Having knowledge and sharing it does NOT mean a know it all!!

i just wish there were answers for people like me who can't even do stretching w/out their knees hurting but i haven't found any :( Usually the rx for knees like mine is some kind of PT like modified weight training but even pilates hurts them BUT... i can do ab and upper body workouts, right?
So as not to hijack this thread even further:

http://www.3fatchicks.com/forum/goal...made-goal.html

you're not hijacking it! i'm in that same boat...where I can't just do free weights and not have constant fear of re-injuring myself....i'm soooo paranoid about that, especially after narrowly escaping back surgery in the past...I had to walk with a cane for almost a year while the chiropractors put my back together again and even now, it's nowhere near perfect, still twisted and one vertebrae is completely backwards

Wow *loving* all that I'm learning in this thread!! For the first time in my life I've been lifting (for the past 6 weeks) and it was fascinating to learn how that actually works! :D I've been able to get heavier by almost half on most of my leg weights and a third with my upper body.

I actually just read a very interesting article on Pinterest concerning the slow twitch vs. the fast twitch - but won't share unless you all want me to, so not to hijack the thread. :)

Defining - Really appriciated your post!! Really helped clear up a lot of stuff I had been confused about! :)

RideRunRepeat, glad it was useful - and congrats on your strength gains!

nelie pointed out an important aspect of strength training as well - motor unit recruitment - that also contributes quite a bit to the whole process. It`s a whole different subject, separate from hypertrophy though -and I had kinda seen the OP`s question more about muscle gain.

But, if alaskanlaughter feels ok about it, we might be able to use this thread for people to talk about muscle development (and theory/science) in a more general sense. I`m also happy to start a new thread. :)

ReillyJ and alaskanlaughter; I am so sorry to hear that some movements are a struggle. I wish I had something more constructive to offer than that, but I'd just be parroting whatever I could find on google, for exercise modifications. Um, I'm sure you've both already spoken to physios/fitness people, but it might be worth explaining to a 'professional' that you're interested in exploring more resistance training - they might have a few suggestions of movements you can try without pain. But both of you have clearly figured out what works for you, and I am so impressed at your persistence to still remain physically active, despite the challenges. Wow.

i'm fine with whatever you all want to add to the thread :) I've never found a place to talk about weight machines and the additional information about resistance training that doesn't involve free weights...so add anything you want on any pertinent topic :)

I tore my left rotator cuff in 2005, then in 2006 the surrounding muscles, my posterior deltoid, upper pec, tricep and traps...as those were healing, I was overusing my right side, and ended up pulling my right deltoid, pec and trap. I couldn't afford therapy, so it took nearly a year and a half to heal. Well, not fully heal because there probably is still scar tissue.

In reference to your back Alaskanlaughter, I know exactly that fear. I only started doing shoulder exercises THIS year. I was terrified. I started ultra slow, just shoulder flyes, 2 lbs in each hand, and 6 reps, 2 sets. I'm up to 5lbs after 8 months and I stretch like mad after.

If you're not comfy with free weights, the machines are fine. Free weights will isolate the muscles, and sometimes that's not a good thing depending on our body's injuries and weak points. I honestly doubt I'll ever have the courage to lift more than 5lbs.

Chardonnay, it's interesting that you find free weights to isolate muscle groups more. I generally find that it's the opposite for me, but that's one of the fun things about all of us having slightly different bodies. :p And I'm sorry to hear about your injury; rotator cuff issues take AGES to heal. I'm impressed you're still lifting!

alaskanlaughter, have you ever tried playing around with bands? They're kind of a grey area between machines and free weights. Also, if you don't mind sharing, which machines do you enjoy using? I had a bad experience with machines when I was younger, and so have studiously avoided them since - but now you've piqued my curiosity again. Oooh, or have you tried bodyweight exercises?! Those can also be fun/awesomely difficult. :) If you're worried about your back, do you focus on developing the stabilizing muscle, or do you choose to avoid the entire muscle group? Sorry for all the questions, I just find it interesting!

ReillyJ - I was thinking about your issue with exercises involving knees, the other day. Have you tried using rhodiola for stress/fatigue or omega-3's for the underlying inflammation? I obviously can't specifically recommend anything, I've just read some really interesting literature on those two; they might be worth looking at. Also, potentially underwater workouts might help provide resistance without pain?

The actual reason I'm posting ;) is actually because I remembered another nifty tidbit about muscles and resistance training. Because women literally can't put on as much muscle as men (without steroids or hormone supplements), we also don't have the capacity to overwhelm our nervous system to the same degree. What this translates to is that women tend to be able to A) complete slightly higher rep sets B) maintain better form during higher rep sets than men and C) recover faster between sets and workouts. This is handy information because so many of the weight lifting routines out there are targeted at guys - for women, sometimes it's actually more effective to add 1-2 reps to equivalent routines targeted at male muscle development.

Kinda nifty, hey? :D

I haven't tried the bands although they look interesting and haven't really done bodyweight exercises either....These are the machines I'm using right now and the weights at them:

bicep curls 3 sets/10 reps at 37.5 pounds (using both arms at the same time)
seated cable row 3/10 at 60
inner thighs (adductor maybe?) 3/10 at 180
outer thighs (abductor??) 3/10 at 100
obliques (a seated pull where you twist your torso) 3/10 at 65
ab crunch (seated where you pull weights forward) 4/12 at 75
seated chest press 3/10 at 92.5 (pushing with both arms at the same time)
back extension (pushing backwards against weights) 4/12 at 190
seated leg press 1/12 at 310, 1/12 at 330, 1/12 at 350, 1/10 at 370 and 3 reps at 390

this plus stretching takes about 45 minutes

EDIT to add: i'm working on strengthening my abs, core and upper and lower back muscles in the hopes that it will prevent or minimize anything else from occurring

Holy geez, now I feel lazy. :( I really enjoy band/bodyweight stuff because it's A) cheap and B) more or less impossible to drop heavy stuff on yourself ;). Personally, I have horrible posture, so I make it a priority in my workouts to target the upper back (pulling) and posterior chain (glute). I've never heard of the back extension machine before....hmmm...(off to research :))

Are you working obliques for stability, or just as an extra exercise? Have you experimented with any erector spinae specialized movements? (eg. seated good morning, single arm rows, etc.)

I haven't experimented with any of those and not sure what they really are...I do obliques because it's a core muscle group and I feel like my back needs all the help it can get LOL

first, nice write up on muscle growth, defining. :)

and to add to this... did you see what just happened to brandon lily? so depressing. he is not natty, so obviously that was a huge contributing factor to his accident. his quads completely separated from his knees. he is likely permanently out of the game. he has come back from injury before, but none so devastating...

http://www.powerliftingwatch.com/node/27108

http://youtu.be/2U2KPXrfai4

it made my stomach drop to watch it.