Is it really true, or just another flowery excuse?
 

I hear it and read it daily, from Oprah to Dr. Phil, from 3FC to friends, family and neighbors...but is it true?

As a formerly super obese person, I felt comforted in hearing that my weight issues stemmed from my predisposition to care for everyone except myself. I was fat because I didn't take time for me, but spent all my efforts caring for my family. But wait? How could that be? I certainly had time to eat 5000+ calories a day...isn't that *me time*? I certainly had time to read up on every weight loss pill, diet, and surgery. I had time to daydream about being thin, make charts , graphs, and journals that I never followed through on. I had time to take all the necessary long steps at personal hygiene that takes an enormous amount of time when you are an enormous person. I didn't encourage my kids to play sports because I didn't want to have to go to games, I didn't encourage my kids to exercise, because I didn't want to have to do it with them. I didn't want to have sex with my husband because I was to tired/fat/embarrassed. I didn't feel like cooking so we ate out at the greasy spoon a couple times a week, hit the drive through when we were in the city. Lets see...I did laundry and made sure homework was done and that's about it.

So who was I spending all this time taking care of? Do we REALLY get fat because we take care of everyone except ourselves? REALLY?

Lori, you keep bringing up all these uncomfortable topics that challenge us! (don't stop - please!) I suppose I might be able to justify my lack of exercise as due to time constraints, but you're absolutely right - I found time to stay at the table for extra helpings, I found time to start my car and drive to a fast-food place, and I found time to do all those things you did - start journals, read self-help books, draw up detailed menu plans. Was it Einstein who said, "Nothing happens until something moves?" For me it was the difference between thinking about doing something, and just plain doing something.

i think there are as many reasons for why people put on weight as there are people who put on weight.

i put on weight for a multitude of reasons, including a lack of self-respect. but i also genuinely love to eat and to cook. i lived a sedentary lifestyle. i am also certain that i have a few emotional defense reactions going on, but i'm really working hard on that part of the picture.

isolde

I'm really tired of hearing people talk (or write) about the ONE "secret" to weight loss. If there were only one cause to obesity, we would have had a "cure" at least 60 years ago. Even for myself, if there had been only one cause, I would have solved it more than 20 years ago.

If we stopped treating obesity as a "simple" problem, maybe we'd have a better success rate.

For me that has been true. Most of my life I addressed my weight as if it were "simply" a matter of willpower and calorie restriction. Eventually I learned that while calorie restriction is essential, there are ways to make the calorie restriction a whole lot easier and less unpleasant. Finding those tools to make my life less stressful while losing weight has been a whole lot more effective than spending most of my day trying not to eat (while feeling starved).

Well mine wasn't spending time on others and not myself, mine was just not spending time on anything really. After 40 (gulp) years of soul-searching, mine's a fairly simple formula. Extreme sensitivity (allergy, really) to carbs equaling addiction/lack of control/able to gain very easily/hard to lose PLUS depression. The weight gain didn't cause the depression but it certainly enabled it. Concurrently, the depression didn't cause the weight gain directly but it prevented me from being able to do anything about it. I knew WHAT to do (Atkins) but depression kept me from being able to just do it.

There's no 100% answer for everyone. So, for a lot of people, it's really true. And for others, it's not. Same way with what eating plan/lifestyle works. "Eat less move more" works for some (but is way oversimplification for those of us who need to lose 50, 100, 200, on and on). "Calories in calories out" ditto. What works for me is low carb, not low fat or low cal. But I would never have the arrogance to suggest that any ONE of the above is the ONLY possible way to succeed. Everyone has to find what works for them.

Wow Lori Bell, you always start great threads. :)

This is a very interesting topic and one that I've wondered about myself. I think the only concession I can make to this theory is the point that when you are doing all of those things for yourself that keep you fat, you are disrespecting yourself, and not "caring" for yourself. Assumably you wouldn't treat others in this way, so from that point of view you are caring for others and not yourself.

But this does seem like a lame, partial interpretation. It's so true that so much time is wasted on destructive behaviours when one is obese. And then Dr. Phil and Oprah always go on to say that when you care for yourself better, you care for others better. So if you care for others better while living a healthy lifestyle, it follows that you weren't doing as good a job of it before, right?

