Ideal Protein Diet - Losing more muscle...




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New Englander
12-28-2011, 03:37 PM
I was told today I lost two pounds of muscle in the past two weeks. My coach asked me about my protein intake and I told her I stick to 5 ounces cooked (no more/no less)...she recommended I eat more to prevent more muscle loss...

Seriously! I'm following the plan and now I have to eat more protein?? Her recommendation (which I admit is doable) is to eat my 5 ounces of chicken/fish etc. and eat a hard boiled egg white. The problem is I get full so quick and just can't stomach that much fish or chicken at once... hopefully this will fix my muscle loss problem.

Has anyone else experienced this? If not that's okay...just needed to vent...


Pamelama
12-28-2011, 03:42 PM
I always have 7-8 oz of protein a day. Sometimes at lunch I'll put 2oz with my veggies, then the remainder at dinner. No muscle loss either. My coach said he's seen great results with retaining muscle this way.

New Englander
12-28-2011, 03:45 PM
Would you eat an additional 2 ounces at lunch or is the 2 ounces at lunch taken from your dinner allotment?

Thanks,
Maggie


Marionm
12-28-2011, 03:48 PM
I was told today I lost two pounds of muscle in the past two weeks. My coach asked me about my protein intake and I told her I stick to 5 ounces cooked (no more/no less)...she recommended I eat more to prevent more muscle loss...

Seriously! I'm following the plan and now I have to eat more protein?? Her recommendation (which I admit is doable) is to eat my 5 ounces of chicken/fish etc. and eat a hard boiled egg white. The problem is I get full so quick and just can't stomach that much fish or chicken at once... hopefully this will fix my muscle loss problem.

Has anyone else experienced this? If not that's okay...just needed to vent...

I had this problem too. I have to increase my protein intake pretty significantly for normal life and when I dance, I have to do it more. I have a difficult time getting enough with just meat so I have used whey protein, the EAS carb control shakes or an extra packet.

Pamelama
12-28-2011, 04:45 PM
Would you eat an additional 2 ounces at lunch or is the 2 ounces at lunch taken from your dinner allotment?

Thanks,
Maggie

2oz at lunch then 5-6 oz with dinner....

Lakewood
12-28-2011, 05:58 PM
Just 1 egg white doesn't seem like enough to prevent muscle loss. Can you add a packet? Or split your protein between 2 meals? Maybe 3 oz at lunch and 5 oz at dinner?

I've been coached that if you have a lot to lose (and I don't know how much you have to lose) you can add up to 2 packs a day to prevent muscle loss and fuel your body until you can go to the 'standard' 3 packs/day.

Keep us updated!

DanafromAustin
12-28-2011, 06:05 PM
I've had the same problem, but thankfully when I started this plan I had a higher lean muscle mass than the average women (according to my coach) so while I've lost some muscle mass I'm still okay. I have since the beginning ate 8oz. of protein per day. I usually do 3 oz at lunch and 5 oz. at dinner. And to be perfectly honest some days I eat a little more protein if I want as I'm happy with my weight loss and like protecting my lean muscle when I can.

New Englander
12-28-2011, 06:06 PM
Just 1 egg white doesn't seem like enough to prevent muscle loss. Can you add a packet? Or split your protein between 2 meals? Maybe 3 oz at lunch and 5 oz at dinner?

I've been coached that if you have a lot to lose (and I don't know how much you have to lose) you can add up to 2 packs a day to prevent muscle loss and fuel your body until you can go to the 'standard' 3 packs/day.

Keep us updated!
Hi, I have about 35 pounds left to go...I just managed to eat 8 ounces of fish tonight...it was a struggle 'cause I just don't enjoy eating that much at once. (My fatness was caused by grazing high fat food!!!)

