When I was in grad school, "No Fat Chicks" signs were EVERYWHERE. One day, at a plus-size clothing shop, an extremely unattractive middle-aged man came in to buy something for his mother. He was wearing a "no fat chicks" t- shirt.
We politely helped him, and then laughed our asses off. We joked that NO chick would have him, so he really didn't have to advertise his preferences. We ended up joking about a store we might open, called "We B Fatchicks" where the door censor would be weight sensitive and would only open for weights of 200 lbs or more.
I'm not sure if there's a point to my story, but it never dawned on me to confront the guy or anyone else about offensive t-shirts, bumper stickers, unwelcome mats, or signs in their windows.
Of course, I tend not to get offended easily. I even winked once at a guy wearing a "no skinny chicks" t-shirt.
Was his t-shirt offensive? Yep, especially to skinny women, but I was in my 20's and at the time didn't care what "skinny chicks" thought, and hey, he was cute... and I've always been drawn to dark or sarcastic humor.
My husband loves wearing off-the wall, sometimes offensive t-shirts, such as "Sin like you mean it." I bought him one that reads "Come over to the Darkside, we have cookies," and another that says, "Welcome to the Darkside, we lied about the cookies." He also has an "I love my wiener" shirt with a picture of a dachshund, and a pink shirt that says "My executioner's robe is in the wash."
My favorite is "I'm big, you're small, have a nice day!"
I understand you're uncomfortable about the mat, and since you live in an area where people voluntarily give up their property rights, I suppose complaining to the governing body is every bit as appropriate as telling people what color Christmas lights they can display and how long they can display them, and what breed of dog they can own, and what kind of toys and chairs can be left on the lawn, and how many cars can be parked in front of your home and whether or not you can have a fence or garage sale.
Personally, while I find the mat mildly offensive, I find the idea of forcing him to remove it even more offensive, but then again I'd never live in an area with "strict rules" about what I may own or display on my property.
As for the "No fat chicks" mat, maybe if it hadn't been everywhere in the mid-1980's, I would be more offended now. Probably not though, as I find even the most offensive bumper stickers amusing, mostly because to put a bumper sticker on your care you have to believe that someone cares about your opinions.
Kaplods, I actually thought the sayings on your husbands shirts were funny! If I knew him IRL I would look forward to seeing the various shirts just for the laughs.
It's not that the mat is offensive, and it's not about controlling other people...it's about standing up and having the balls to speak out against discriminatory statements and actions! In defense of those discriminated against and as an example for our children! I am saddened that so many of you would brush this off...what if the doormat, or the man's t-shirt had said No n-words allowed? Would you feel compelled to make your dissent known in that case? Things won't get better unless we are willing to step outside our comfort zones and stand up for what is right. You were willing to offer your opinion to the OP that her concern is petty...but you wouldn't offer your opinion to a vocal bigot that his actions are immature? It doesn't take much time or energy to simply state, "Hey, you know your doormat is pretty offensive.", I see no reason whatsoever not to. Just MO.
Even if the mat had used a racial, religious or ethnic group, my feelings would be pretty much the same - I would be offended, but would not expect anyone to force him to alter his property because I was offended.
I very well might SAY something to him, because I have the same right to free speech as he has (though I'd do it from the sidewalk so I couldn't be accused of tresspass.
As for children, it's a potential teaching moment to illustrate to children that there rude and bigoted people in the world, and that often ignoring them is the best way to make them go away.
If the mat had read "no goth chicks," or "no Jehova's Wirnesses," "No Busybodies," or even "No Muslims," a large number of people would be less offended, or would even find it funny.
But ultimately it doesn't matter how offensive you find the message, the turd-ball has a right to say it and display it on his property - just as we all do. On our own property or on public property we have the same right to voice OUR opinions.
Actions I would support (which protect the right to free speech) would be
1. Knocking on his door and telling him in any way you'd like that you find his mat offensive, or writing him a letter (anonymously or not). Just remember that threats are illegal and sometimes vague or implicit threats - so you probably don't want to say what horrible things you might wish to happen to him.
2. Getting neighbors to communicate to him in a group or even asking the condo association to ask him to remove it, but for me, forcing the issue is unethical.
My sister and I were once looking for affordable apartments, and found a very nice place in an older section of town. We decided against it because a couple of the houses had HUGE confederate flags displayed and more than half of the homes had pitbulls and other "badass" breeds.
