I debated whether or not to open a 'can or worms' but I think it is an important subject and the whole point of boards is to get a diverse set of opinions, so even though many or most of you might disagree with me, that again is the point of having boards. And I choose the title with care, this is a view not 'the' view not the 'right' or 'wrong' view it is a view from my own experience.
It was incredibly important to me in my weight loss journey to no longer accept my weight or myself being at my high weight. When push came to shove every day when we all make our eating decisions this non-acceptance was the extra push for me to stay the course.
This was a decision based on love. Love of life, love of family, and yes love of self. If I didn't love life and want to get the most out of it, then it would have been easy to accept my weight. If I didn't love being outdoors and being active and hiking, it would have been easier to accept my weight. If I didn' love my family and friends it would have been easier to accept my weight, but I didn't want to deny them a healthy me or someone who was able to partake in activities with them. If I didn't love myself I could have accepted my weight.
I also realized there were social implactions for being overweight even those they are not correct. Discrimination in jobs (studies find overweight people make less then people who weigh less) are WRONG. Making assumptions about people's personalities who are overweight is also wrong, there are a million reasons for being overweight.
However finding someone attractive or not attractive because they are overweight is NOT WRONG. Think about it. I am very accepting of gay people because my personal stance is it is biological. I never 'choose' to be attracted to women I just am. Should I be critcized if I was attracted to men not women? I don't think so. I never 'choose' not to be attracted to women who are a certain size I just am. And it is NOT media driven. I am not attracted to the skiny model type women the media keeps driving are beautiful and desirable either. The point is it is a biological reaction (with I am sure some society thrown in) who I or anyone else finds attractive. And it is pointless on this point agruging if it is wrong or not. Is it wrong to not find people attractive with small noses?
So part of the non-acceptance of my weight was realizing that a lot of women would not find me attractive at my large size. And I never thought of it as wrong. **** if I did I would have been a hypocrite no? I didn't find sizable women attractive why should I expect them to find me attractive? Part of why I am writing this is that a previous discussion helped clarify my own thoughts on these issues. As I said a couple of paragraphs ok issues surrounding discrimination of overweight people in society are dead wrong and that includes being embarrased or not by someone who is overweight. But finding someone overweight attractive is not wrong, it is mostly biological with some obvious bias by mass media thrown in there. But clearly it isn't wrong in the same way discrimination is. You can not 'politically correct' what somone finds attractive or not. Would a man or woman who found average weight or skinny people very unattractive be 'wrong'?
I just wanted to provide my view that non-acceptance of my weight for important life issues is what, ulitmately, led me to lose the weight. And that may not be the case for anyone else. But I don't want to have anyone feel 'presured' into feeling they have to accept their weight or ok about it or whatever in order to lose it. That did not at all work for me, but it may for others. I also don't want to feel 'shallow' because I am not attracted to a certain size woman. I am not attracted to thousands of women with 'perfect' by my denifition bodies I have run across as well. Again as far as I can tell I don't even 'choose' who I am attracted to. But here again I feel my thinking has cleared over the past few days. Being attracted to someone is an entirely personal phenomona that is very important but it different from accepting someone as co-worker, boss, child, parent, spouse, friend etc. Judging someone in those roles be weight is wrong. But clearly weight does come into play with attractiveness just as a thousand other factors do and someone not finding a person attractive based on weight as one factor is no different from someone not finding a certain height or full lips attractive or not.
in my view, there's a big difference between finding a person attractive enough, in ALL ways, to form a loving relationship, and acknowledging a person's right to every day courtesy and respect.
not that you've confused the two, but i think many people in this world do. they make the jump from "fat = unattractive" to "fat = subhuman = object of ridicule"
you also made the point that your weight loss journey was largely motivated by self-love. and that's really the best way. in fact, the only way.
many people, women especially, simply don't have self-love, and they are unable to accept themselves [let alone love themselves!] regardless of their weight. they view their lives as worthless because of their weight. when they lose the weight, their lives are still worthless because they don't have the perky nose or the right clothes, or enough money, or whatever.
much of the self acceptance concept tries to wake people up to the fact that, regardless of size, they are worth the effort. they are worth loving. and perhaps, the self-love will grow and help the healthier person emerge. it's not really about "i dare you to love me!!!!" but more about "i dare to love myself"
i once told someone that i could no longer generate the self-hate i needed to lose weight. the response was that self hate doesn't work, but self love would. and i answered that this was a completely alien concept!!!!
oh, i could keep going. but this might be enough to pull a few more worms out of the can.
