I am beginning to wonder why there are such negative, nonsupporting posts in the "support" forum. Seems like there is a lot of disdain for fat and those who love themselves despite being fatter than socially acceptable.
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Originally Posted by snapless
I'm sorry but I have to agree with Photochick.
Granted, I'm not in the 300+ club (my high point of overweightness was 200 pounds when I should weigh 135), but I did try the same arguments with myself...sorry if the following is a little blunt but these are some of the arguments I had with myself. I had to be brutally honest with me in order to see results and make commitments.
I'm junoesque, voluptuous.
No, I am just fat. Using pretty words won't make the truth any different. The cellulite on my thighs is disgusting, the rolls around my waist makes me look like the pillsbury doughboy, and I'm embarassed to wear shorts and swimsuits (and wouldn't be caught dead in a short shirt!).
I'm healthy and in moderately good physical condition.
No, the disproportionate amount of fat in my body means my body has to work hard...harder than it should...to function on a daily basis. This means my life span is severely diminished. My blood sugar levels are too high. My blood pressure is too low. My feet hurt if I walk for long periods. There is no way I'd ever be able to keep up with my oldest brother on a hiking/skiing/biking/insert other activity here trip.
*Please note I am 39 and my oldest brother is 17 years older than I, making him 56.
I could go on but (hopefully) you see the picture here. Please don't get me wrong...I love me. But the fat is NOT me. It's extra baggage that I DON'T NEED. It is good that you love yourself (because a lot of people out there don't), but try to be honest with yourself too.
I *am* honest with myself. I actually dont know a more "brutally" honest person than myself.
I don't see how you could have some of the same "arguments" with yourself, as I have an excellent health profile. The stats aren't lying and I am not lying to myself.
Unlike you, I can be very physically active for long periods of time, my blood sugar is just fine as is my blood pressure. That is *my* honest reality. My doctor is supportive of me and my lifestyle.
I am sorry you are embarrassed by your body, but I have to say that your view of self may not change with your body fat percentage. 98% of the "thin" women I know and have worked on have cellulite too.
I think its very complex, and a continuum as well.
I think it is probably healthier to be of a normal weight and a good fitness level than it is to be of a higher weight and a good fitness level. That being said, I think it is probably healthier to be overweight and a good fitness level than normal weight with poor cardiovascular fitness. So it's complex and all factors should be considered by physicians in setting goals and treatment plans.
Yes, agreed on both counts.
AND as I stated before, I obviously intend to continue to lose weight and reduce body fat percentage as I have consistently been doing since last year.
I'd also like to remind everyone that, while this thread was started asking for opinions, and giving opinions is therefore fine, the topic is sensitive and very personal to many people. I'd hope we can all use courtesy, respect, and tact in our responses, and refrain from directing them at specific people or circumstances, even while expressing our differing viewpoints.
If I wanted to "justify" any such thing, why would I continue to drop 1-7 pounds a week, consistently? That is illogical.
Well, by the same token, why would you continue to drop the weight if you truly believe you are healthy as you are?
I'm not trying to say anything negative about you, but you *did* pose the question here and so I tried to answer it honestly. Also the only thing I edited on my post was to add the line about blood sugar - I didn't change anything else.
And, for what it's worth, I'm 40 and I"m just now beginning to see health issues related to my being fat for the last 15/20 years. I played the same mind games with myself - the whole "accept that fat is beautiful" thing ... rather than face the fact that what I was doing to my body was dangerous and unhealthy.
It's not beautiful. It's not healthy. It's not good. Being fat doesn't make anyone a bad person, but none of us should fool ourselves that we're "healthy" and fat. The two are mutually exclusive in the long run.
(Edited: Please note that when I say "you", I"m not directing that towards any one person .. not even the OP, except in the first sentence where I respond directly. Further from that, it's just "you" as the generic anyone who is reading this. )
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Last edited by PhotoChick; 06-12-2008 at 01:34 AM.
Well, by the same token, why would you continue to drop the weight if you truly believe you are healthy as you are?
