Question about cream cheese
 

Does anyone know the reason that fat free cream cheese isn't core when cottage cheese is & other fat free cheeses? Also not to sound contrary... why does WW assume that a person will binge on a certain food? I never heard of a diet (except for Atkins) that didn't allow even whole grain bread. I can't imagine anyone overdoing it on WW bread, why would they assume? Is there any scientific proof to the foods they are saying no to? Sorry about all the questions, but I wonder if they are winging this as they go along or have they thought this out before putting it in print?

First off W/W doesn't omit anything. The whole grain bread can be done but you use your WPAs. Breads are a binge and processed food.

As for the cream cheese yes you could mix it with some Splenda or Aspartame and basically make it a cheese cake and eat it all in binge type situation.

They have tested it and (I was told) when they started breads were Core but binges and high calories aka calorie density came into play. I could eat a whole loaf of WW bread without blinking so there now you know someone who could.

I LOVE WW bread and can easily eat 5-6 slices of it, although I don't do that anymore, the guilt sets in after 2, thank goodness for that!

You can also mix the cream cheese & ricotta to make a cheese cake also. Also Kelly S. thanks for saying your response no nicely. It made me feel really good.

:mad:

Not quite sure what you mean. I was not intending for anything to be harsh. I am a straight to the point type person. If you took it that way I am truly sorry but I (and I had DH read it just now and neither did he) see anything to make one feel bad.

If a person wanted to, they could "binge" on any food on the list. I remember when they put a point value to carrots because "some" people were eating the whole bag at one sitting. If you wanted to you could eat a whole chicken or a bushel of tomatoes at one time. I agree with India that the binge element in itself shouldn't have made a food non-core--why not just give us a statement that says "Any food eaten in excess could hinder your weight loss journey. Portion control is urged when eating even Core foods." Or "whole wheat bread is limited to 2 slices at 2 meals a day" like they limited potatoes and rice. We are adults. If we are "serious" about losing weight, we aren't going to binge on a whole loaf of bread or a whole cheesecake or a lb. of pinto beans. The "eat until full" factor should come into play somewhere. I think there is also a big difference between overeating (lack of portion control) at a meal or even cravings and bingeing . Portion control can be taught and reinforced through meal planning and example. Cravings can sometimes be eliminated by excluding certain foods that set up the craving. The whole "binge" element is a psychological issue. I don't think Weight Watches presumes to address that with any of their plans. That's just my opinion.

As to the cream cheese, who knows? But FF cream cheese is 4 TBSP for 1 pt, or you can have regular or whipped at 1 TBSP for 1 pt.

As to cutting out foods that people tend to binge on - I suspect that some foods were removed after doing the test group. My feeling is that there are no WW police - if you want something that you consider "should be Core" and you use it responsibly, go for it. If you find yourself eating too much, or it slows down your weight loss, which I sometimes feel is ruled by the whims of nature anyway :lol: , then cut it out. I count Cheerios as Core under this theory btw, because I only ever eat the recommended serving, only with FF milk, and only once a day (in fact only 2-3 days a week). Truly not a trigger food for me, and I don't like any of the cold cereals WW considers Core. But please, this is just my opinion! Don't jump all over me for it. :)

The bread is easy to realize why it isn't CORE....IT IS A PROCESSED FOOD and W/W is steering away from processed foods as well as it is very much A BINGE FOOD for many. They are trying to make it as liveable and easy a program as they can.

I think the same concept is for the cream cheese....but more the binge factor or the cheating factor on what you'd be able to do with it. Cheesecake is not a core food and they could foresee people making a cheesecake with core foods...just like the 'Core Cornbread' really isn't core because bread is not a Core Food. Then it also comes down to the individual doing what they need to do....

No, Kelly, it wasn't meant that way at all. You were just being straight up, nothing wrong with that. I much appreciate the help. I'm just mad I can't have cream cheese, lol. Actually the FF kind tastes just like cardboard. I can see it now, everyone making FF cheesecakes w/Splenda. Portion control is so hard for me; regardless of the taste I'd probably eat a few pieces. Anyhow, thanks everyone for your help

India thank you for clarifying with me. I know what you mean about something you can't "have" and wanting to know the reasons behind it.

