La Weight Loss
 

I am so angry right now that I can't see straight not to mention my wallet is alot lighter (but I'm not) I was duped and mislead and flat out lied to !! I'm not through with them yet but I doubt if I'll ever get any satisfaction. Unfortunately I've learned a very expensive lesson. I can't even begin to go into what they did to me right now because I'm to angry. :mad: :mad: :mad: Am I alone in this ?

I suspect I know what you're driving at...why not expound on your experiences for the benefit of others here - I know that LAWL advertises a great deal and it's getting close to that time again (after the holidays) when people start their New Years' Resolutions...so let's hear your story please!

I know I will probably get alot of positive feedback about LAWL and hey, if it is working for you, that's wonderful. All I can tell you is my own personal experiance with them. First I want to say that I blame myself foremost because I had the power to say ENOUGH, unfortunately not the willpower. I went into the center, poured my heart out and put myself in their hands !! I also want to say, that from what I have been reading in this forum, it doesn't sound like all the centers are ran the same and unfortunately I had to get a really bad one. I signed up, only to be told about all the other expenses after the fact. I was told I had to buy the supplement bars only to find out later that I didn't. And they pushed the supplements so hard it wasn't funny. My vitamins I was using wasn't as good as their's, my calcium tablets, and so on ... You get the picture. They pushed until I gave in and bought most of thir supplements . Of course when I got them home, I compared labels. Stupid me. The remaining supplements I hadn't purchased were continuiously pushed on me at every weigh in. I kept telling them I just couldn't afford them. ($150 for just 2 every month) I got major attitude from one girl imparticular. She kept asking me if I was cheating with lunchmeat because I wasn't losing as much as she thought I should be. When I told her no, that should have been enough but she kept asking me over & over like I was a child. Then I kept telling them that the supplements were making me sick and they acted like I was nuts. One would tell me one thing to do or to eat just to have another tell me no that's wrong. I could go on and on but I've vented way to much. I'm an adult and I should have known better. I'm on my own now and am doing ok. I quit using the supplements that they pushed on me and I am feeling much better. I'm truly not a crybaby or a quitter but I've had enough.

Sounds like a SCAM to me!!!
 

Now, I know that by saying this, I'm going to step on a few toes here as there is an active LAWL thread on the Diet Plans forum...but to me...having you pay a HUGE chunk of money up front...combined with high-pressure sales tactics to buy apparently overpriced supplements and bars...is a SCAM, pure and simple (apparently they used to REQUIRE that you purchase a certain amount of products each week, but at least in NY they have stopped that...as follows: http://www.oag.state.ny.us/press/200...jan23b_02.html
To my mind, paying so much money up front (and nearly $400 to me IS A LOT OF MONEY!!!) is like making a bet with a bookmaker...you're essentially betting $400 that you will lose x amount of pounds in a certain period of time...and despite the claims that they are there to HELP you in your goal...it is to the COMPANY's benefit to see you take longer (and have to purchase more weeks and products) to make your goal. I'd be interested to see the statistics on the percentage of customers who actually attain their goal according to their contract(s). (Of course, I'm sure that LAWL doesn't keep statistics on that). And now that they can't REQUIRE you to buy a certain amount of product each week, they employ the hard sell, which the employees are probably highly trained to do by the company - and which can be pretty tough to ignore or deny. Remember - these companies spend a LOT of money on advertising and market research. They KNOW what to say to get you to part with your hard-earned money. They KNOW how desperate you (and others) are to lose those pounds...and use that knowledge to their advantage!!!

IMO, you'd be better off using the money to go to a REAL nutritionist (ask your doctor) or certified personal trainer for assistance in making permanent lifestyle changes. (something I and others at the BFL/BB board have done with EXCELLENT results at a fraction of the cost of LAWL, BTW).

Just my two cents...

I only wish I had found this site before I found the LAWL center !! They get people when they are really vulnerable and that really stinks !!!

One of the things that gets me about LAWL is the connotation (through the company name) that they have something to do with Southern California or Los Angeles (because you know all us California girls are blonde and wear bikinis, right - NOT!). Kind of like the Hollywood 48-Hour Diet or the Miami Diet - that aura of glamour.

Ya know, I did a zip code search on their site and as far as I can see, they have NO California locations! Sheesh....

I know that an eye for an eye isn't the revenge motto to go after...but it seems a lot of former LAWL members are getting their money back, by selling the LAWL plans on Ebay-I have read the auctions, and they are pretty much selling you a copy of the diet and the fast food guide, etc. without the high pressure sell of the supplements and such.
I kindof laughed when I saw this-these people are taking it into their own hands to get some of their money back as well as costing LAWL some new customers...hee hee hee
Pat-don't feel bad about letting them get to you. We have all been duped by some product or another. I have mixed feeling about LAWL-the basic plan is a decent balanced one to follow-but it is the misleading of the cost and the hard selling of the supplements that upsets me the most.
Good luck!
Aphil

Just a caveat…

Maybe the sellers are getting a portion of their money back - judging from the auctions posted (including completed auctions) LAWL is still making out like a bandit...from what I've heard the LA Lite Bars cost at the centers vs. what the sellers are getting in the final bids they are still taking a loss (albeit less of a loss than if they DIDN'T sell them).

