well the FA forums ive been too certainly included a lot of fat fetishism and ppl using the FA movement to make it okay to be 800lbs and have your family be your slaves because you can't walk or wipe your own behind.

It is mostly fashion, but I love this magazine http://volup2.com/ - it is truly about beauty at any size, shape, etc.

I had a similar experience to kaplods. Finding the FA movement allowed me to shed so much of the self hate and shame I had that I had for myself and was what actually enabled me to get healthy. I finally stopped the cycle of self hated that led to me gaining so much. I am rather conflicted about it in total though because I also find that often it isn't about health and beauty at any size, but rather it is all about being fat. I think like many other things there is a great core message that people then take to extremes and proceed to bash other people over the head with. That part isn't cool.

Statements like these are what made me join NAAFA in the first place - people who "think" they're accepting of a person, while holding the vilest prejudices against them.

You ASSUME that all very overweight folks are eating cheeseburgers and pizza, and wouldn't touch steamed veggies with a ten-foot pole.

And you assume wrong in my case. Before I found and joined NNAFA, I wasn't avoiding exercise and vegetables. Instead, I was trying desperately to diet not just the way "common wisdom" dictated, but I was dedicatedly researching and utilizing the most up-to-date science.

Sad part was that the science AND common wisdom were both wrong.

It sickens me how many people still assume that because I weigh almost 300 lbs (and once almost 400) that I always eat Fast Food (have always hated it), have not been eating fruits and veggies (always have), and have sat on the couch all day (not until I became disabled).

What my life really looked like was having such intense PMS hunger that I felt starved on 5000 calories of whole foods (South Beach eating style) a day. Despite trying to hold to an 1800 calorie diet "that week" by way of white-knuckled willpower, I'd gain so much from that week that I'd have to spend the rest of the month (when the willpower would work) on a very strict diet just to get the PMS/TOM weight OFF - just to break even.

I've eaten what I understood to be a healthy diet, for as long as I can remember. Dessert being an extremely rare treat, no sugared sodas, no fast food (except when I had to resort to it, because of working two jobs, which I usually did unless I was going to school full-time then I only worked one full-time job)...

I ate a lot, because I was hungry 24/7, but I ate mostly whole grains, lots of fruit, lots of vegetables, healthy fats and carbs (though often too much of them). Even close friends and family assumed I must have hidden stashes of candy and chips, because "no one eats THAT healthy and stays fat."

I never gave low-carb diets much of a chance, because all the ones I tried had a super-low carb first phase, like Atkins induction. And at that carb-level, I got extremely sick to the point of passing out, and only carbs would make me feel better (I now recognoze the symptoms as low-blood sugar), but at the time it was proof to me that low-carb was truly as unhealthy and dangerous as everyone said it was.

Turns out the only diet I can control hunger and calories on (especially during "that" week, and even so only if I'm on my birth control) is a moderately low, but not too low, low-carb, virtually grain-free diet. Essentially a paleo diet.

But paleo is still not mainstream science. If I follow the advice of the mainstream scientists, doctors, dietitians and other "experts" as I always did (thinking it was the only responsible thing to do). I fail.

Once I was an adult and cooking for myself, I gained weight on restaurant food during my PMS/TOM (when I felt lousy and didn't want to cook - though it was usually what most people would consider mostly healthy food, except for chocolate which I only even like during my period. I usually chose chinese food, but dishes with lots of veggies or vegetable fried rice. General Tso's chicken was about the worst food I'd choose. I'd order it with extra broccoli, but the broccoli couldn't counteract the breading on the chicken).

What I didn't know was that I was eating far too much fruit and grains. Even though I was eating whole wheat, brown rice, quinoa... the grains were too much.

Ironically, it was my desire to be thin, and the foods I assumed were healthy (because the experts said so) that kept me fat. I had to learn that a combination of a low-carb diet and oral contraception was the ticket to getting control over my weight.

Too bad I learned it after my health and metabolism were trashed from decades of crash dieting (because my doctors were recommending crash dieting to me, not because I was ignoring their advice).

The calorie level I'm now eating just to lose a pound or two a month, is the same caloie level that once netted me weekly losses AVERAGING 5 to 7 lbs.

We encourage overweight people to follow extreme and unsustainable methods of weight loss, while discouraging exercise (at least in public where anyone might see their disgusting bodies in motion) and pushing foods that are believed to be healthy, but often only make the problem of intense hunger worse, and blame them when they fail for being lazy, crazy, stupid, or selfish.

If they're not losing more than two pounds a week, or 2% or more of their body weight, we tell them they're failing (despite the fact that almost no one succeeds at losing this much in the long run), and we tell them they need to do it alone, because fat is so disgusting and taboo, even talking about it is wrong.

