Hi, Turtle Buddies,

Here it is - my "official" version of the fable:

The Hare and the Tortoise

A hare met a tortoise one day and made fun of him for the slow and clumsy way in which he walked.

The tortoise laughed and said, "I will run a race with you any time that you choose."

"Very well," replied the hare, "we will start at once."

The tortoise immediately set off in his slow and steady way without waiting a moment or looking back. The hare, on the other hand, treated the matter as a joke and decided to take a little nap before starting, for she thought that it would be an easy matter to overtake her rival.

The tortoise plodded on, and meanwhile the hare overslept herself, with the result that she arrived at the winning-post only to see that the tortoise had got in before her.

Moral: Slow and steady wins the race.

This comes from a book handed down from my grandmother to my mother to me. The book is so old it doesn't have a copyright date or an author/editor's credit.

That fable has been the motivation for us turtles for about two years. Someone on the ancient WW forum mentioned the fable and I discovered it was very motivational for me. I talked about it in posts and other people said that the tortoise philosophy worked for them, too. So, I started a thread for us turtle types.

We work toward accepting that our bodies have a natural speed of weight loss when we choose to live a healthy life, instead of "going on a diet". Many of us have experienced "the diets" as go on/lose weight-- go off/ gain the weight plus more back.

We choose to perservere with each choice we make throughout the day. We believe that choosing to be slow, steady turtles helps us to learn the skills we need to learn in order to not only lose the weight, but keep it off and become the healthiest people we can be.

So, welcome to all who realize that losing and maintaining a weight loss is a lifestyle change. And who want support as we all learn the skills we need to successfully make the changes that will allow us to reach our goals.

Happy turtlin', everyone!

Lin

Hi, Turtles,

Mousie, in one of the posts that disappeared, I remember you asking for our good luck wishes. You have mine. I think you will do well, both with returning to the strong person you've become and in your wieght-related goals.

It's not easy to get family to see growth in us. They like the comfort of "knowing" who we are and keeping us that same person. It will take time, but I'm sure that as they get used to the new you, they will come to accept, like and appreciate the changes you've made.

I'm still doing fine. I'm OP. I'm walking. We're having springlike weather. It's a little chilly, but sunny and no clouds. Up to now, I haven't missed filling out my journal once since I started my new one. That's one of the biggest things I need to do if I want to be successful. Like Lauren, when I stop writing it down, is when things get too far off and I start gaining weight.

I sent the recipe this morning. Hope you all enjoy it!

Hope you all are having a great day!

Happy turtlin'!

Lin
272/233/225/135

(I just caught a very funny typo--I almost put 25 as my immediate goal. Don't think I've weighed that since I was a few months old! :LOL

Hello, tortoises.

Lin, thanks for the recipe. I'm looking forward to reading it and trying it. And way to go on that weight loss! Woo-hoo! I could feel your happiness all the way across the country. I thought of you as I was ripping through the grocery store, thinking -- Lin actually *enjoys* going to these places! I wish I had your creativity with regard to food. I enjoy eating it, but I sure don't like to make it.

Mousie, wow, some insights there. That's so interesting about falling back into the "old" Mousie now that you're back around your family. That's so easy to do; I find myself doing it all the time when I'm back with family. In my case, it often looks like stupid arguments with my brother. Or, for a while there, with my dad I became much more quiet and scared and submissive -- DH was very surprised to see me behave that way, since he'd never seen it before. I've improved in that area, fortunately, and am now much more myself. But it's strained, because when I act differently from what my family expects, it causes tension -- and I HATE tension. So that's a constant battle. Good for you for recognizing the problem; that's half the battle right there.

Judy, I'm glad you've been doing well, too. Your optimism is contagious.

I've been doing well, but I have some pretty major PMS, which is odd because it's at least a week early for this. No idea what's going on, but I sure do want to eat, eat, eat. I'm keeping up with the exercise, doing my new tapes, and as usual I'm writing it all down. This morning I was down 1.5# on the scale, which is good. Earlier in the week it was 2#, but I'll take it anyway.

