, whether I was dieting or not.
I think for most people, desire, commitment, motivation, and hope/belief are probably what they had to change in order to lose weight, so naturally what they would think most important. For me, it wasn't any of those things that I had to change, it was two very tangible, physical changes. Birth control hormones and carbohydrates. Who would ever guess it could be so simple? Certainly, not me!
Too bad I destroyed my metabolism looking for what was right under my nose.
Hindsight and all that. I'm not blaming doctors, or anyone else on my obesity. But, I'm not really blaming myself either. And maybe a large part of that has to do with how real that "lion" of hunger was to me. I knew him, and I knew I wasn't imagining him (or if I did, I had one heck of an imagination). With the low carb dieting and bc change it's literally what I would imagine a schizophrenic would feel like if the voices or hallucinations suddenly disappeared. "Poof" you're now a different person.
I do feel like Cinderella, poofed into glass slippers. And all of the health benefits that losing the 50 lbs have initiated, well the "ball" hasn't ended yet.
Just getting caught up on some of the posts. Interesting input!
Thesusanone - good for you! Hope you are having some success! I know I had to change my attitude and adjust my behavior to get to where I am. Good luck.
I think it is possible to want something so bad, you do anything to get it. Unfortunately, some of the paths we choose to get something have dire consequences - starving ourselves to be thin, stealing, wanting companionship so badly we nearly go bankrupt buying a person's affection. In the past, I have made many attempts to lose weight. I barely ate, and exercised strenuously, to the point I felt weak. Did I want to lose weight? Yes, but I decided the path I chose to get there wasn't worth it, and always gave up. Maybe I just bought into the hype that if I ate a little and exercised a lot, I would get thin, not taking into account emotional eating, etc.
I think motivation is what gets you started, then you have to actually do the work. People ask me all the time how I'm losing weight, then make excuses why they can't do the same thing. I just found what works for me - I count calories (too bothersome, they say), weigh myself every day because it keeps me accountable (too "obsessive"), walk or jog every day, exercise to DVDs when the weather's not nice (no time, too boring, or they have to have a buddy to do it with). I am single, so they assume it must be easier for me because I don't have to cook for a family. They think I have more time to exercise because I don't have a man or kids - I have one full-time job, one part-time job and meanwhile I'm trying to have some kind of life and my time's limited too. I can go on and on, but my point...do they want it any less than me? I don't know, but they may not be ready to make the changes needed to get the outcome they want.
As for wanting something badly enough, I know I've mentioned before that I decided at 290 pounds to become a cop. The motivation - the reason for losing weight - was there. This was something I thought of doing on and off for years...but I don't think I was ready as I was in January of '07 when I started to do the work to get there. I started exploring strategies to see what would work - counting calories, exercising every day (whether I felt like it or not - except when I was sick or in pain), lifting weights. Two years ago, I could barely walk...now I can jog 30 minutes without stopping (thanks, "Couch to 5K"!) and can lift 50 pounds to my chest. Still a long way to go but I'm getting there. I started doing volunteer work (with Citizens on Patrol), paying close attention to how I conduct myself (gotta have a good rep!), because I want this badly. I may never get in, but I'm trying. My point here is that I'm motivated, and now, as opposed to my twenties, I'm at a time in my life where I'm ready to do the work to get there. I've tried many times to lose weight, but it seems like now, I am ready I had to give myself pep talks. I've had to physically get up from a table and go somewhere else because I was too tempted by what was being passed around. I've counted down the minutes to the end of an exercise video I was doing because I just wanted to get it over with, but I had to get my exercise in for the day. I had to change my thinking...if I had a bad situation, I'd reach for comfort food, I had to learn to take my aggression out by speed walking or something. And I'm not perfect...I had my TOM this past weekend, and I couldn't shovel enough food in my mouth. Or so it seemed. I had to tell myself that I just have to get back on track.
Now, I don't want to offend anyone or anything, or imply that they're not "ready" if they haven't lost weight. I've been there...I'm 37 now and if I had the same mindset when I was younger as I do now, I would never have been overweight. It's hard. I don't know what got me to change. I have a co-worker who's also trying to lose weight, with little success. We started around the same time, with about the same amount to lose. I just tell her not to give up. It's hard. You may not always win the battle, but eventually, you can win the war.
. Finding something to curb my hunger was just the tip of the iceberg. 
