Kinda of makes me think about airplane seats too. What should we do with those?
Everyone wishes they were bigger, even normal sized people. No one wants to sit next to an obese person either. (I wouldn't want to sit next to me!) Is it fair to charge these people more for another seat? What if they don't have the money on them? What if there is no other seat, should they be bumped?
Personally, I think the airlines shouldn't have to accommodate larger sized people. It's really great customer service if they do, but forced? No.
This is a question that I think is impossible to answer with just a yes or no answer. Instead, it's better to separate into a few different issues:
- Discrimination based on someone's weight is NOT acceptable. Jokes about one's weight are not acceptable, and defining beauty on weight alone is not acceptable.
- A greater focus needs to be placed on healthy eating and exercise. That includes massive re-education on what healthy eating includes. Schools are doing a horrible job at this and many parents just don't know how to cook healthy food on a budget (because it's freaking hard to do!!!). Gym is being cut from schools, and where I live at least, there aren't a lot of public parks and/or safe areas to exercise in poorer neighbourhoods.
- Urban food deserts NEED to be dealt with. I've lived in the inner city and can tell that are definitely areas where people have very, very limited access to fresh fruit, veggies, and meat.
- Doctors need to be better educated. That need to stop focusing on BMI and be retrained to test body fat percentage. They also need to help their patients learn what they CAN do in terms of exercise with physical ailments. So often you hear "oh have a knee injury so you can't do XYZ." That's fine and important to say but they also need to help patients found exercises that they can do within their physical limitations.
- Restaurants need to take a hard look at what they are marketing to consumers and companies need to do the same in terms of prepacked food. There are just too many additives that don't need to be there and I almost feel it's a race to see who can include the most sugar in products, when it's really not needed. Something has to be changed here but I'm honestly not sure what the best approach is.
In terms of accepting overweight individuals and equal members of society, well, I'm 100% for that. But what I don't accept is how many weight loss myths are perpetuated by our society, how difficult it can be to have access to healthy foods/exercise, and how low of a priority exercise has taken in modern society.
guacamole mentioned this but I also wanted to add that I think a real effort needs to be put forth to explaining and understanding the psychological issues behind weight gain. I used to be a really bad emotional eater and if I would've understood that better a long time ago it might have said me a lot of weight loss effort. There are others who purposely (or subconsciously) gain weight to hide themselves after some form of abuse. Others might have depression or eat to deal with anxiety.
What I'm trying to say is that access to group support and/or counselling should be available (yes through a comprehensive health care plan) to deal with these issues. It's going to be A LOT cheaper to provide counselling for eating related issues and help someone overcome then than paying for weight related health issues in the long run. I definitely know of a lot of people (and I put myself in that category at my highest weight) who WANT to change but feel hopeless or overwhelmed by the process. I don't think tough love is the answer at all in these cases because many times there is already the desire there but not the knowledge. Using tough love is more likely to lead to unhealthy eating habits when a person doesn't have the proper education first.
I think this is a very difficult question to answer.
I think right now we have too many extremes. The fat acceptance movement refuses to accept the fact that health issues can arise from obesity and shuns any doctor who suggests weight loss for an individual, while society as a whole shuns fat people in general and lowers them to the bottom rung of society. We need a middle ground here and it's quite difficult to find.
All overweight people are not about to keel over and die, but I think it would be remiss for doctors to completely remove weight from the equation. Then again I think they rely on it too much to diagnose issues that people have that may be caused by other things. There are healthy and fit fat people—I was one—just at there are healthy and fit thin people. I've seen people twice my size run longer than I can, after all.
Overweight folks should not be ostracized by society either though. As far as I'm concerned it is none of my business as to how much someone weighs. Nor is it anyone else's business as to how much I weigh unless I wish to disclose that information. Granted, problems arise when size causes disruptions, such as on the case of an airplane or an amusement park ride, but I still don't have a clear opinion on this matter and I'm not sure there is a right or wrong answer for dealing with these circumstances.