:)

New Englander
12-28-2011, 06:08 PM
I've had the same problem, but thankfully when I started this plan I had a higher lean muscle mass than the average women (according to my coach) so while I've lost some muscle mass I'm still okay. I have since the beginning ate 8oz. of protein per day. I usually do 3 oz at lunch and 5 oz. at dinner. And to be perfectly honest some days I eat a little more protein if I want as I'm happy with my weight loss and like protecting my lean muscle when I can.
Yeah...your weight loss is impressive! :)

I'll email my coach about splitting my protein up between lunch and dinner...that sounds like a really great solution that several of you have recommended.

New Englander
12-28-2011, 06:09 PM
2oz at lunch then 5-6 oz with dinner....
I think that's a great idea...seems like a few of you have been splitting up your protein. I'll email my coach to see how she feels about that because it sounds like a great solution! :)

DanafromAustin
12-28-2011, 06:26 PM
Yeah...your weight loss is impressive! :)

I'll email my coach about splitting my protein up between lunch and dinner...that sounds like a really great solution that several of you have recommended.

Hope that works out. It was actually my coach who recommended splitting up the protein if I wanted. She said most women complain that 8oz can be a lot of protein at one meal.

New Englander
12-28-2011, 06:54 PM
Hope that works out. It was actually my coach who recommended splitting up the protein if I wanted. She said most women complain that 8oz can be a lot of protein at one meal.
Mine never mentioned that to me and I appreciate learning it could be a possibility. Thanks again!

rubyrosered
12-28-2011, 08:04 PM
My coach told us she went to a seminar recently where they were encouraging everyone to eat 8oz per day. I'm always amazed at how much that is and how hard it is to eat most of the time.

Paint Lady
12-28-2011, 08:13 PM
I always ate 8 oz of protein at dinner, no problem. But, I love meat!

sekc14
12-28-2011, 08:53 PM
I've been eating more protein lately because I was so hungry. I'm glad to know that it's okay to eat more. I've started exercising and I think this is why my appetite increased.

sandralosingweight
12-28-2011, 09:02 PM
I do believe that the old IP sheet that I had said 5 to 8 oz, 5 for meat and 8 for fish, while the new sheet I recently downloaded says 8oz for everything.

gs463
12-28-2011, 09:05 PM
I will be starting IP the first week in Jan. I don't mean to be stupid but how do the coaches know if you are losing muscle vs fat?

New Englander
12-28-2011, 09:13 PM
I will be starting IP the first week in Jan. I don't mean to be stupid but how do the coaches know if you are losing muscle vs fat?
That's not stupid to ask! There's a device that measures body fat, and other things...you hold it in your hands...it's used by insurance companies in wellness programs as well as physicians offices and in IP offices...if you google "device that measures body fat" you'll find all sorts of information on the web. Where I use to work we had one that was included in the scale so when you weighed yourself you also got a print out on your body "make up" i.e. body fat... :) Enjoy the diet and keep coming back here...there's a wealth of information regarding IP!

New Englander
12-28-2011, 09:14 PM
My coach told us she went to a seminar recently where they were encouraging everyone to eat 8oz per day. I'm always amazed at how much that is and how hard it is to eat most of the time.
Ugh...it is alot!!! I like the idea of dividing it between two meals (lunch and dinner)...hopefully my coach will be on board with that idea.

New Englander
12-28-2011, 09:15 PM
I do believe that the old IP sheet that I had said 5 to 8 oz, 5 for meat and 8 for fish, while the new sheet I recently downloaded says 8oz for everything.
Serious!!! Ugh..it is so much to eat! Can you upload the doc to this site for us to see??? Thanks!

New Englander
12-28-2011, 09:18 PM
I always ate 8 oz of protein at dinner, no problem. But, I love meat!
Lucky you!!! I'm not a meat lover...was actually a vegetarian for quite a few years...but I'm weaving all sorts of meat back into my diet... well mainly chicken... I use to have no problem eating it fried! but I use to love anything fried... :)

DanafromAustin
12-28-2011, 10:12 PM
Like this one?

http://www.omronwebstore.com/imagesEdp/p99268b.jpg

You are aware that these are highly inaccurate, right? :) They fluctuate based on what you've had to eat or drink, what you're wearing, the humidity in the air and all kinds of other factors. I have one of them myself - I got mine on Amazon for $30. At the best they're good for a general estimation of where your bodyfat is.