Something else to take into consideration before selling LAWL materials such as diet plans, etc. would be copyright laws. Anyone considering doing this (I noticed that there are several auctions for copies of LAWL materials currently) should check their contracts with LAWL very carefully - I'd be willing to bet that there is a line somewhere that prohibits the duplication or selling of any LAWL plan materials (i.e. copyright law). It's one thing to sell extra bars or supplements on eBay - but selling program materials is, quite frankly, illegal - and if LAWL gets wind of it, they have every right to take legal action. (as much as it pains me to say it - as IMO their plan is a rip off anyway!)

Yeah, I am sure if LAWL knew they were selling their materials they would sue...but hey, I am not telling them! :D
They are not making a lot on selling their old bars, but they are doing pretty well on the copies of the plan-most are dutch auctions where they will sell as many copies as people want.
LAWL doesn't make all that much on their plan alone, but when you read the fine print and realize after you have signed up, that you have to buy their $120 case of bars for a couple of the phases, and they pressure you into $40 supplements...boy, they really get you by the time it is all over.
LAWL doesn't even allow you to have an online membership like Weight Watchers or some of the other programs-they know this way that they cannot use their "hard sell" techniques to bully you into buying their bars and supplements. It is the same thing as a door to door weeper salesman. They are right there in front of your face showing you all the dirt (or fat) and telling you your only solution is what they are selling. They use hard sell techniques, and make you feel uncomfortable, or bad for saying no-and you walk away with a $1500 sweeper. (or $400 worth of bars and a membership)
They all work on commission-not by the hour-so they are looking out for their own benefit and not yours.
You can come here, or sites like www.shape.com, www.fitness.com, and many other sites and get all the diet and exercise information you want-FOR FREE.
Aphil

I should clear up some misconceptions here ;) I'm a LAWL member, and it's been the only "diet" that's worked for me. I certainly haven't been "scammed." Yes, it was expensive. Yes, they are hard-sellers. But I continue to refuse the supplements at every weigh-in, and I told them that I would not be buying any more bars after my initial purchase. They were OK with that. The LAWL plan does have merit in that it teaches weighing and measuring of your foods and, in a manner of exchanges, counting calories. Calorie counting is worth NOTHING if portions are not controlled.

When I finished college, I considered taking a job with LAWL for a time. I stopped considering this after they tried to sell me supplements during my job interviews! The folks who work at LAWL don't have the slightest idea of nutrition. They are just salespeople who work for an hourly wage and a comission (not just a comission).

A lot of the stories I'm hearing here seem to come from (no offense) a lack of willpower. Patty, it totally sucks that they didn't tell you about the bars beforehand. They did it to me, too, but other LAWL members demanded they know everything up front. Just say "no" if you don't want the supplements! I have told the people at my center that I do not want to be sold supplements anymore. I made them write a note in my file so I will never have to bother again. No one can make you purchase anything. You have every right to get angry with them if they continue to push the issue.

LAWL does not belong in this forum along with Metabolife, "Peel Away" the Pounds, and the like. LAWL does not claim to be a miracle fix. It is a diet that's tough to stick to sometimes. They tell you up front that you will lose ~2 lbs a week, which is quite healthy. With a little common sense and some assertion, you can get what you want out of the program. I'd suggest to you that, if you've already paid all that cash for it, you give it a try if only for the purposes of learning how to control portions. The plan is quite do-able without going to the centers (other protein bars out there are comparable to their overpriced "La Lites"). They WANT people to join and quit. Make them work for that money.

xTYx
I think in addition to what the others have mentioned, LAWL is a ripoff because there is no incentive for them for you to lose weight. Once you have paid (and paid and paid) it is actually in their best interest if you quit and make room for another "up front" payer. When I joined a couple of years ago, I was told I had to loose 50 pounds in 24 weeks. Needless to say, I didn't.... I told them I had been doing WW with ittle success so they knew that I was a slow looser. I paid UP FRONT for an entire year and a zillion pounds of bars and supplements. When week 24 came and went...they wanted me to start paying them $8 a week. WITHIN my paid up year!!! Why? Because I "violated" my contract. Ya know when you talk to them and they look at your journal? They are recording every single slip-up you have made so that they have REASON to get rid of you and make room for the next check book that walks in the door. They aren't looking for ways to help you.... they are actually looking for your mistakes!! My mistakes were things like having beef and potatos in the same day (oops), eating salmon twice in the same week... not big blow out binges mind you....just mistakes. OR missing a weigh in, not buying enough bars.... How supportive is that? They had no suggestions, no ideas, no support, just more bills. They stay in business by turning over clients and selling bars & supplements.... not from successfull weight loss. They used to be "Quick Weight Loss" also knows as "World's Best Weightloss" all run by a businessman (who owned the Philadelphia 76's) out of NJ... not LA.

