Hi everyone,

About 10 years ago I took up weight training after I quit smoking and didn't want to gain weight. I did cardio (at that time called aerobics ) 3 days a week and weight training 3 days a week. I belonged to a small gym that had a separate women's weight training room (The women were welcome to use the big room as well but had their own room). The big room had Nautilus and all the newest circuit equipment whereas the women's room only had dumbbells and "old" Universal equipment. So I started working with it and good results even though I wasn't sure I was training "right". I tried to follow a book called Hard Bodies by Gladys Portugues and Joyce Vebral. It is out of print now but it was good to help me "learn" something about training (though I didn't do it exactly) I did it for about a year then I was injured twice outside the gym and from going back too early, twice inside the gym. I stopped training, didn't gain weight immediately but got flabby, then I started smoking again. Needless to say, after I quit smoking again I didn't do any exercise and gained 50 lbs (3 years ago this month). After bemoaning these 50 lbs for 3 years, I started back to weight watchers on 1/3 and joined a gym the beginning of February....a small women's gym. I do circuit training and cardio 3 days a week (not 3 each, I do it all on 3 days only).

For the past 3 years I have tried different weight loss plans with no results so I think that the key has been that I need to add exercise and so I have finally made a commitment to it, both timewise and mentally.

This time I am trying to do it "right". I think that I had good results last time but could have done better if I lifted in sets. I think I have good form and that is important. I see so many women at my gym relying on the momentum of the weight to lift and I go very slow and try to make sure it is *I* who is lifting the weight...not momentum.

Anyway, I am already feeling good results but my weightloss is still slow. I read different things and have different questions and would like tips/techniques for doing weight training for lean, healthy muscles. Also I'd like to talk about doing cardio on the same days you weight train (best way to do that etc). I don't know if anyone else is interested in this, but I'd love to have some people, both new and knowledgeable, to talk to about using weights to slim down. Anyone?

Susan

Hi Susan!

I think it's wonderful you're using weights! So few women realize the immense benefits of adding weight-training to their exercise schedule -- not only for fat loss, but toning too! Not to mention that muscle takes up less space + burns more calories than fat!
I'm not doing separate weight-training/aerobics workouts, but working out using The Firm tapes, which are a blend of weight-training and aerobic exercise. I love them and highly recommend their tapes -- of which there are about a billion, so you can't get bored! I do follow the Firm's guidelines of alternating lighter, faster workouts with heavier, slower workouts -- but I do do weight/cardio blend workouts on consecutive days. I've been seeing wonderful results, and look forward to futher advances as I progress.

I'd love to hear more about your program + how you're doing with it. I'm a HUGE fan of weight-training + the benefits of gaining muscle, and would be happy to discuss it anytime!

-copperblu

Hey, Susan!!! Welcome. I learned the power of strength training for weight loss about 15 years ago when I started and inadvertantly lost 20 pounds! I was off and on for many years and started seriously with it again about a year ago. So far, I've lost 28.2 pounds and have been at goal for 6 months. My personal goal is another 12.8 pounds.

Check out this site: http://www.stumptuous.com/weights.html

You should do a 5-10 minute warmup, wieghts next, cardio last, should you want to do cardio on the same day. You do weights before cardio becuase you don't want the cardio work to pre fatigue the muscles you'll need for lifting (and lowering).

Sets--3 sets of 12 reps of the heaviest weights you can lift with PERFECT FORM (you knew that, right?!)

Between sets--instead of resting, stretch the muscle you just worked. It will help your range of motion and reduce your chance of injury.

Exercises--to start, one exercise per body part is fine. Do upper together and lower together and move from biggest muscle group to smallest. I do quads, hamstrings, back, chest, bicept, tricept, shoulders, abs. After a few months, you can work up to two exercises per body part. I first added the extra exercises for my lower body and about a month later added them for upper.

Eating--I found if I ate at the high end and a few of my exercise points, I lose better. I'm in 18-23 range and eat about 25 points per day and in the past month have lost 1.7 average pounds per week. See what works best for you.

That should do it to start and should take you between 30 and 40 minutes per session for ST plus your cardio.

Hope this helps.

REC
176/147.2/153WW/size 10 (~135)P

Thanks so much you two!!!!!!!!!! I was hoping there were other fans of weight training here! I really think it is the fasttrack to fitness......

