Most serious fitness people are big proponents of eating "clean": very lean meats, fibrous veggies, limited whole grains, no extra fats, no processed foods. I'm thinking about people like Tosca Reno.

As much as I'd love to eat this way, I have tried it numerous times and just can't get into it.

My q: Assuming the exercise component is on track, is it possible to get cut like Tosca by simply counting calories? Or is the "clean" diet aspect a necessity to really lean out?

Thanks for any insight. I just need to figure out if I can go back to calorie counting or if I have to keep trying eating clean.

That "cut" look is due to a strict fitness routine. Dieting will take the fat off but it will not contour your body like weight lifting & cardio exercises. Remember the golden rule:

Diet for weight loss; exercise for fitness.

Whatever diet you choose, as long as you'll stick with it, the weight will come off. And if you're doing the proper exercises for that cut look, you'll get there. Not overnight, but it'll happen!

For the most part I agree with this. However, I would say that you really need to eat a good amount of protein to substain and build your muscles so you really need to pay attention beyond just calorie counting. Also, when you say you don't eat clean what do you mean exactly? There's a big difference between the occasional meal of processed foods/treats vs. eating them at every meal.

I would like to also add that if you are not eating very clean that it might be a very good idea for you to be taking a multivitamin to make sure you're getting in enough vitamins every day.

As always, I'm going to have to suggest you read the New Rules of Lifting for Women. It discusses the protein component there. I'm not a fan of all the protein powders (I'd much rather eat steak ) but there's still a lot of good info there!

I'm not an expert, but I'd assume that the extra sodium/fat/sugars that are in processed foods may not lend themselves to getting a very lean looking body. I don't think it's impossible, but you may find it more difficult.

Yeah, I wonder what you mean by not being able to eat clean - is it a few products or is it every meal is a frozen meal?

Truthfully, I mostly don't eat clean because I don't like the taste. I can't stand the taste of the standard components of a clean diet: chicken breast, brown rice, oatmeal, fish, whole grains, fruit, sweet potatoes. Fatty foods (cheese, gravy, fried foods) and white carbs (white pasta, white potatoes) are my biggest weakness.

I do like veggies though. And I eat whole grain breads.

If I could eat "clean" with dark meat chicken, white rice and broccoli, I'd probably be ok.

Yes, it's possible within reason.

Believe me, Tosca is just yet another person hocking the same thing over and over again with a new name - "clean eating" is just a meaningless term. After all, how is protein powder "clean" in any way? Another buzz word. A lot of false information circulates in the bodybuilding/fitness circles - ie. 6 meals a day, no fruit, no dairy, no carbs, etc.

Getting "cut" ie. a very low body fat percentage with the muscle mass to support the look (which makes a person look atheletic and lean) is optimal when eating high protein in a calorie deficit and lifting very heavy to preserve muscle mass.

I suggest reading the following:
Lyle McDonald
Leigh Peele
Alan Aragon

And NOT people like Tosca Reno if you are interested in getting "cut". Sorry, Tosca's plans are simply common sense (although she does present some information that is false) and fine for the average person (although many of Oxygen's meal plans are too low in calories & dietary fats, that seems to be improving lately though).

Whole foods and the most nutrition for your buck is optimal when getting very lean - you can, theoretically, do it with junk food too. But you will probably feel like crap and it's not optimal. I used to maintain around 15-16% (which is very low for a female) with a weekend diet of vodka and diet coke. But I felt like crap (I was 22, what can I say? LOL I was partying a lot).

Even Adela Garcia eats steak on her competition diet plan - google her pics and compare her to Tosca

I think you have your answer right there.

I eat A LOT of red meat (granted I try to buy cuts that are lower in fat/calories). I know it's a totally dieting but it works well for me. Cheese you can eat but try to find cheeses that aren't too bad for you (do you like cottage cheese, for instance?).

Personally, I don't eat a ton of fish (way too expensive here!) but I do take DHA daily. If there's something I absolutely hate, I'm not going to force myself to eat it but since you say you like veggies why not increase your veggies combined with red meats? It's certainly a lot better for you than white carbs (that, honestly, don't provide much of any nutritional value at all). I won't say you have to cut them out completely but maybe work on portion size and make sure you're getting the vast majority of your calories from veggies/meat (and cheese can be in there too as long as you don't go overboard).

Right now I'm working on increasing my fruit intake but I always try to eat it with some sort of protein or dairy (cut up in cottage cheese or yogurt, usually). I'll also add cinnamon many times to give it a bit of flavor. On my own I probably don't eat enough of it but I'm consciously trying to eat more.

I'm not an expert on this but from what I have read, looking cut is partly about genetics (esp. for women) and partly about getting your body fat level down below a certain point. Doing the workouts is really just the beginning of it. So at some point, it is most likely going to come down to the kind of calories you eat and not just the amount.