Well, I don't think this will stir up quite as much trouble as you may have thought!
I agree with you that attraction is a personal choice. I too have people that I do not find attractive. For example, a REALLY good looking girl (in my opinion) has fallen in love and is getting married to this guy I know who I don't find attractive. but she does!! Attraction is all a matter of personal choice.
HOWEVER, What I do have a problem with is when people let someone's physical appearance instantly influence them on whether or not they will speak to them, or even socialize with them. All too many times I have seen my wonderful, sweet, incredible friends passed over because of their appearance. That is wrong.
A true relationship is not only based on physical attraction. I was not tremendously physically attracted to my husband at first sight. It was his personality, his sense of humor that really caught my interest. I did of course develop a physical attraction for him.
What I have EXTREME issue with is people who fall in love, accept the person, marry them, and then when they put on some weight say "I don't love you as much" or "I'm not as attracted to you anymore so I don't have sex with you as much"... That is not right in my opinion. Your attraction to your spouse is not based on physical issues alone. You should accept them for who they are, and continue to love them.. again the difference between "love" and "attraction" and "health concerns" and "embarrasment". I garuntee you that if you DO happen to have the joy of meeting someone and falling in love with them, that someday they will be old and wrinkled, and sagging, with no teeth.. but you will still love them just the way they are. With loving someone comes accepting them, faults and all.
Besides, if my mom had passed over my dad just because he was big, I wouldn't be here today
Most of you if not all and me as well don't/didn't accept our weight or we would not be on these boards. And it is totally possible and commendable to feel good about one's self and not where you are with where you want to be with your health and weight. So I wasn't really saying much at all I guess except wherever you find motivation from to lose weight be it 'non-acceptance' or whatever that motivation is a good thing.
Now it's my turn on this subjet. And my oppinion isn't totally different form yours Larry.
I agree that you can't change what attracts you to someone. But at the same time, you can develope an attraction to someone. Their have been many people that I wasn't initially attracted to, but once I got to know them, their personallity, their heart, I developed an attraction to them. I have a friend who met a guy on the net, (not my thing but o'well) she is very overweight and the guy she met has not visible body fat. They talked and talked on the net. He didn't know what she looked like and she didn't know what he looked like. Anyway, they grew to like eachother a lot with out first seeing eachother. She then told him about her wieght problem and he told her that he liked her much more then to worrie about weight. They met, dated and married. She told me later that when he told her about his other girlfriends that none of then were even a little overwieght. They now have been married for about 2 years. He has supported her greatly and in turn she grew to really love herself and since has lost about 50lbs.
The whole point of my story is to show you that just because you arn't initially physically attracted to a person, that doesn't mean you won't if you just take a min to actually meet that person. (i hope you understand what i am saying )
I also agree that you need to find what motivates you to loose the weight. We are all built and programed different so no two things will work for all of us.
I also agree that you can be happy without accepting your own weight. And others can still love you. Some of my weightgain makes me proud. It came from my two beautifull girls. (don't get me wrong, i still want it gone)
I also wanted to mention that like being gay, (i as well feel you are born that way) they also think you may be born with a gene that can make you heavy. So with that said, although you can't change who you are attracted to, you can change your feelings on attraction. You can decide that you will take a look at the person in another way, you may end up finding that person very attractive. You never know.
I hope everyone understands what I'm saying. This is a hard subject, but a good one. Thank you for bringing it up.
Ok, I agree. I do not accept my weight. But there is a HUGE difference between ME not accepting my weight and other people accepting me regardless of my weight, do you not agree??