Anyone who is using one to tell you to the pound how much muscle or fat you have on your body is telling you a lie. They simply cannot measure that accurately.

I'm sure most of the clinics that do measure BMI are using some type of BIA equipment. Of course water testing is the gold standard, but really who is going to do that unless they are a professional athlete. Certainly not the average dieter. I don't think anyone can go 100% by these BIA machines, but as long as one is well hydrated, then at least they can give you a ballpark figure.

New Englander
12-28-2011, 10:17 PM
Like this one?

http://www.omronwebstore.com/imagesEdp/p99268b.jpg

You are aware that these are highly inaccurate, right? :) They fluctuate based on what you've had to eat or drink, what you're wearing, the humidity in the air and all kinds of other factors. I have one of them myself - I got mine on Amazon for $30. At the best they're good for a general estimation of where your bodyfat is.

Anyone who is using one to tell you to the pound how much muscle or fat you have on your body is telling you a lie. They simply cannot measure that accurately.
You got it! :) & I know they shouldn't be administered so frequently, and my coach does it every week...hmmm...maybe I shouldn't be so worried about my "potential" muscle loss...

Marionm
12-28-2011, 11:50 PM
The bioimpedance devices aren't as accurate as some other methods, but if you have your weigh ins at consistent times and such what you can see are trends. I have access to a BODPOD and so I did that and found slight differences but it wasn't huge.

When I began IP, I had a stress fracture in my foot, so I wasn't able to do much for the first few months. I had good weight loss and reasonable body fat loss. As soon as I started back dancing, I kept having good weight loss, but wasn't dropping fat... probably because I wasn't eating enough to compensate for the exercise. As soon as I increased my protein, the fat percentages began to drop again.

I wouldn't worry about it if it's just one week, but if it continues that way for a month, then, I'd be more concerned. Follow your coach's advice though.

Good luck.

Y Guy
12-29-2011, 12:02 AM
I had the same concern over several weeks on plan. One or two weeks raises an eyebrow, but if its consistent then you should increase your protein as suggested. I was on 4 IP packets a day, plus 8oz of meat at night. I began adding in 1/3 cup of egg whites in the morning then I had my IP item about 1/2 hour later (to space things out) with this I began to regain my muscle mass and still lost weight.

Tmg1989
12-29-2011, 12:30 AM
So how often do your coaches measure your muscle vs body fat? I only had it done at the start of the program. Each week I am measured with a tape measure and weighed but no checks.... :(

DanafromAustin
12-29-2011, 01:30 AM
My coach checks every week. I always get checked first thing in the morning and with basically the same workout clothes on, so as Marionm suggested being consistent helps. I'm not going to hang my hat on those numbers, but they do tend to be consistent and not all over the place number wise. I also get measured and weighed of course each week too.

New Englander
12-29-2011, 09:49 AM
So how often do your coaches measure your muscle vs body fat? I only had it done at the start of the program. Each week I am measured with a tape measure and weighed but no checks.... :(
Personally, I asked to be measured monthly because there won't be significant changes week to week. Also the device should be done less frequently...again, just my personal opinion, I think it should be done monthly because it's not a exact science. And of course weigh-ins should be done weekly.

