Wow, great thread this week!
 

Gotta make this *real* quick since I'm up to my eyeballs this morning...

Mel, Meg, and Colleen are making some great points. As for me...I don't know if I have an "eating disorder" per se - I just eat too much unless I CONTROL myself. Dunno if any of you are watching Dr. Phil's "Weight Loss Challenge" - but the 13 folks selected - WOW they all have BIG issues (BTW haven't read the book yet - I'm #1 on the hold list in our library system...). I'm sure that even if I was at my heaviest weight, I wouldn't have been selected since I really don't feel I have any major head stuff going on...no childhood traumas (other than being FAT), no sexual abuse or any kind of abuse for that matter. The only thing I can put a finger on is my parents putting me on my first diet at the age of 7 - and my three slender sisters getting to eat whatever they wanted. I truly believe that being told I COULD NOT HAVE "____" (insert food of choice) made me desire it all the more and turned me into a nighttime sneak-eater.

Something I still fight today - whenever Jim has a gig or is recording and I'm home alone the first thing that comes to mind is "I'm alone! what is there to eat?" I have to QUELL that desire and YES it is a struggle, especially at night - during the day I can always do something else - go out to the stables or the mall, for example. The best things I've been able to do at night are to turn off the TV, take a long hot bath, brush and floss my teeth, and settle down in bed with my journal, a good book, and my two kitties :) For some reason I CAN'T eat in the bedroom...

Have you checked out the website www.somethingfishy.org? Pretty good site about eating disorders...Personally, I have the binging down pretty well, but never could purge...it just stays in me and turns to FAT.

And of course y'all know my thoughts on competition dieting...or situational motivation in general. Like Meg said...once the competition or occasion (wedding, prom, etc.) has passed...how do you STAY motivated? Just like Mel said - if you want to stay away from a raging eating disorder - or want a better chance to keep the pounds off permanently - stay away from the comp and pre-comp dieting, the crash diets, etc. Losing weight slowly as I've advocated for a long time now maybe isn't as fun and interesting as losing a great deal of weight in a short time, and definitely not as impressive to others (you know...your friends, acquiaintances and co-workers who still read those magazines with The Crash Diet of the Week on the cover) but isn't it better to lose weight ONCE AND FOR ALL, rather than losing the same 10-20-30 pounds over and over again?

Back to yesterday...

Mel - I have actually only had Sunday brunch at the Ahwahnee but some friends of ours told us the time to go and EAT there is during their "Vintner's Holidays", "Chef's Holidays" or the Bracebridge Dinner that is held during Christmas which was started by Ansel Adams back in the 30's I believe - tickets for Bracebridge are practically impossible to get - they have a lottery system in place and you have to apply a year in advance, so I'm told...

Salad Dressing - when I'm at home I actually do the same thing that Colleen does - get a salad at Draeger's, add my own chicken and salad dressing (my absolute favorite is Girards Light Champagne Dressing - 60 calories per 2 tablespoon serving), put the lid back on the salad container and SHAKE IT UP!!! When I eat out, I order the dressing on the side and do the ol' dip and stab...and there ya have it.

Back to work ladies!

Hi LWL! I'm back, got in late last night and don't know if I'm tired or coming down with something, but I'm not feeling right. I see there's lots of reading to catch up on here! So I just may lurk for the week.

We had a great time, some rough sailing, but all in all it was pretty kewl. I will say it was the first time I've been at the marina that I didn't feel self-conscious about my size.

I did finish reading Dr. Phil's book, and need to go back for review, and do some thinking and writing. I did note what you said, Mrs. Jim, about not having any head issues, and from what I took away from the book, you don't have to have any head issues. Just a one time excuse to overeat to compensate for something else, and it sticks as a bad habit. That alone can do ya in. SO for myself, I'm beginning to wonder if maybe it's too easy to blame head issues instead of something else like environment or learned behavior from a parent or sibling. That's what I have to think about! The people on the show are pretty much extreme cases.