I agree with you that this may be just a story we tell ourselves. I think I used to have "people pleasing" behavior that could have been interpreted as caring for others more than myself, but I definitely had more than enough time to care for myself once I got rid of some of the activities you mentioned (like daydreaming about being thin etc).

I think that some people--mostly some women--use food to make up for something they are not getting elsewhere. It might be love, it might be appreciation, it might be time to pursue their own desires. Certainly using food that way could lead to being overweight/obese, but making a blanket judgment about cause and effect isn't warranted.

For example, I became obese even though I don't have children, don't have to take care of a husband or boyfriend (or my girlfriend--funny how that works! ;)), and pretty much have everything the way I want it. So--go figure! :dunno:

Jay

It may be true for some people, but certainly not all.

When I got fat I wasn't taking care of anyone, really. I was in college living it up. My only responsibility was me. It's just that I gave in to all my simple wants: good food, good tv, and good video games. I was lazy physically and completely wrapped up in self indulgence.

Wow!
 

Thank you so much for this thought provoking post! I have never actually thought about it this way before. You are so right Lori Bell. How many times have I made the excuse that I don't have "time" to workout b/c of how much I do for others? And yet, I find time to make nachos and sit in front of the TV with them...I find time to obsess about losing weight...I make charts too, and food diaries, and on and on. The truth is, even with my busy schedule I can carve out time to actually DO something. I need to less time obsessing and feeling sorry for myself, and be honest in evaluating how I'm using my time. THANKS FOR THIS - I NEEDED IT. :)

Once again LoriBell - you're on to something.

Okay, I am gonna swim against the current here and say it was true for me to a point. I overcompensated in many areas of my life before. I couldn't just put up some Xmas lights--my display had to be the best in the neighborhood....I couldn't just dress my kids--they had to have the latest line from Gymboree from head to toe AND matching underwear...I couldn't just be involved with my kids school--I had to be the room parent that did everything and paid for everything...meanwhile I was making myself and many of those around me miserable! On top of that I always felt like I had to be the life of the party--the girl that talked to everybody, etc. Now, I am so anti all these things I mentioned. And you know what? I feel amazing and I feel like ME!

I guess you could say I was grossly imbalanced before.

I don't get it. I don't hear the message that everybody is fat for only one reason and that taking care of everyone else is that reason. I don't even hear that as "a" reason all that much. I hear stuff like eating junk food, portion sizes, carbs are too high, yo-yo dieting, couch-potato-ness, etc, etc, etc, far more often.

As for it being a reason for some, why is that hard to believe?

I feel like borrowing your "Really?"

Hmmm. I am guilty on this one also. But lately, I'm starting to give attention to my health also, especially that I am assigned to the night shift.

I'm kind of mixed on this one. I know that those with kids/jobs/elderly parents spend aLOT of time looking after everyone else. And often, they put themselves last on the priority list. And I can see how easy it would be to just "let the kids order pizza" instead of insisting on a healthier meal that is homemade. and " If you both just stop FIGHTING in the back seat, we'll go for ice cream later tonight". Moms seem to get the last rotation in the shower in the am, the burned piece of toast, the mangled piece of cake, the minivan schedules, the grocery shopping...So perhaps there ARE those out there who don't look after themselves as they should. Dietarily AND exercise-wise, especially when one feels "guilty" for leaving the kids at home with Dad so she can go to the gym...

BUT, on the other hand, perhaps the act of caregiving really serves as an excuse after a certain point. "I'm going through the drive-thru (again) and ordering a double Big Mac because I'm tired and stressed looking after everyone". "I NEED this double caramel mocha-ccino-latte-frappe-supreme with whipped cream right now. GOD I'm tired." "If you don't finish your mac and cheese, I'll eat it so it won't get wasted."

I think everyone has to find their own path. Some never find it because they get swamped in rationales, excuses, and will argue STRONGLY to keep their limitations ("I can't eat salad because noone at home will eat it and I'm only cooking once." "I just don't have the time to cook dinner all the time." "I hate to sweat so I won't exercise." "Diets don't work for me so it is impossible for me to lose the weight." "I'd lose the weight if veggies were cheaper." "I can't resist the ads on tv and eat too much junk. It isn't MY fault -- they shouldn't be allowed to advertise".), and those people win. They get to keep their limitations and their excess weight. Others really take a hard look at themselves and DECIDE that they WILL change and FIND A WAY TO DO IT.