New Englander
12-29-2011, 09:51 AM
I had the same concern over several weeks on plan. One or two weeks raises an eyebrow, but if its consistent then you should increase your protein as suggested. I was on 4 IP packets a day, plus 8oz of meat at night. I began adding in 1/3 cup of egg whites in the morning then I had my IP item about 1/2 hour later (to space things out) with this I began to regain my muscle mass and still lost weight.
Thanks for sharing your experience with me...that made me feel more at ease (along with all the other posts). I've increased my protein intake. Unfortunately I was just told my thyroid isn't working properly and I'm getting more blood work done to determine how "off" it really is...but I'm so exhausted I can't do any exercising...oh, and my MS doesn't help either... woe is me!!! :)

Y Guy
12-29-2011, 12:24 PM
So how often do your coaches measure your muscle vs body fat? I only had it done at the start of the program. Each week I am measured with a tape measure and weighed but no checks.... :(

Each week I get on a Tanita scale which kicks out detailed print out of weight (gives a 2# clothing allowance), my age/height/body type is input and then gives muscle mass, BMI, Fat, degree of obesity, and more. We usually then take a waist measurement as well.

Unfortunately I was just told my thyroid isn't working properly...
Good news is that you've caught it and can treat it.

New Englander
01-28-2012, 03:58 PM
So, to date I've lost 25% muscle...(from my first reading to just the other day...it was a reading spread of 12 weeks). I know these machines aren't 100% reliable but there is some validity to them...All I know is they said this diet is suppose to maintain muscle mass..um I don't think so. Maybe it's because I had more to lose...I was a strong women...now...not so much.... Are others losing more muscle than they expected???

PS I am eating 110% per protocol...I use to eat only 5 ounces of meat but in the last few weeks I increased it to 8 ounces...

infoplease
01-28-2012, 10:43 PM
So, to date I've lost 25% muscle...(from my first reading to just the other day...it was a reading spread of 12 weeks). I know these machines aren't 100% reliable but there is some validity to them...All I know is they said this diet is suppose to maintain muscle mass..um I don't think so. Maybe it's because I had more to lose...I was a strong women...now...not so much.... Are others losing more muscle than they expected???

PS I am eating 110% per protocol...I use to eat only 5 ounces of meat but in the last few weeks I increased it to 8 ounces...

Just had mine done for the same interval (start & at 12 weeks).
Lean body mass is down 7.69 pounds, which is 7.14%.
I spoke with a new coach on this, who said 7 pounds is about average, as lean body mass includes water, too.

You've probably run these numbers, but with a goal of 155 and an assumption of 23% desired body fat, your lean mass would be 119.3 pounds. Have you fallen well below that?

Momto2cs
01-28-2012, 11:06 PM
These scales can be inaccurate. Look for a trend before getting too worried.

Most people do not gain muscle mass without resistance training, or lose muscle mass very quickly with adequate protein intake.

My bf fluctuates wishing a couple percent each week, but I just accept this is normal.

New Englander
01-29-2012, 09:03 AM
These scales can be inaccurate. Look for a trend before getting too worried.

Most people do not gain muscle mass without resistance training, or lose muscle mass very quickly with adequate protein intake.

My bf fluctuates wishing a couple percent each week, but I just accept this is normal.
Hi, I used these machines at an insurance company I worked for (I was on the wellness committee) and I know they can fluctuate. If I look at my first reading and the reading from last week it's a 25% loss, plus I feel weaker...maybe it's not 25% but being weak stinks... I do have some old reading from my days in Insurance so I'll pull those out and see what my mm (muscle mass) was at then..I'm not really worried more annoyed by the promise not to lose much mm! :)

BACKDROPsilhouette
01-29-2012, 01:21 PM
I read that you are supposed to consume 1 gram of protein for every pound you weigh to maintain or build muscle. Maybe we're not getting near as much protein as we should be?

In the event that I do lose muscle from this diet, I can always build it back up, right? I have no way to measure my lean muscle mass as I go along because I'm doing this on my own.

normarubys
01-29-2012, 01:30 PM
This may be a silly question, but how do they determine how much muscle you are loosing?

New Englander
01-29-2012, 01:39 PM
This may be a silly question, but how do they determine how much muscle you are loosing?
Check out the whole thread...there's a picture of the type of device that's used and some talk about it.. :)

New Englander
01-29-2012, 01:41 PM
I read that you are supposed to consume 1 gram of protein for every pound you weigh to maintain or build muscle. Maybe we're not getting near as much protein as we should be?