I'm at a weird clothing size. I'm smack in between sizes, according to everybody's charts, and boy, do I notice it. I'm not quite a plus size anymore, but many regular sizes are a little snug. An 18W from Lane Bryant is a little too big, but an 18 misses from Kohl's is a little too small! Right now I'm wearing anything from a 2X to a 14-16. Depends on what it is, and who makes it. (I can wear some designer clothes in 16-18, but who has the money for those?) This wouldn't be a big deal except that I've undergrown two business interview staples -- my black blazer, and a full black skirt. Replacing them has been pretty much impossible. I'm currently having to wear a fairly baggy outfit to interviews. Well, I'll keep looking. And in a month or so, it shouldn't be a problem anymore.

Well, best get busy. Got my WW meeting tonight, and my cat is knocking things off the desk and spreading her tail on the keyboard. I'll take that as divine intervention and get to work.

Onward and downward,

Lauren
274/196.5/189 by April 17 (anniversary)

Well, that's odd. WW had me down 2.8# this week. I'm not complaining, but that's quite different from my 1.5# this morning. I'll check again tomorrow a.m.

I'll be working the rest of this week but will try to check in.

Onward and downward,

Lauren
274/196.5/189 by April 17

WOW LAUREN! That is soooo impressive! You're really on a roll! I think you'll make your April 17 goal! And I don't think you'll be a "weird clothing size" for long, at the rate you're dropping!

Judy and everyone, thanks for the snaps up. I'm so much more sure of myself, even in the last couple days. One DUH moment, and everything falls into place. Wow.

Having real issues with emotional eating today, for the first time since I started this whole exploration/examination/self-scrutiny thing. I've admitted to myself that I don't honestly like who an old friend has turned into, and I'd rather not have her in my life anymore. This today because of a destructive email she sent me. I've also been trying to figure out work, and working with my clients, and if I can take a shift to keep my clients, and if I can't what I will do, and if it's good for my self to work at the club again. So, lots of uproar today. And INS tomorrow, yipes! Wish me strength, I'm gonna need it.

Lin, got the recipe, think I'll tackle that one on the weekend. Thanks!

Hi, Turtles,

Lauren, congratulations on your great loss this week! At that rate, you'll easily reach your April goal. Woo hoo!

My dh can relate to your dislike of grocery stores. He says they make him fall asleep. I don't like chain stores because they only carry items that a ton of people buy and because so much of their shelf space is devoted to their own store brands that there isn't room for a decent variety.

OTOH--specialty stores, "gourmet" stores, "natural food-type" stores, ethnic stores--those are the interesting ones. That's where you can find stuff that sparks the creative cook. And the different stuff that you find in magazine recipes that you'd like to try, if you could only find the ingredients. Also, you can find most anything online, but searches can be frustrating sometimes.

I can relate to the in-between clothing sizes. I always end up wearing a belt in my jeans to hold them up for months because I lose so easily in my waist and so slowly in my abdomen. It's a real pain because I when I have to cinch a belt tight enough to keep my pants from falling down, it's tight enough to be pretty uncomfortable.

Suggestion: Have you looked for someone to alter your suits so they're not so baggy? It's not usually an expensive service and since your job search is so crucial right now, it might be worth having it done.

Mousie, I can see why you're having issues with emotional eating right now. You're in my thoughts and prayers. The hardest thing to do when I want to eat due to emotions is to remember that eating won't help or solve the problem. It will only make me uncomfortable and mad at myself. Which just adds another problem to the mix. I use my journal, as I know you do. But sometimes the only solution is to go for a walk and get away from food. Good luck! I know I didn't tell you anything you don't alreay know, but I know that I usually need a reminder, so I thought I'd send one your way, just in case.

Things are going well for me today. I'm OP. Been walking because it's been sunny and dry. But really cold. I'm wearing my gloves today when I go for my walk.

Had an interesting thought this morning. I often worry about lowering point ranges because it's hard to do mini meals if you only have 1-3 points available for each of them. Then I realized that the difference between the top of the lowest range and the bottom of my range is 1 point. (in 123 Success) I think, between exercising and the knowledge that my appetite is going down with the weight loss, I will be able to handle it. But I'm not changing ranges unless I stop losing on a regular basis. Anyway, it makes me feel better about this whole journey to realize that it probably won't be as difficult to deal with as I thought it would.

