Someone said that going to church doesn't make you a Christian and that is right. Trusting Jesus Christ as your Savior is what makes a person a Christian. I was raised in a protestant denomination and learned all about Jesus and the cross. When I was 22 I met people who were sure they would be in heaven. Now that would be a proud thing to say if it depended on our works but it depends only on what Jesus did at Calvary. One July day in 1971 I saw for the first time why Christ died.......it was for me! We go to remember the Lord on Sun. morning, tell others about Christ and his sacrifice on Sun. night in the gospel meeting and for prayer and Bible study on Wed. Life is short......etetnity is forever.
forcing religion on someone pushes them away from it - IMO.
There's a lesson, that in my mother's nearly 30 years of Christianity, she's failed over and over to learn. What I never understood is that the same Bible she believes in even talks about not turning people from God. So WHY would a true Christian do that? That's why I can't fathom organized religions. I don't think half the people congregating truly understand their own beliefs enough to teach them to others. It's what makes so many of them look so hypocritical to me at least. My mom would say she just doesn't want me to go to ****. Well ok, but mom, who are YOU to decide that's what will happen to me? Just because I don't share YOUR exact beliefs. But to her, if I don't attend church, I can't POSSIBLY believe. So she continues to try and force, and her own Bible is telling her not to do that. It's like spinning in circles going nowhere.
Wow.
I think the concept of **** is so horrifying. It is one thing that has caused so much pain and terror and anguish. Here. Now. On earth, in real time. It has caused itself.
*Big Sigh.*
I remember one time as a child my dad told me what he believed that scared me, but now I just think of it as sad. He said that God would not "punish" anyone for following what they were taught to believe, whatever that teaching may be. So, if you were, like me, taught to be Catholic, the safest course would be to continue to practice Catholicism. But, if you were to veer and pick something else, you had better darn be "right." Because if you veered and chose incorrectly you could be, well, you know, sent down the **** chute. So, you had two choices: Stick with what you were taught (the safest), or choose differently and choose RIGHT. Can you believe THAT????
Last edited by Spinymouse; 09-15-2007 at 11:49 PM.
Interesting thread. My Dad's family were Laestadian Lutherans (super conservative Finnish sect) and My Mom's family was also some conservative denomination I don't remember (I just remember dancing and cards weren't allowed). I was raised Mo. Synod Lutheran, although I went to a Baptist church for a time as a kid. I think it was because they had a bus and picked us up Sunday AM and then my Mom didn't have to take us. My parents sent us to church and weren't really big on attending themselves. I went with the neighbors frequently. I married a Lutheran of a more liberal denomination and gladly left the Mo. Synod. My kids were all baptized and have been or will be (the last one this year) in the Lutheran Church. I am now a Convinced Quaker and have found my religious home. I have had more "God" experiences sitting in a silent meeting for worship than ever in my life as a Lutheran. It's definitely my path to God.
Luja - the silent meeting concept interests me. I have not attended anything like this. But I took a beliefnet quiz and it labeled me as being most like a Quaker.
jo
This is such an interesting thread, thanks for getting it started. I was raised Baptist and I absolutely loved going to church. I sang in the choir, we went on trips, and most of my close friends were there. The church was the center of my life, and as I got older I played the piano for the youth choir.
As as an adult I realized most of what I was taught I never really believed. I never accepted what the Bible had to say or didn't say about women among other things. It was also hard to accept God as a father when I didn't have a good relationship with my own. God became this parent who dotes on you when you do right but harshly punishes you when you do the wrong thing. I still haven't been able to shake that concept of God.
I now consider myself to be culturally Christian and I always will be. I still love gospel music, it warms my heart and spirit in a very real way. I also realize that a lot of what I still do is so wrote from my Christian upbringing, like praying before the plane takes off "in Jesus name, amen". I say it not because I truly believe it, but because of the fear factor with which I was raised.
I've been exploring other faiths and belief systems, because I terribly miss the community of a church, but my beliefs are completely different now and I don't forsee going back to the church. I do believe in God/Goddess as mother and father, I believe there is a divine holy spirit in all of us that connects us to the Devine, others, and ourselves. When I felt comfortable enough being honest with myself about what I truly believed it was so incredibly freeing, but I went through a long mourning period because I lost the very foundation on which my life was based. In the meantime, I'm still figuring it all out.