Still and all... best of luck on your journey. The diet plan may work for you. Whatever it takes. But LAWL belongs under investigation.

I totally agree with you there...they ARE just looking for fresh meat with some cash in their pocket.
You should always be careful of every paper you sign.
And for everyone's information-eating salmon more than once a week, or eating a banana, or any other of the RIDICULOUS rules LA Weight Loss has-is not going to keep you from losing weight. It is very common for you to be able to lose the 2 pounds they want you to in the first few weeks, but after 10 pounds or so, that begins to slow down a bit. That is just the way it is-the saying is true-the last 5 pounds are the hardest to lose! It is unrealistic for them to have you sign a contract stating you have to lose 50 pounds in so many weeks. Every body is different-and their rules are just to make it harder for you to stay on the plan, not to lose weight faster. They just want to sell you their juice and bars-plain and simple.
For those of you unfamiliar, they have crazy rules like no bananas are allowed at some centers because they are higher in calories-well, do like every other diet center in the world does and have a 1/2 of a banana equal a fruit serving instead of a whole one! They have 2 or 3 day programs of eating no carbs, drinking their special juice and eating only veggies, and all sorts of little things in the plan like that...and if you are not losing enought weight on the diet card they give you-which is really only a menu of what foods you are allowed each day, then they charge you $40 for a slightly different menu with less calories or carbs or what have you.
I realize that all diet programs have to make money, but companies such as Weight Watchers, Nutrisystem, Jenny Craig, etc. have much better "bedside manner" and much more incentive for you to lose the weight. They do not "require" you to lose a certain poundage in a time period, and they offer you support when you are having a hard time-instead of looking for reasons to kick you out.
While it is much cheaper to learn about nutrition and exercise and do it on your own-if you want and need a structured diet program-this is one I would DEFINITELY stay away from.
Aphil

Yes, but none of that is a surprise. They tell you up front that you have a certain number of weeks in which to lose a certain amount of weight. People need to be a little more assertive! If they don't like the plan, don't join! Every one of the centers you mentioned is thrilled when someone joins up and then leaves... it means more $$ for them! Not to mention any gym you might join. Those places survive and bank on the fact that people will join up and quit. Weightloss centers are businesses. You can't fault them for trying to make money... If you're looking to do a plan in which there is absolutely no capitallistic behavior, go see your doctor... that's really the only place you'll find that sort of support.

All I was saying was that LAWL doesn't belong here with all the ridiculous gadgets, patches, pills, and creams... give me a break! It's not a miracle pill... it's simply counting calories in a structured way. Consumers need to learn to insist on knowing what they're getting into so that they don't feel "scammed" like this.

I am sorry that I do not agree with you xYTx, I am very familiar with the membership procedures of Weight Watchers and other structured plans-I have spoken to many head honchos (so to speak) via email from diet centers, as well as reading up on the posts here at 3FC to learn about what the consumer thinks of whatever plsn they are doing-and LA Weight Loss is a far cry from those other plans. I agree with you that all centers have to make their money-but there are some simply wonderful Weight Watchers counselors out there who go grocery shopping with their members to help them with good food choices, exercise with them, and so on-almost all of the time they were once members who became couselors after reaching their goal weight-not just some thin person hired who knows how to hard sell to desperate overweight people. On Nutrisystem, you can go have a personal one on one live chat with a counselor at any time you want to-even if it is 3 in the morning-at no additional charge to keep you from eating that cheesecake, or to get a question answered. That is a prgram where you buy food from them, but you can only do it for a week if you want to-there is no month or year you have to pay for. Try to get someone to do any of those things with you at LAWL. You can go to any of these "good" structured programs and find out what you can eat on the plan, etc. before you join. Even Richard Simmons shows you exactly how the Food Mover works on the commercial! When everything is hidden until the pocketbook opens-BEWARE!
From what I have found out through members of LAWL and from talking to a nearby center myself-they won't tell you anything really about the plan, until you fork over the cash, and you can't pay for a small membership-you have to pay a year in advance, and about 3/4 of their "structured" plans are unhealthy crash diets centered around their products-NOT structured calorie counting. I have talked with a few LAWL members and found out what they are eating on their plan-I calculated the results, and a lot of them are eating 800-1200 calories on their plans-which you should never go below 1200, or risk slowing your metabolism down into starvation mode. Add the fact that the calories you are allowed are consisting on some of their plans of 48 hour type diet juice, and their little nutrition bars-it is pretty much just a rotating crash/fad diet with way too low calories on most of their plans. Even if you are not using their bars or products-it is still too low in calories and the strange food restrictions are just uncalled for. They are simply setting you up to fail on purpose.
As well as being a moderator here, my mother is a nurse, and my stepfather a former pro bodybuilder-I talk with them about my findings in the weight loss industry to get their professional opinions-and we can truly find no "pros" to joining LAWL.
I truly believe it does belong right here in the buyer beware section, because of their simple lack of not telling you everything when you sign up. Your center may have-but from what I am hearing from members, that is the minority of centers-as well as the diet being unhealthy, and having all of the rules to which there is no medical reason behind-such as some of the food restrictions, etc. The silliest one I have heard as of yet is being allowed to have one color of grapes, and another color of grapes were not allowed. Do they sit around in a room just to think this stuff up? I would hate to think that a women are going around labeling a grape a bad food choice because of its color...but are guzzling down their processed $30 juice for 2 days on the Take off plan....
I do say, however-that if you have already joined-YES, make them work for all that money you shelled out, and hate every minute of it!!!! :lol: We need to teach them they cannot take advantage of us any longer!!!
I do not want you to be offended because of all of the moderators take here on LAWL, but with all of the things they are doing to their customers, it would be totally unfair for us not to state the risks of joining. If you do not feel scammed-fine-but if I can have the peace of mind knowing that I have told what I have found and possibly save someone their hard earned money-then I feel better.
Aphil :)