None of it proof that the neighbors were skinhead racists (except for the bumper stickers on one of the vehicles), but we decided against the apartment and not just because our African American family members wouldn't feel comfortable visiting.
But does that mean that people shouldn't own big, fierce-looking dogs or display bigoted signs or symbols?
I think not, especially because I want to know who the morons and bigots are, and when they tag themselves, bonus.
"I would be offended, but would not expect anyone to force him to alter his property"
Nobody is disputing his right...I agree he cannot and should not be forced, although he can be legally if he signed a lease with an applicable clauses. My aunt was forced to remove an American Flag from the front of her Texas condo, even as her son and husband served in Iraq. I have strong libertarian leanings...so no force here...just moral obligation to be a good citizen.
"I very well might SAY something to him, because I have the same right to free speech as he has"
Whew..okay...that makes me feel much better. lol
"As for children, it's a potential teaching moment to illustrate to children that there rude and bigoted people in the world, and that often ignoring them is the best way to make them go away."
I agree that it presents a teaching moment..."Here's how NOT to be kids."...but personally I want my kids to be taught to stand up to intolerance, not stand idly by...so my teaching moment would include a brief reproach of the perpetrator. How does ignoring bigots the best way to make them go away? (honest question) WW(MLK)D? I think he would disagree that ignoring bigots is effective. lol
"If the mat had read "no goth chicks," or "no Jehova's Wirnesses," "No Busybodies," or even "No Muslims," a large number of people would be less offended, or would even find it funny."
...Not this person. I don't see how busybodies are comparable to a large minority group commonly discriminated against, but as for the others, all those people would deserve reproach as well. I can't count the times I have spoken to people about their attempted reappropriation of the confederate flag. Armed with a small amount of history and a smile, you can inform people without being confrontational. They usually won't immediately change their behavior...but at least a seed has been planted. I know this has been true for me as an individual. As a teen I used to use "gay" as though it had negative connotation, then one day I did it at a cafeteria table and the girl sitting next to me said, "You know, my sister is gay, and I would really appreciate it if you didn't say that, it can be hurtful to people."...I was embarrassed. I didn't change my behavior immediately, but I never forgot what she said. With practice I eliminated that use of the term from my vocab...because one person had the chutzpah to speak up. Little actions, big outcomes.
The actions you support are the very same actions I would support...the thing I can't get behind is inaction. Apathy is American enemy #1 lol
No, people should not display racist/bigoted symbols. I'd defend to the death their right to do so, but that doesn't mean they should...and their protected right to do so should not encourage people to be complacent in correcting their behavior.
Thanks for writing kaplods, you are one of my favorites. I always enjoy your perspective.
Hmmm, soooooo.... yeaaahhh.... let's seeee..... discrimination against people over a certain weight is not illegal. But it's unethical. (and IMO, it's downright passe.) Sooo.... you have a neighborhood community where this attitude is potentially not okay as defined by it's rules and regulations.
And here, right here, is a community(us! you reading this now!) that has been discriminated against (name calling, office politics, violence, bullying, underlying anti-fat social attitudes, lack of accommodations, etc.) annnnndddddd....
When one of us has a chance to say "No, your behavior isn't ok. Hate isn't ok." We're gonna let it slide?
I'm biracial (black'n'white with a gooey filling). When my parents met, in some States, it was illegal for them to get married. Like, throw them in jail illegal.
I know it isn't the same as ONE person having a LEGAL(!) discriminatory attitude against one unprotected group, buut you get enough of these *******s in a room and you have, drum roll please.... institutionalized discrimination.
So what? What about it? You get unfair hiring practices, unfair housing opportunities, open hostility and, in the case of my parents.... unrecognized marriage.
Yeah, one doormat is a drop in the bucket hate we drink everyday, and walking around with your phasers set to kill is a shitty way to live, and he has the right to insult the people he lives next to, and it's more work to do something than nothing, buutttttt.....
Come on, we gotta shape the world we live in, and if this is her chance to do it, then DO IT.
This guy can't walk around thinking that his home community supports this detrimental paradigm.
He can't feel that hate is okay where he lives.
Because it's not... right?
I am grateful to ALL the people who had nothing to do with interracial marriage but still stood up for others, who said discrimination is bullshit, who silenced the hate.
To the original poster: I really get where you're coming from on the not being able to let go. I find since I've started making changes and basically opened my heart up to deal with how I feel about my body, I'm more sensitive than usual. And that's not a bad thing.