My opinion has really changed on this matter since losing weight. Through a lot of the fat acceptance blogs, etc. I was able to feel better about myself, but I also thought that weight loss was just impossible. It was also "bad" according to those people. However, since losing weight I feel so much better, that quite frankly it's hard to ignore the difference. I'm not talking about being more confident in my skin—I am better in that sense—but I feel so much more healthier and energetic. I can physically do so much more than I could just a year a go. I also don't want to sit around anymore, when I didn't mind doing that before.
It's really hard to pinpoint where the causes lie, but the fact is that a large portion of our population is overweight and obese. There has to be a reason as to why this is happening. After all, if some people were just meant to be fat, wouldn't the rates of obesity simply stay stagnant for the most part? Some cite the fact that it's more acceptable to be overweight, but I think it's just common human decency to accept individuals for the way they are.
i am all for people having confidence and i know some obese people who have sky high confidence and i truly respect that and wish you could bottle it. Its one thing to accept who you are and another to neglect and be in denial.
I think its a hard subject as it depends on how big a person is .....once it get life threatening or could cause ill health it should be looked at simply for the persons well being ( this having known and been close too two people who have passed away young due to being obese)
But on the other had if someone is happy and there health isnt majorly at risk then who is anyone to judge x
I don't think being extremely obese should be seen as acceptable, however I do think it would be a good thing for society to be a little more understanding and perhaps more sympathetic (for lack of a better word) towards people with weight problems. For a lot of people (like myself) it's not as simple as just "stop eating unhealthy foods!" There are emotional issues tied in with food...emotional eating, stress eating. Things like that are not easy to overcome. While I don't doubt that there are tons of obese people out there who just eat because they like to eat and don't give a crap about being healthy, I would imagine that there are just as many obese people out there (or more) who hate being obese, who would love nothing more than to be thin and healthy, but struggle because it's not always so black and white. A lot of people (not all, obviously) who have never had weight/food issues have the attitude of "well just stop eating and you won't be fat anymore" because they can't possibly understand what it's like to struggle with weight and food. While I don't expect them to understand (because really, how could they?), I wish more people did, or at least tried to.
Also, I know a couple of people who are very large, and have the attitude of "I'm fat and I love it!" and don't seem to put effort into losing weight. But under the surface, I know (because they've confided in me) that their attitude is a defense mechanism, and deep down they hate how they look, but are struggling with changing.
So the bottom line for me is, I don't think that the emphasis should be put on size necessarily, it should be put on being healthy in general. That is the most important thing.
what does that mean exactly "is it acceptable"? should we make it illegal? force fat camps on people? or just ridicule them and let them know they aren't acceptable? Cause really, I don't notice it being so acceptable now.
Being a little overweight is not really the automatic early death sentence popular opinion would like you to believe. Lots of thin people are unhealthy, eat crap, smoke, drink, and dont exercise. Lots of overweight people eat healthy and get a little exercise. Most of the time I think people going on and on about other people's "health" are just using it as an excuse to criticize others.
Well I have read articles on both sides of the fence. The fat acceptance crowd really does make good points about not judging people and discriminating against them and I agree with that b/c you don't know someone's special challenges. Some injuries and medical conditions make it very painful to even move or almost impossible and it's a shame those people get judged every day for what others perceive is not wanting to make healthy changes. I have a lot of compassion for those people b/c [U]it is [U] really hard to lose weight after injury or illness when you simply can not do much physical activity.
On the other hand, it makes me sad to think that someone might give up on living healthier and having a good fitness level b/c they just don't care. I still don't think they should be judged b/c some people have even more deadly habits and we're guaranteed our persuit of happiness, at least in the U.S., even if it isn't the healthiest thing.