Can't add anything to that aphil...

Except maybe to those who have a lot of money to burn in their quest to lose weight - as I stated before you would be FAR better served by spending that $$ on a CERTIFIED, TRAINED nutritionist (ask your doctor for a referral) who KNOWS what he/she is talking about - to assist you in making PERMANENT LIFESTYLE CHANGES. Weighing in two-three times a week and doing a 48-hour semi-fast using juice is not going to help you and will even harm you in the long run...as well as taking in too few calories...you are really doing a number on your metabolism - putting it into "starvation mode" which means you are burning LEAN MUSCLE, rather than fat - then when you start eating 'normally' again, your body will store every single calorie it can, just in case there's another 'famine'. Of course, those calories are stored as FAT.

I'm sure the powers that be at LAWL know this...that's how they win...kind of like a casino - which always comes out the winner in the end. LAWL gets your $$ and that's ALL they want IMO.

You're right , I should have been more assertive. I'm the one who went in there and I'm the one who joined. That was my fault and I took full blame there. But I was douped no two ways about it. They left out alot when they were selling me their plan. And like I said before, desperate people do desperate things. I was vulnerable and wanted to believe in someone. Their so called quick loss juice is none other than the Hollywood juice. (Something they were fast to point out that it wasn't) When I didn't lose what "they" thought I should they pushed supplements on me like you wouldn't believe. They said I had to have them to lose the weight. By this time, you're already in alot of money. Now before I started they said I didn't need them. These supplements made me sick, literally. (at least the combination of them) I tried to rell them that but they kept pushing more on me. When I finally refused, their attitude changed very suddenly. NO longer were they friendly and helpful. They kept accusing me of cheating on my diet and so on. To make it worse, one would tell me one thing to do and i would go back in and someone else would tell me that no that was wrong and that I should be doing something else. Yes I lost some weight but as little as I was eating , anyone would have. No, I won't go back to them, I'm doing just fine on my own and I feel alot better. I left them, got myself educated about foods and exercise, something I should have done in the first place and I'm doing just fine on my own. I'm sorry but LAWL does belong in this forum. I'm glad it works for a percentage of people, at least not everyone is getting ripped off but people need to know their tactics. Not everyone is strong enough and assertive enough to make a good judgement call on it. And I know tht not all centers are ran the same, I know that by reading the forums on here. I got ahold of a really bad one. My eyes were opened in a very bad way. And I'm happy for everyone who does lose weight thru them. All I'm saying is, get yourself educated on food and exercise, especially if you are thinking about going into ANY weight loss venter. If I was told everything up front, I wouldn't joined.That's what I'm trying to say. Mine is only one experiance but I know I"m not alone.

xTYx..
No they DON'T tell you all this before you sign. They don't tell you the plan, they don't tell you you have to pay again with in your year if you EVER "cheat", even by accident.... and that is the whole point. If your "saleperson" (not a counselor) told you all of that before you signed, she isn't following the program. They are not supposed to tell you..... that is how they get you in there.

I never thought about them operating like a casino...he he he That is pretty good.
Aphil

I feel ya girl !! (barbs88) !! This site has helped more than anything yet to date.

Barbs, the issue is that they certainly DO tell you that you are losing weight in a finite period of time. They also tell you that if you do not complete your weightloss in this amount of time, you must pay for additional weeks. Please read my post :)

For some of us, having a deadline helps out a lot. Having someone on our backs 3x a week can also help, too. I still refuse to classify a hard sell with all the other ridiculous products on this forum. It's working a whole lot better for me than an ab belt would. LoL