There are still fat people who've decided they won't leave their houses, at least not except when they have to, until they lose all of the weight, then they're so lonely, isolated, and despressed because food is the only comfort they have.

And while there are some (but virtually no) fat women who have "decided" to become fat and helpless (it's almost never a conscious decision - rather overeating is a maladaptive stress-coping mechanism). But we don't judge other maladaptive stress-coping in the same way we judge overeating. Despite the fact that it's legal and less harmful to others in comparison to other maladaptive coping mechanisms such as drug and alcohol addiction, sexual addiction, and even gambling, shopping, and hoarding. Those all are addictions our culture has some sympathy for, but obesity and overeating, you're just an out-of-control, disgusting pig.

We're taught that asking for help and using support groups like Weight Watchers, OA, and TOPS is nearly as shameful as being fat in the first place (thankfully that at least is changeing). I joined WW for the first time at 8 years old with my mother, and for decades you almost never saw a man there - because guys aren't supposed to need help. Sadly that's still true. And the women who did go often were so ashamed they couldn't look anyone in the eye, or would admit that no one outside of WW knew they were trying to lose weight or were going to a weight loss group.

Much more common than the person deciding to make their family slaves to their obesity, are "feeder" mates and parents who want their child or loved one to be entirely dependent on them. Sadly some of the feeders will leave their spouse once he or she has become dependent.

The ignorance surrounding obesity is killing us.

re:
 

It's really like any other movement out there - trying to promote "you are worth it" in a world of people telling you that you aren't. Whether it's because you're fat, gay, black or something else, if you are the minority, someone will always be there to tell you that you're worthless.

That particular aspect of the the movement I agree with. Everything else I don't particularly care for.

^^^ This post right here just taught me so much. Thank you, Kaplods.

Well this thread has sure been an interesting read...

I grew up with a friend who was really overweight as a teenager..She was probably about 260-270 pounds and only 5`10 at the age of 16... We were friends and i liked her personality...but she lived every day like the next day she would die..In other words: She ate whatever she wanted and couldnt care less what other people thought about her or about what she ate...I loved her for the fact that she had such a good confidence and self-esteem and being around her, made me feel more able to accept myself..but i admit that even as her friend.. i would mutter under my breath or as i was walking away from hanging out.. i would say : Oh my God... i hope i never get to be as fat at her...She is so fat.

While i can appreciate groups that have an acceptance for fat people and for being fat in general.. I will NEVER have an acceptance for FAT. Yes i even admit to having made fun of fat people behind there backs before, people who were much bigger then me. In fact, this one show i watch: Hells Kitchen..There is a girl on there who is much larger then all the other girls..and i hate her just because she is so fat..

In fact, my ex was 350 pounds when i dated him when i was 17 and i was much much smaller then and watching him eat, made me feel like barfing up my lunch because i felt so guilty about how much HE was eating...I couldnt stand to think that he was eating all that ....

Now before you go `booing` me for being a fat hater. Let me make one thing clear: I HATE myself. I do not love myself. I have no love for my body or being this fat. I will NEVER accept myself as the weight that i am...I used to be really really thin and while i recognize that being the weight i was when i was 16, isnt likely anymore..I know i will never accept me as being fat..I can not stand it!

Let me make another thing clear: I have suffered from eating disorders and body dysmorphic disorder... i still suffer from body dysmorphic disorder...The reason why i point these two things out are because i dont think that i have a very healthy perspective on weight in general..Its an area that is very difficult and frustrating and i tend to jump from extreme to extreme with things..I become super obssesive when i start on somthing like weight loss or working out...I have no found balance..and i have not found self-acceptance..

While i love my friends for WHO they are...I can not love them for the size they are. I will not pretend to love someone as a size 26 or whatever...and i say this because i will NEVER love myself at that size either..I dont expect people to be skinny..but i know that I cant accept them at that weight, because i wont and cant accept myself at that weight. I dont ever feel like its right.

As i said earlier..im rather screwed up in the head in terms of diet and exercise and body image and stuff like that...just my 25 cents and how I personally feel...I KNOW for a fact, very few people feel like that.

No doubt this wasn't meant as insensitively or as intentionally hurtful as it came across. Though it was quite shocking to read such an insensitive, overgeneralizing, bigoted and cruel statement made here of all places, or that such thoughts could come from someone who truly understood the actual causes, contributing factors, and impacts of obesity.

Such "well-meant" insensitivity can often be more harmful than the outright hostile abuse, because how can you argue against someone who doesn't realize they're being hurtful, and how can you argue against someone who thinks they "just have your best interests at heart."


Not just some of obesity is caused by burning fewer calories than calories taken in - ALL obesity is caused that way.

The problem is it's a bit like telling a person in poverty that the solution to their poverty is earning more money than they spend.