For me, I sat on my A$$, ate Frito-Lays and chocolate and junk, and didn't move. I chose to be large because I chose what I ate and I chose how I moved. I also have chosen to be healthy, and have found a way to do that which works for me. No excuses, here!!!

Kira

Every time I hear people on Oprah saying they put themselves last I always picture new mom that are having trouble balancing their new lives, so maybe them putting their selves last means they are not losing their pregnancy weight, or the gained a few pounds because they are looking after children instead of exercising. In these kinds of situation I can see how"I put myself last" applies.

I do not think it applies to someone like me. I gained well over 100lbs because I ate way too much, I was extremely lazy and I just plain didn't care. IMO those are the things that cause most people to become extreamly obese.

I love that, sums up my years of endlessly spinning in place without accomplishing anything - dreaming of weight loss.

I'll answer your question with some questions:

How does making a weight loss chart satisfy your soul?

Does reading a diet book or researching weight loss without following through on the information make you feel relaxed, calm, secure, confident?

When you were eating 5,000 calories, did you feel loved and valued, emotionally satisfied, or something else?

Does daydreaming about being thin make a person feel that they are worthy of being cared about?

Does not encouraging others around you to do things so that you don't have to be embarrassed or uncomfortable make you feel more selfish or more good about who you are, like you're fulfilling your potential and helping others to fulfill theirs?

Just because you aren't spending time on other people, does that mean you're truly spending time giving yourself what you long for, deep down?

If you weren't spending time taking care of others, what were you doing? Were you REALLY "taking care" of yourself, or was it more a matter of existing?

If your behavior related to simply not caring if you were fat, then were you really, truly putting yourself first? If not, then what were you doing?

I think that some people do take care of others and use food to try to make up for the lack of care for themselves. A distraction or guilt or feelings of worthlessness or any number of motivations. But that doesn't have to be the only reason people get fat.

Ufi, some very excellent questions.

Unfortunately, I think some of us can sometimes end up feeling like a weight loss chart satisfies our soul, or reading a diet book or researching weight loss without following through on the information makes us feel relaxed, calm, secure, confident.

Obviously, it's not really true. But denial, the power of resisting change, and the subconscious can do crazy things. We think we feel satisfied or relaxed or loved because we so want to feel that way without having to change things.

Just posing the questions, however, shines light on the denial.

I have had a hard time putting a finger on what I wanted to say, and this isn't eloquent, but - here goes...

I think, for me it is more about my "head" values than my time.

I DO think that I put others first and that DID keep me from losing weight. It wasn't as much about the actual day-do-day actions and whether I had time to put myself first - each and every day I DID have the time.

It is more about what priorities I set. At first it was my family, then it was family AND career. Taking care of me wasn't even on the radar most days. Now, COULD I have taken time to exercise and eat right - of course! But, without my head being there - it wasn't going to happen. I had to change my priorities (brain activity). THEN I could change my actions.

I'm there, but honestly - my family and my work are affected. When I take time to exercise, DH gets stuck with making dinner. When I leave work on time, some things just don't get done.

So, I do think there is some truth to this argument - not from an analytical perspective, but from a psychological one.

There is another way to look at it that a lot of us might identify with. Last weekend I came home from running errands and was hungry. I needed to get some veggies in so grabbed the bag of celery, snapped off a stalk and started eating it while standing up and putting dishes away. It suddenly hit me what I was doing. If I was trying to help my sister/daughter/mother with weightloss, I would have taken time to cut the celery into sticks & arrange it on a plate with the FF ranch so that it looked appealing, and had them sit down to eat it. But because it was just for me and I was busy, why bother?! I didn't conciously think that when I began eating, but it's just a habit to not treat ourselves the way we would treat others. It IS important to take care of me,to make time to pack appealing nutritous lunches, to do those extra little things that can make a big difference in our weight loss success. Since that day, I'm trying to be nicer to "me" and hoping that this will help me finally succeed in my life-long battle with this weight.

I do think there are many people out there for whom this applies - if it hadn't rung true for many, it wouldn't be such a popular idea.

