Sort of working... sort of not!
 

Ok. So. (heavy sigh! - I apologize in advance if this is too lengthy!)

I've been at this calorie counting thing for two years now. 39 lb down. Not too shabby; I feel much better than I did at 192. But since Thanksgiving, I've been "accidentally maintaining" ...I hate the word plateau, but that's what it is! (ugh) :rolleyes:

Throughout my journey, I've adjusted my calorie count by 200-250 as was needed along the way, & I'm in "no rush" to get to my 140 lb goal. HOWEVER! - :( ... lost one lb since T'giving?!?!?!? Come on! - that's pretty pathetic. (altho, yes, better than gaining!-but that's not my gripe here)

Anyway, I've noticed that I've been "extra hungry" lately - like the past couple of months. Yes, I've been eating too much. Yes, it shows on the scale (3-5 fluctuations where it was normally 1-2 lb fluctuations). I hit 153 in March & lost nothing in April. Now it's nearing end of May and I'm 155....156, 155, 157, 156, 158, 156, 157, 155, etc. (Yes I weigh daily; no I'm not obsessed with the scale.)

IN THEORY - I HAVE GAINED 5 POUNDS. Blah. :(

I could go the normal route & "cut back" on calories (again.) For awhile I was averaging 1300-1400, but like I said - feeling hungry. Not just a day or two of hunger, but two months (almost 3 now). So I upped my calories to 1475 - 1600. Apparently that's "too much". ARGH! - sometimes it really IS a total PITA to count calories. :tantrum:

So I thought... maybe it's time for me to TRY SOMETHING NEW. Maybe IF (intermittent fasting)... But OMG, I 'm absolutely TERRIFIED to do so. :stress: So scared that I will gain even MORE weight. And then of course, spiral out of control & be back at 192... or fatter. :(

Other than losing weight, my main goal is to get off the weight loss merry-go-round. Stop with the lose/gain/lose/gain syndrome. Give up the yo-yo-ghost. In other words... LEARN TO EAT LIKE A NORMAL PERSON. No more binging! Control that sweet tooth! I feel like it's never going to be in my grasp; I'll always fight it. Right when I feel like I've truly got a handle on things, I find myself over-eating, be it healthy food or whatever. Eating a 6oz chicken breast instead of a 4oz, because 6oz is what I have. Can't "not eat" that extra 2 oz. :sorry:

So I've been SORT OF attempting the IF. A couple days here & there, just to see how it works with my regular lifestyle/routine. I find skipping breakfast not too difficult. BUT - by 9am I'm SO FREAKING HUNGRY that I cannot focus on ANYTHING but food. :?: Then I get a headache if I don't eat something. So I eat something. Nothing too big - just a small bowl of oatmeal or a power bar or something - usually right around 250 calories. This usually tides me over til lunch - which I normally have at noon, but during IF I find I can go until 1:00 or 1:30 - sometimes 2:00. My basic lunch is 480 calories.

Come dinner time?.... I'm OFF THE CHAIN. So hungry that I want to eat everything in sight. EXTRA helpings of dinner (normally about 600 calories, which includes a sugar-free dessert) plus a snack before bed. So see? NOT REALLY WORKING.

I'm really tired of dieting. I'm tired of maintaining at a weight that is NOT my goal weight. And I'm really tired of all the thought, planning, and effort I put into thinking about food all the time. HELP! or just shoot me now. :stars:

First - this will sound odd - but I am so used to seeing your posts around the forums, sharing such smart advice, that's a bit reassuring to know that ALL of us absolutely run into troubleshooting issues. :)

You didn't mention your macros. Have you tweaked them, too? i.e. trying low-carb, high-protein in the morning (or at lunch, or whatever). In general, it seems like upping protein and fat can be satiating - does that work for you?

I calorie count too and don't really explicitly do low-low-carb (I tried it and it didn't seem to speed up any loss), but it does seem moderating carb intake -- and more importantly, the timing of carb intake -- shows some additional benefits for me above just straight calorie counting. My macros also have ~50% fat.

I'm hoping JohnP comes in here with some smart comments. One other thing that pops into my brain is doing a "refeed" to reset your leptin levels, but I don't know how valid that stuff is or if it's just broscience.

What about leaving the calories alone, experimenting with macros as suggested above and incorporating weight lifting into your routine?

Refeeds have definitely been my key to getting where I am, so I don't think they're broscience... but it's also largely dependent on current training and bodyfat levels. They're generally much more beneficial and measurable for someone who is already quite lean.

Well, I've been weight lifting. But admittedly, not quite routinely enough the past few months. (once a week is not sufficient, IMHO) Yes, heavy weights (I've never been a pink-dumbbell kinda gal!) Walking tho - always with the walking, (two dogs, twice a day most days, plus some walking around my work in the middle of the day) and it's swim season now, so I'm swimming again. Occasionally yoga - helps with the joints of my old-ladyishness, heh.

Doesn't make much difference with me. I hate to say it, but maybe my body is just DONE with the whole weight loss issue. I hate that. Cause I don't FEEL done, dadgumit.

Can someone please explain re-feed?? I haven't heard of this! Thanks. Sorry OP I don't have much to add, I was stuck for several months recently and I decided to increase my workouts [I added running 3-6 miles a few times a week, finally able to do so after quitting smoking], and I cut down on alcohol [less happy hours, only one night a weekend etc]. I finally noticed changes about a month into these changes but I am not feeling more hungry so I can't quite help with that part...

Could it be that IF is not for you? My mother, for example, would get nauseated if she skipped breakfast and seriously ill if she skipped breakfast and lunch. I'm not quite as extreme, but I find a big breakfast sets me up well for the day. I aim for 500 calories at each meal and an extra 250 to 500 in snacks, depending on whether I'm trying to lose a couple of pounds or simply maintain. By and large this system keeps the hunger dragon at bay, though some days are simply hungry days and I have to get through them. And there isn't a day when I don't feel I could eat twice as much and still feel comfortable.

I've kind of accepted that I'll never be a "normal" person when it comes to food. It will always be a struggle, some days/weeks/months/years more than others.

Freelance

I'm going to preface this by saying, this may or may not work, but it's what I would try if it were me. I would take a set amount of time, maybe a week or two, of eating at or above maintenance calories. Don't eat whatever you want without tracking. Keep tracking, just raise the calorie goal way up there. After the time period is up, move your target back down.

I don't know if this is the technical definition of a refeed, but I don't think they're broscience.

^This^. I've know of people who have done this and it worked, and based on my own experience, it works.

It seems counterintuitive, but try raising your calories to 1700-1800 or so, and eat at that level for two weeks. I would advise not weighing yourself during that time as it is possible for the scale to show a gain simply because there is more food physically in your system. Also, if you can, switch up your workout routine a bit. For example, perhaps you can add in a more intense workout (doesn't have to be longer, just more intense) a couple of days a week. After two weeks, lower your calories back to your current level. Stay on that a week and then weigh yourself.

It may be psuedo-science, but I really believe that the body adapts well to most things, including calorie levels (which is one reason I like calorie cycling---btw, have you tried doing that?). Increasing your calories for a while and then going back on losing calories seems to "fool" the body into letting go of the weight. I think it's worth a shot.

Finally, and this may not be the case (but "just in case"), are you tracking everything? I don't know about you, but I know that I have slipped into "picking" mode during the past month or so. If I go into the kitchen, I'll grab some raisins while I'm waiting for my coffee to brew, or I'll give my dog a bit of peanut butter as a treat and I'll take a bit of it from the jar for me, too! Or I'll take a few more bites when cooking than are really necessary to "taste" the dish. You get the picture. All those add up.

With IF many people have more success EASING in to it. If 9 am is when you are starving, just try eating 15 minutes later each day. But when you DO break fast, BREAK it. Eat a full meal. Dont try to eat something small to tide you over to the time you really break fast. That just leads back to constant grazing.

And maybe you would be better with your window at a different time. It doesnt HAVE to be late in the day

Or, alternatively you can get many of the IF benefits by simply consolidating your meals. The push for meals and snacks doesnt work for everyone, I was always hungry because I never ate enough in one sitting to be satisfied. I do better with 2x 700 calorie meals than I ever did with 2000 calories spread out. Even 3 meals for me works better than meals + snacks.

One of the things I am seeing with your IF plan that might be an issue is you are trying to use IF but also keeping your meals tiny. You might be less off the rails hungry if you ate a bigger meal earlier. If 1400 is your limit, try for 700 and 700 - just see what happens. Or even 600 and 800. Think big.

One other thing I have found SOMETIMES works if I am just crazy hungry all the time is to radically change up my diet to something totally different for a couple weeks. If I am low carb, go low fat for a bit instead. Paleo, go vegan. I started trying this when I figured out WHATEVER diet I started my hunger would drop initially and then creep back. I found what worked BEST for me most of the time and that is my baseline, but if i am getting hungry on that, going radically different for a couple weeks seems to help. When whatever the new thing is leaves me unsatisfied again I switch back to my baseline plan

If one is not losing at one's current calorie level, increasing those calories isn't going to somehow cause weight (fat) loss. Fat is lost when there's a calorie deficit below maintenance-level. Increasing the calories above that level will only result in the excess calories not burned being stored as (more) fat. I never could grasp how physiologically one's body would lose weight by eating more. I'm all for that if it does work.

I agree with Tricon. I have never seen any REPUTABLE medical journal articles or websites confirming that upping calories can lead to greater weight loss, and believe me I've looked. I've only found such claims on fitness websites hosted by personal trainers or on sponsored sites.

According to the WeightWatchers research team, if you follow a very low-calorie diet you may lose weight at a slower rate than expected (because of a slight metabolic slowdown), but you will still lose more quickly than if you eat more calories.

Anecdotal evidence doesn't convince me, because there are a lot of coincidental reasons the scale could show a lower number after an increase in calories, and people who don't see such "losses" would be less inclined to talk about their experience.

F.

I'm not saying do it forever. I'm saying do it for a week or two, let your body reset a little bit, and then drop the calories again.

Weight loss is a lot more than just decreasing calories and getting results that way. If it were, we'd all be exactly where we wanted to be because it would be simple math. There would be no plateaus to speak of.

Refeeds have been shown to be very effective in a lot of cases. A refeed is typically referred to as raising calories, mostly in form of carbs, for a short period of time (eg 1-2 days) and then resuming with a caloric deficit. What a lot of people here are describing is more of a "diet break" which has also been shown to be very effective. Either way is effective because it raises your body's leptin levels back to normal, increases your metabolic rate slightly, and actually can cause your body to release stored water.

Once I started doing refeeds, I started to get really lean. My avatar is me about 3-4 pounds heavier than where I am now, which I achieved and am maintaining using that method.

You can do a quick Google search and find about a bazillion examples and testimonials of it working in addition to what the folks here have said already.

Refeeds are not needed unless you're already lean and trying to get leaner.

Having said that - a diet break might be exactly what you need BeachPatrol. After two years of dieting I think a break would be very beneficial.

Rather than eat over maintinence I would estimate what your maintinence calories are and ease into them.

You can read Lyle McDonald's excellent article on a full diet break but the short version is it gives you a mental break from dieting and can help to reset hormone levels.

^^ Either way, it's just one suggestion. One thing to try, and if it doesn't work you'll be no worse off than you were to start.

besides what is the bigger problem? the weight loss stall or the constant hunger?

Refeeds may or may not help break a plateau but they can do wonders for the constant hunger.

There are a lot of theories as to why the hunger can build but sometimes whatever it is a refeed of a few days can fix it.

I agree and also would like to add that I find that reducing carbs in my diet helps a lot with hunger. When I have too much carbs (particularly carbs found in things like rice, pasta, potatoes), I feel hungry within an hour or two. With more protein and vegetables, I find that I don't have hunger or cravings as much.

If you're trying IF, I suggest eating dinner earlier if possible (I eat at 6pm), so you can break it earlier at 10am. Also, don't do the full 16 hours at first if you're finding it hard. Start at 12 hours and work your way up an hour a day. It gets easier. I only started incorporating IF in the last week and the first day I was starving but it got better. I found an earlier dinner helped as I could break my fast earlier.

I've been stalled w/my weight loss for SIX months now. And while that is completely aggravating and quite a discontentment, it's that hunger that I feel is "undoing me". :?: I mean, I'm SO AFRAID I'm just going to super-binge & go off the deep end from there. I don't wanna do that!! :(

I've gotten some good responses here, and I have decided to continue trying the I.F. but to ease into a little more instead of attempting a gung-ho approach. I like the idea of eating two 700 calorie meals; that would be just about perfect for me; however, when I eat a lot like that, I always feel "bloaty". One thing I've seemingly accomplished since I've been CC'ing is that I do "eat less" volume wise & don't feel so bloaty anymore. Except for the past 3 weeks or so. It's like that bad habit is sneaking up on me... little by little. Dagnabit! :mad:

As far as calorie cycling, I have tried that, and I found it difficult to maintain because I tend to "eat the same things" over & over & over, until I tire of them (it can literally take months!) then I find something else to eat.

And like freelance said, I too have never seen any REPUTABLE medical journal articles or websites confirming that upping calories can lead to greater weight loss, but I'm well aware of many people touting their success by using this method, which leads me to believe that it may not have a lot of science backing it up, but for some people, it does seem to work. And yet, I just cannot believe that "eating more calories" will help me lose any weight, because I'm a FIRM believer that weight loss is achieved through a calorie deficit. But I also believe it's as JossFit said: Weight loss is a lot more than just decreasing calories and getting results that way. If it were, we'd all be exactly where we wanted to be because it would be simple math. There would be no plateaus to speak of. And yeah... here I am... STUCK on a plateau for 6 months & now recently gained 3-5 lb.

I swear, I don't know whether to scratch my watch or wind my butt! :dizzy:

And I think maybe JohnP has a good point about "not dieting" for a while; but that REALLY terrifies me...like on a monumental level - so fearful of completely falling off the wagon altogether. (sigh!)

At least I have lifted weights 3x this week. I do feel better about that. :^:

Have you considered hiring a nutritionist? Sometimes people get what I call "paralysis by analysis" where they just are too afraid of failure, so they do nothing.

Conversely, you also have those people who switch "diets"/"programs" so frequently that they don't really give anything a chance to work.

Oftentimes it can be a good idea just to give up that control and place your faith in someone else for a while. Trust that person to do the calculating and worrying for you, and just do what they say for a while.

Read the article before you decide what to do.

Also I would reccomend reading up on Leptin because in my opinion it is a huge part of your problem.

As for being terrified of a diet break I don't know why you would be. You've proven yourself capable of dieting for six months without much if any effect. THAT takes way more will power than maintaining. Plus, you're going to have to maintain someday you might as well get a little practice.

I'll just ditto what John said - you've been at this for 2 years without regaining all the way back up the scale, so you might want to try having some faith in yourself. This is something I've been working on a lot lately, trying not to see every off-plan bite as a portent of doom. I keep telling myself that, even though I'm still 20+ pounds from goal, I'm a lot better off than I was.

I too got tired of being hungry and am trying the Fat 2 Fit method of eating just below maintenance. My weight loss is slow to nonexistent lately, but (again to echo John), I think it's good training for how I'll have to eat from now on. Like freelance said, I'm never going to eat like a normal person but that doesn't mean I should give up and go back to eating like a crazy person - as tempting as that is sometimes!

Good luck with whatever you try next. As several people have said, don't be afraid to take a chance. Believe in your own strength!