[aphil]

Originally Posted by AnAbsoluteDiva

At my height and age, I need approximately 12 pounds of body fat to protect my organs and keep my body insulated. If I were to get myself to 10% body fat, and 12 pounds of fat were the target, then I'd be striving for 120. I choose 119 because all the literature I read by Chinese doctors consistently used the 119 number, and I kind of like it.

What none of this accounts for is muscle mass. And as I get more and more fit with weight training and running, I know that I am adding "pounds" to my frame. So what I really rely on is the body fat count. The ticker still reflects a goal weight of 119, but you can be sure that as soon as that little computer beeps TEN PERCENT, I will stick with that.

I wanted to inform everyone, that 10% body fat for women, is the lowest end of ESSENTIAL body fat by most standard body fat percentage charts.

(In laymans terms for those who don't monitor it, basically, it means that 10% body fat is the lowest you should ever try to get to/be-basically, it is JUST enough fat to protect your organs, etc.)

Most body fat percentages for women read like so:

Essential (necessary) body fat for women: 10-14%
Female athletes: 14-20%
"Fit" females: 21-24%
Acceptable female body fat: 25-31%
Obese/too high body fat: 32% and over

I am curious, why you are aiming for 10%, when the female athlete range (extremely fit) is 14-20%? 10% body fat is basically, just enough to survive with, not what is recommended to strive for.

I am only asking this, out of concern, btw, and also-because I want everyone to know what percentages are considered healthy, athletic, obese, etc. when or if they decide to calculate their own goals.

(I am editing this as well, to let Jman know that the figures are different/lower for males than they are for females.)

[AnAbsoluteDiva]

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/tanji5.htm

Second paragraph is where the information lies. I was at 9% body fat five years ago when I was a fitness competitor (fitness... not bodybuilding). I do not menstruate (cancer) so amenorrhea is not an issue. I work closely with my MD (oncology) to be sure I'm not screwing myself up in other ways. While it may not be for the masses, it works for me and quite a few others like me. Blood pressure, cholesterol levels, liver, kidneys, heart are healthy and in fine working order.

I didn't arbitrarily choose that figure, and I most definitely do not have an eating disorder nor a poor self-image.

I would consider 20% for myself if it weren't that the full 20% insists on settling on my thighs and nowhere else.

;-)

[Justme33]

Speaking of body fat....how accurate are those bathroom scales?? I got a Tanita scale last month (begin of feb) and the fat and water % just amazes me...When I first for the scale I weighed I think 184 and the fat % said 41 water 40......now I'm down to 168.6 in the morning fat is 40% water is 40%...If I weighed right now it may say 170 fat 36.5% water 44.5%...Also yesterday I was SOOO high in my calories (very bad day out and about...dinner and lunch was out..) and the scale had me at my lowest fat % as 35% water...??....this was when I got home last night... I dont think its right...LOL

ALL I know is I started in a sz 18 and today I'm wearing a very loose 12, and really need to go buy some sz 10s!! I'm just about where I was before I quit smoking!! YEAH!!!

[walking2lose]

Hi gang!

Justme -- Loose 12s??? That's awesome! It sounds like you are on a roll, so keep up the GREAT work!!

Zenor -- Just wanted to say I love TJ's lemon meringues; I had 2 last night! I wish they made the lemon in the mini size, but the chocolate minis are good too.

Bobbi -- I have to chime in with everyone else... I loved reading about your chickens. Your husband, Bruce, is a real cutie (even if he does mess up your calorie counting!).

Aphil, Diva, and Robin -- The only time I ever had my body fat officially calculated when I was an extremely fit college athlete (field hockey). I was 15% and I can't imagine being much more lean than I was at that time in my life. I know, though, that elite female athletes can go lower. I'm guessing body type and the weight lifting regimen have a lot to do with how low you can go. I have to say, I absolutely shudder to think what my body fat is now...I have a lot of soft squishy spots that I didn't have when I was younger. I do work out, but the intensity will probably never be the same (both because of my age and my health problems from a few years ago). I don't know about those scales, Robin. Mine was done with the calipers and I don't know what all. But I would think your scale is at least semi accurate.

As for me... my week is going ok, but I'm a little off plan, mainly with exercise. Between Saturday and Tuesday, I only worked out ONCE... very bad. Lots of reasons, but I won't bore you with them. None of them are good ones anyway. My calories have been around 1300-1400, not too bad normally, but not so good with no exercise. Today I got back on track. I've had just over 1,000 calories and I'm finished eating. I need a low day. I also did a good workout -- treadmill walk/run and weights (upper body). Tomorrow will be a good day too, and then I just need to cross my fingers for Friday's weigh in.

Everyone else... here's to a healthy day tomorrow!
Claire

[CoolMom75]

This was my 5th day on the 1700 cal plan, and I felt very weak and fatigued this afternoon. I had a bowl of Cracklin Oat Bran for breakfast and a two patty garden burger for lunch. I was craving some kind of fat and protein, and we walked to 7-11 for our walk today, and I got a Snickers bar and a stick of jerky. (shameful!)

Whew, I felt better! And still keeping in my calories. My body is still trying to adjust from the 9 month food fest I was on just a short time ago.

Cals: 1664
one mile walk.

[littlered]

Hi, everyone. wonderful day today.
sun was out, so warm.
and I Turned off the furnace.

Hope all are well today.

Total for today.

Cal: 1499
Fat: 23%
Carbs: 55%
Fiber: 63
Protein: 21%

Curves 30 min.
treadmill 15 min.
1 hr. cleaning up a garage, again!
seems like that is where the overflow seems to end up.
Oh well, I got a very good work out there.

Good night.


Theresa

[AnAbsoluteDiva]

Robin,

Those scales are a trip! LOL I don't bother. A trainer does the electronic calipers thingamajig on me once a month and her numbers are heck of a lot nicer than the scale's.

:-)

Total calories for today were 300 with 12% coming from fat. Four mile-run and back and biceps workout.

Good night, kids. Gonna curl in bed with a good book and SLEEP!

[RocknRoll]

Well i was very close to my target for today:

Total Calories: 1190
Total Burnt: only 288

i ate way too many carbs today!

[cablgurl]

Todays calories were 1345, still a little higher than i would like to be but its still ok. No time was spent on the eliptical today, but i did some power cleaning today. When i got home from work, had the house to myself so turned the tunes up and started to clean. I was able to get my heart pumping and i made the house sparkle.

[zenor77]

Calories for today: 1333
Considering I was a little high yesterday, I'm okay with the lower number.

No exercise again today, but I did get antibiotics and cough syrup from the doctor. So, I'm on the way to recovery. I hope the meds kick in quickly, I'm really looking forward to feeling well enough to go on my walks again. It's funny how you begin to miss them after awhile.

You know it actually occurred to me when I was at the pharmacy that medicine must have some caloric value (I'm silly aren't I?) Not that I wouldn't take them, but I'm just curious. I wonder how many calories lemon-mint flavored cough syrup has in it? Yes, I said lemon-mint and yes, it is as gross as it sounds.

I had a REALLY stressful day at work today. To the point where I think perhaps it's time for a new job. I'm not 100% on that, but I was almost stressed to the point of breaking down and going to Cold Stone Creamery. I should mention I'm lactose intolerant, so that is some hard core stress. Thankfully my will power stayed with me and I had 2 meringue cookies instead when I got home. Don't ask me how I held out... I have no idea...

[Mami]

Originally Posted by AnAbsoluteDiva

Robin,
Total calories for today were 300 with 12% coming from fat. Four mile-run and back and biceps workout.

How do I say this without being rude? Almost everyday your calories are well below 1200 calories. Is this something new for you or why are you going to this extreme?

Developing muscles requires a lot of calories and protein, none of which you're getting. You said you're building muscle and I believe you, but think how much more they would develop if they received the needed calories and protein. There's often little point in lifting if you don't eat a bunch of protein within a few hours of your workout.

Personally I think women look more sexy with some meat on their curves (both muscle and that in-shape type of hard fat you get when you eat but also workout).

Diva, very sorry in advance if I should be minding my own business

[rockinrobin]

Good morning ladies.

Yes, walkingtolose, I think my scale is at least SEMI-accurate. And that's good enough for me. I'm not looking for perfection. I just want to have an idea of where I stand.

Justme, it sounds like we have the same scale.

zenor, sorry your work is so stressful. Good job on resisting food when stress hits. Not an easy thing to do. Don't we all know that? A smiley addiction? I can think of a lot worse things to be addicted to.

calbgurl, I need to take a cue from you and do some heavy duty house cleaning as well.

Wednesday's calories - about 1200, with lots and lots of exercise. I conked out last night at about 9:00.

Have a great day everyone, healthy and safe.

[aphil]

Originally Posted by AnAbsoluteDiva

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/tanji5.htm

Second paragraph is where the information lies. I was at 9% body fat five years ago when I was a fitness competitor (fitness... not bodybuilding). I do not menstruate (cancer) so amenorrhea is not an issue. I work closely with my MD (oncology) to be sure I'm not screwing myself up in other ways. While it may not be for the masses, it works for me and quite a few others like me. Blood pressure, cholesterol levels, liver, kidneys, heart are healthy and in fine working order.

I didn't arbitrarily choose that figure, and I most definitely do not have an eating disorder nor a poor self-image.

I would consider 20% for myself if it weren't that the full 20% insists on settling on my thighs and nowhere else.

;-)

I agree that many bodybuilders and fitness competitors do often carry a body fat percentage of around 10%. On this same note-it is only their "contest" weight and body fat-not what they carry on a day to day, or monthly/yearly basis. If you look at any Muscle & Fitness, or other bodybuilding magazine-the women's stats usually say something like:

Weight: 129 Contest: 117

Basically saying that their average maintenance weight and body fat% is much, much different than what they carry every single day. My stepfather, as many know here, is a former competitive bodybuilder (I have pics of him shaved, tanned, and Speedo-ed! ) and his contest weight/body fat was not what he carried every day. It is only "short term" for a competition. They might only carry that weight and extremely low percentage for a couple of weeks, and then go back to a better (healthier) weight and percentage.

I work at an Athletic Club-my coworkers are personal trainers. My mother is a nurse. My stepfather a former competing bodybuilder. I am a professional dancer/instructor. I am around fitness every single day...and I honestly do not believe that what you are striving for, and what you are doing, is healthy.

Your oncologist may be saying that your functioning is fine right now, but does he know that you ran 4 miles, and strength trained on 300 calories? Does he know that you consistently eat an average of only 900 calories a day? Your functioning may be okay now-but I am sorry, it is going to affect you sooner or later-and it would be irresponsible of me, as a moderator here, not to tell you so.

Whether or not you menstruate due to cancer treatment does not make 10% body fat okay. It just means that you no longer have that "warning signal" to let you know that you are overdoing it.

I have been worried for a while-and I am finally being vocal about it. If not for helping you, than at least helping everyone else here, including the newbies-know that 300-900 calories a day and overexercising on that little food are not healthy. There are young people (teens) who come here to 3FC, and recovering anorexics/bulimics here as well, and I don't want them thinking that this type of regime is healthy-because it isn't.

[AnAbsoluteDiva]

Whoa, guys!

I understand the concern about eating disorders and young women, the pressure they're under to look a certain way, and the crazy things they may do to get there.

But I am not one of those. If you look at my calories over the past week or so, you'll see I've had days of 1400 and more. I zig zag a lot and it isn't planned that way. When I'm hungry, I eat. When I'm not, I don't. I've never been an emotional eater. I don't use food for comfort. I only gained the 20 or 25 pounds over the past five years because I stopped working out COMPLETELY. Unless you count getting the mail as a workout.

If you look at the patterns, I always eat very little when I work out. Studies have shown that exercise curbs appetite. It's true. It does for me every time.

March 16 - 929 calories (worked out)
March 17 - 1093
March 18 - 1913 (race day)
March 19 - 1473
March 20 - 1767
March 21 - 300 (worked out)

Clearly, on the days I work out, I eat way less (with the exception of Race Day which just knocked me out after climbing those hills that I swore were mountains). It seems to me that the wise thing to do is to look at a total picture before honing in on brush strokes.

As for the ten percent count, I won't debate that any further. Healthy women in other parts of the world are not nearly as hung up with the numbers as we are. Think Kenya.

Miz Claudia, I assure you there will be plenty of curves on this frame when all is said and done! LOL

But if my posting is deemed as a threat to the well-being of the masses, then I will refrain from doing so. As wonderful as this forum has been for me, and as lovely as you ladies have been, the last thing I want is to be the contributing factor in someone's downward spiral into anorexia or bulimia.

Miz Claudia, I will PM you when I head to NYC. It would still be great to see you and have lunch with you!

Be well, ladies, and press on!

Wendy

[zenor77]

RockinRobin~ Thanks for the support! I really don't want to be at work today, but I'm determinded to have a better day today. Regardless of everyone else at work!