Do you think that muscles have "memory"? That is, if you weight trained once before, you get into shape faster? That is what someone told me but I was wondering if it had to do with muscle memory or just the fact that you know what you're doing and can get into "form" quicker.

Rec, what about pyramid sets or modified pyramid sets. I was looking at some of my old books and one that I have by Rachel McLish (I can't find the Porteguese/Vedral book) recommends pyramid or modified pyramids. Yes, no/maybe?

I have lots more thoughts and questions but I'll let it at this for now. Thanks again!

Susan

Susan,

Acutally, I do pyramid sets also. (For those that are curious, you increase your weight a little on your second set; first set and third set are at same weight.) I like it because it is more challanging. I cannot do all three sets on the second set weight and it is more challanging than doing all sets on the first set weight. I feel that this has jump started my strength gains. (And, no I didn't bulk up, just gotten stronger.)

I've also done drop sets, which may happen on the third set if I'm more tired than I thought, and chose the wrong starting weight. Basically, if I cannot finish the set with the weight I started with (on that set), I do as much as possible with perfect form and drop the weight down slightly to finish the set. Sometimes I have to drop the weight twice. That way, even if I goofed on choosing the starting weight (for that set), I still do my 12 reps.

Who ever thought this non jock, marching band lover/ gym class hater would love strength training?!!! I still have aways to go, but I am sure I look better, feel better, and am healthier for it. I got a lot of encouragement from the url that I posted, also.
REC

Great topic! Thanks for all of the info! I have been going to the gym and have always been intimidated by the weight room. I just started weight training 3 weeks ago (decided there was nothing to be afraid of!), and can really notice a difference in how I look and feel. It doesn't seem to have impacted the scale numbers at all, but hopefully that will change soon. I will incorporate some of the suggestions given into my routine. Thanks again!

Thanks REC! Do you ever do half reps (people used to call them cheater reps) at the end of a set, especially on the leg press or leg extension? That BURNS but I am not sure if that is still in favor (as you can see, I'm comparing what I knew 10 years ago with what is going on now)?

susan

Luv summer,

Sometimes you can definitely gain weight or stay the same when you begin weight training. It's the muscle weighs more than fat argument. I find this is true. When I was weight training before I was in great shape, small size in clothes but definitely you could not tell from the scale that I was in great shape. You will lose inches and weight training is AWESOME to hit problem areas. Did you do measurements before you started? If not, do them NOW so that you can see the difference in a few weeks. You are right, it is great....!!!!
Stay with it...and us!!!!

Susan

Susan No I've never done, nor heard of, cheater sets. Is that a 4th set at a higher weight? Or, just adding 6 more reps to your normal 12? On every set? I don't think I could squeeze another rep out. If I did, I should be increasing the weight. LMK, please.

LuvSummer Like Susan said, most times you'll see and feel a difference in your clothes and body before you see it on the scale. That is why my personal goal is a size 10, not a weight. I like her suggestion of taking measurements. Do that monthly.

I was so embarrased when I first went gym a year ago, being about the heaviest person lifting weights there. So what? If I was going to look good, that's what I needed to do for ME. Everyone is into themselves, anyway, so I don't think they noticed me.

REC
walking, yoga, ST
176/147.2/153WW/size 10P (135ish)

Rec,

There are basically 3 kinds of cheater reps. The first kind are half reps are also called burns because that is what they do! It is when you know that if you bring the weight back you will not get it back up (you are at exhaustion and you know you won't be able to stay in form if you try one more rep). So you keep it up there and do a few quick, partial reps with the weight up there). When I was lifting way back when, these were controversial. Some people said that when you can't lift anymore without perfect form, it means it is time to STOP. Others said you could squeeze out a few good reps with the cheater reps. For me, I sometimes try it on a leg extenstion or leg press just to make sure I'm really at exhaustion. Another form of cheater reps that were not really controversial was using other muscles to get the weight up there once you were past exhaustion but using the muscle you're supposed to be working to bring it back down very slowly (this is usually good for 1 or 2 more reps). The third method of cheating is forced reps: doing 1-3 reps by pushing the muscle through the exercise with your hands or having a partner do it. Sometimes I do this on the adductor/abductor machine. I push out 1-3 more reps by pushing my legs out with my hands when they can't do it on their own power. With all forms of cheater reps they are only supposed to be done for 1-3 reps and usually when you're working a target muscle in a problem area. If you keep doing them every workout, you will reverse their positive effect eventually. They are for those days you go to the gym energetic and committed and feeling GREAT and want to get the best workout possible and maybe push the envelope a bit.
I know that when I was hanging around other people who weight trained, they used to argue about this (mostly the burns) all the time. Some people would say why torture yourself after you are truly done and others would say it was good to do on a good energy day.

Susan

Susan--

I asked my personal trainer about cheater sets and he said it's something that serious (6 times per week) body builders do, but he doesn't recommend them for us "normal" folks.

He did say that there was some good for the cheater sets in which someone "helps" you just enough to get the last rep in. He didn't like the others becuase once you broke form, you had a higher chance of injuring yourself.

REC
176/146/153WW/size 10 (135ish)P
walking, yoga, ST

Thanks REC,

I don't use them much but sometimes I do try to push those legs out one more time.

I'm still trying to figure out my correct weight and number of sets. I do like to go up in weight but sometimes I am not done by the last set. I wonder if I should go up another set. On some exercises the first weight seems low but I know that I can't get 15 out of it if it's any higher.

I bought Body for Life yesterday and I know I read all this before......you use BFL training with WW points? Do you do the strict food plan that he recommends? I couldn't find the portion size but I assume that since it's so much like Slimdown that it is the same (Protein the size of your palm, carb the size of your fist). I do believe a good protein/carb balance is essential in weight training but I find the BLF just a bit unrealistic for the long term. Do you use the BLF supplements? Do you think they make a difference in weight training?

Thanks again REC!!!!

Susan

Susan

I did do the 20 minute aerobic thing a few times and did like that because it only took 20 minutes. However, seems like that's more geared to working on machine (treadmill, stepper, etc) and I really prefer to walk or bike outside. It was good, though, when the weather was really nasty a few days this winter. If I was to do it ongoing, I'd invest in something that would beep every minute, so I don't have to spend the entire time looking at the clock.

For eating, I use WW.

Perhaps in the future, when I'm without a personal trainer (I love mine, but he's EXPENSIVE) I'll do the workout part. I just got my routine changed yesterday and next week I'm going back to two exercises per body part, superseted. (I've been taking it easy the past month because I hurt my knee.) Summer's coming in 3 months and I only have 10ish more pounds to lose and now want to work really hard to look good in shorts and sleeveless tops.

If you cannot get the end of your last set out, why don't you do what I do--drop set. I sometimes have to do that for the last few reps until I get strong enough to handle a new higher weight. When I just cannot do any more with the correct form, I drop the poundage one notch and finish the set with the lower weight. It'll still feel like work.

Good luck!

REC

Hi Rec,

thanks again. What do you consider a superset to be?

Also, I have read about 7 different ways to do leg presses recently. I used to just do straight ahead (feet shoulder width apart, sled up as close to the plate as possible, feet slightly sticking past the top of the plate, push with your heel), then turn out and then turn in. 3 sets each position (for a total of 9 sets with gradiated weights). Then I heard other things such as put the sled (seat) all the way back, don't turn your feet different ways.......etc......just a bit confused.

I did prefer the vertical leg presses but I have not seen one in many years.

I had a distracted workout tonight. There were 2 teenage girls in the gym and they kept banging the weights and running from machine to machine and I kept losing concentration. Arrrrrrrrrrgggggggghhhhhhh.

Thanks again!
Susan

Hey, Susan. Too bad we're on different coasts. I'l love to see some of what you're doing in the gym.

For leg press, I just use the only one in the gym. I usually change my feet position from shoulder to narrow with each set.

Superset. Doing a set of two different exercises, either for the same muscle group or for opposing muscle groups, without taking a rest.

Instead of doing quads(q)/rest(r)/q/r/q/r and then hamstrings/rest/h/r/h/r, I do quads/hamstrings/q/h/q/h and then rest. For upper body, I do back/chest/b/c/b/c , rest, and then bicept/tricep/b/t/b/t rest. Then shoulders.

This is a harder workout, but you still are resting your quads (for example) when you are doing your hamstrings. However, you're not totally resting, so the workout is more intense. Also, I really don't rest at all. Instead, during the "resting period" I stretch the muscles I just worked out, keeping away pain, lessening chances of injury, and increasing range of motion.

Starting next week, I'll be going back to two exercises per body part, supersetting opposing muscle groups and stetching between supersets: q1/h1, q2/h2, b1/c1, b2/c2, b1/t1 b2/t2, shoulders. Only 3 more months til tank tops and shorts.