Some people get a "pass" for taking in more calories than they burn, if they have a bizarre enough health problem. The problem though is these health problems are inivisible, and invisible health problems are generally dismissed by the ignorant as non-existant.

The cultural norm is to assume that most obesity is caused by laziness, craziness, and stupidity - it becomes ok to assume that obese individuals are to blame for their own fate, regardless of their circumstances.

Assuming that "most obesity" is voluntary is bigotry. It's an understandable bigotry, because we're all taught to think that way. We're taught to blame the victim and make assumptions about their irresponsibility (and most of them false, or true but misleading).

Unfortunately, most of what we're taught to think about obesity and its causes is absolutely wrong. I spent over 30 years blaming myself, and following the common-sense and state-of-the-art science, and failed because I didn't understand the mechanism of my own obesity. Even though I put more effort and work into studying weight loss than I did in earning my masters' degree in psychology (which I pursued as much to figure myself out as to help others).

Yes fast food is one of the major contributors to obesity, but it's by far not the only one, and there are billlions of obese folks with no apparent unusual health problems who put herculean effort into weight loss only to fail and fail again, not because of a defect in character, willpower, or effort - but because we've been sold a bill of goods by the diet, medical, AND fast food industries.

But we blame the victim (even when it's ourselves - ESPECIALLY when it's ourselves) and we make it impossibly difficult for a person to reach out for help, because when they do, they face ridicule and condemnation if they can't acheive what we consider "normal" weight loss, even though it's far from normal to lose weight without many mistakes, stalls, and even regains.

If you're not losing at least 2 lbs a week, many doctors will tell you that you must not be committed enough, that you must be cheating, that you're "sabotaging" yourself, even though the average weight loss is far, far smaller than 2 lbs per week, as a culture we've determined that you're failing if you can't achieve this holy grail and litmus test of weight loss.

Some weight loss programs will even drop you from their program if you're not losing fast enough or consistently enough (accusing you of cheating, whether you are or aren't).

And crazily enough, it's actually less socially acceptable to be seen DOING SOMETHING about your obesity than it is to be seen stuffing your face in a restaurant. As a culture, we ridicule the obese, while feeling sympathy for the substance abusers, the financially irresponsible, and sometimes even will justify and sympathize with murder more than obesity.

You can beat your wife and kids and get sentenced to anger management classes (and if substance abuse is invoved, you will be given substance abuse treatment) at the taxpayer's expense, but if you commit the crime of obesity, there is no help for you, because you (unlike the perpetrator of domestic violence?) are entirely responsible for your weight, regardless of your situation.

If you're in poverty, you may only have access to unhealthy foods, foods that increases your hunger exponentially... but you will be condemned if you yield to that hunger... because even if you only had twinkies in the cupboard, you could have eaten one twinkie and could have lost weight (you could have also lost your hair, your gallbladder and your life... but hey weight is more important than all of those things anyway).

It's absolutely ridiculous that 2/3 of Americans are overweight, and yet weight loss support groups are more rare than support groups for schizophrenia, cancer, divorcees, mother's of multiples.

It's sometimes easier to find a birdwatching club than a weight loss support group.

And now with shows like The Biggest Loser, people are starting to believe that losing 15 lbs a week is normal, and anyone can do it.

The unwitting bigotry against obesity is often much more harmful and insidious than the overt. I know the person who calls be "lardo" is an idiot, but the person (sometimes even doctors) who pats me on the back with sympathetic eyes, unknowinglly sticks a knife in my heart by assuming (and often telling me) that all I have to do to lose weight is give up fast food and desserts (which I don't eat on a monthly basis, let alone a daily one), and "eat some steamed vegetables" instead.

This website: justmaintaining.com, sums up my views on this. It's a great read... it's by a woman who has lost and maintained a significant weight loss, but also supports Fat Acceptance.

Being fat as a child/teenager completely messed up my self esteem. To this day, everyone always congratulates me on my weight loss, and it amazes me that I weigh less than 200lbs now and am inching towards being in the 180s, but I still have trouble accepting myself. Someone else said it perfectly in another post; I don't see the weight I've lost -- I still see all the weight I have to lose. I still don't believe I can do certain things because of my size. I still believe I'm too fat for a man to love me. I still think everything about myself, negative or whatever, is somewhat related to my size.

FA wasn't as prevalent when I was younger, at least not where I was. I didn't know about it. I was just happy that some stores carried junior plus sizes and that I could find fashionable clothes in a size 20. I was always ashamed of myself and never lived life because I didn't feel like I was worthy.

FA is helping me now, and it's helping me learn that my size does not define me. I'm much like kaplods, except mine's a bit delayed. I wish I had learned all of this stuff earlier so I wouldn't be so f'ed up in the head and would be able to actually accept myself for who I am and not just see fat when I look in the mirror.