W/W made the plan with over 10,000 people who tried it and this is what they came up with 'for whatever reasons.'

Kelly I understand your reasoning on bread and such not being core... but then you have to agree it doesnt make sense that ww allows pudding and such to be core when chocolate is a binge food for just about all women, lol. And is pudding not processed?? LOL... So their theory on cutting out ww bread and allowing puddings and stuff like that doesn't make sense (not that I am complaining because I love my pudding! LOL) but I know we have our WPA's so bread is not lost to us we just have to budget it in our pts. Anyway, that was just my thoughts, not trying to argue I just enjoy your thoughts as well so I wanted to see what you thought about this too! :)

spryng, I just got to talking with my leader and here is what she said about Core (and she is a supporter and does it). Core is really a LOWER CARB program because of the restricted items and the nonCore foods. It is the same as many of the low carb plans with a few differences (such as being able to have WW Pasta or Potatoes or Rice 1 meal a day, allowing corn and peas, complex carb grains are core --- many of these items are nonbinge items <and that is where that part comes in> and allowing the sue of many fat-free products). Even many of of the low carb diets allowed sugar free this or that....

She stressed it is not LOW CARB nor NO CARB but LOWER CARB. Hope this helps.

also another friend got this from her leader (we go to different meetings):

. .From what I've pieced together reading all I can about the plan and the science behind it (along with other materials on similar plans), it's not the chemical/nutritional composition of foods alone that makes them suitable for the core foods list. The form in which they're eaten matters, too. Research has shown that if you offer volunteers either a casserole, or a soup made with IDENTICAL INGREDIENTS, they will spontaneously consume fewer calories when the ingredients are part of a soup. Or consider how many bowls of oatmeal you can eat vs. how many oatmeal cookies/muffins. Some of it has to do with the convenience of the format (how much trouble is it to fix a second bowl of oatmeal vs. how much trouble is it to grab a second muffin) and some have to do with the water content/caloric density, and sometimes it's a combination of things--how long does it take you to eat, and will that give your brain/stomach time to register that you are satisfied, etc.

We consume more or fewer calories depending on the format the ingredients are presented in. The idea is to consume fewer calories by eating "food formats," if you will, that naturally limit intake.

And another post got this:

Anyways- in an attempt to make a long story short and before someone hears the computer , yesterday I had called WW to find out if they sold materials without going to meetings. As I started asking my questions, the woman at the center, whom I've spoken to previously, asked which plan I was doing, etc. I told her I was doing Flex, would be starting meetings next month but wanted the books as I started the diet itself this past week. After giving her some background information, she told me that Core would definitely NOT be a good idea for me after leaving Atkins because in some ways the diets are similiar. She stressed the idea that many of her members are ex-low carbers who need the variety on a daily basis rather than a list of "forbidden" foods, which aren't really forbidden as you have 35 points for the week. However, eating some of those foods of choices, and this is the part they don't necessarily speak of very often as she told me, can prevent weight loss. As she explained, and took her time to do so (almost a 40 minute conversation), there are certain foods that will slow down weight loss regardless and therefore one plan should not be judged versus the other based on pounds lost. Also, a turn off for Core right now, aside from it being somewhat newer, is that not many people go from Flex to Core and back to Flex, simply because they are in love with the larger weight loss on Core. The representative explained that you see a larger loss on Core (and that's what attracts its members aside from not counting) because you are essentially cutting down on carbs, but not out. However, that continuation of higher loss is not necessarily going to follow, since anytime you lower your carbs, you're going to lose faster. I made the comment that Core sounded more like some later stages of South Beach, rather than that of Atkins which people have commented on. And while she couldn't agree, she didn't argue either. The only difference being that the first two weeks of South Beach is strict, planned menus and the following weeks are also somewhat planned as well I think. Obviously there is much more freedom on Core. Similarities may be there, but Core was designed specifically with certain goals....

Thanks Kelly! That was informative! :) I just thought it was ironic to cut ww bread off the list and leave sf/ff pudding is all, lol. But I do understand the theory behind it all. No matter what though I love this program and support it wholeheartedly! :)

Spryng, I know what you mean about the processed thing--after all canned fruit and veggies are processed. Cornmeal is processed. Applesauce is processed. The list goes on and on. I am not going to spend anymore time trying to figure out why they chose one food over the other--I am just going to trust they had a reason and work the program.