I was thinking about this a lot on my way into work today. Weight loss is a really really difficult thing. So is accepting yourself, and self esteem if you are overweight. But I KNOW that I had to accept myself as a person, and be really secure in my own self before I could even THINK about doing this, or it would backfire. I tried over and over again for the wrong reasons to get the weight off, and every time something would happen that would throw me right back off again. Each time I came back weighing more than I did the last time. Now, I will tell you my story of the last 2 years. When I met Greg in November of 1999 I weighed about 220 lbs. Yes, I know that was overweight, but nowhere near as bad as now. I looked good, I fit into size 16/18, I was just out of shape. I have the type of body that if I am not exercising, even if I don't eat anything, I put on weight. In January of 2000 I got really really sick. I had been put on OrthoTrycycline, and was bleeding non-stop, and ended up in the hospital with an IV in my arm delivering blood to me. That was the beginning of a long chain of illness. I got pneumonia, I had stomach flus, I was really sick until about March or April. In April, I tried to exercise, but my lungs were so taxed from the pneumonia, and having asthma, that I could only walk about 1/8 of a mile before having an asthma attack. I couldn't do anything really, but the only way to get better WAS to exercise. So I was just starting to slowly get better, and get back on my feet. I did the walk for hunger the first weekend in May, and actually made it 5 miles, but ended up with an extreme case of sun poisoning, and whammo, couldn't be outside for a few weeks. Then I broke my wrist in the beginning of June. I was in a cast for 10 weeks. Let me tell you right now, the LAST thing you want to be doing in Massachusetts is exercising in the summertime OUTSIDE in the heat with a cast on. It thumped on me, I sweated into it, it was miserable. So I stayed inside out of the heat. Then in August, I joined Weight Watchers. I lost 5 lbs in my first week, because we went away for the weekend and WALKED EVERYWHERE!!! I was out of breath all the time, but I ate like a cow and still lost 5 lbs!! But I quickly gave up on weight watchers because I was also in treatment for clinical depression at that time, and so my weight went up from the medications. I finally came off the medicine in about February of 2001, at the same time as I was finally diagnosed with Fibroid tumors. In April I had surgery to remove them, and once again, no exercise for 4 weeks. Then they found out that for some reason, my adenoids had grown back after they were removed in 1998. They were very concerned that I had non-hodgkins lymphoma, and so once again, I found myself on steroids = balloon face, and I was supposed to limit my exercise. I had them out in June. Of course, during all this I was also getting ready to get married in July. I'll tell you right now, when you are planning a wedding, the LAST thing on your mind if you are overweight, have really poor lung function, AND are recovering from surgery, is trying to get back in shape. Getting back in shape for me would be a really really long long long hard road, because my lungs had never gotten better or "retrained" after the pneumonia from a year before. THEN I Went through an ENORMOUS emotional trauma, and I am a comfort eater. I packed on another 50 lbs, which gets me to where I am today.
I also have a genetic disposition towards being overweight. I am pretty much a genetic copy of my dad. We look EXACTLY the same, have the same personality, and the same big bone structure, and pack our weight on in the same places. I've never known my dad to not be overweight. I KNOW that some people have a genetic disposition to putting on weight more easily than others.
Am I telling you this sob story to give an excuse for why I weigh what I do right now?? NO! But I am telling you that you NEVER know why someone might be overweight.
I know for a fact the reason I am succeeding right now is because I DO accept myself as a person. I just don't accept my weight, mainly because of all the health issues I have that are slowly going away as I lose the weight. I don't think I could lose this weight if I wasn't happy with myself, or didn't accept myself. I had to be in a really good place before I could ever even think about doing this. Yes, I hit rock bottom the day I stepped on the scale and realized that I had a serious problem. However, I also had the internal self-love, and the external support to take on this incredibly challenging task. I'm doing it for ME. I'm not doing it for anyone else. I want to have my life back. I don't want to be a respiratory cripple anymore. I don't want to feel like I'm going to pass out just after climbing a flight of stairs. I want to reclaim my health, and have my body be able to keep up with my mind's and heart's passion for life. That is why I am losing weight.
Good luck in your weight loss, I think those are wonderful reasons for losing weight and I hope things work out. Maybe it is because I am male but along with wanting to do the weight loss for myself and those around me because I love myself there honestly was anger, frustration, and reprimand that went along with it for me as well. I was completly pissed off at myself for what I had done to my body and that was part of what allowed me to succeed. I know I would not have succeeded without being angry at myself. I don't claim that works for everyone and it may indeed totally not work, I just am saying honestly what happened in my case.
I also agree you can grow into finding people attractive or not attractive! I don't know how many times I have gone up to attractive women and they just don't seem very attractive after getting to know them and, of course, the opposite happens as well. I just don't think I have 'concious' control over the initial attracted to thing.
I agree that looks do have a big part in our lives and what we are and are not attracted to. I love a man with a nicely built bod!! :sigh: but anyway
I also know that if you were going to try to develop a relation ship with some one there are some things that you just can not live with. for me it is being unclean, body odor (armpits), and feet stink. and being over bearing, and being vulgar. those are definte turn offs for me. if the guy has these things then it will be very hard for me to get to know this guy to find out if i like him or not. then i need to like him enough to be able to overlook these things. so it is obvious that the relation ships where the guy or gal decided they do nto like the mate cuz they have gained weight then that was one of the things that were a trigger that turned them off in the begining.