Have a great day!

Happy turtlin'!

Lin
272/233/225/135 or so

Lin and Lauren,
Congrats on your incredible weight losses. We're all doing so well.

Lin,
Thanks for the macaroni and cheese recipe. It looks fascinatin. I love the idea of yogurt or creme franchaise (I think I spelled that wrong) as a creamy thickener.

Lauren,
You're right. It's an odd place to be, but how great that you're moving down in sizes. Mousie's right. In a couple of weeks you'll be right where you want to be for now.

Mousie,
I think it's terrific that you're analyzing what makes you tick emotionally.

Everyone--I had another good weight loss of at least 1/2 a pound this week. Today is WW WI and I think I may skip the scale and only do the lecture since I had the saltiest food in the world yesterday and I don't want to see a phony weight gain.
We'll see. I've been successful doing it this way before. It's hard for me to take an *undeserved hit* at the scale. I don't fool myself into eating more than I should the following week. But in any case, I'm moving right along and eating the way I want to eat
almost all the time. I took your suggestion of dropping into the lower point range since I'm only 7 pounds away and that's helping too. Again and still--the exercise is the thing.
You all take care. I'm reading your posts every day--just can't respond to it all.

Judy
234/206/199soon

Lin and Lauren--my DH, too, protests the grocery store and refuses to go shopping with me. On the rare occasions I can get him through the doors, he looks at the fresh-made sandwiches, picks one, then hides in the magazine aisle while I finish the shopping! He says he hates how the store "sucks the life out of" all the shoppers. "You look at their faces and they're turned into drones, wobbling up and down the endless aisles." I personally enjoy shopping. And this is a good thing, since I got in the habit of buying fresh stuff every 2-3 days in London and now can't seem to break it!

Went to INS today, sat and waited to be seen for FIVE HOURS. Finally got in to see the single woman who was in charge of such processing, and she's complaining to us about how no one has the right paperwork, no one fills things out right, no one is complete, on and on and on...then tells us we don't have the right stuff either. THIS after we brought, to the letter, the list of papers on the list she had handwritten *herself* and given us at the last meeting! She actually had the gall to say "oh, no, not that, you should have known what I meant" at one point! ARGH! So, we get to go back tomorrow morning. UGH!

We got out of there and I was so keyed up and so angry I was shaking. Thankfully DH was driving. He made the decision that we would get some lunch (it was a bit past 1--we had been there since 8) and took us to Chevy's (mexican food). Get this--I made the conscious decision that I could have anything I wanted, and as much as I wanted, this was a time when I just needed to eat. So I had...a few fresh chips (about 1 serving), a few nachos (about 1/4 of an order), one piece of a fresh veggie quesadilla, and half an ice cream/brownie dessert. Quite small amounts, compared to the amounts I know I've eaten in the past! Amazing what happens when you just accept it and give yourself permission.

So I get to go find my mom and fill out paperwork with her tonight, and then she, DH, and I get to go down to INS again tomorrow and file HER as the supporter. Sigh. This is absurd. DH earns well on the way to a 6 figure salary--we figure 2 raises, and he's there--and yet they won't accept him as supporting himself. I'm a student so I'm not working, so I can't support him. I'm 26 years old and I have to have my mother file that SHE Will support him! Obviously if something happens to his job he'll get another, and we'll never mooch off of my parents, so this is just absurd paper-pushing. Never, never, never get married to a foreigner. If I didn't love him so much it would not be worth all of this. That whole marriage-of-convenience idea? HA! As IF.

Okay, I've vented. I feel better. Have a good evening, Turtles.
Thanks for being your cool selves!

Mousie,
I give you so much credit for two major things. One is that you gave yourself permission to eat whatever you wanted. And two, that what you wanted wasn't very much.
It's tough to be caught up in government systems. I hope your correct paperwork met with official's approval today. Hopefully with your mom's signature you'll have this all straightened out today.