It did not apply to me. I actually live a fairly self-centered existence. Not in a bad way, but in the way that most of my time is spent on me. I'm single, no significant other, no kids, parents in good health, self-employed, but taking a bit of a break from that. The only living things depending on me are my two dogs and the plants in the yard. I've got nothing but time for me. And yet I still managed to fill all that free time with self-destructive behavior.

I agree with Kaplods, if the answer to obesity were simple, it would have been solved long ago.

Like a lot of other people who have already posted on this thread, I have a lot of reasons to believe that obesity is not being driven by one factor, but by an interaction of many factors (context/environment, hormones, childhood/upbringing, social pressures, learned helplessness, lack of knowledge, etc.) But I totally agree with Julie here... why is it hard to believe that this could be a factor for some (and I would argue, many) people, even though it doesn't appear to be one for you?

I really liked this.

really like your post as well, Ufi.

though it seems seriously off kilter way of thinking to me now, I used to feel like if I couldn't eat anything I wanted, in any amount I wanted, I was depriving myself. Exercise felt like a punishment. I didn't have kids to take care of either. Food just meant lots of things to me that it shouldn't have.

It can get complicated, losing weight: habits, ways of thinking, biology, sociology, yikes. Takes real concentration and focus.

In my case, taking care of others doesn't fit into the popular equation of women as caregivers. I've got no children & no pets & no plants. But there was definitely an element of self-abnegation in it.

I spent a lot of time "taking care of business." I worked late almost every night. If you came to me at 5 PM with something you really needed done -- no problem. I'd stay till 7 PM to finish it. I would be perfectionistic about it, too. If I had to go home & log back on from my laptop at 9 PM, I would do that, too.

I did not say no often enough. I did not guard my personal life as I ought to. A company is just an entity. It is not grateful for all one's efforts. It just uses you up in the course of business. So, in my case, taking care of others meant taking care of the company & thus of coworkers, even if not of children or elderly parents. I mean, I didn't bring in cookies for coworkers or listen sympathetically while they recounted their struggles with their love lives or their kids (though I have done that a little bit, too), but I was helping them get their work out when they had a soccer game to attend or something.

To relieve the stress & to "treat myself" for all the hours I was putting in, I ate pretty much whatever I wanted, in whatever quantities I wanted.

But a bigger part of the problem was a sort of obliviousness on my part. I always say that I lived "from the neck up." I forgot I had a body & I didn't seem to know how to care for it. I kept it very clean -- I think most fat women I know are cleaner & well-groomed than the thin ones, as a form of overcompensation. But in other ways, I treated it worse than I treated the lapptop I worked on or the antique furniture in my apartment. I was very ignorant about its workings & about the consequences of my choices. I had this very delicate thing entrusted to my care, but I never bothered to read the manual or to educate myself about it. I just took it for granted. And fretted because it wasn't as pretty as others. As if prettiness & thinness was just mysteriously **given** to other people, without any effort on their part, and since I clearly wasn't one of the elect, there wasn't anything I could do about it. I guess I had a sort of Calvinistic notion of predestination of fitness & attractiveness. And I decided that since I couldn't be pretty, I would be smart & useful & hard-working instead.

I really like the post of COUNTING DOWN. I agree. I had time before it was more about the priorities I set--not necessarily the time involved to do those things.

I am doing the things for ME that I didn't do before. Putting my nutrition, exercise and sleep at the VERY top of my priority list--no matter what--works for me. All else has to follow that. Otherwise, it just doesn't happen. It really is the best advice I could give anyone regarding weightloss.

Not everyone is fat because they overeat. And unfortunately, if you really look at life when folks are faced with crisis it is often easier to sacrifice caring for themselves over "neglecting" others.
I think all of us being here proves that there is no simple answer to why we get fat and we are certainly proof that it is not easy getting healthy and losing excess fat. It takes effort and committment. And sometimes - a lot of encouragement, sometimes from strangers.

I disagree. Barring medical issues, why else would one be "fat" (using your word here) if they're not overeating? I really think the very bottom line for being overweight is - is consuming more calories then you need - overeating.

Of course there are tons of different circumstances that lead us to - overeat. And granted, they are not as simple as "the bottom line". But again, barring medical issues - it always comes down to ingesting more calories then we burn.