Now to be honest not only are us women forced to feel that thin is being accepted, but think of the men? they are also under the same social pressures too!!! as a young guy if they are with the heavy girls then they are ridicled for being with the fat kid. and that is still from younger ages when the fat kid was riddiculed. so it goes even deeper than we atually think. it is in the young child in the way we make them think from the start. so to make the changes we need to make the changes in our kids too. and they are getting the wrong message.
I could go much deeper into this sayint that theyget the wrong messages when we see a large child and say too bad that kid is so big. we say it with concern for the kid not as riddicule, but is that how the kids see it?? when they hear us. are they understanding what is meant when we say that???
and then i can go even deeper by saying that as a society we give these kids the idea but what are we doing to change those thoughts??? Look at the tabloids, look at the talk shows. and most importantly what do to give the kids good examples. it is so hard to lose weight that we all know that it takes a mighty effort, and not all people have the energy to loose the weight and make the changes in thier life, so their kids learn what they are tought.
let me open the can just a bit larger with this thought: now think if we feel so bad about how big we are and feel very selfconsious. (due to the social pressures) are we really presenting the best possible person that we are??? are we being our true self when we meet these new people?? I found that when i was larger i did not feel good with my body and was very selfconsious when i met new people and wondered if i was being judged on my size. what kind of outward presentation was i giving unconsiously??? was THAT the turn off or was it really my size??? When i did not think about my size i could be flirty and joke, and really have a good time. SOOO is some of the feeling because we are not showing the best person that we are???? I also know that i was feeling depressed due to my weight, and did not like my self so how can have expected anybody else to like me???
Well Larry I have opend the can larger. i have so much more i can say but i will leave it for now.
but in essence yes it is wrong to judge people because of their size, their color, their sex, and their national background. But it will always happen. we can just make it known that it is wrong, and hope to God that some day they will realize what a mistake they have made. Because of prejudice many great relationships will never happen, and many more people will be unjustly hurt.
I feel a book coming soon!! Wow..great topic and am so glad it was started.
Maybe a bit surprising, but while reading the 1st post, I was shaking my head agreeing with you completely diamond.
Where do I start without babbling forever?
Self Acceptance: Like it was said, none of us have accepted our weight. We may have accepted our bodies, accepted that we HAD to lose weight, accepted the people that we are, accepted that we are fat, accepted that most of us have been battling this forever, accepted that we failed more times than we would like to admit. I remember torturing myself over those feelings, and it got me nowhere. Just because I was completely depressed and fed up with myself because of my failure, it still didn't give me the determination to do something about it. I didn't accept my weight, and I still haven't. That's why I am here, as we all are. Anger didn't equal the determination I needed. Love did. I love myself enough, as I love life too much to settle for this. I am capable of changing my body, no one else is. If I want to continue looking in the mirror and not feeling good about myself, then I will sit back and try to convince myself that it's okay if I weigh 215 lbs. Is it okay? Of course not. But why not? For me, looks. There I said it.
The biggest reason, and the biggest motivator for me is to LOOK BETTER. Am I shallow or vain? Some may say. But am not going to sit here and lie and tell the world that it doesn't matter what you look like. BECAUSE it does. In every aspect. I am NOT in any way saying that a woman who weighs 145 lbs looks much better than a woman who weighs 245 lbs. I see ugliness all around me, despite what the weight is. But for me, I can and will look much better at a lower weight. And with looking better comes feeling better. I will feel better, I will be stronger and in the end I will be happier. I do have medical concerns also, which pushed me to lose weight. But all in all honesty, looks is my #1 reason.
And while I am being so honest, I will admit and have admitted thought I do not judge someones character on their waist line, I am not attracted to very skinny men or very heavy men. Usually, if a man weighs less than 200 lbs, I am not attracted to him. Just my preference. I am not offended if a man isn't attracted to me because of my weight. It's his preference. In a perfect world, every man would be attracted to me, as I would be attracted to every man. But that's not the case. There are plenty of men that are attracted to me now, and were at 250 lbs. Remember the saying "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder".