If there are others who've had similar experiences, I would love to talk more in depth about this topic.
You know, I hesitated even reading this thread because I was afraid of what would be here. I didn't want to read arguments or condemnations of anyone based on their beliefs. So, like others have said, how nice it is to read everyone's opinions and not have any criticisms! Awesome people here!!!!
I had to laugh (and agree with) those who said that they have left church because of the rigidity and structure that they were faced with as kids. I felt the same way for a very long time. I was raised Missouri Synod Lutheran and then went ELCA Lutheran when the church converted to that. I went very much away from going to church when I went to college and on into married life. I always felt the tug to go back and tried a variety of churches. When my kids were born, I knew that I wanted to give them the knowledge and experience of being in church. I started attending another Lutheran church here in town. I honestly found myself sitting there listening to the sermon, but I was planning what I was going to do with the rest of the day. When I went to get my daughter from Sunday school, I realized that she was being taught in the same way I had been when I was in Sunday school. You know, the felt boards?! I really did some soul searching because I didn't want the same boring, blah Sunday school that I had when I was growing up.
So, while watching TV, I saw an ad for a local church that is a Christian non-denominational church. I decided to give it a try. Honestly, I have never been so uncomfortable in a church in my life as I was that first time. Where are the bulletins, where are the hymnals, why aren't we following some kind of order of service???? The good thing is that I was not on the end of the row, so I couldn't just leave. I made it through the worship/music time and settled in for the message. It was life-changing. I still remember much of what the pastor said that day, 10 years ago. I've attended ever since. My kids, middle school age, love to go to their class. It's high tech, has a rock band, video games, sometimes they play mud volleyball... you never know. And, the best part is that they are getting it. They tell me what they learned, I've heard them use the info in their everyday lives, and they ASK to go back every week. How cool! (I wish we could have had that when I was growing up!)
I just think it takes each individual to find what works for them. I have relatives that don't understand why I'm at this church. That's ok, they don't have to understand. As long as it makes sense for me, and is uplifting to my family, that's where we need to be!!
You know, I hesitated even reading this thread because I was afraid of what would be here. I didn't want to read arguments or condemnations of anyone based on their beliefs. So, like others have said, how nice it is to read everyone's opinions and not have any criticisms! Awesome people here!!!!
I completely agree--when I clicked on the thread, I expected to find all kinds of bickering and arguing and defending...I'm glad that's not the case
When I was little, we went to church every Sunday, and I went to Catechism every week as well. We did that until I had completed my first confession and my first communion (I was the youngest, so my older sister went longer), at which time we stopped going to church because my parents felt my sister and I had both had enough education in the area to be able to decide what we wanted to do ourselves religion-wise in the future.
Today, anything religious makes me VERY uncomfortable. I have relatives who are avid church-goers and are very active in their religious communities, so I've attended many religious services (baptisms/christenings, religious wedding services, etc.). I remember what a big deal it was in high school when most of my friends were being confirmed. But none of that is for me. I just can't do it.
I can't force myself to believe that anyone has control over my life but ME. Like others here have mentioned, though, just because I don't believe in a higher power doesn't mean I don't have good morals. I think a lot canbe learned from the stories in the Bible, but in my opinion, they are just that--guiding stories based not on actual events, but rather handed down from generation to generation to teach lessons on life. And not GOD's lessons on life, but simply those that are socially acceptable.
I'm not sure if I'm an atheist or agnostic, as I sometimes have a feeling of believing that "things happen for a reason." But I can't say that "reason" is any higher being's grand design.
I have my own theories on the true reasons behind many organized religions, but I will keep them as being my own since I don't want to be the first to offend or start any heated debate in this thread
Suffice it to say, I believe human beings are animals. No other species feels the need to rely on any intangible spiritual force, so why do we feel the need to do so? I can't accept the belief that humans have souls and other animals do not--but I CAN accept that humans have such an underlying need to "belong" and to be "righteous" that they would create a system by which they can do both.