Because I will be even MORE healthy as I become more lean and fit, that's why. Health doesn't exist in a vacuum.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoChick
And, for what it's worth, I'm 40 and I"m just now beginning to see health issues related to my being fat for the last 15/20 years. I played the same mind games with myself - the whole "accept that fat is beautiful" thing ... rather than face the fact that what I was doing to my body was dangerous and unhealthy.
It's not beautiful. It's not healthy. It's not good. Being fat doesn't make anyone a bad person, but none of us should fool ourselves that we're "healthy" and fat. The two are mutually exclusive in the long run.
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I don't like how you continue to assert that I am "playing games" with myself. You might as well say I am lying. That's rude. I am NOT playing "games". What I am doing is NOT "dangerous and unhealthy". I am exercising, eating well, loving and being loved. It's VERY healthy and balanced.
I am beautiful, healthy and good, TODAY, regardless of contemptuous, scornful assertions to the contrary.
I am sorry you are embarrassed by your body, but I have to say that your view of self may not change with your body fat percentage. 98% of the "thin" women I know and have worked on have cellulite too.
Let me clarify something right now. I've been thin (too thin, not by force but by nature...when you're 21 years old and you wear size 0 and not by choice...). I've also been in extremely good physical condition...so please don't tell me what "other thin women" do. I've been there, both on the sides of the coin.
I also know that fat is not healthy. Period. Ever.
I am only embarassed about the parts of my body that should not be there and which I am working on removing (the fat, unhealthy, ugly cellulite encrusted parts). To insinuate that my dislike of that portion of me is just a symptom of something bigger is...well...rude and misinformed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoulBliss
I am beginning to wonder why there are such negative, nonsupporting posts in the "support" forum. Seems like there is a lot of disdain for fat and those who love themselves despite being fatter than socially acceptable.
While I can't speak for others, it seems to me you are the only one who is getting negative here. You asked what people thought and we have responded honestly. No one, from what I have read, has attacked you or told you to not love yourself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoulBliss
Unlike you, I can be very physically active for long periods of time, my blood sugar is just fine as is my blood pressure. That is *my* honest reality. My doctor is supportive of me and my lifestyle.
I didn't say I couldn't be physically active for long periods of time. I work out at the gym for 1.5 to 2 hours EVERY DAY. What I said was I couldn't keep up with my brother who is 17 years older than I am. I am still 44 pounds overweight and still out of shape - while he has never been overweight or out of shape a day in his life.
Bottom line, if you didn't want people to give you their honest opinions, why did you post?
Harpochicogroucho said something about obese 70, 80, and 90 year olds, and how you don't see them walking around. I live in Florida, where we have many people in those age ranges, and yes, many of them are obese. The reason you don't see them so much is that overweight older poeple have mobility issues. But they are here! --at least the 70 year olds. The 90 year olds I know are all normal weight. Interesting.
It is possible to be fit and fat--any NFL lineman demonstrates that. But it is just so much harder to be fit when obese/overweight as time goes on. I know, because I'm a lot older.
I used to buy in to the idea of fat acceptance--and I do believe people should not be judged by their appearance. That said, the day came when it no longer worked to keep telling myself I was OK. I wasn't OK, and I wasn't happy, and also I wasn't healthy. Not any more.
My view on this is that people have to decide for themselves what to do or not do about their obesity, and also about their health. Yes, it's good for people of any size to be more physically active and to eat healthy foods. That's just true! Being obese is to some extent a separate issue from that, I think--but I believe it really is harder to stay fit when obese as the years go by. Been there.
I think it is more than possible to be fat AND fit. In fact, a lot of the overweight people I know, who workout regularly and eat well, are MORE physically able than some of the skinny people I know.
Also, this might be TOTALLY taboo but... I question how much of a health hazard being overweight really is. Yes, I think being 100+ lbs overweight *IS* a health risk, but I question whether being 50-ish lbs over is really unhealthy. I remember reading some interesting studies that show that eating healthily and exercising regularly, even if it doesn't lead to weightloss, will have a bigger influence on your health than merely being naturally thin. It's an active lifestyle that makes a person healthy, not skinniness.
