I'm one of the small crowd still gathered around your soapbox hanging on your every word ;)

I know it's not true for absolutely everyone, but I am very definitely someone who's weight loss was hindered by artificial sweeteners. I used to drink literally gallons of Crystal Light thinking I was doing a good thing because that's how I was getting all my water - just flavoring it. I don't think it was the cause of any cravings but I lost no weight no matter what I did or didn't eat. My doctor was the one who actually told me to eliminate artificial sweeteners (originally, it was supposed to be a short term thing to determine if I had a "sensitivity") I was actually so addicted to the stuff that I cried the day I dumped the last of the pitcher down the drain and tossed those cute little tubs in the trash, but in less than two weeks I was noticing a difference not only on the scale but in my whole outlook and attitude. Now, disclaimer here - I also stopped consuming anything that contained HFCs at the same time so I have to be open to the possibility it was the HFC's - or maybe it was a combination of the two so now, to be on the safe side, I simply avoid them both.

My favorite treat these days is chocolate Silk soy milk. It is sweetened with "organically dehydrated cane juice" - no matter how politely they say it, that's still sugar. But, I can have just one serving and put the rest away without a second thought so, for me, that's a form of sugar that doesn't seem to kick in any cravings and hasn't seemed to interfere with my progress toward my goal (I did hit a plateau for a short bit but cutting out the soy milk didn't make a difference in getting past it). I can absolutely see myself going the rest of my life with very little processed sugar and no artificial sweeteners.

Euphony,
Does xylitol have the same horrilbe affects as other sugar alchohols? The gas, bloating and diahrea?

I bought a bottle of stevia at Trader Joe's a while back. I don't like it, it's got a strange after taste for me. But that's just a personal opinion. Everybodies' taste buds are different.
Sarah in MD

Xylitol and Erythritol are sugar alcohols that seem okay to use. All sugar alcohols should be used in moderation as they have a laxative effect. Keep them away from pets, though. My protein powder contains Xylitol.

The Vanilla Creme Liquid stevia tastes okay. The trick is to use the tiniest amount first and then add to taste. Most people use too much and it tastes bitter.

Xylitol can but generally not as bad. The body seems to adjust much faster with it too. But as Belle Mer mentioned, all sugar alcohols should be used in moderation.

WOW, what protein powder do you buy?? The one I have has sucralose, I'm so ticked!

I buy Mercola's Pro Optimal Whey It's expensive, so I don't buy it very often.

But Natural Factors also makes a good one sweetened with Stevia.

I use the Mercola Strawberry and the Natural Factors French Vanilla.

I use them when I don't have an appetite for a regular breakfast.

Thank you so much for the info! I just realized I'm in the "South Beach Diet" forum, well I'm not doing South Beach but when I saw Splenda mentioned in a thread on the "new posts" I had to chime in. <insert grin emot here> ( since clearly I can't yet, and I had to remove the links from the quote...ohhhhhhhh I'll be so happy to finally have privileges here! )

Have you noticed how other people's houses "have a smell" (not necessarily a bad one, just a smell), but you think your own doesn't, and that only after you come home from an extended period of time, sometimes even a vacation that you notice that your house DOES have a smell after all. Or that after a certain period of a bad smell, you don't notice it so much anymore.

That's because your sense of smell habituates over time. You stop smelling smells that are ALWAYS in your environment (survival-wise this is a good thing, so you can smell new smells easier).

It also happens to our taste of salty and sweet. The more we eat, the less we taste it. Nearly everyone has a level of sweet that is "far too sweet" where yummy turns to yucky. For me, that sweet has always been grocery store cake icing. Blegh. But reducing the use of salt and sugars, lowers the bar.

My husband whines that he can't cook for me anymore, because I always tell him it's way too salty. I tell him to stop adding the salt and salty ingredients (like bouillon) and let me season to MY taste and he can season to his. For soups and sauces, I season to my taste and he seasons in the bowl. I keep telling him to cut back on the salty snacks, and his salt-tooth can catch up to mine.

For me, sweeteners are like that too, but I haven't made as much progress in eliminating as with salt. I justified it by saying I really didn't have much of a sweet tooth - as we think of it. I'm not one for overly sweet desserts. Fruit is great. I never understood why anyone made desserts out of fruit, because the fruit itself was such a perfect dessert.

However, I find I still have a tendency to overuse sweeteners. I like savory foods with a sweet component (sweet and sours, barbecue sauces, ketchup, tangy sauces, chicken and tuna salads with sweet relish), and sweet beverages (diet sodas and Crystal Light).

I'm not saying that I'm going to stop consuming artificial or natural sweeteners, but I am planning on drastically cutting back, so my sweet tooth can shrink the way my salt tooth has. Not that I haven't made some progress. Every once in a while I take a bite out of something I used to love (like recently a brownie) and I didn't finish it because it was WAY too sweet. The sweetness coated my mouth and I couldn't get the taste out of my mouth, even with milk. It was like trying to eat Captain Crunch as an adult - it forms a greasy sugar coating on your tongue and the roof of your mouth (or maybe that's just me).