Pat-I am so sorry that you feel that you got duped by LAWL. I am glad you are doing fine on your own, and welcome you to join in on the general diet plans boards-there are plenty of very wonderful and helpful ladies out there that will root you on and help you towards your goals.
I hope anyone who feels that htey have been duped by LAWL doesn't blame themselves or feel bad about it. They are taking advantage-plain and simple.
xYTx-I do not feel that LAWL is the same "type" of gimmick as an ab belt or a lose weight while you sleep miracle drink-but I DO feel that it belongs in the buyer beware section. It is not only the hard selling- I have repeated over and over until I am blue in the face to people that these so called counselors do not know what they are talking about. They downright LIE about their products-when they are the same vitamins and 48 hour juice you can get for 1/3 of the price in Wal-Mart-but they tell you that they are different, or superior, or what have you-and it is the same!
They tell you it is a healthy plan-it is not-it is potentially harmful, it is so low in calories-and they are completely making stuff up as far as the no bananas, salmon only once a week, etc. Any professional nutritionist would tell them they are crazy. If it were just the hard selling tactics I wouldn't beat them down so badly-but it is the hard selling with the lies, potentially harmful dieting tactics, and totally bogus information they are telling people.
I am glad that it is working for you, and that you are really sticking it to them-but I recommend that you eat over the 1200 calorie mark-and totally ignore the bunk about bananas, grapes, salmon...but really make yourself a pain in the rear end to those ladies! :D

I have lost 17 pounds in the past few months with exercise and a proper diet of OVER 1200 calories a day-usually around 1500-1600-and the loss has been averaging 1-2 pounds per week. And I feel great-and my diet includes bananas and whatever color of grapes I want... :lol: Boy, those ladies would fall over if I visited their center...

I am also on LA Weightloss and post on the same board as xYtx. It is frustrating at time with the people at the center, but you have to tell them no. The sheets that they show you in the initial meeting tell you the bars are optional (even if they don't say it aloud you see it and it isn't fine print). I normally don't say things such as this, but maybe some of us (myself included on nights like this) need to spend less time complaining about weightloss programs while sitting idly in front of a computer and get off our butts and get healthy. Just an observation. Don't mean to come across rude.

No offense taken. I've been up since 5 am, stuck, to a healthy diet, walked 3 miles, did ab exercises for 15 and got on the Gazelle for 30 minutes. The time I spend on my computer is my down time, the time I take just for myself. LAWL is working for you guys and I'm truly happy for you so there isn't anything anyone can say on here to sway your minds. I never tried to do that or I would have posted on the LAWL board. I just passed on what happened to me and I can see that I wasn't alone. When they sat down and told me about the program (in the beginning)they said the bars were optional (along with the supplements)but when I went back in after the accceleration period, they told me something completely different. Yes I should have really questioned that but like I said, I was in a very vulnerable state. My fault. I didn't mean to step on any toes in here . Their program can work and it does for a percentage of people but their hard sell tactics ruin it. I did learn some things from the program and I use them today but I don't agree with a number of other things. I took resonsibilty for my lack of better judgement but LAWL has a whole lot more they should take respnsibilty for.

The plan MAY have changed since they conned me, but when I joined a couple years ago NONE of that was told to you before you signed (maybe all the lawsuits helped). And xTYx.... perhaps you don't understand what I am complaining about..... I PAID for 52 weeks.... at week 25 they wanted me to buy more weeks cause I wasn't at goal. HEY.... except for a few accidents and once licking Cheeto dust off my fingers (which I got yelled at for... my daughter was eating them), they couldn't tell me WHY I wasn't loosing while following the program. Know why? Cause they aren't nutritionists...they are SALESPEOPLE! Do you understand? I PAID for 52 weeks, if I wasn't at goal by week 24, in my mind I still had 28 weeks coming to me....NOOOOOOO.... I had to "buy more weeks" because the plan wasn't working. You do know that don't you? How many weeks did YOU pay for? AND how many weeks did they give you to get to goal? DO you plan to pay more after your goal date? I sure didn't.

The other "big lie" is that the bars etc are optional.... unless it's changed, SURE you don't have to eat them, but if you don't you are in "violation of your contract." THAT is where that buying more weeks within your year kicks in. Do you think because you paid for a year you can go for a year? HA... so did I.

So...they give you a finite time to loose...what if it doesn't happen? I sat in there crying... literally crying week after week and all they could do was ask me when my last BM was. They had NO IDEA why I wasn't loosing the perscribed 2 pounds a week.

The BIG clue was when my "counselor" (heheheheh), who wore a nurses uniform and had a "nurses are special" pin on told me she wasn't a nurse... it was part of her "COSTUME"!!!! That sinced the con for me.

:?:

OK, you know what? There is no reason to get rude, sarcastic, or to start "yelling" via caps. I'm sorry we have a difference of opinion. LAWL was sued earlier this year, and yes... some policies had changed before I joined. I'm sorry you feel you were scammed. I hope whatever plan you decide on takes you to your intended goal.

BUT I'm not sorry I joined the center. It's worked for me so far, as well as the rest of the members of the LAWL thread. Some of them couldn't lose on WW or Jenny Craig, and all of us exercise routinely. We're all adults here, and I can tell you that I use fitday.com, and I very seldom consume unhealthy (under 1200 cal) amounts of food. I'm not a nutrition neophyte ;) I'm a med. student. I just thought I'd give a dissenting opinion on LAWL, that's all. Just like the ladies who posted in defense of WW.

And no one buys into the fact that the counselors pretend to be nurses, Barbs. That's like believing in Santa Claus. They couldn't tell me what the bloodwork they wanted to do was for, so I refused. It's all pretty funny. :-)

I can't speak for the other ladies, I know I don't mean to come across rude or sarcastic. I'm just really still upset about my experiance with LAWL. I never said the program didn't work for a percentage of people. It was working for me to a certain extent. It's just like any other program out there be it WW or whatever. But the center flat out lied to me about alot of things and I feel, no, I know I was scammed and would have continued to be if I wouldn't have finally said ENOUGH. I was told that the women I dealt with were "trained counselors and food experts". They were not, just somewhat trained salespeople. There's a big difference. And if I would have went in and someone was in a nurses uniform, I would have assumed she was a nurse. Call me stupid. No one is ever going to agree or disagree on any given subject and everyone is intitled to their opinion. I've said mine and I feel better in doing so. I found out that I am not alone and that I am human (still) I think the bottom line is that if you find something that works for you then that's great. Do it. I think there's a saying "Can't we all get along"? We are all on here for the same reason - to lose weight and have support in the process. Thanks ladies, you have all made this thread interesting.

I don't think that anyone here is purposely trying to sound sarcastic or rude, and I believe noone here is intentionally trying to step on toes or hurt any feelings.
I think we can all agree to disagree-as there are meny elements that are making everyone's situation a bit different.
xYTx-in your case you are a med student, and are having good luck with your LAWL center. I am glad that you are doing well and know enough about nutrition to be eating more than 1200 calories a day and refusing to do their semi-fast plans and such. You sound like you have a good head on your shoulders, and know enough to refuse the bloodwork, etc. that they are pushing-but not everyone is as educated on nutrition or dieting as you and the others on this site.
But there are also other women in Pat's situation-maybe not knowing enough about calories, etc. and assuming that these women care about her well being and listening to them-because she thought she was getting advice from someone more knowledgable than her on the subject.
There are also many of us that associate a uniform with a profession as well-I used to be mistaken for a nurse or nurses aid when I worked in a salon that required us to wear an all white uniform-I was never mistaken in a hospital, of course-but on my way home from work if I stopped at the store or at a gas station with it still on-so there are a lot of people who wouldn't question what you do if you were dressed the part. There are many trusting, honest people who think that others intentions are always as good as their own-and those are the ones who get fooled or hurt.
As far as Weight Watchers goes-it was mentioned that some are having success on LAWL that did not on WW...I have talked to a lot of ladies, even some of those who post on my regular threads, and I find that some members of WW can slide/cheat a bit on the points system, and maybe use all of their points on high carbohydrate foods and meat or junk food-and pretty much leave out fruits and vegetables or dairy products. I have told one woman on a particular occasion after reading over a food journal I had her keep for a few days that she was using points pretty much every day on candy bars, flavored coffee creamers,breads, etc. and wasn't eating near enough produce-but she was eating under her allowed points. Weight Watchers has a lot of freedom with the points system, but just beacause you are calorie or point counting, I still stress to my regular ladies that you still need to making healthier food choices in your diet. You shouldn't have a Snickers bar for breakfast every morning just because you are still under your calories or points for the day...I find that if you really refine your diet and eat foods that fuel your body-clean foods that aren't overly processed, such as fresh produce and lean meats-your weight will come off easier and you will feel much better in general. I think that this is where some LAWL members are having the weight loss compared to being on WW-when you HAVE to eat so many fruits or veggies a day, you do...but if you know you don't have to...some of us don't. :lol:
Aphil :)

Just what I was going to say, Aphil - about the nurses' uniforms I mean - it's a matter of PERCEPTION.

To have someone dressed in a nurses' uniform and wearing a "Nurses are Special" pin...to the average person (i.e. not a med student) they would automatically assume that is a nurse - especially when they are requiring/strongly suggesting that bloodwork be done. And not everyone is assertive enough to dare question 'why this or that'. In fact, many overweight/obese women are pretty UNassertive and (from personal experience here) when they walk into a place like LAWL, or Jenny Craig for that matter, are so desparate to lose weight - that usually they have pretty much made up their mind that they WILL be joining...and if someone in a white coat (a little 'perception ploy' that Jenny Craig uses in their centers as well) is telling them that for success they MUST buy the supplements and products, well, they will do it for the most part. Remember that LAWL and similar businesses have spent a great deal of money on market research. They KNOW what to say to get the average person to whip out their credit card...to sign a binding contract...to seal the deal...and they doubtlessly train their staff accordingly. (I'd be willing to bet that most of the so-called "counselors" work on commission as well - so they have an added incentive to 'sell' the products.)

Like Aphil, I'm not wanting to be sarcastic or rude at all...but I do get extremely angry and upset to see people being taken for a ride the way Barbs and Pat (and most likely a host of others) have been. I don't blame them in the least for being angry...I know I would be!

Just my two cents...

The Nurses Uniform Thing
 

It sounds under handed and scam artistry. Why dress them like that at all if you weren't try to make a perception?

Miss Chris:cool:

Sorry, I didn't mean to come off yelling or sarcastic at all... I was merely ephasizing certain words. I've been over reading the support board and I've noticed that all of the LAWL gals have already broken their contracts (ie cheated) so I was just trying to make it perfectly clear that you will be expected to pay more money after your goal date.... not at the end of your paid up period.

I don't "feel" scammed.... I definitely was scammed. If you can loose on their plan and not feel taken advantage of more power to you. It's not so much their plan I have a problem with except the food they sell is totally unecessary for weight loss. It their totally "deceptive business practices" that really burns me up.

I was really struggling on the supplements. They were making me really sick. All they could do was push more on me. They kept telling me that my body needed time to adjust to them. I kept getting sicker and my metabolism took a nose dive. I had no energy and felt dizzy and nautious everyday. Not to mention the heart palpatations. I went there in the first place to lose weight and get healthy!! My dad died of a massive heart attack and I didn't want to end up like him. Yea right, I was probably headed there at the rate I was going. There was no concern, just accusations of cheating. To me that is just out and out irrisponsibility on their part because I believed what they said they were - Professionals. Something terrible could have happened to me. That's a frightening thought. To represent something you're not is just wrong and they should be investigated, period. End of story.

I too belong to LAWL and I am VERY happy. I gave a LOT of money to WW.(who by the way are untrained people just like us) and lost nothing. I have lost 17 # in 11 wks. which for me is great. You ladies who are against LAWL keep saying the same things over and over. I try to be an aware consumer and ask questions. All I know is my cholesteral has dropped from214 to 178, my blood pressure is down to 120/65 aand my pulse is down from 90 to 70. Everytime I have asked, I have recieved a truthful answer. I know none are nurses, even the science teachers at the schools I have taught at wore lab coats and even the kids knew they weren't nurses. The nurses around here were complete uniforms and none that I know wear white coats . They weaR smocks, white pants ,white shoes and some even still wear nursing caps. I know which counselers have been on LAWL because I asked. There was no big deal made, they simply answered my questions.
This should be a lesson to everyone "ask questions" Do you go to the MD and just accept whatever they say? I had breast cancer at 45 and learned that I am my own best advocate. I hope you all learn to ask more questions. You all use the internet-there are tons of info out there. I thought long and hard about spending this money. I didn't just jump into it. I suggest some of you should do the same.

Once again it is about perception, as the nurses in my area haven't worn a nursing cap since they graduated from nursing school, and they wear all sorts of different colored, white, or patterned scrub outfits-their ID tag is how you differentiate whether they are an RN, LPN, or a nurses aid-or even a doctor getting ready to perform a surgery or deliver a baby...(My mother is a nurse)
The scientists mentioned just now wore white lab coats, but I believe it was obvious to the children that they were not nurses because they were in a lab environment-not wearing a nurses badge in a center requesting bloodwork from them. There is a bit of a difference there-it is not just about the uniform alone, but about what they are doing while they are wearing it to add to the perception.
I think that the ones who feel burned feel bad enough without others making them feel worse because "they should have known better" or "I would have known better, why didn't you?" They know that now, and we are just trying to help them feel better about themselves, let others know the downside to LAWL, and avoid others getting burned by letting them know what my go on in the center before the go in.
AS far as the heart palpitations, I am sure if I went in and asked them if their ephedra containing products could cause them, they would tell me "No, you'll be fine!" When I have a bad reaction to any products containing ephedra-(I can only take certain types of cold medicines due to the small amount of ephedra in some of them-really sensitive to it.)
If it is working for you and you have what you think is one of the better centers-then fine, I am glad it is working for you. The ladies who feel scammed were-and I realize that some centers are probably worse than others-and I believe them when they tell their story. I think they should have the right to say their peace on LAWL in the buyer beware section, just as those who like LAWL can sing its praises in the LAWL board that is active here. There is a place for everyone-but there is no reason to make the already hurt feel worse.
Aphil

We shouldn't be told to give our opinions only on our own thread. That's ridiculous! All we're doing is offering a dissenting opinion. WW advocates did so on the WW scam thread, so why can't we? No one's trying to make anyone feel worse. It's not fair to your users if they only receive one half of the bias concerning LAWL. They need to hear how other people have gotten something good out of the centers and plan and how they did it, (i.e. asking questions, refusing certain practices, researching their silly supplements, taking matters into our own hands... after all, we're paying THEM to help US lose weight. They shouldn't push us around).

But to say "those who like LAWL can sing its praises in the LAWL board that is active here" is to silence our opinions on whether LAWL qualifies as a scam on this board, and that defeats the purpose of a free forum like this one.

I was not stating that you or anyone should NOT post on this thread with your opinion-if it sounded that way, then I apologize.
What I was saying, is that while giving your opinion of LAWL here, that maybe we should all try harder not to make the ladies who feel scammed feel worse about what happened to them while we are doing so. They have alread stated that they feel used, feel duped, feel stupid, etc.
I believe the comments throughout the thread concerning lack of willpower, or that they would have obviously known that the lady was not a nurse, or you should have just told them no like I did,etc. is just reopening the wound here.
The problem that occurs with forums is that when posts are read, the reader cannot hear the person's tone of voice, and maybe things are taken the wrong way. That is what moderators are for-to diffuse (or at least try to) diffuse the situation.
The forums here are great, and everyone is allowed to have their own opinion about their center, group, or plan-but it is the job of the moderators and administration here to make sure that that is carried out without comments that could be considered hurtful to others, such as the ones I have mentioned.
I fully advocate if you have paid the money, to stay there and make them work for it and hate every minute of it-but I do not encourage new members to sign up due to the methods and misinformation that are being used by LAWL. I have stated before that my disataste for LAWL has nothing to do with the hard selling-becasue everyone CAN say no-it is the misinformation that goes along with LAWL practices. Some women go in there thinking they are getting an experts experience, and end up getting duped.
I have never intended for anyone to feel that they should not post at a certain topic-all I am saying is that when you are in the buyer beware section, there is going to be a lot of people posting negative things about the plan or product involved-it is fine to give an opinion and share your good experience, but it need not turn into a battleground. Everyone knew that there were going to be negative comments about LAWL here when they clicked on the topic. If everyone is prepared to listen to them with an open mind and honestly share their feelings with others and a way to maybe help or remedy their situation-it is a wonderful thing. But with LAWL being in this section-everyone needs to be prepared to read all of the negative comments about LAWL, and if that angers or offends in any way-then there is a more positive thread on LAWL available here on the general diet plans board. All I was saying is that if hearing negative comments and experiences related to LAWL offends you, then there is a more positive thread devoted to the centers on this site for your enjoyment.
We moderators here are not upset with any loyal customers of LAWL-we are upset at the devious practices of most of the LAWL centers, and the laws and such that let them keep taking advantage of overweight people.
Aphil

I agree, both sides should be represented on here. I've read other threads where I've disagreed with a negative post. That's what makes this site interesting and informative to me. Everyone is intitled to their opinions. I should have researched everything before I "jumped" into it. I take the blame there but I will not take the blame for their lies and misrepresentations. I am not a stupid person, just human and I will not keep trying to defend myself. And no I don't believe everything I am told but when someone is supposed to know what they are doing, I tend to give them the benefit of the doubt. I'm not going to argue with anybody,I respect everones input . I know what happened to me and it's obvious that I am not alone. This is somewhat of a comfort to me, not snide remarks about what I should have done. I feel bad enough already. I learned from what happened , I know it's happened to others so now I go on and do what I set out to do - lose the rest of my weight and get healthy, which I am doing. I wish everyone luck in their weight loss endevours and whatever works for you, be it WW or LAWL or whatever - that's wonderful. We are all working for the same goals I think. That much I hope we can agree on. I hope I didn't step on anyone's toes in the process of trying to get my point and feelings across.

If they tell you up front that you are paying for a year, and then try to charge you again after a set number of weeks, then they are probably in violation of the contract as well. At the very least, they are acting in a deceptive manner.

Telling one not to eat bananas at all or salmon more than once a week is silly, at best.

It sounds as if LAWL cannot help but to succeed, at least in the beginning, due to the incredibly reduced calorie intake.

There are women who lose weight successfully on a diet of cabbage soup. That does not recommend it to the population at large, however.

I am also a member of LAWL.
I'm not going to try and defend the program. If you think it's a scam, nothing I say, or anyone else, is going to convince you otherwise. All I know is that it has worked for me when other programs failed.
Are there "bad" centers that give out misinformation? Yes, just like there are bad WW leaders, Jenny Craig counselors, TOPS leaders, etc. Whenever you are dealing with people you're going to get some misinformation. But there are also wonderful centers that don't mislead their clients, who answer questions openly and honestly, and don't push the LAWL products onto their clients at all.
As far as the supplements, currently none of the LAWL supplements contain ephedra. I don't know what they had before I joined in June of this year but they don't contain that ingredient now.
It sounds like some people had bad experiences at some centers but not everyone has the same negative experience. Most of my counselors have been informed women, most on the program as well. I've never felt pushed to buy a single thing. Perhaps I've just been lucky.
I don't feel the program itself is a scam. I think that there are some centers that are not as informed as others. Some counselors are overly sales driven. Is there room for improvement? Yes. Does that mean that the program as a whole is a scam? No, not in my opinion.
Basically, no program is going to work for everyone. Some people are going to love it and others are going to hate it for one reason or another. I think that people should consider any weight loss program with caution because you will always find some bad apples mixed in with the good.

I would personally be very leary of any program that makes you pay up front. That in itself, to me, is an indication of a scam.

I just want to say that I was a member of LAWL for a year and not once did anyone at my center wear a nurses uniform.