I decided to weigh in at WW yesterday and was down 1/2 pound.
I'll take it and run because I could have easily been up some weight. The lecturer spent the whole time on food points with a title of the lecture being: What's the point? Cute and informative.
She had a group of foods we could eyeball and then figure out points for. She had the tiniest little apple I've ever seen and it weighed out as 1 1/2 points. She noted that English muffins light
pointed out as 1 for one, but 3pts. for 2. What she was trying to do was to tweak some members who were complaining that they weren't losing and she felt that probably their point counting needed a little tweaking. She also said *again* not to change anything if you were happy with your weight loss and were losing well.
One gal combined the points of Kashi and yogurt since she ate them together. I called it a breakfast casserole. Funny--Margo pointed out that if a person was off by three to five points a day, a weight loss could stop. None of this is fun to hear, but last year I had been making use of quite a few zero point foods and at the end of the day I'd eat anything to get to the bottom of my point range. That really didn't make much sense and I should have known better.

You all take care. I'm doing well. Splurged last night and had the points for it, so it was fun.

Hi, Turtles,

Mousie, what a mess! One of the main reasons everyone hates bureaucracies is that they have the same set of rules for everyone and there are rarely exceptions for specific individuals who don't fit the category the rule was made for.

I got stuck with that stuff last year when we applied for welfare. They wanted me to apply for unemployment even though I didn't fit the unemployment rules and they wanted some paperwork that Paul could not get his retirement money from a former employer. Like all pension funds, you have to be 55 to start receiving benefits, but they didn't care about the rules of the other institutions. We were supposed to get (nonexistent) paperwork anyway. As you all know, he found his job just in the nick of time and we were able to go on without the "help" of the "wonderful" government.

What's really stressful about both of our situations is that the agencies we were/are dealing with are set up with the idea that people are out to defraud the government and they make you feel like dirt. It's very hard to ask for help when you're treated like you are bad people for having hard times. And like you must be on drugs or be an alcoholic or have domestic violence problems or other horrible things. If you didn't, you wouldn't need their help. It was an awful experience and I hope I never have to go through that again.

Or, in your case, they make you feel like you're a bad person for falling in love with a (gasp!) foreigner. Who obviously married you so he could come and live in America. It's a stupid system, but it's the only one we've got. You have our sympathies and hopes that all goes well. Soon, we hope, you will have all of the paperwork done and be rid of the government agencies and can get on with your life.

You did a great job of handling it. You realized that you needed food, so all of your desire to eat wasn't emotional. You gave yourself permission to eat what you needed. And you didn't eat more than what you needed. That's so !

Judy, congratulatons on that half pound. You're moving in the right direction at a steady rate, too. And congratulations on sticking with your exercise program. You don't mention it much, but when you do, we get positive reports.

Your report on your meeting was really interesting. If your 0-point foods were veggies, I wouldn't worry about the calories adding up. What I do about those tiny amounts of other foods that can add up to big point counts is to keep track of foods that are a half point or less by writing the points in parentheses. Then, if I have enough to add up to a point, I mark them with little x's (so I know that I counted them) and add that point to my total. I have a lot of those because I eat things like 1/2 teaspoon of butter, which is a half point and 1/2 bowl of soup, for another half point. That's a point and I count it.

I'm doing fine. Still OP. Still tracking and pasting those stickers. I found the ones I had lost during our move last year, so I have a ton to use. I also found my paper clip chain and updated it. It's hanging in my dining room and has 40 clips on it, since it has one for the starting weight and 39 for the total pounds I've lost since I started 123 Success.

I'm not sure if I'm going to walk today, but I will be getting in activity around the house. I have to bake bread, which uses a lot of energy when you knead it. It's a great mini-workout for your upper arms. And I have a bunch of cleaning to do, which I may do instead of my walk or I may not have time to get it all done.

Talk to you all later. Have a great day!

Happy turtlin'!

Lin
272/233/225/135 or so

TURTLES!!!

Three hour wait at INS today, including a running-around hour looking for a copier (they wouldn't copy my mom's tax paperwork fro her, and she refused [rightly so] to hand over the originals) and guess what? He's a legal alien now! YAY! YAYAYAYAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY! What does this mean? This means:

a) he can come and go freely, so if he has a family problem back in England he can just go immediately instead of queuing for a day to get an advanced parole document;

b) he no longer has to file for the Employment Authorization Document each year, and can continue to work at his job with no worries about queuing for a day for the EAD;

c) WE DON'T HAVE TO DEAL WITH INS FOR TWO YEARS!!!!!!