My mom was raised Jewish (of the conservative persuasion) and my dad was raised Methodist. My dad was always atheist and never went to church as a child unless his grandparents brought him. However, he was very well versed in all world religions. My mom was more religious and went to Hebrew school, Sunday school, High Holiday services, and Shabbat services throughout her life until she went to a Catholic college where that wasn't available. So when my brother and I came along, it was planned that we'd be raised Jewish. However, we moved to a very conservative Southern Baptist dominated area of North Georgia where the closest synagogue was "Jews for Jesus" (which is the biggest insult ever) and we'd have had to go into practically downtown Atlanta to get to the nearest Conservative congregation.
My mom taught me the best she could but in addition, my parents either took me or had friends take me to every church or temple in the vicinity. It always shocks me when I meet people who have never experimented in their religion- by the time I was 10, I had been to 8 different denominations of Christian churches (Southern Baptist, Southern Methodist, Methodist, Roman Catholic, Greek Orthodox, Armenian Orthodox, LDS, and Russian Orthodox) as well as a mosque, Unitarian Universalist church, and Buddhist temple.
All and all I'd say now that I identify as an agnostic Jew. I go to a Jewish founded secular college so cultural Judaism is all around me. I go to High Holy day services because it's relaxing (none of that offputting religious rock music *shudder*.. just good old fashioned Hebrew cantors). However, I probably feel most comfortable at Unitarian Universalist services and will pick that up once out of school because it has all the benefits of organized religion without being the organized religion that I so despise.
It has taken me a lot of years in therapy to get over my complete hatred of Christianity. Being a Jewish, liberal, sensitive child growing up in the buckle of the Bible Belt was not good for the psyche :P I still have issues with any person who can believe in ****. Growing up with everyone telling me that I was going to go to **** for being Jewish, I feel strongly that in order to have a concept of **** and feel that it's OK that your diety would banish others to it, it's just the embodiment of pure evil. I'm much more comfortable with the idea that everything ends when I die than that I will go to Heaven but much more worthy people will go to **** or limbo.
I'm in the middle of this question right now myself. I grew up in a weird overprotective charismatic christian home. My parents think nothing bad happens in the world... and are superstitious about saying bad things out loud because it might 'give the devil something'. They still wont research anything about MS or my drugs because they think that might just give the devil ground
Anyways.... I went to a United Church this morning... I left my 'home church' last month which is a missionary run pentecostal type place. I went to a christian university... I've noticed the 'christian encouragers' thread on 3fc but I'm at the point where I'm overly negative about the whole christian subculture and I dont know what to do because I want to be able to just walk away. I think I've got a lot of journalling to do about this.
I think it's fascinating reading through all these posts. I am surprised at the number of people who were raised in the Roman Catholic faith. I am a cradle Catholic. I was raised by a Catholic mother and my father converted to Catholicism when I was born. I have seven brothers and sisters. We all attended Catholic grade school and the local Catholic high school until it was closed after my 8th grade year. We were taught by nuns and priests. I always thought many of them were hypocrites.
Many of the priests drank too much and some of the nuns were very mean. Catholic schools are known for their strong discipline and curriculum. I remember after about 4th grade the nuns were allowed to wear normal attire instead of habits. We always noticed that the cute nuns wore short skirts and we were quite annoyed at them. At one junior high party at a student's house, they got into the parents' liquor cabinet and flirted with the deacon that was there. We were horrified!
One of our priest got up on the pulpit one day and told us he was leaving the priesthood to marry and ex-nun he had fallen in love with. My husband had a classmate who became a priest. About 15 years ago, he left the priesthood because he had gotten a woman in the parish pregnant.
I think many people can't take all the rules and regulations in the Catholic church. I guess I'm a cafeteria Catholic as my mother calls me. I pick and choose from the rules which one I will abide by. My kids attended Catholic school through 8th grade and two of my three kids still attend weekly Mass with us. My middle child still lives at home but chooses not to go with us. I know it bothers my husband but she is an adult and we can't force her to go.
I do believe in the power of prayer. I have read many studies that reinforce this and show that people who are prayed for have survived health problems better than people who are not.
I work in a Catholic hospital where there is a daily prayer overhead on the PA and in our e-mails. I am comforted by working in a place where gospel values are part of our mission and I feel I am helping my fellow man. I miss the nuns that used to make rounds in the old days and visit with patients. There just aren't enough of them any more to do this. It was a great comfort to our patients.
