Here is an article from MSNBC.com/Newsweek about the effect that friendships and social networks have on obesity. This one seems controversial to me, but I though it could spark an interesting discussion!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19961197/site/newsweek/

This was the most eye catching part: "When one person in the study became obese, his siblings’ risk of also becoming obese jumped by 40 percent, while his spouse’s risk jumped by 37 percent. More strikingly, if that person had been named as a “friend” by another participant, the second participant’s risk of becoming obese shot up by 57 percent. If the friends were of the same gender, the risk was even higher, at 71 percent. (The study found a man’s weight gain would have no significant effect on his female friend’s weight, and vice versa, but the study did not have many male-female friendships to examine.) If the friends were particularly close—judged in the study by the fact that they both named each other on their lists of loved ones—the risk that one’s weight would follow the others’ increased by a whopping 171 percent."

Hmmm...

The interpretation of these results seem pretty insane. If you become obese, of course your relatives are genetically and evironmentally predisposed to the same risks - they didn't "catch" it from you. And though you don't pick your friends based on them being genetically similar to you (at least not consciously, some social experiments suggest that maybe we unconsciously do), you do often choose them based on sharing the same interests, hobbies, goals, life experiences, geographic proximity.... In other words, you're likey to choose friends and even spouses based at least somewhat on traits they have in common with you. They're likely to be living in the same community, possibility sharing the same work environment, and similar life stresses - again they didn't "catch" it from you, they just share a similar environment.

Interesting. I do think there is some merit to the study. I know that if I am around people who are also heavier I don't feel as bad about my weight & am less motivated to make the changes needed to lose weight.

Plus, I think it is a positive that they are studying other factors to obesity besides just calories in, calories out.

I didn't read this yet, but it was on the news last night. I do think this has to do more with social/enviroment than genetics. If you are fat, most times, you are not going to hang out with really thin people. Of course there are exceptions. But if you are really overweight, you are not going to be outgoing, playing sports ect.. Most likely you are going to have friends who have the same interests as you, they may not be as overweight as you are, but I don't think they are the friends who are out everyday at the gym or running.
cheryl

I saw the same thing on CNN this morning. Apparently the study is getting some media interest if nothing else. I have many friends, fat and thin. One thing I do notice is that when I was with my fat friends (prior to my weight loss efforts) I would eat a TON of junk. It was like we all just gave each other "permission" to remain gluttonous.

I read about the study and I must say, I am dubious about it.
I have thin and fatter friends and I haven't made any of them skinnier or fatter...

I posted a lot about this over on the 300+ board.

If you're interested, the original study is here. It's interesting to see how differently the media spins it and how the researchers themselves discuss it.

My sense is that the research is reputable and published in a top journal. I think the patterns they observed -- that people who gain weight have friends and spouses who gain weight too -- is likely true -- at least with the sample they had.

However, the conclusions being drawn -- especially this sense of "contagion" in the mainstream media -- are a stretch. The researchers themselves recognize that the patterns they observed could have other causes.

What I found interesting was that people were likely to gain weight if their friends did even if they were not close geograpically. Kind of takes the punch out of the environment argument. They aren't all going to barbeques together necessarily.

Maybe not, but if you're the "kind of person" who goes to barbecues, maybe you're likely to pick friends who are also the kind of people to go to barbecues.

When people share any bad habit, they can enable each other, but I have a BIG problem with even the hint towards the idea that fat is somehow contagious. Fat people are ostracized enough, the last thing our society needs is a "good" excuse to do so. If we believed that fat was contagious, I can see mothers forbidding their children to play with a fat classmate, or maybe children should be taken away from fat parents at birth, just in case.

Oh, I agree with you 100%! It's a point that needed clarification and elaboration and I'm glad you made it. I'm also worried that the "take home point" for many people will be that fat is contagious.

My point was just that it's not necessarily the immediate social environment that's the issue (since people's geographic closeness wasn't related). But there are still other explanations not accounted for!

I think our points are showing just how difficult it is to separate out all of the things that could be contributing to the correlation. I know you have a lot more experience in this than I do, so I wouldn't assume you hadn't thought of my point, your point just got me thinking "yeah, but..." Even when you KNOW better, it's so hard for your mind not to go to causation. Even coming up with the alternative explanations (which might not be any truer than the contagion theory) it's easy to make assumptions you don't even realize are based on speculation, not fact.

Well, now I'm embarrassed. I didn't look for this thread before I posted mine. After the first Oh S*** moment after reading, I just aimed and fired. You all seem to have reached the same conclusions I did. Since of course we're much smarter than the population at large (pun intended) I look foward to an awesome backlash over the next few days. I imagine everybody from Daniel Pinkwater to Al Roker to Oprah will have something to say about it. Stay tuned!