I agree with rockinrobin. Of course, there are medical issues that can cause weight gain, such as thyroid conditions and hormone conditions, plus use of cortisone or derivatives. The list can go on. But for people without these issues, it really is a matter of eating more than one burns with activity.

I used to think that I didn't eat more than other people, but surprise surprise, once I actually started tracking what I ate, and found out just how high in calories some foods are, I had to give up that story.

But I also agree with borntobefine that getting healthy and losing excess fat is hard work, no matter what the reason for gaining.

Jay

Medical issues or not, I think that one can argue that a person who is overweight, is by definition overeating (even if they are only eating 1200 calories, if they're overweight that means that those 1200 calories are more than they "need.")

That doesn't mean that even morbidly obese are eating tons and tons of food. The difference between meeting and exceeding caloric needs can be very small. Finding ways to burn more and eat less can be complicated.

I never believed in metabolism differences when I was younger. I KNEW why I was fat, I ate too much, way too much. A lot more than anyone I knew. What was harder to find out was why I was so extremely hungry all of the time. Mindful eating or eating "only when hungry," was useless advice to me, because I was always hungry - physically hungry often even when my stomach was obviously full. Dieting was torture, because no matter how hard I tried, all I could think about was how hungry I was. To lose weight, I had to abandon almost everything else.

For me, finding the contributors to my weight, did help me find tools to fight. I (eventually, when I found clues as to where to look) found that hormonal hunger and carbohydrates were large factors. Changing to a birth control that minimized hormonal drops, and to lower carb eating made dramatic changes in my ability to control hunger and lose weight. Too bad, my metabolism now is much lower and I am eating much less. What I need to eat to lose one pound, would have once allowed me to lose 8 or more in the past. I can look at it as being cursed now, but I see it more as not realizing how lucky I was. I do, of course, wonder what my life and weight would have been if I had found the hormonal and carb connection when I was in my twenties (I knew the hormonal connection, but never had a doctor willing to endorse using bc to eliminate periods).

It may seem like there is a fine line between identifying factors contributing to weight loss and making excuses, but really there is a very simple distinction. The first makes weight loss easier (helps you develop tools and techniques to succeed) and the second inhibits weight loss efforts.

In essence "excuse" is in the mind of the beholder.

When I thought my "only" problem was eating too much, and moving too little, but didn't look to any of the factors that made moving more/eating less more difficult, my only tool was "willpower," which ensured that I spent more time and effort "white-knuckling" it, instead of trying to find ways to make the job easier.

It's like if you were told that you just weren't trying hard enough to jump over a wall, so you keep trying to put more and more effort into the jump, while ignoring an assortment of climing tools a few feet away.

For me it really is simple..... I got fat because I LOVE food; I still do. The difference today is that I don't eat a pint of Ben & Jerry's I eat one of the 3.6 oz. cups. I eat a cup of frozen grapes not a cup of cashews (only have 6-8 of those). I have a Special Dark Kiss not a king size candy bar. Most days I eat clean but if I want something that most consider "bad" I have it. Last weekend Mack and I shared a small DQ Blizzard and I was completely satisfied and I was down for my WI Monday.

I decided this time I would not exclude ANYTHING from my diet I am truly learning how to control what and how much I eat and this is a plan I can live with for life.

just an excuse
 

I really like eating, ALOT, and I seldom feel satisfied after eating. I feel full, or even bloated, but seldom satisfied.
I don't know why this is.
I did not grow up in poverty, I never really went hungry.
I was in fact able to overeat for years before I started to put on weight.
I still have not learned to eat appropriately.
(hence my ongoing problems and lack of recent weight loss)
I am a caregiver, (both of family and as a profession) but I have never felt that is the "reason" I got fat.
I still do not enjoy exercise/activity.
I enjoy the effects, but seldom enjoy the "process"
If being on 3FC burned calories, I could get thin fast tho! (LOL):D

It seems like if you do something you enjoy, you should feel satisfied by doing it. That makes sense, doesn't it? I like to read. After I've spent some time with a good book, I feel satisfied. Sooooo, if you like to eat but you don't feel satisfied (as opposed to full), wouldn't it make sense that something other than the actual act of eating is what you're seeking? A sense of reward or you time or immediate gratification or SOMEthing, YOURthing.