How about you read up on IF? Sites like Leangains are made specifically to inform people who want to have a low body fat % and be 'cut'. There are a ton of articles for you to read through and they are very interesting. I'd say check it out and you might be surprised!

There's a difference between general healthy eating and following a highly restrictive diet, and what you're describing is the latter. I'm on a low-fat diet for medical reasons (gallstones) and even I don't subscribe to this "no added fats" business. Humans need fats, albeit in moderation. As for wholegrains, they are excellent things and there has been huge amounts of reputable research into how fantastic they are for health.

You sound like you have a pretty good idea of how to eat healthily, and as everyone's saying, apart from making sure you get sufficient protein, the rest of what you're after is about fitness rather than diet anyway. If you really feel that you should be eating more wholegrains, my main advice is to try different types. I had to go through quite a lot of brown rices before I found a couple that I like. In my case, it's brown jasmine rice for most cooking, and red Thai rice for putting in soups. As for wholewheat pastas, I've found that the fusilli (spiral) shapes are the only ones that work when you're having pasta as a main, and the better-quality ones are noticeably more appetising (in the UK, this translates to Napolina bronze-cut fusilli instead of the Tesco stuff). I also have some wholewheat gomitini (baby macaroni) which I put in soup. I don't know if it would be as good as the fusilli on its own, but in soup it tastes absolutely fine.

As for everything else, there are so many foods around that I see no reason why you should eat oatmeal, sweet potatoes or fish if you don't want to.

Agreed. I think I eat sweet potatoes a few times a year and I never eat oatmeal, and I eat a moderately clean diet.

For the example of dark vs white meat, just off a quick search (I'm definitely no expert), it looks like the skinless, boneless dark meat has comparable calories to the same amount of white meat, and a little more fat. I'd consider them both to be clean because there is no additional chemical processing involved, regardless of which side of the chicken is being eaten, but that's my opinion. I also eat cheese

I happen to like chicken breasts and so I do eat quite a bit of them. However, I also love chicken thighs, so I eat those too (boneless, skinless of course). I eat fish because I like it, not because someone told me I'm supposed to. I also eat turkey, pork, beef, lamb, deer, elk, and whatever other meat I want. For me it is about the cut of meat, not that animal it came from. I buy lean meats, but I do not restrict myself to chicken breast. I would be so bored. I just buy the leanest version I can get of whatever it is I am wanting to eat.

As for the grains, as has already been mentioned, not all brown rice is the same so consider trying some others as well as reds. You can also consider mixing your rices. That is how I got my step-daughter to eat brown rice. I mixed a little in the white rice and gradually changed the percentage until it was all brown. There are also other whole grains that you can try. If there is a Whole Foods near you then go check out the bulk goods section there. Try some whole wheat couscous, quinoa, bulgar wheat, wheat berries, groats, amaranth, steal cut oatmeal as a savory side with dinner, etc.

I eat lots of dairy too, yogurt every morning and cheese almost every day plus milk. When I eat eggs I eat the entire egg, I like my yolks. I also eat some processed foods occasionally. I try to keep it as low as I can, but I'm not perfect.

Now, with all of that said, I still have a layer of fluff covering it, but I promise I am able to build the muscles without eating the perfect diet and when I finish taking off the fat I will have that look, it is already starting to show on some areas of my body. I am getting it with weight lifting and other exercise. I am taking the fat covering off of it with my diet. Could I lose the fat faster if my diet were perfect? Maybe, but it is coming off with my diet as is and I refuse to torture myself. Also, my husband eats what I eat when he is home and mostly processed garbage when he is at work. He has a 6 pack, fwiw.

Google dirtycarnivore and you will see some amazing results of cutting carbs. Super nice people to boot. In the research I've done no, I do not believe that it is possible to get that cut look without properly feeding your body.

At a certain point - depending on a variety of factors - you may need to take additional steps. Cycling calories, or macro nutrients or both as one example.

However, the most important things are:

Caloric deficit
Adeqaute protein intake
Low volume lifting routine
Sleep
Patience

The above steps probably make up 90+ percent of one's resuls when it comes to getting "cut".

You may need to retrain your taste buds, at least partially. For many people, it is an acquired taste. I would say that I eat very clean, but by that I mean a minimum of processed food. For example, I don't eat brown rice at all - because I can live without rice entirely. I do prefer white chicken meat to dark, but I refuse to live on chicken breast only. I eat, without guilt, red meat as well - lean cuts of both pork and beef. I do eat a lot of fish (because I like it). And what's wrong with oatmeal? Have you tried steel cut oats? I sweeten them with a bit of protein powder (because typically, it is my Monday-Wednesday-Friday breakfast after 45 minutes of swimming), I add a lot of cinnamon and blueberries, strawberries and red currant (or black currant, when available). It's a killer breakfast. I bet you would like it if you tried it.