I have felt for the past few months that perhaps I was developing an eating disorder because I have been so focused on food. But I realize that I have to be focused because I am in the early stages of change and need to be conscious of every thought and action when it comes to food, for now, until the new habits and best choices really kick in. I know I am not toally there yet! But I would say I'm at 95% when it comes to exercise. What I really need to do is take daily quiet time for meditation, and I'm adding that to my Thanksgiving Challenge as of today.

I'll have to look for the Girard's Light Champagne Dressing. It's now on my list.

Have a safe and healthy day/week!

dip

Well...I just happen to have a photo of me and my three sisters taken shortly after the Stone Age - I had just turned four from the date on the photo (1966!) If memory serves...and it often doesn't - I'm the one on the far left, then my two twin sisters who were age 2, with my oldest sister on the far right (five years old at the time...we were all November babies).

Wish I had a seven year old photo but you can see I wasn't *that* much bigger/fatter than my sibs...

Hey ladies - have just a minute or two, and just wanted to share that I had my bf measurement done today, and I'm down another %! I'm in the 20's finally - woo-hoo! I'll be sure and change my signature.

Decided to take things easy this week - still eating my 6 meals, but eating more carbs for lunch and dinner than usual. Next week will be back on BFL with a vengence - going to try to eliminate as many processed carbs as possible.

I've noticed that you gals don't seem to eat any brown rice, is that correct? I'm not really a salad person, especially not in the winter, and so I'll have to come up with some veggie ideas to eat with my meats if I can't base the meal off of brown rice or ww pasta.
Cindy

Quick update on me:

Havent yet been back to the gym, no real good excuses so I wont even bother. Just havnet done it.

Food has been so-so. I am getting my protein in tho. I know I overdid it on carbs today. Will do better tomorrow.

I met with my new trainer today and he seems like a good enough guy. He's been doing this a long time and really wants to make sure its WORKING for me, and is totally obsessed with proper form. I am really stoked about getting started. Im seeing him early next week to do the flexibilty tests etc. He's going to do a bf% measurement but I DONT want to know the numbers. I'll find out how much Ive lost in 6 months :)

Im still trying to decide which gym to join. The cheaper, less equiped school gym, or the nice new clean and totally stocked gym 5 mins walk from my house. Augh!

Overall Im a bit stressed as Ive got an exam on thursday which I havent studied enough for, and Im trying to figure out how to pay for my gym membership.

AUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGH :censored:

**ahhh also PMS time. probably accounts for my lack of enthusiasm! hehe**

anyhoo, hope you're all doing well. Well done Cat on getting into the 20's! Hope to be joining you soon!

*HUGS* thanks for listening :)
Tidey ;)

Wow - great discussion on the eating disorders. When I posted my thoughts last night, I wasn't even considering disorders to the degree that you mentioned, Mel - thanks for adding that to the discussion. I, myself, *have* purged in my past - if it were less unglamorous, I may have had serious issues with bulimia, but fortunately, it was such a horrendous ordeal when I did it, that months would go by before I'd consider it again.

Cindy - way to go on the BF%!!!

Karen - how cute you guys are in that photo!

Ilene: did you try out the EDT workout yet? I do my third one tonight - felt really great after the last two!

I'm off to eat my chicken and rice - gotta fuel up for workout! ;)

Meg: that line about Dr Phil is so true. It wasn’t until I was totally disgusted with myself that I stop shovelling junk down my throat and starting educating myself. The mental and emotional pain was huge – overbearing actually.

Robin: what is this new Dr Phil book? Can you give me a title? I want to search for it over here. ‘Stop making excuses’ is what got me going on my first fatloss journey.

Dip: great points!

Cindy: I don’t eat brown rise but that’s because I am on a low carb diet. Brown rice is a good choice for a carb though.