I was thinking about it, and it seems to me that food can be a quick and cheap way to feel better. A treat that can be had for a couple of bucks or less. I've been trying to think of anything that can compare, both in price and in quick response. I can't.

Sex :devil:

Protected. :chin:

Jay

It can make you feel better - but only temporarily, if it's the "wrong" foods. The "wrong" foods come with a big price tag - side affects, some longer then others - weight gain, headaches, sugar levels all wacky, guilt, brings on cravings, etc... That's why it's essential to find foods that do double duty. You're satisfied while eating them, and long after you're done chewing - no unpleasant side affects.

Eating can be used to self-medicate. There's some evidence that cravings and binges most often include foods that affect neurotransmitter production or utilization. Food can be a quick "fix."

Short-term rewards become habits easily BECAUSE they work in the short term. Eating, shopping, gambling, drinking, sex, drugs.... they all can be habit-forming, and can become destructive.

Food is probably the most commonly abused substance in North America, because it's socially acceptable (sometimes socially mandated), affordable, available and entirely legal.

I think acknowledging the "useful" side of eating (or any "addictive" behavior) is key to addressing the problem. I think when people say "I don't understand why I _____ even though it's bad for me," makes people feel out of control, weak, and helpless. Not knowing what you get out of a behavior makes it that much easier, I think, to keep making the same mistakes over and over again.

If you know that you eat (or for sake of argument any other self-destructive behavior) when stressed, then you can make plans to "do somethine else" at the first signs of stress. Having the alternative plan in place makes it more likely that you'll use it.

I think that's where the distinction between making excuses and recognizing contributing factors/triggers is made. If you aren't using the knowledge to make and use alternative plans, then it becomes an excuse for why you didn't. The information doesn't change, just an individual's use of it.

Quote:

Eating can be used to self-medicate. There's some evidence that cravings and binges most often include foods that affect neurotransmitter production or utilization. Food can be a quick "fix."

I saw a program on I think the Discovery Channel about 2 years ago, where this was very true. They hooked up drug addicts and gave them their drug of choice to mark brain activity and did the same thing to people who binged. The bingers, of course, got to pick their favorite, most satisfying food. The brain activity was the same, like a food-high. The people who binged were then given different foods and the brain scans did not detect the same level of activity.

It was very fascinating. And no wonder my favorite restaurant is Olive Garden. Just their slogan alone makes me feel good and want to go there on EVERY birthday for the last 3 years. "When you are here, you are family". I have ordered the Tour of Italy and ate every single bite, several of the bread sticks and the salad and even ordered a dessert and coffee. Most other restaurants, I am taking home to go boxes. I'm not sure, but I think this could technically be classified as a binge. Because yes, I certainly LOVE pasta and bread and all, but there is no way in HE double hockey sticks that I could eat that much at home. I think it was the "family feeling" that it had somehow emblazoned on my brain. Which is weird because binges often occur under more negative situations. The only other times I have been known to go so extreme is Thanksgiving and Christmas dinner. I eat until I am absolutely sick.

Oh dear, not the Tour of Italy! Did you happen to see the recent news about overly salty meals from the Center for Science in the Public Interest? http://www.cspinet.org/new/200905111.html I'm not sure what I think of them as an organization, but their announcements do garner attention.

"Olive Garden Tour of Italy (lasagna) with a Breadstick, Garden Fresh Salad with House Dressing, and a Coca-Cola: 6,176 mg of sodium"

Oh my goodness, A breadstick, meaning one. I probably ate at least 3! I did skip the coke and opted for sweet tea, as if that helped at all. I am glad you spared me the calorie content, LOL. I will be doing "homemade" birthdays from now on, for sure. I hope to have lost most of my weight by my birthday in September and there is no way I will mess that up by going to that place again.

It is very eye-opening once you start paying attention to what you are putting in your mouth. I am learning day by day that if it didn't come from the ground, it's more than likely no good for you. Even then, I am concerned with pesticides and such, which is why I started a little mini-garden a few months back. It is actually relaxing and my one tomato I have gotten so far was the best tasting tomato I ever had.

Maybe it isn't food you are after.