That being said, my smart aleck response would be a door mat in front of my own place that says "No douche canoes that think a "No fat chicks" matt is funny".
Quote:
Originally Posted by Remington90
I've seen trucks with stickers that say "no fat chicks" or "my truck is lifted so fat chicks can't get in .
Speaking as someone nearly 400 pounds who's been driving her brother's diesel as a loaner all week, this doesn't necessarily work. I can haul my fat rear up into anything!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tai
This is timely. I saw this bumper sticker on a truck in a parking lot earlier in the week. A man and woman got out and they were each very large.
I wondered if it was some sort of self-deprecating humor.
I've seen people do this, but I don't condone it myself because while it's great to be able to laugh at yourself, some people aren't there.
Someone who puts this mat out is clearly (to me,at least) looking to get a rise out of people. Why give him what he wants?
This is a good point, and I do wonder whether negative attention is what the guy wants. My hubby has a guy in his gaming group who is known for his bigoted comments. He does it to get attention, and the guys keep him inline by ignoring him (real cold shoulder treatment) when he steps out of line.
He tells the guys (and anyone who will listen) that he won't date anyone who isn't supermodel gorgeous. He reminds me a lot of t-shirt guy when I was in grad school.
Maybe that's why the "no fat chicks" slogan doesn't bother me much, because the guys I've seem making those comments don't have much chance with any woman.
To me, it's not worth rewarding such childish behavior with the attention the guy probably wants so desperately. I imagine the mat reflects "sour grapes" more than anything. I suspect he wants to appear as if it's his choice and not the fat chicks who might reject him.
This is definitely the case with hubby's gamer friend. The guy doesn't have much of a chance with any female because of his limited social skills and his "reject them before they can reject me" attitude.
He's so pitiful it's hard not to let his ignorance BE his punishment. Can you imagine any self-respecting woman regardless of size still being attracted to "Mr
Doormat" after seeing that Doormat?
And that's probably why I wouldn't want to ask him to remove it or even explain to him why it shouldn't be there. 1. It gives him the attention he's craving and 2. That mat advertises his ignorance so that it serves as a warning to others that the guy is a poopnugget.
I also think that there are so many offensive door mats, t-shirts, bumper stickers, door signs, tattoos, jewelry, posters and conversations, that you can't confront them all, so you have to pick your battles, but if you only choose to fight those that are aimed at a group you belong to, then you're a bigot in your own right (I don't care who you insult as long as it's not me and my group).
Personally I think the "no fat chick" mat is it's own punishment as I can't imagine that this guy has many friends of either gender and the mat isn't going to help him win anyone over.
Hubby and I have a sign in our house that says "we got rid of the kid, the cat was allergic." We've offended parents with that sign, even when we explain it's a joke and we have no kids. We also have three teddy bear head faux taxidermy mounts (including baby bear) along with a wanted poster for Goldilocks. This has offended or disturbed ethical vegetarian AND hunter friends.
To us the decorations are harmless black humor, but to some we've crossed a line that shouldn't be crossed. We've been told on more than one occasion that our decor is inappropriate for children, and our reply is, "so don't bring your children here, we haven't invited them anyway."
I think if the mat said "no tall chicks" people would think the guy was strange and creepy, but not so offensive - largely because fat is seen as an insult, where tall is not.
I think I'm not offended because you have to give an opinion weight to be offended by it. When I see the "no fat chicks" sign it tends to amuse me, because I think to myself, "As if any chick, fat or otherwise wants your sorry ***."
Hey, that'd be funny, in front of his house, om the sidewalk (public property) writing
If the mat had read "no goth chicks," or "no Jehova's Wirnesses," "No Busybodies," or even "No Muslims," a large number of people would be less offended, or would even find it funny.
But ultimately it doesn't matter how offensive you find the message, thei turd-ball has a right to say it and display it on his property.
Actually I don't know anyone who would condone that or find it funny. Especially when pertaining to religious groups.
I think your point is moot anyway, he lives in a condo and therefore has to adhere to certain rules thank goodness.
Now... If someone could just tell my neighbor that a garden made of plastic flowers is cramping my view then I'd be a happy camper.
Maybe that's why the "no fat chicks" slogan doesn't bother me much, because the guys I've seem making those comments don't have much chance with any woman.
I keep having flashbacks of the guy walking down the beach wearing this t-shirt with his hairy beer gut hanging out. I always thought, "Yeah, I don't think you'll have to worry about that!" LOL