I agree with Mel in that some eating disorders are diseases and some are just ‘issues’ or ‘baggage.’ I also agree that exercising like a maniac is probably not normal but I don’t think there is a problem with logging and tracking food at all similar to Meg’s idea. Let me explain that further though. I am an accountant and so I track things for a living. The reason I track things personally like my money is that I want to be accountable for what I do with my life and that includes what I spend. If I can bother to take the time to record all my expenses and incomes etc so that one day I can achieve the goal of being wealthy what the difference with tracking food so that one day I can be as lean as I want to be? I don’t see any differences at all and thus I don’t see that it’s obsessive in any way. There are many great things that happen when you track your food. When we shop now we only buy what we are going to eat and so we rarely waste or throw food out. That’s good for us and the environment. When you plan your food you can take a list to the supermarket and thus save time because you get what you need and don’t spend hours aimlessly wandering the aisles. Not focusing and controlling what I eat is to me like going and spending all the credit on my credit card. That’s the way I view it anyways….

I am doing well personally – back on track. I cooked up a bunch of chicken last night so I am all set for the moment. I did a chest & abs workout last night which had new exercises in it so I am feeling it this morning. I am getting the wobbly fat on my tummy so hopefully there is going to be a fat drop soon.

JC

Thought-provoking discussion indeed. I'll have to go over it again once more.

Mel, I completely know what you mean about substituting one eating disorder for another. I also don't know if I'll ever be 'cured.' Sometimes, I think that I should just give dieting up and just let myself be, but then something kicks in and I regard that as self-abandonment. Alternatively, I would like to be ultra-vigilant with both diet and exercise as that would make me somewhat satisfied, but that's like tightrope-walking to me. Just one little wrong step and I go crashing down. It seems like I am either losing weight or gaining it, never maintaining. :(

John Stuart Mill once said it would be better to be Socrates dissatisfied than a pig satisfied. I guess for myself the question would be: Would it be better(less worse) to be insousciantly out-of-shape or to be lean and shapely but have to forever watch the diet and exercise? I wish I could find a happy medium!

I think that I do suffer from depression; it comes and goes. My GP wanted to prescribe anti-depressants, but the side-effects put me off them. Has anyone had any experience?

Going out to lunch today; will try very hard to eat clean! I'll post what I ate later on.

Good Tuesday Girls :wave:

Eating disorders ~~ I am like Karen, I think, because I don’t particularly have an eating disorder per say, but often, and that’s obviously too often, I will fall off the healthy wagon and eat too much and even eating too much of a good thing, will screw up all the work I have done the rest of the week.... I was not overweight as a child... (BTW cute pic Karen) ...The only thing that I remember bother me as a child was that because I was literally big boned, everyone would comment on my how wide my shoulders were... My mom would have to buy a larger size to fit my shoulders and hem the dresses about 6 inches so that they would fit in the length, also the waist always had to be taken in... I remember visiting an aunt and uncle when I was young and I always coming back in tears because I felt fat, my aunt always made comments, but I really can’t remember what they were, my cousin was very tiny too she still is, and she’s a great person... I also eat when I am bored; I eat if I have not planned... Karen I eat when hubby gets called out late in the evening, I worry because he works for the gas company and that can be very dangerous... Planning I have discovered for me is key and I have only really discovered this in the last year or so, mainly from hanging around here... :D As a teenager I did try laxatives, and you know I think that’s my mom’s fault...:lol:... I laugh at this because when we were kids if we didn’t poop every day my mom would give us Agarole (sp) OMG I hated that stuff... Of course not knowing any better she would have never thought about fruits and veggies... The only fruit and veggie I remember as a kid were apples in the fall and bananas of course; veggies were canned carrots and peas... OMG this is soooo bringing back memories, and they honestly aren’t bad ones at all it’s just that Mom didn’t know better... I started dieting when I was 14 or so but I started reading magazines and absorbing anything about healty and I still love magazines... I can barely go by a news stand without buying a mag, but now I have the internet and that’s even better ‘cause it’s free!! I was the one who introduced my family to steamed brocoli and cauliflower at 18...