Thankyou for saying this, because I did the same. I have two best friends, who have been obese for years. I had other thin friends try to tell me that hanging around them as much as I did was like a poison to me, as I was starting to gain weight. It's true, I did to the tune of 128 pounds.

I tried getting them to diet and exercise with me. Of course, their answer was to bring junk food over the house all the time, and after battling with them over it, I started nibbling. They had every excuse not to lose weight, and sadly, I picked up that unhealthy mentality. Soon, the very things they said about losing weight came out of my lips, too. I slowly became less active than I was before. I was more relaxed, if you will, about food and my appearance than I ever had been in my life. I use to love clothes shopping, getting my hair and makeup done, nails polished, etc. I stopped those things because some days, I was too tired to do them, and other days I felt, why bother, it didn't make a difference in my appearance.

They were so much fun to be around, that quite honestly, I enjoyed every moment (and still do) of spending time with them. However, I've learned to say no to the food again, and keep my sitting time with them limited. If I want to go swimming or for a walk while they're here, they have the option to join me, or watch TV or talk to someone else in my family while I go. I've learned that I can't change them, but I can change me.

However, the weight gain is MY fault-blaming them for my weight problem is ridiculous. I was thinner back when we started hanging around more than before (one is a friend from junior high, the other, college), a 100 pounds lighter than I am now, and I knew better. We had been friends for years, but once two of us had children, we hung around even more, due to being at home with the kids during the day. My other friend joined us on her days off and evenings, and off track I went, by choice.

My friends that were in shape saw me less, because these two friends were genuinely loving, caring, nurturing people, and are STILL my best friends to this day. No one was going to turn me away from them because of their size, because they were too good to lose as friends over something cosmetic. However, I did pick up their bad habits (again, my fault, not theirs, and I KNEW better) and here I am.

One of my best friends just started Jenny Craig this week, after seeing how much I lost since the last time I saw her. I hope and pray this works for her, because she deserves to lose weight. However, as I told her, her success depends on herself, and no one else.

Our other best friend- she still finds excuses not to lose weight. Mind you, she's single, works 4 days a week, and has plenty of time to go to the gym and cook- she just won't do it. Pizza shops and McDonald's are her best friends, and TV, shopping (with one of those motorized carts), and going to the movies are her only hobbies. Funny, we weigh the same, but I am much more active than her, and I refuse to make my obesity easier to live with by using that motorized cart when we go shopping.

so so true

Obesity is a complex problem with lots of contributing factors. One line in the research article I thought was interesting was that the authors just sort of ruled out genetic explanations for obesity, and yet we've been having lots of discussion about genetic factors in the Rethinking Thin discussion on the maintainers forum.

And Steelslady's and royalsfan's posts highlight one way in which friends (and family) may influence each other to gain weight -- through shared behaviors and giving ourselves permission to eat. Coleen suggests that another influence is that we tend to gravitate to people who like the same things we do. And then, some of us probably are more predisposed to put on weight than others.

Probably all of these factors are involved in obesity -- and more I haven't even thought of. Yet that's not how it gets discussed in the media.



I'm really glad we have a place to come and discuss these issues! I know I learn a lot from hearing what other people say, because they often think of things I haven't!

My sister just got married about 18 months ago. Since the marriage, she has gained fifty pounds and her husband has gained seventy-five pounds. She attributes it specifically to their giving each other permission to eat as much as they wanted. She just got her master's degree and had roommates up until the marriage. She said that she would be embarrassed by completing "pigging out" in front of them, and that helped her keep her weight in check. So, when the study came out, I immediately thought of her. The bottom line, as I see it, is that we do influence each other's habits. I know I wouldn't want my children to hang out with those who smoked or drank or used drugs. Not that overeating is necessarily on that level, but it's the same principle. I had never considered the potential backlash, though. I'll have to give that some thought.

I believe that how the results are reported make a HUGE difference, not only does it imply things that may be true, it may encourage an unhealthy response to (even) true information.

I agree that people influence each other, but the next study in this vein would be to research whether the same effects are seen for weight LOSS. I think it would be more helpful to say try to develop friendships and spend more time with people with healthy lifestyles, than to say avoid fat people, even friends and relatives or you might stay or get fat. That is my opinion, and it's only based on my assumption that it is true for weight loss as well as weight gain (but I have no proof). Also, I know that losing friends, whether by choice or not, often makes social problems worse, not better.