I don't buy into the obesity costing us lots of money line of thinking. I know it ups the cost but so do many unhealthy habits that people have. I personally think that like smoking or drinking, it's used as a "reason" to up the costs for consumers, seems logical enough but money is still made and that's the bottom line, companies making more money.... But then, I don't really carry a torch for villianizing smokers, or alcoholics, or people who are getting treatments for STD, or gym rats who injure themselves b/c they are hooked on the gym....it's collective and we all take our chunk out of that collective fund to some extent whether you are getting your 3rd knee surgery or getting your gallbladder out. No one lives an ideal life. Everyone needs health care at some point and it costs money.
I don't really care too much about what a person's weight is. I think health and fitness should be the focus b/c a healthy, fit person that's a little overweight is going to be much better off than an out of shape person that's in the healthy weight range.
I agree with a lot of what 4STAR said, so I won't repeat it all. I have never held someone's size against them for any reason, whether big or small (my DH is very thin; only 120 lbs with his clothes on). I judge people by their personality more. You can be a very good looking person on the outside but be a very ugly one on the inside, and visa-versa for that matter (very beautiful on the inside) ...
I have a lot of physical challenges myself, so it is upsetting when I am judged for my weight alone. I walk with two canes; some days I can walk better than others. I just do my best each day, eat as healthy as I can, and choose other exercises that I can do.
An large city emerg nurse once said that she sees more average size people die in the ER than big people; and that people should just live their lives the best they can and enjoy it. Lots of slim people have bad health habits (ciggies, alcohol, drugs, junk food); and I eat better than many of them. It is sad & insulting how people just assume that I don't eat healthy becuz of my weight or size (or assume that I don't care).
My skinny husband doesn't eat as healthy as me, and eats almost twice as much. Recently, a man made a comment while we were in the grocery store; and I was fuming (nicely though ) becuz what they don't realize is that my skinny husband eats a lot of food and most of what's in the cart. Grrr ...
Anyhow, I think people need to mind their own business; and stop judging and discriminating against people becuz of their size or whatever. We truly don't know what challenges & struggles these people are facing in their daily lives that led to the problem in the first place. What they really need is compassion, support, and kindness so they can heal, become healthier, and fully enjoy their lives ...
Last edited by Justwant2Bhealthy; 03-16-2012 at 11:56 PM.
On an individual level I think if self-acceptance is your only alternative to being downright miserable about being fat then go right ahead. However if that acceptance means you resolve not to try and do anything at all about it then it's as negative as being miserable, if not moreso.
I hate the idea that slim = good and fat = bad, but from a health perspective extra weight does often have negative implications. It's a fine line to tread between promoting healthy weight and vilifying fat people.
PS: No offense intended by using the word 'fat' to describe being overweight - I know it's a sensitive issue.
I'm really uncomfortable with telling anyone else what he or she should think about his or her own body, and even more uncomfortable with telling them that they shouldn't accept themselves.
My house is glass. So is yours. Have some kindness.
amen. especially since I haven't met that many people who are accepting of their bodies not matter what their size.
I did think "society is destroying itself" because of this reason strikes me as big time hyperbole. I could think of about 100 ways society is destroying itself that I'd put in a priority before it, but I think the weight issue is easier for people to deal with (ie it strikes many as a "no-brainer" that fat people should lose weight to be healthier, and so less a burden on themselves, their families and society; and in reality the issue as a whole is much more complicated as others have pointed out).
Last edited by dragonwoman64; 03-17-2012 at 01:21 PM.
This thread is by no means intended to be disrespectful to anyone. I am just wondering peoples opinions. This comes after reading an article about how "society is destroying itself by becoming more accepting of overweight/obese individuals". Do you think that it is okay for so many to be fat and they should be able to do what they want, or do you believe that by accepting obesity as more of a "norm" now a days, that we are in turn helping with the struggles in the health care system and encouraging those to be overweight since it is slowly becoming more acceptable. Thus, putting less pressure on those to lose weight?
First of all, I agree with the others who have said that it's not acceptable to be fat in this society (American). So, I don't think we're quite yet at a place where "it's okay for so many to be fat".