My mom is golden, my mom is a wonderful person, they accepted her as the sponsor and she was happy to do it. As a sponsor you are legally obliged to provide for your applicant in times of their need, for forty quarters. SO! Mom said she was happy to help, but he's HERS for 10 years and he better not push his luck! HEH!

I'm going to go SLEEP, Turtles, we're free! This is such a load off! YAY!

Lin,
I like your take on the zero point foods. I agree about the veggies and wouldn't think twice about those for myself because it's seldom that I overeat that category. As far as the other little tidbits, your plan is great.

Mousie,
Congratulations on your husband's new status in America!!!! I'm so happy for you both. And your mom sounds like a real love. She certainly went out of her way for the both of you. Well, enjoy this time together.

Lauren,
Hope work is going okay. Take care of yourself .

Aren't we all doing great?

I ate very low points today and am creating my own pattern of Wendie's Plan. Odd how that works out. I only had 15 points today, but I am completely satisfied. Hmmmmm.

Take care and do well.
Judy
234/206/199soon

Hi, Turtles,

Mousie--I'm so glad your problems with the INS have been taken care of. That must be a relief!

Judy, I hope you don't get into a pattern of eating 15 points on a regular basis! That's 3 points under the minimum range WW suggests the smallest people follow. It's probably OK to do that once in a while, but it can leave your body needing extra food a couple of days later.

An example: I ate 20 points for dinner last night. I needed some extra points because I've been eating much lower in my range this week than I had been and still doing a lot of activity. I have the banked points to cover it and I know I needed the food. I wasn't overstuffed after I ate. So, I guess I'm just warning you not to be surprised if you are hungrier and eat really high or even use banked points in a few days.

I'm still OP. I'm planning to go for a walk after lunch. WW is going great.

But, I had another bout with being depressed. I couldn't figure out why I haven't been able to write. Well, I can't write when I get depressed. The story just hides in my brain and refuses to come out.

The depression isn't a new issue, but I've been pretending things are OK and they aren't. I've been pretending to myself, not just to everyone else. Pretending that the situation is OK because I know that I can't change it right now. I feel better after admitting to myself that I still feel a deep loss and that I still want to go home. I'm not pretending anymore.

So, somehow this year I have to figure out a way to move back to San Jose when our lease is up in December. I don't think I can take a third year of being cooped up in this apartment. The best solution is to get Chris settled in art school so he's only home on vacations and get David out on his own. Then we'd only need a one bedroom and there are one-bedroom apartments we can afford. (Or, for the boys to pay the difference between a one- and a two-bedroom and contribute their share of utilities, etc.)

A good thing happened, though. There's a thread on Dotti's site that points to a BBC news online essay by Susie Orbach. It's basically about diets not working and accepting your weight at whatever its set point is. Anyway, I wrote an email expressing my opinion and they want to include my email in the online debate. They wanted a picture of me, but I don't have one I can send. No scanner, no digital camera. And no Kinko's where I could rent scanner time.

Here's where you can read the part they put online:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/uk/...00/1759464.stm

If this link doesn't work, try going to the BBC News site and searching for the Suzie Orbach essay. Then click on the link to the online debate.

Of course, they didn't publish all of what I wrote, but what they cut was the part that was my personal story and it pretty much reiterated what I said in the part they did publish. In any case, as a writer, it feels really good to have a pro find worth in something I wrote. Wish it paid money! But, truthfully, I'd be happy if it helped one person see that the situation isn't as hopeless as Ms. Orbach says it is.

Hope you all are having a great day!

Happy turtlin'!

Lin
272/233/225/135 or so

Interesting debate, Lin -- I'm glad they included your thoughtful response. I'm glad you thought to write in. Good for you. And I agree with you, of course.