As to our "natural" diet, I think there's a lot of disagreement, but I think that it's safe to say we were more likely designed for an apple than for a brownie (it's a very good thing that brownies don't grow on treas, don't you think). But, as humans we've messed with the fruit so much through selective breeding that even our fruits aren't natural. Several years ago, I read that zoos have had to change their decades old formulas for feeding the herbivores because modern varieties of fruits are bigger and have so much more sugar that the formulas that had been keeping the animals trim, were starting to become obese (because an apple is larger and sweeter than it used to be).

Books like Neanderthin and The Paleolithic Prescription, did give me alot to think about, but I don't think we know what the optimal human diet is, or if there even is one (different climates and/or genetic types might require different proportions of nutrients).

LOL, that's not just you. I had forgotten about that, but I know exactly what you mean.

I'm totally with you there. A couple of months ago I ate a fast food breakfast. First one in years. It was so salty to me, it was inedible.

I'll have to say, though, we can still eat fairly well if we make good choices, like organic or locally grown fruits, veggies, whole grains, and grass finished, free range meats and poultry.

When we stray into processed foods, corn/soy fed meats/poultry full of antibiotics, and genetically modified veggies/fruits and grains, we not only gain weight, we begin to acquire health issues.

No, we can't eat the way our ancestors ate due to soil depletion, chemicals, experimentation, and air/water pollution, but I personally am resolved to try and find the most unprocessed and local food I can get and do the best I can on a budget. I don't even feed my dog commercial dog food.

It's hard to do in this day and age, and it takes time and money, both of which many of us are short on. We can only do so much.

At least with SBD, many people have begun to make better choices.

My hierarchy of "sweeteners":
Splenda - I like the taste, and haven't had any adverse reactions to it. When I was on WW, I made chocolate chip cookies with regular splenda and brown sugar splenda, and my friends couldn't tell the difference!

Agave nectar - I've just discovered this since being on South Beach. It's good for tea, but I'm not sure how it works with baking (no cookies allowed on South Beach!!!! LOL. That might be a "cooking experiment" when I decide to have some cookies).

Equal - I'll use it if I have to. I prefer not to, though.

Sweet-n-low -- NO THANKS. I'll go without first. :barf:

hhhmmm, I wonder if my using splenda in my coffee is whats detering my weight loss! :(... I tried Stevia in the past and it's horrible tasting!

GGRRRRRR I hate this!

I appreciate everyone's soapboxes and information. Here's my soapbox.

Splenda contributed to my near-40 lb weight-loss, after trying several other sugar substitutes. Without it, I would still be a sugar-binging fat cow. I've never had a side-affect from it: no addiction, no headaches, no grouchies, no nothing. It very likely COULD be doing something to my body that I don't know about, but just about everything does these days, with cell phones, pollution, unsafe chemicals in tap water, unsafe chemicals in bottled water, the list goes on to infinity. Now people are raising questions about what's in my soy-based meat substitutes. What's a sugar-hungry, well-hydrated vegetarian that likes to talk on the phone and breathe air to do?

I think it's just another one of those things. Nothing is going to be perfect until the Lord comes back, and people are going to react differently to different things. If you notice that you have negative affects from something, don't put it in your body anymore. If not, and it works for you, then I think you're good to go.

Yeah, this is a really tough issue for some of us. I agree with a lot of what has been posted here--we have such wise members! :grouphug: Here are some things I've learned from talking a lot with other 3FCers and professionals, and from my own experiences:

• People react differently to sugar substitutes. What may give one a migraine may have absolutely no effects on another. Don't assume that something is bad just because it affects someone you know. (for example, apple juice gives me an instant headache and the shakes. I don't think most people think there's anything evil about apple juice, though. ;) ) Just find out how it affects you. I can't eat Sweet n' Low (or other versions of it) because it gives me bad headaches. Equal/aspartame and Splenda don't bother me at all. :shrug:
• Like Amanda so excellently explained, we have to weigh the medical/moral issues of eating chemicals or processed foods against the medical issue of being overweight. What works for you?
• Eating anything extremely sweet does seem to have a strong effect on cravings, even when the sweet is coming from something without any calories. Not everyone reacts the same way to all sweeteners, but it does seem to be very common that when you eat something sweet (even gum), you find yourself wanting to eat more. Be aware of this and figure out what works for you.
• Agave Nectar can be a great substitute. It has a very low GI, is natural (it's juice from the Agave cactus plant), and can work especially well in things that call for honey. But it's expensive.
• My nutritionist told me that with pregnant mothers, they advise to stay away from Sweet n' Low (or other versions of it), have no more than 2 servings of Equal daily, but they allow unlimited amounts of Splenda. That has give me a guide for how much I want to consume of those products.
• I've never had a "laxative effect" from sugar alcohols, but they do cause bad gas (and, hence, pain) if I eat too much of them, even erythritol or xylitol. Whatever the effect on you, if you find that you get side effects, limiting the quantity you consume can help. One thing to keep in mind--xylitol is dangerous for dogs. If you use it for baking, make sure it's kept somewhere your dog can't access.

You'll find more info on this issue in this thread from earlier this year: Natural Sugar Substitutes

:lol3: Weezle, you're a riot! I totally agree, hon. Nothing's perfect. We just try to do our best! :hug: