Hi all,

I'm Dawna and I am new here at LWL, but not at 3FC.

I am new to lifting. I started working out with a trainer about four weeks ago and am an absolute convert. I have joined gyms and used their workout programs and equipment probably 50 times in my life, but have never felt I made any progress. After only a few weeks with my current trainer, I cannot believe the changes I can see (in what I am able to lift) and feel.

By way of history, I had a duodenal switch type of gastric bypass surgery 3.5 years ago and lost 160 lb. Although I exercised (water aerobics) during that time, I definitely lost muscle. I lost the weight quickly, over about a year, and have remained fairly stable since that time, but obviously never gained back the muscle I lost during that quick weight loss phase. I didn't realize how much until I started working out with Curt. We are really working on building core strength, and hip flexors are also a weak area.

One of my questions is about nutrition. My trainer is seriously down on dairy products. He really pushes lean protein, low glycemic vegetables and oatmeal, although yesterday he added brown rice to the mix, as well as protein shakes and lglutamide. I have read recently that dairy helps with weight loss, and as a result of ongoing malabsorption from my surgery, I need to get calcium from dairy sources as well as supplements. Is dairy really an evil if you want to build muscle? I would really prefer to adopt a balanced diet.

Also, as I am trying to lose a few pounds, I am having trouble figuring out what to eat before a workout. I eat lunch at work around 11:30, and then usually have a snack around 3:00 or 3:30, before hitting the gym at 4:30. My sessions with Curt at at 6 and 7. My afternoon snacks of raw veggies and a cheese stick just aren't cutting it. I just cant perform like I did before I started cutting back. Yesterday, I tried eating a carb about an hour before I worked out, which helped with strength, but I think was too close to workout time. Any advice?

Thanks

Dawna

Hi Dawna and welcome to LWL! Wow -- your story about finding a great trainer sounds a lot like mine -- in retrospect, one of the smartest things I've ever done (and the key to my weight loss) was finding a wonderful personal trainer who taught me all about weightlifting and nutrition. That's knowledge that pays off for me every day.

Your trainer is probably down on dairy because of all the sugar it has in it. Even though it's natural sugar -- lactose -- it's still sugar to your body. If you look at a carton of skim milk or no sugar added yogurt, for example, you still see all these grams of sugar listed -- it's the lactose in them. That's why you don't usually see it as part of the "clean" diet that a bodybuilder eats (they avoid ALL sugars -- sometimes even fructose). BUT there's still a way to get calcium naturally while avoiding all that lactose -- ta dum! -- cottage cheese, the weightlifter's friend! A serving of my Light N'Lively cottage cheese (which I just finished) is 80 calories, 1 g of fat, 6 g of carbs (3 of which are sugar) and 11 g of protein. And 20% of my calcium for the day. I also eat Dannon carb control yogurt, which is 60 calories, 3 g of fat, 3 g of carbs (2 are sugar), 5 g of protein and 15% of my calcium for the day. I often mix the two (just did for my last meal) and so get 35% of my calcium for only 140 calories, 16 g of protein and 5g of sugar. Maybe you could ask him about those options?

And about eating before workouts -- my opinion is that you have to eat or you'll crash. Your body needs some energy to draw on, especially if you're going to push yourself and work out with intensity. I don't see anything wrong with eating an hour before working out so long as it doesn't upset your stomach while you're in the gym (some people can get a little queasy, but not me ). Perhaps you could try having a little protein and some carbs to keep you going? And I've always read to follow up a workout with some protein and carbs -- what does your trainer advise you to do?

Good luck, Dawna, and let us know how you're doing!

Another reason that serious bodybuilders won't eat dairy even in the form of cottage cheese, is that it tend to make people retain water a little, which "smoothes out" a bodybuilder. It's not going to make a bit of difference in terms of muscle building. Non-fat cottage cheese is a fantastic protein and calcium source. As long as you are not trying to get your body fat down below 12% and see muscle striations, it doesn't matter!

Welcome to LWL!

Mel

I would double-check any dietary changes with your doctor, given your medical history. Frankly, I am always very skeptical of nutritional recommendations given by most personal trainers, precisely because they do tend to be gym lore, specific to bodybuilding, psuedo-science, and heavy on fads instead of individually-tailored advice for average people, especially special needs people.

Funniegrrl's right -- it's always a good idea to check with your doctor before starting a new nutritional program, especially after WLS.

As in any profession, there are knowledgeable and not so knowledgeable personal trainers, good ones and bad ones. I'm not very comfortable broadly dismissing their nutritional knowledge as pseudo-science and bodybuilding lore and heavy on fads. In reality, many trainers have extensive education and training in nutrition.

Speaking from my own perspective, I learned far, far more from a PT about nutrition than a lifetime of dieting and Weight Watchers and doctors and dieticians ever taught me. I know beyond the shadow of a doubt that I would still be a fat and miserable 257 pound woman if I hadn't turned my life -- and diet -- over to a personal trainer.

I lost 122 pounds in a year and have maintained that loss for more than two years using the nutritional knowledge and skills taught to me by a personal trainer. I think that speaks for itself. Hopefully Dawna has found one that will guide her to her goals also.

Thank you all for your answers.