Losing weight is such a loaded issue in our culture, because it is so rarely just about wanting to be healthier, especially for women. It's about getting approval and love and popularity and a better job and acceptance and beauty and control and power ... sheesh. But it certainly makes for interesting discussion, and that one is definitely interesting.

I can understand your struggling with depression, and it sounds like you know what you need to do. I hope you can move back to "home." I had a terrible time when we lived in a little apartment in an awful town right after we were married. Yucky neighborhood, yucky town. I didn't know a soul. Didn't have a job. The internet was my lifeline. I missed Philly dreadfully. (This was in a suburb of Detroit.) We were there for two years, and I gained a LOT of weight during that time. Good for you that you've managed to do other things with your emotions besides eat.

Mousie, glad you beat the INS monster! When I was working in refugee resettlement, we were always dealing with INS. It's a monster, no doubt about it. What a relief for you!

Judy, good for you dropping that half pound!! I hear you about the 3-4 points a day stalling out weight loss. It's not welcome news, but I need to be reminded. I fall so easily back into the "I'm sure this slice of cake couldn't possibly be 12 points -- let's say it's 4 instead" delusion. I think I'm struggling with it a bit right now. I just plain don't want to eat less of the food I want, that's the bottom line. No pun intended.

The past couple of days I've been slightly over points. I had some banked, but not quite enough. Turns out it was PMS, just early. Today I'm back on the wagon.

I also figured out a great way to get my heart rate up and still be low-impact -- walk uphill! The past few days on this project, I've had to park about 10 minutes from the office (in order to get free parking). And the walk was mostly uphill. What a surprise! I got my heart rate right up there! It felt good, actually. I wish we lived near some hills, but it's flat as a pancake around here.

Anyway, I'm still exercising, still tracking, just didn't have much time to check in lately. (And frankly, after looking at a computer screen all day, I don't exactly rush to the monitor as soon as I walk in the door.)

Oh, I went back to Kohl's to continue my elusive search for a black blazer, and -- voila. Found one immediately. Size XL. Fits great; in fact, I could wear the size L, too. So it just depends on the brand and the style, apparently.

Onward and downward,

Lauren
274/196.5/189 by April 17

The work project was mildly fun, though I was waaaaayyy out of my league. I'm not a programmer by any stretch of the imagination, and this project was about troubleshooting a bunch of javascript! Fortunately, I wasn't doing it alone or I would've been toast. I let the others do the troubleshooting, and I wrote the report.

Hi, Turtles,

Great to hear from you, Lauren. I figured your job was keeping you busy!

One of the few benefits of doing a treadmill instead of walking outside is that you can set it to incline so you can walk uphill. But I really don't like doing outdoor-type exercises indoors. For me, part of the reason walking and bicycling and swimming are fun is because they're outdoors.

Congratulations on finding the blazer! Now, I hope it gets you a job, soon. One that doesn't require you to be a programmer, at least not until you can learn how to do it, if that's what you want to do.

Good to hear you're doing OK. PMS can be a pain, but it sounds like you're not going completely nuts.

I'm trying to decide whether I should stay off the scale and let my clothes tell me when I've lost weight. It's so discouraging to be doing so well, but have a gain of a pound on the scale. It's most likely due to water retention--a lot more sodium Friday and Saturday than I usually consume and not quite as much water. Yet, I find that it's easier to set pound goals, even if I don't set a time limit, than it is to set clothing size goals. Clothing sizes can be so capricious. So, it's a dilemma. I'm going to continue doing what I've been doing and see what happens.

I'm OP today. Had a nice walk this afternoon.

My mood has improved since a few days ago. My dh told me that there was an article in the SJ Mercury about how rents are plummeting. There are vacancies all over the valley. And renters are calling the shots. This has happened since the first of the year-after we signed our year-long lease, of course. But, I'm hopeful that we will manage to move next January when our lease is up.

But the main reason it's improved is that he is so understanding about how I feel. He lets me vent, if I need to. My journal writing has helped, as it always does. I spend a lot of time in the morning writing in my journal when I'm going through a tough time, but it's cheaper than hours at a therapist! And it seems to work just as well, at least for me.

Hope everyone is having a great weekend!

Happy turtlin!

Lin
272/234/225/135 or so