I think that my famiy is very comforted by the rites and rituals in the Catholic faith. The Easter holiday, Midnight Mass at Christmas time, Lenten sevices, Palm Sunday, May crowning, the Rosary. I married a Catholic man who attended Catholic schools through 12th grade. I always tell him he is an old altar boy. He would never miss Mass.
I really have enjoyed reading all these posts. I hope I haven't rambled on too much.
Like many of you, I was afraid to click this thread too. I did because our pastor is doing a series on the beginnings of the church right now (Acts).
It is a nice calm thread on, what can be, a prickly subject.
It makes me sad that so much of what we find offensive/wrong/off-putting about church is the human stuff. Stuff that, unfortunately, stands between us and our Lord and Saviour.
oh yes, Christian, the born again kind and yes I go to church when I don't work day shift on Sunday. I go to worship, fellowship and learn.
Location: Down in the dumps..but working my way out!
Posts: 907
Quote:
Originally Posted by carolr3639
Someone said that going to church doesn't make you a Christian and that is right. Trusting Jesus Christ as your Savior is what makes a person a Christian. I was raised in a protestant denomination and learned all about Jesus and the cross. When I was 22 I met people who were sure they would be in heaven. Now that would be a proud thing to say if it depended on our works but it depends only on what Jesus did at Calvary. One July day in 1971 I saw for the first time why Christ died.......it was for me! We go to remember the Lord on Sun. morning, tell others about Christ and his sacrifice on Sun. night in the gospel meeting and for prayer and Bible study on Wed. Life is short......etetnity is forever.
Well said Carol! That's my story too. I was in my 20's when I started really questioning what I had learned as a child. Then I discovered the magnitude of what Jesus did for me on the cross..and it changed my life! I grew up in a dysfunctional family; so my church family is very precious to me.
Originally posted by Susan B
Quote:
It makes me sad that so much of what we find offensive/wrong/off-putting about church is the human stuff. Stuff that, unfortunately, stands between us and our Lord and Saviour.
I went to church every Sunday as a kid and even taught Sunday School. It was an important part of our weekly routine and something special that my sister and I shared with our mom (my Dad rarely went to church). I continued to go on my own after my mom died when I was in college and even for a while after I graduated, but eventually I gave it up.
I took a course on western religion in college and the more I learned about it, the more I felt like God was a construct of man. I just don't have much faith, I guess, because I really can't believe in God anymore. I wouldn't say I'm an atheist, but I'm an agnostic at best. Then I also had issues with the sexism inherent the religion I was brought up with (Episcopalian) and that was the straw the broke the camel's back in terms of me going to church regularly.
I used to go occasionally when I wanted to feel close to my mom. Because it was such an important part of her life (she went every Sunday, our priest was one of her best friends and her closest friends were from our church, she organized all sorts of fundraisers for the church, taught Sunday school, etc. etc.), it is a way that I can feel close to her. But that also makes it painful for me, especially now that I hardly ever go. When I do go, it brings back all these feelings about my mom and I almost invariably end up crying, which I hate to do in public.
The fact that my SO is completely non-religious (oddly enough, he's also Episcopalian--I've always thought that ironic since it's so unimportant to both of us) and NEVER goes to church is also a factor in my decision not to go. Weekend breakfasts are a special time for the two us and church would get in the way of that.
What I never understood is that the same Bible she believes in even talks about not turning people from God. So WHY would a true Christian do that? That's why I can't fathom organized religions. I don't think half the people congregating truly understand their own beliefs enough to teach them to others. It's what makes so many of them look so hypocritical to me at least. My mom would say she just doesn't want me to go to ****. Well ok, but mom, who are YOU to decide that's what will happen to me? Just because I don't share YOUR exact beliefs. But to her, if I don't attend church, I can't POSSIBLY believe. So she continues to try and force, and her own Bible is telling her not to do that. It's like spinning in circles going nowhere.
That's my story too. I was in my 20's when I started really questioning what I had learned as a child. Then I discovered the magnitude of what Jesus did for me on the cross..and it changed my life! I grew up in a dysfunctional family; so my church family is very precious to me. 