Colleen ~~ I did do the chest workout on Monday and really liked it, and I am very sore tonight, even my arm pits!...:lol: I’m looking forward to the leg workout tomorrow... How did you like the leg workout?

Laurel ~~ Good luck with lunch, we know you can make the right choices!

Past my bedtime... gotta go...nite-nite...

JC.....it is The Ultimate Weight Solution: The 7 Keys to Weight Loss Freedom . From what I understand it focuses more on the behavioral issues behind weight loss, and is light on the nutrition side. But, behavior is an important aspect of weight loss, which is why I am thinking of picking it up.

Robin :cb:

Ilene - I am STILL recuperating from the leg workout! But to be fair, I had kind of laid off of lower body workouts for a while because it interfered with my running & spinning (was always too sore to participate in either!), but I had forgotten how much I *LIKE* feeling this tightness/soreness in my calves and hamstrings! ;)

What an excellent thread this has been on eating disorders and food obsessions. There's much to be learned here.

Personally, at this point in my life, I don't consider as obsessive the tracking, the gotta-eat-every-three-hours, the logging, the weighing and measuring, the ordering-everything-on-the-side, the careful stocking of my shelves so I'm never unprepared and the 101 other things I do for myself. They are simply actions that I take to maintain my weight, my physical health and my mental health. They are becoming as familiar to me as brushing my teeth ... and as unremarkable. Put another way, I've quit beating myself up mentally for taking care of myself. And as several others have said, all of this has given me a sense of control that I only dreamed of for several years. Incidentally, because it has all become a habit, it has ceased to feel like a dominating force. I just do what I have to do and move on with my day.

Another thought: I've tried to divorce food from "moral values." Today, I look at food as food. A piece of cheesecake, for example, is just that -- a piece of cheesecake. It is not a symbol of debauchery, licentiousness or homicidal tendencies. Likewise, a head of broccoli is simply a green veggie. It does not represent virtue or beauty or honesty. So what, you say? Well, that means that eating the cheesecake does not reduce me to a three-toed sloth or an ax-toting maniac, just as eating the broccoli does not elevate me to some kind of holier-than-thou status. It's all just food, and I'll eat what I want, when I want. This was a liberating discovery, by the way, to learn that I, too, could eat cheesecake WITHOUT self-loathing. It also made "falling off the wagon" kind of difficult since it was harder to get up on that wagon when it's all just food.

It's late, and I think I'm wandering around the barn here, but I can't quit without one last thought. I'd strongly recommend the Skinny Daily Posts that are part of this very web site. IMHO, Julie Ridl is producing some of the most sensible, most thoughtful and most caring writing on weight control anywhere. Her columns are short, sweet and to the point, and set me to thinking every time.

Of this and that ... Cindy, I eat brown rice, but rarely more than half a cup at a time. It's a great complex carb.

Thinking of food, is anyone else astonished at how much cottage cheese they consume on a daily basis! It's just so darn easy.

It's been a good week so far ... LBWO on Monday; biceps and triceps this morning, and then I threw in 15 minutes of Pilates. What I laughingly call "my form" leaves much to be desired but it sure does FEEL GOOD. Cardio tomorrow.

Regards all,

Airegrrl (Indiana Robin)

Robin: thanks for that. As I suspected it isn’t available yet. Damn country…..

Airegrrl: I have been through that type of divorce as well although sometimes I digress into old thought patterns. I remember meeting my MIL for the first time and then her suggesting that we go to a bakery to get some ‘disgustings’ – yes that was her nickname for bakery treats. I was astonished at it at the time and still won’t let my husband use that term. It has such a negative connotation about it.

Thanks for the recommendation by the way – I may check it out.

JC

JC....forgive my nai'vety, but y'all don't get new releases and such when we do? I thought everyone got them at the same time?

Robin :cb:

nope it often takes 6 months to get something released over here and we are about 3-4 months behind in movies as well.

JC