Second of all, I highly doubt that there are many people who are obese who are genuinely happy with their bodies. Like the above poster said, there are very few women who are happy with their bodies and a growing number of men who are also unsatisfied with the shape of their bodies. Again, an indication that our society isn't very accepting, period, regardless of whether it's towards obese individuals or chubby ones or overweight ones or skinny ones (even too skinny is seen as unacceptable).
Third, there is a bigger issue in our society which is not at the individual level. If it were up to me, I wouldn't be overweight. ****, I'd be at 130 lbs and freaking happy about it. But I'm not. It's not for lack of trying. I've done what other people think I don't do, which is exercise 6 days a week, strength and cardio, eat whole foods, take supplements, and I'm still weighing in at 163 lbs. The reason why? Because I have a metabolic disease (PCOS) that prevents my body from losing weight "normally." The incidence of PCOS and other metabolic issues have risen in the last thirty years. Where is it coming from?
Lastly, I think our food corporations (the fact that there are even agricultural corporations is terrible!) are NOT interested in our health, but rather in making money for their shareholders or in the case of the private companies, for the owners/family of that company. They are not interested in making sure that I am getting my vitamins and getting all the fiber and nutrients that I need -- they are interested in making a quick buck. If it comes from my addiction to sugars and fat, no problem! They'll take it! Add to that the local government's lack of interest of developing more parks, eliminating gym class from the schools, making streets too car friendly and not pedestrian friendly, combined with the whole push for surburbia, rather than developing town centers... Man, it's no wonder so many of us are overweight.
In my opinion, the fat acceptance movement is a way to handle the overt discrimination that exists in our society. But I think there are very few folks who genuinely like the idea of being obese. I think most would welcome being healthy and being at a weight that allows them to do what they want to physically.
I think there is a psychological component that has to be addressed and while American society is more open to therapy than others, this should be covered (absolutely RUNNINGFROMFAT) by our insurance companies, with no limits on coverage. Holistic medicine should also be included, as well as gym memberships and other healthy pursuits. This whole concept that a doctor can only prescribe you a diet pill is ridiculous.
Lastly, I think our food corporations (the fact that there are even agricultural corporations is terrible!) are NOT interested in our health, but rather in making money for their shareholders or in the case of the private companies, for the owners/family of that company. They are not interested in making sure that I am getting my vitamins and getting all the fiber and nutrients that I need -- they are interested in making a quick buck. If it comes from my addiction to sugars and fat, no problem! They'll take it! Add to that the local government's lack of interest of developing more parks, eliminating gym class from the schools, making streets too car friendly and not pedestrian friendly, combined with the whole push for surburbia, rather than developing town centers... Man, it's no wonder so many of us are overweight.
In my opinion, the fat acceptance movement is a way to handle the overt discrimination that exists in our society. But I think there are very few folks who genuinely like the idea of being obese. I think most would welcome being healthy and being at a weight that allows them to do what they want to physically.
I think there is a psychological component that has to be addressed and while American society is more open to therapy than others, this should be covered (absolutely RUNNINGFROMFAT) by our insurance companies, with no limits on coverage. Holistic medicine should also be included, as well as gym memberships and other healthy pursuits. This whole concept that a doctor can only prescribe you a diet pill is ridiculous.
Amen! Like I said above discrimination is never ok. BUT what I see as the much bigger industry is how messed up the food industry is and that there is no support in terms of health care (all the misinformation, lack of coverage of gym memberships/support groups etc). Fixing these things would do a lot in terms of health care costs. Even if it didn't bring everyone to a "healthy" weight, I'm pretty sure it would DRASTICALLY change everyone's health levels, which really should be the aim.
I think it's okay to love yourself, but I don't think accepting that you're fat and saying, "I think I'll just stay like this the rest of my life" is okay.
I feel this way because of the health issues that come with being overweight. I also don't know anyone who is fat and is being really honest with themselves is okay with it either.
re:
) becuz what they don't realize is that my skinny husband eats a lot of food and most of what's in the cart. Grrr ...