I like the program but am afraid it is not working as well as it did in the beginning for me. I did a sneak preview this morning and it looks I have maintained again this week. :( I can only guess that I am either eating too much (I used more WPAs this week than last) or I am not exercising often enough, long enough or hard enough. Do you think a gallon of milk a week is too much? I drink milk at all three meals. At least I'm getting my calcium.

My plan is to start exercising in the morning again (that worked best for me in the past when I lost weight) and doing something different every morning. I will see how that works.

I do think it will be the easiest maintenance program to follow. I think it would be really hard to gain weight on it, assuming you followed the plan as it was intended. Especially if you limited the WPAs.

Have a good weekend.

Janette, you are so close to your goal weight and that may be why you are starting to lose slower now. I know 24 oz of milk is endorsed on tv for healthy weightloss so I don't think drinking it at every meal is what is slowing you down. How are your portions? How is your water intake? I don't get in enough exercise either but that doesn't seem to slow me down too much. Do you eat alot of popcorn? I know popcorn can really make you retain some water if you eat it too close to your WI... but maybe this week try shaking things up a bit by re-examining portions, drinking more water (do you get calcium in by eating other dairy in the day too? like ff cottage cheese or anything?) if so then maybe cut out one glass of milk and replace it with water and when you make your plate aways have more veggies than protein and starch, you probably already do that. But that is what I would try. But don't let this get you down! Maintaining is much better than gaining and sometimes our bodies will stop losing for a week or more to readjust to everything and then take off again. Are you measuring yourself? You may be losing inches still, how are your clothes fitting? What do you use your WPA's on? I eat all of mine too. Well, I probably bombarded you with too many questions so I'll shut up for now, lol... let me know what you think, ok? You may have already tried all of the above already but I will be here to help you through this, don't give up! ((((((HUGS!))))))

Spryng, thanks for your encouragement and ideas to help. When I weighed in this morning I actually showed a l lb. loss. So I am encouraged. It is wierd how that 24 hours can make a difference in the scale! Guess that's why ww do it on a weekly basis, huh?

I don't use my WPAs for desserts or junk food. Except the occasional C-2 coke (only 1 this week and that was actually yesterday) I used to be hooked on Cokes and I still enjoy that jolt when you take that first drink. C-2 is only 1 pt. though and I seldom finish the entire can. It is mostly 1 pt. bread for toast in the morning (love toast with my oatmeal) and an occasional cornbread or tortilla. But since I did show a loss after stayin the same last week I guess it isn't hurting me that much. I actually used 19 WPAs this week--a record for me. I guess I have a slight hang-up about WPAs because I feel like you eat them only when you mess up and don't stay with the program. Like they are a safety net to keep you from just giving up and going hog-wild. I know this isn't true, (so don't jump on me anyone) but it's hard to change mind-sets sometimes. There is so much to eat on CORE that you shouldn't need to use them but really some meals just don't feel "complete" without things they didn't include in CORE--like toast with breakfast or a tortilla with fajitas or bread with a sandwich--well, I guess it wouldn't be a sandwich without bread but you know what I mean :dizzy:

I am still going to increase my exercise this week. I am just getting back into it after not exercising for almost a year due to a hip injury. I used the treadmill one night last week and I felt the pain again that night so I'm thinking I may not be able to use it anymore. That means I have to walk outside and that is hard to do during the week when I have to be at work at 8:00. But I have a few exercise tapes so I will start using them again.

I guess I could limit my milk to 8 oz at each sitting (drink a little more most days)but I also find that drinking the milk with meals makes me feel full sooner than with water. That means I eat less at meals. I also eat yogurt and cottage cheese at least once each week. I do get in my water though--I take a bottle with me everyday and have it is gone most morning by 11:00 a.m. Sometimes I drink a second bottle in the afternoon/evening. I don't like meat so eating too much protein and not enough veggies has never been a problem with me but sometimes that backfires because the protein and fat are essential for weight loss too.

I am going to try to use the recipe file this week and try some different foods.

Well, I talked enough. A lot to think about. Again, thanks for your encouragement. I will not give up!