In the event that I do lose muscle from this diet, I can always build it back up, right? I have no way to measure my lean muscle mass as I go along because I'm doing this on my own.
My clinic still says I should eat 5-8 oz even though I heard and told them there's a new protocol (or updated) stating 8 is the requirement... I'm sure you can build it back up. I know muscle has memory...but I don't know if you lose it how easy it is to get it back...I know if you have it and don't use it for a while you can build it back up... hope that makes sense! :)

Momto2cs
01-29-2012, 01:58 PM
If you want to do more research on this google protein sparing modified fasts. Ip is this type of diet.

You can see how much protein you should be having based on the lean muscle mass provided by the bio impedance scale.

How many pounds of muscle does it show you have lost?

I think some weakness is common from the low calories...

normarubys
01-29-2012, 04:29 PM
Got it. Thanks for response. My clinic does not have one of these machines. They didn't mention anything like this and just weighed and measured me. Interesting, I will ask about this during my next appt.

Lilmink
01-29-2012, 04:35 PM
I'm curious to know if and what your clinics charge for your weekly weigh-ins, do they have the body mass contraption or is it just weigh and measure. thanks

AussieonIP
01-29-2012, 04:41 PM
I'm curious to know if and what your clinics charge for your weekly weigh-ins, do they have the body mass contraption or is it just weigh and measure. thanks

My Clinic charges $30 CAD per visit plus cost of food, which I was quite happy with

glomor
01-29-2012, 05:00 PM
My "clinic" is a doctor's office. There was an initial fee for meeting with the doctor and most of it was covered by insurance. The only thing I have paid since then is for the cost of the food. I meet weekly with my coach--an RN who has done the program herself. She is very knowledgable and encouraging. I get weighed, BMI checked, blood pressure checked, and occasionally measured. She leaves the measuring up to me. Originally it was every week, now it's usually every 2 or 3 weeks.

Linden
01-29-2012, 05:35 PM
So, to date I've lost 25% muscle...(from my first reading to just the other day...it was a reading spread of 12 weeks). I know these machines aren't 100% reliable but there is some validity to them...All I know is they said this diet is suppose to maintain muscle mass..um I don't think so. Maybe it's because I had more to lose...I was a strong women...now...not so much.... Are others losing more muscle than they expected???

PS I am eating 110% per protocol...I use to eat only 5 ounces of meat but in the last few weeks I increased it to 8 ounces...

Are you a 100% getting in at LEAST 1/2 ounce of water per pound of weight and then adding more, if necessary, for exercise and caffein? The hand held that's pictured is so unreliable. I know. I had the same one and I threw it out. I'd hate to see you tricked by false numbers.

Momto2cs
01-29-2012, 05:56 PM
At my clinic they have a tainita body composition scale. It gives you weight, body fat, lean muscle mass hydration, visceral fat, etc.

It requires your height and age and is reasonably accurate. I paid $100 up front to use this scale every week as long as I want.

They will measure weekly too.

omgzitsmiranda
01-29-2012, 06:36 PM
I have 0 problem eating 8oz, not gonna lie LOL.

New Englander
01-29-2012, 07:05 PM
Just had mine done for the same interval (start & at 12 weeks).
Lean body mass is down 7.69 pounds, which is 7.14%.
I spoke with a new coach on this, who said 7 pounds is about average, as lean body mass includes water, too.

You've probably run these numbers, but with a goal of 155 and an assumption of 23% desired body fat, your lean mass would be 119.3 pounds. Have you fallen well below that?
Hi infoplease, I'm currently at a weight of 187.4 and my lean mass is 117.3. Does that appear problematic to you...or should I just not worry...My coach told me I am losing more than expected, and more than usual...but wasn't helpful to provide anymore information. She only asked if I was eating my protein...which I am!