We cannot judge people who aren't attracted to overweight people. We don't judge those who aren't attracted to the skinny model types. I see many gorgeous men dating women who aren't exactly beautiful, as vice versa. We are all attracted to what we feel. I have had male friends who weren't "my type" but after forming a friendship and knowing eachother, an attraction did form. But that is not the way it always is. And on-line relationships are probably the most intimate way of getting to know someone without knowing what they look like. But when you walk into a bar o a club or something, and you see someone, your really not thinking about what lies in their heart. You are thinking about what you see, and what you feel. We are human, and we all would pass up a chance to talk to a man/woman who may have been the most special person we'd ever meet in our lifetimes, if we found them extremely unattractive, wether it be weight, clothes, hygene, or just the face.
There are of course shallow people (imo) that refuse to even talk to people who don't meet their standards. Women who weigh more than 120 lbs, men who aren't at least 6 ft, have a great job, 3 car garage..the list goes on. But those ppl are missing out on so much, because they are judging instantly. And I would never want to date a man who cannot appreciate a woman with curves and some meat to her bones. Men who will only date the 110 lb skinny 6 ft model types..don't do anything for me, and I'd walk right by them even if they did want to talk to me. I like my curves, I like meat on my bones, I just want them much smaller.
I am sure I wouldn't be attracted to all of the men that my friends find attractive and vice versa. I find myself attracted to all men, regardless of weight, height, race and age. Again, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. But I couldn't love someone who didn't love himself.
Wow..let me stop..I don't even know what my point was..I just babbled. But am not deleting it now.
One more thing before you all start boo-ing me to sit down and shut up already.
As far as the "gaining a great deal of weight" while in a relationship...
You love someone for them, not because of what they look like. You cannot possibly stop loving someone if they gain 50 lbs. If you do, it is not love. But you're attraction level can change. Yes, you are attracted to you're "honey" for other reasons besides looks. A beautiful woman can be a real pain, and not be attractive at all. Or a not so hot looking woman can be irresistable based on who she is within. My point is this, I would not be a horrible person if I wasn't attracted to my "honey" as much as I once was after he gained 100 lbs. Would I love him any less? Of course not. When I was married, and I gained weight right before I got married, my then husband was honest with me. He still found me attractive at the heaviest weight, but not as much as when I was 50 lbs less. It wasn't just "the looks" either, it was my attitude. And boy, pack 50 lbs onto a woman, and her attitude changes, nomatter what some may say. I cannot possibly be attracted to a man who is grumpy, depressed, no self esteem, crying and *****y all the time. Is it okay to let the relationship die because of a weight gain, or stop having sex or not love them anymore? of course not. And in any case this does happen, there are other much deeper problems, and the weight gain is being used as an excuse to not look deeper into the relationship.
We all have different needs in relationships..and we have them in different orders. Some may be financial support, communication, family life, hygene and being in shape. I can say that communicating with me is the #1 need that I have, while some women would say family life is more important to them. And then some could say a spouse that takes care of themselves, exercises and feels good about themself is their #1 need.
We are all different with different likes and needs. We just have to remember that and not judge others because of the differences.
Okay..am going now and promise no more long babbling posts today.
Unless of course someone seriously picks my brain. heehehehe
love is blind. straight fact. if someone "loves" someone and then that person gains weight, goes bald or developes warts on their nose and eyelids, is that grounds for loss of love from their partner? NO! if one truely loves someone, they dont give a (add your own word here) about what is seen with the eyes. love sees with the heart and they soul.
i have never had a girl friend in physical life. not one. ive had three that i have met online, and one i even moved to live with for a few months. i fell in love with their person, not their looks. i could love a woman who weighs 650 lbs and a woman who weighs 78lbs
if someone decides to lose weight for any other reason than to look better for themselves than that person is FLAT OUT WRONG. losing weight for another person is a form of mental abuse in my mind. to lose for yourself, is an act of pure love of YOU!!!
You are right! It must be for yourself to lose weight!! there is nobody that you should change for. When i said that about "changing their feelings" i was trying to gently say that it was not a true deep down from the heart love. but i was trying to be kindwhen i said that. there are many here that feel that pressure from their husbands. I will say that i had never heard it from mine. I know it was my imangination that was causing me to have my feelings like i did. (but 65 lbs down i get the same responce so i know that is not the problem. ) on the other hand my DH has gained 50 lbs since we met and well i do not feel he has to lose weight but i am concerned for his health, and his cholesterol, but it does not make any changes to me with physical attraction.
BTW great pict!!!
and it is nice to hear that from a guy. not many people will give them the chance to know some one and love first before they meet.
To accept or not to accept: a view on weight loss
but anyway 