I just looked at my 12 oz tub of FF cream cheese and the whole tub would be only 6pts. So in the amounts I use (usually on a rice cake for a snack) isn't anything to worry too much about. I can't imagine binging on the whole tub, the stuff is kinda gummy..LOL :lol:

Janette! Congrats on the lb gone!!! That is fantastic, and yes it strange how are bodies flucuate day to day. But you will be at your goal before you know it!
I feel like you do about the WPA's... ask me what I use mine on, lol... it IS my security net, lol. I hope you can find an exercise that doesn't bother your hip, have you tried pilates or something to that nature? I'm thinking about buying a video for a stability ball. I have a ball from the birth of my last child (used it during labor) and my tailbone gives me trouble so alot of exercises that require me to lie on the floor and such kills my tailbone so I heard the ball would be great for me since you can do just about everything on the ball and it supports you, hence no tailbone pain. I just haven't got around to looking into any. But I hope you find something. :) I wouldn't encourage you to limit your milk, I mean you lost weight this week so I'm sure the milk helped with that and I agree it helps me get satisfied quicker and when I have milk with a meal I usually have food left on my plate versus drinking water with my meal.
I think trying new meals is a great idea though! I'm always trying new stuff because variety is what keeps me OP... all my other diets failed because I would get bored with what I was eating, let me tell you, ww has turned me into a chef!! LOL! and now Core, which requires more prep or planning has really enhanced my cooking abilities. I used to be the box dinner queen, lol.. and now people rave about my home cooked meals and my in-laws always tell people I cook rich people stuff (not sure what they mean since it's only fresh foods and such I use now and fresh herbs and no more mac and cheese from a box, lol... I guess I understand what they mean, lol) either way it's a compliment and I'll take it! LOL... so yes, try a few new recipes this week and let me know how it goes ok?

This diet is very similar to Dr. Phil's diet, AND to the South Beach diet. I can see why they limit certain foods. I don't see why they allow certain others. Maybe they decided that we had to have certain "outlets", so they allowed something like SF/FF pudding (although it also serves a secondary purpose, providing calcium.) Some of the things left off the list seem arbitrary to me-- others I understand (or I think I do.)

My biggest gripe is the sense I have that this Plan is a "work in progress" and that they basically just tested it briefly, then rushed to get it out there. I predict many changes ("clarifications") will be made to this Plan as they fine-tune it. IMHO, they are doing what Microsoft does when they release a new version of Windows-- they test it some, but then just release it, get millions of people to use it, then let all those people essentially debug it for them. All Microsoft has to do is keep track of the reported problems, then come out with the inevitable "Service Pack" that corrects them all. I think WW is doing the same thing-- we are ALL "beta-testing" this Plan, and once WW compiles enough data about the problems people have on it, they'll set about changing it.

They tested this for over a year and a half which is usually longer than they test most plans. Also most plans have clarifications every year (each year with points they adjusted it based on concerns, questions and research).

I remember when they limited the amount you could "count" fiber in figuring Points, but other than that, and some tweaking of the Points ranges and the introduction of the Flexpoints idea, the Points system hasn't changed all that much. Okay, we used to have a 7-Point range, then it was 5 Points, then it was just a goal number plus Flexpoints. But the basic Points formula hasn't changed since they limited the fiber.

I forsee this Core plan being changed a LOT as time goes on-- some foods will be added to the Core list, and some will be removed. AND, if the Core Plan takes off, expect a reformulation of most or all of the WW frozen entrees to suddenly be "Core". WW is not about to lose the millions of dollars it gets from the frozen entrees by leaving them non-Core and making people who want to eat them waste valuable Flexpoints on them. I think it'll be a savvy move, too, because ONLY the WW entrees would have the "magic checkmark" on them, whereas anybody can calculate Points values (though they can't put them on the package without paying WW.)

But if the idea of Core foods is that they are basic, unrefined, healthy, non-processed foods, how will they justify offering "Core" frozen entrees (or even desserts!)? It should be interesting... :)

Actually they have already done a few changes to the CFC. Core was brought in to try to bring back many who left for other programs such as Atkins, SBD, etc.

I can see frozen entrees becoming Core easily (it really isn't that hard) by using whole wheat pastas, brown rice, veggies and plain meats. I don't forsee much in the way of the desserts though.