New Englander
01-29-2012, 07:07 PM
If you want to do more research on this google protein sparing modified fasts. Ip is this type of diet.

You can see how much protein you should be having based on the lean muscle mass provided by the bio impedance scale.

How many pounds of muscle does it show you have lost?

I think some weakness is common from the low calories...
Thanks for the tip on researching online. I'll give that a look.

It shows I lost about 12 pounds of muscle (from 129.1 to my current muscle weight of 117.3)

New Englander
01-29-2012, 07:09 PM
I have 0 problem eating 8oz, not gonna lie LOL.
LOL!!! Thanks for the laugh!!! Personally, I have to split mine up between proteins..I'll have tofu and meat, or eggs and meat... I just can't do eight ounces of any one protein!!! TOO MUCH BLAH!!! :)

New Englander
01-29-2012, 07:13 PM
At my clinic they have a tainita body composition scale. It gives you weight, body fat, lean muscle mass hydration, visceral fat, etc.

It requires your height and age and is reasonably accurate. I paid $100 up front to use this scale every week as long as I want.

They will measure weekly too.
The one I go to requires all that too... they measure on the scale and also the hand held type... I appreciate you and everyone helping me figure out if this is too much to lose...It is what it is and I'm not going to stop this diet anyway...it's working out really well for me... :)

infoplease
01-29-2012, 10:49 PM
Hi infoplease, I'm currently at a weight of 187.4 and my lean mass is 117.3. Does that appear problematic to you...or should I just not worry...My coach told me I am losing more than expected, and more than usual...but wasn't helpful to provide anymore information. She only asked if I was eating my protein...which I am!

My vote is just not worry about it, as someone else suggested.
Here's why:
*inaccuracy of the measuring device (5%, maybe more as others have posted)
*what lean mass contains (about 73% water, 6% mineral, 20% protein, and 1% ash)
*average LM loss is 7 lbs for a 30 pound weight loss
*if that remains true for each 30 pounds, then anticipated for 41.6 lbs lost is about 9 lbs
*I would think that we need a lot less blood vessels, skin & other non-fat mass "stuff" which has got to weigh something

By the numbers:
*11.8 lbs LBM is about 9.1% of your original LBM (not 25%), yet you have lost 50% more LBM than your coach expected (see how those % can tell all kinds of stories that don't really let us know what is going on?)
*Typically 3 to 5 lbs of water (LBM) comes back at the end
*You've lost 41.6 lbs which is 18.2% of your starting weight (and the health benefits come with as little as 10% gone)

When I've lost weight in the past and it was tracked with the body fat, it all worked out in the end (well, except for that maintenance part).

Not sure if that helps. Feel free to PM me. Other than personal weight loss success (and failure), I don't have a health background (but I read a lot!).

New Englander
01-29-2012, 11:06 PM
My vote is just not worry about it, as someone else suggested.
Here's why:
*inaccuracy of the measuring device (5%, maybe more as others have posted)
*what lean mass contains (about 73% water, 6% mineral, 20% protein, and 1% ash)
*average LM loss is 7 lbs for a 30 pound weight loss
*if that remains true for each 30 pounds, then anticipated for 41.6 lbs lost is about 9 lbs
*I would think that we need a lot less blood vessels, skin & other non-fat mass "stuff" which has got to weigh something

By the numbers:
*11.8 lbs LBM is about 9.1% of your original LBM (not 25%), yet you have lost 50% more LBM than your coach expected (see how those % can tell all kinds of stories that don't really let us know what is going on?)
*Typically 3 to 5 lbs of water (LBM) comes back at the end
*You've lost 41.6 lbs which is 18.2% of your starting weight (and the health benefits come with as little as 10% gone)

When I've lost weight in the past and it was tracked with the body fat, it all worked out in the end (well, except for that maintenance part).

Not sure if that helps. Feel free to PM me. Other than personal weight loss success (and failure), I don't have a health background (but I read a lot!).
I IMed you...I think I got it but just needed a little clarification. Thank you!