After reading here, I wondered why I saw so many recipes containing cottage cheese. Now I understand better. Fat-free cottage cheese seems a perfect solution for me.

I did speak with the nutritionist for my weight loss surgeon at about the same time I started seeing the trainer. Her advice was no protein drinks, and to eat a balanced diet, including fruits and dairy products. Basically, I am still malabsorbing some fat, and fat soluble vitamins (A, D, E, K). I supplement these religiously. For some reason, iron and calcium levels are also often compromised. Both also supplemented. Her view on protein drinks was simply that I didn't need them (from a WLS standpoint) as I was able to get in adequate protein from food sources.

I think that I will probably find a middle ground between the trainers recommendations and the nutritionists.

The trainer recommended adding a carb to the afternoon meal or snack, which is where the brown rice recommendation came in. He said six ounces. I don't do conversions well, but am thinking that is 3/4 cup. Am I close?

Another question...how do you all go about eating healthy on the road? Is it possible to find decent food while you are away from home?

Thanks again,

Dawna

Welcome Dawna,

Some people here use protein powder (that are meant for making drinks) as a supplement to their meals because you do need protein to build muscles. Since I eat (and I believe most people here) every few hours, I have to make sure that I have snacks with me that have protein/complex carbs, if I am away from work but in the same area, I keep a cooler in my car.

I haven't had to travel since I've started eating this way but I believe you just have to make the best choices possible. If you stay in a hotel, try to get a mini fridge in which you can put some food. It isn't always perfect when you are away from your home and normal routine, but all I can say is make the best choices that you can.

Chiming in here real quick...

On personal trainers: Yup, there are some crappy ones out there, but there are also a lot of GOOD ones. (Our Mel, of course, being in the latter category!) When shopping for a PT, it's important to be a smart shopper - after all, you'll most likely be shelling out a significant amount of money. Krista of Stumptous fame has a great article on her website on "how to choose a personal trainer" that you can find here:

http://www.stumptuous.com/personaltrainer.html

(now if I lived in West Chester PA, I KNOW who I'd go to!!! )

I just don't think it's a good idea to paint one group of people or one profession with the same paint brush - KWIM?

On cottage cheese and protein powder: I've pretty much stopped using protein powder altogether - after 4 years, I just got burnt out on it. However, cottage cheese is definitely a STAPLE for me, especially this summer - it's been freakin' HOT here and cottage cheese is definitely a nice cool, no-brainer protein source. Generally, I buy a big ol' tub at Smart & Final (not fat-free though; I prefer Knudsen 1% in the pink container) turn it out into a bowl, and attack it with my Braun hand blender until it's smooth, then add Splenda, vanilla extract and a container of light yogurt for flavor. It's an easy keeper in the fridge at work and makes for a quick lunch or snack!

On the brown rice: I'm assuming your nutritionist means six ounces cooked (not raw)! Rather than eyeballing it, personally I'd use a little food scale and weigh out my portion, esp. the first few times. Rice is one of those foods that can vary in weight depending on how much water is absorbed during cooking.

Hi again, Dawna
When I travel, I always tote along a cooler with frozen chicken breasts, cottage cheese, hard boiled eggs, apples, cut up raw vegies, and home made protein bars or muffins (see the last few entries in the recipes thread). The Banana walnut and carrot muffins are lifesavers for me. They freeze easily, and thaw out in a baggie in about 2-3 hours. They can be kept in your purse unrefrigerated for about 8 hours if they start out frozen. I always try to stay at hotels like Embassy Suites or Extended Stay that have refrigerators and microwaves. It really is easy to make oatmeal, cottage cheese and cut up vegies in a hotel room.

If you are eating out, just make the best choices, as nelie said. Dinners: steamed or broiled fish with plain vegies (I usually cut starchies carbs after 2 pm), lean cuts of beef hold the sauces, etc. Salads can be ordered naked, or with the dressing on the side and do the dip and stab method.

Most hotels or restaurants will make vegetable omelettes with egg-beaters or just egg whites if you ask them. It's even on the menu in a lot of places.

That all having been said, there is a time and place in everyone's life when you need to just plain enjoy a luscious meal. As a wls patient, your portions and fat and sugar have to be watched, but don't tote along a steamed chicken breast on your 25th anniversary dinner!

Going back to the trainer discussion, as Karen said: as in any profession, the knowlegde and ability to communicate it runs the full gamut. You need to choose wisely, as you would with any major investment. You are investing in YOU. Your trainer should listen more than talk at the first session: he/she needs to know what YOUR goals and expectations are. Not everyone who walks into a gym wants to be a bodybuilder. That's really only about 5% of the overall gym population as far as I've seen. At my gym, we have 3 full time trainers: a 56 yr old competitive male bodybuilder who is one of the most knowledgeable and least egocentric people I've every met, a 23 yr old lunkhead football player who trains the teens and young males and couldn't tell you how to lose a pound since all he's ever worried about is how to find them, and me. I train everyone else: the rehab clients, the need-to-lose 20,30,50,100 pounders, the "oh my god I'm 50 and just gained 20 pounds" crowd, and the just want to be healthy folks. Nutrition was a major portion of my training, and my continuing ed (which all trainers are required to do to maintain certification) is in sports nutrition and weightloss.

Mel