For myself, I am fat, but I have perfect blood pressure, can walk walk walk walk for hours without feeling tired, all my bloodwork is perfect, I have a strong heart, etc. I don't think my weight is a *health risk* anymore... I think of my desire to lose weight as MOSTLY vanity, and the desire not to regain what I've lost, which WOULD be very unhealthy. I do want to get more fit -- build muscle and endurance, but I definitely think I could do that even if I never lose all the weight (which would suck, of course).
I don't want to talk out of my ear here, and I don't have time to gather stats, so I will just say based on past research and knowledge, overall I don't think you can be fat and healthy long term.
For the here and now, blood work, etc may be great, but that doesn't necessarily show my future, and the unseen damage. I do know that eventually things wear out. Joints, heart, liver, pancreas, etc. Being overweight doesn't cause a lot of problems NOW for everybody, but I completely believe that it can speed up deterioration of or long term effectively of those organs. I won't know for sure what my own personal damage has been until I get older and the time comes.
I think it really depend on the person's genes and body make up.
I am not a large person, and for me personally, being 10-20 lbs. over where my weight should be FEELS absolutely horrendous on me. I feel it when I walk, when I bend and move, driving, making love (sorry - TMI), whatever. I feel more sluggish, etc. Mind you, I am mainly talking about 20 lbs. that came from HEALTHY foods but too much of it... I have never not exercised, so this is extra weight while working out and being 'relatively' fit.
I have often thought how miserable my body would feel with 30, 40, 50 or more extra lbs. to carry when I know how bad it feels with just 20. So, for those who FEEL good with extra weight - no trouble moving, no energy issues, no blood pressure, etc. issues, then that's great. For me, I don't think I can feel fit and heavy at the same time.
BTW, I do not personally know many fit and heavy folks, but I definitely do know some thin and unfit folks!
while we can be fit and fat by socieities standards (i.e. a 160 pound 5'2" woman can be very very fit, healthy and flexible) I do not think at 5'2" 300 pounds we can at age 45 be healthy. at 20 the numbers might look good
at 30 the numbers might look good. you get to 40 the numbers start to look bad.
i'm 48 215 pounds 5'3" and my numbers are good. am I fit? more so than I was 2 years ago.... less than I was at 20....
my numbers at 45 were just starting to look bad...
lso, this might be TOTALLY taboo but... I question how much of a health hazard being overweight really is.
Carrying extra weight makes your joints and bones work harder to support you. You are more at risk for knee, back, hip, and ankle problems if you are overweight. Also fat leeches calcium from your bones so you're at greater risk of osteoporosis.
Carrying extra weight makes your heart work harder to pump the same amount of blood. If you are overweight you are causing your heart to either pump harder/faster or to enlarge to accommodate the increased size of your body.
Carrying extra weight is associated with sleep apnea to a very large degree. Apnea causes the heart rate to increase, the blood pressure to drop, can cause issues related to not getting enough sleep, and can be fatal.
Carrying extra weight is a proven risk factor for developing type ii diabetes and for cancer.
Carrying extra weight, especially around the abdomen is a proven risk factor for heart disease and heart attack.
Carrying extra weight is a proven risk factor for stroke.
Are any of these things that might affect you now? Maybe not. And maybe you'll be lucky and never have any of these issues, despite being overweight. But being an exception doesn't mean that the overall negative effects of being overweight are wrong. Not everyone who smokes gets lung cancer either. That doesn't mean that smoking is healthy.
FWIW I did not have sleep apnea, orthopedic or high blood pressure issues until after i started losing weight... sometimes the arguements are not correct for 100% of the population
sometimes the arguements are not correct for 100% of the population
Taht's right. Read my last line. Not everyone who smokes gets lung cancer either. Does that mean I should go pick up a pack of cigs today and hope I'm one of those folks?
Seems like there is a lot of disdain for fat and those who love themselves despite being fatter than socially acceptable.
