[Bic]

I am wondering if my body will need more carbs for training, and am concerned that it will turn to my muscle if not fuelled properly?? I workout five days a week; cardio/strength, plus one long distance run. My IP advisor suggested adding one more protein after the workout on those five days. Anyone have any suggestions/input as to their experience as runners/athletes and being on Phase One???

[canadiancandy]

i would not recommend it. you would either have to scale back the exercise or add more to the protocol in order to protect your lean mass.

[scorbett1103]

Originally Posted by Bic

I am wondering if my body will need more carbs for training, and am concerned that it will turn to my muscle if not fuelled properly?? I workout five days a week; cardio/strength, plus one long distance run. My IP advisor suggested adding one more protein after the workout on those five days. Anyone have any suggestions/input as to their experience as runners/athletes and being on Phase One???

It isn't advisable to follow Phase 1 with intense training - there simply aren't enough calories. There is an Athlete's protocol that was in circulation a while back that will probably be helpful for you:

http://www.3fatchicks.com/forum/3950642-post19.html

[Jenny38]

Hi Bic,

I worked out extensively on P1 - always added an extra shake after working out and I always made sure I ate the restricted snack each day or at least every day I went to the gym.

Starting the diet in Sept 2013 and was doing spinning, strength and core. In Feb 2014 I joined a new gym and started running on a treadmill. From May -Nov 2014 I ran outside 2x a week, worked out at gym 3x week. The runs were one short and one long working my way up to 1/2 marathon Nov 1st. I started maintanence Sept 2014 but did run 19km in August.

In discussion with my coach who was aware of my workouts, we added for breakfast 1 piece of bread with peanut butter or 1 serving of oatmeal along with the IP mango shake for my runs over 10km. Then I would still have the shake afterwards. I would also use gels on the long runs as needed and not worry about it.

Scorbett is right that the diet does not encourage extensive exercise, but it was originally created for athletes.

For me I was going to change a good habit that I was going to continue long after P1. It may have slowed my loses but I think it helped with my inches.

[scorbett1103]

Originally Posted by Jenny38

Scorbett is right that the diet does not encourage extensive exercise, but it was originally created for athletes.

This is correct...BUT it was created for athletes to use in the off season. The diet was designed as an eating plan that would allow athletes to maintain lean muscle, WITHOUT training, so that their bodies could get much needed rest until beginning training again.

[mars735]

Hi OP, To get more precise input, could you describe the distances you are planning to race? To me, a long distance race is anything longer than a sprint. If you were training for a 10k, that would be different than a marathon. A 10k is doable for almost anyone who is established in P1 if you aren't trying to compete, break a personal speed record or doing an exceptionally rigorous terrain.

A marathon, on the other hand, seems unadvisable. I did one in my 20s, not on P1, and can attest to significant fluid and electrolyte shifts during the race. Let alone glycogen depletion.

I'm far from an expert, but the process of P1 as I understand it is that ketosis is a state whereby muscle stores of glycogen are likely to be metabolized for energy as you diet, in addition to fat. There may not be enough energy left in your muscles to fuel a marathon.

I'd love to hear from others who have more knowledge of this subject.

[Briael]

I don't think it is so much the calories, as your body may not be producing sufficient ketones yet to support the need for fuel for the muscles. This puts you at risk of breaking down lean muscle mass to produce that needed glucose, as the body finds it faster to convert muscle to bio-available glucose/glycogen than it does for the liver to metabolise fat into ketones.

I certainly wouldn't recommend anything beyond walking or light yoga/pilates stretching in the first 5-6 weeks of P1, while your body is adjusting to ketosis and the change of balance from carb fueled to fat fueled.

However, longer term you need to assess how you feel. Gradually increase your exercise, but be aware of how your body is reacting to the level of exertion and pay a lot of attention to pre-fueling and post-fueling.

I walk 3 miles a day, strength train at the gym twice a week and have just started doing running intervals (albeit slow) in the walking. It CAN be done, but you need to look very closely at how your body is reacting and keep on top of tracking changes to body fat and weight on a daily basis, to know if you are burning fat or muscle.

Lots of people prefer to play it safe and restrict exercise, but many of us already have exercise routines and simply need to rethink how we manage them on a different fueling system and reduced metabolic rate.

Choose your vegetables carefully. I tend to look for higher carb/higher fiber and go for more protein dense meats and eggs over fish and tofu.

You may find more information on the bodybuilding and athletics sites on how people manage nutritional ketosis and their fitness program (albeit they tend to be higher fat ratios than IP uses).

As always, listen to your body. If you are already an athlete then you will be more familiar with the signs of fatigue and overdoing it.

[Bic]

Thanks everyone for your input! I saw the athlete protocol so I was thinking along those lines for my training! Are you allowed to add one piece of whole grain toast? or will that kick you out of ketosis?
I plan to run 20-30 km's if that helps.......but am not a speedy runner by any means, so the "intensity" is def not there, just endurance that i'm worried about

[mars735]

Whew, those qualify as long distances by any definition, bic! Good question about the piece of toast....you might want to play around using a tracker tool like myfitnesspal.com, adding in your specific brand of toast to see where that puts you, and do an experiment.

Not counting athletic workouts, I've read that most people maintain ketosis under 50 net carbs/day. Net carbs is total carbs minus fiber. There is individual variation, in addition to the effect of workouts.

But the above idea won't really tell you if you are depleting muscle tissue, which is the risk of intense exercise on calorie limited diets.

I guess I'd wonder how, if your body is busy in fat burning more, does it have the capacity to simultaneously build & repair muscle? I'd keep asking and researching.

[lisa32989]

Bic
You may want to get the book: The Art and Science of Low Carb Performance by Volek and Phiney for more info on the subject.

[Bic]

Thanks guys!

[Briael]

Originally Posted by lisa32989

Bic
You may want to get the book: The Art and Science of Low Carb Performance by Volek and Phiney for more info on the subject.

Oooh, I hadn't heard of that one. Thanks for heads up, Lisa. It's now on my Amazon list.