mars, thanks so much for your support and info. What clicked for me is an upcoming trip abroad. I'm going to a place that will be very hot and I don't look forward to my thighs rubbing together. I was trying really hard and working out and the weight just wouldn't budge. I know there are lots of times I've seen people on this site post that they're counting calories, working out, doing all the "right" things and nothing is helping. I used to think that they must be miscalculating something, but even as I'm having very low calories, I'm realizing that those people were probably right.

If I had to guess why I'm not losing very much at all, I would say it's because of several factors. One, is the sleep deprivation (thanks for the wish for me to sleep, btw...that's super sweet and yes, I"ve had two sleep studies) but another possibility is just perhaps age (I'm 44) and maybe hormones or thyroid...I'm on the low end of normal.

With regards to studies, I think often those can be used to prove just about any agenda. I've read that going low calorie short term is fine, as long as you're overweight to begin with...which I definitely qualify. I won't do this for long. My goal is to get to 175...hopefully before my trip (in 15 days) and then, I'll try some calorie cycling. Based on just calorie intake and the calories burned, I should get to 175 in 15 days, but realistically, I'll probably only lose 3 lbs., which will put me at 177...not a huge deal of course.

Did you find the nutritionist helped you? I've always contemplated trying one out but I'm so crazy food-wise that I don't think I could change. I've even tried therapy and obviously, that didn't help either. I'm an addict and I'm longing for a day when I can finally find a way to manage my addiction.

Btw, there are people here that post about intuitive eating and how it has helped them get over their addiction and I think that's great...but I've tried it and it was just a disaster. For me, it's just better to face the fact that I'm and addict and any effort to eat like a "normal" person is simply my addiction taking over and tricking me into thinking I can handle it...which I can't. Sorry, I just had to get that off my chest. I know you guys would understand.

p.s. I'm terrified of the trip coming up...I have no idea how I'll handle it. I really need my routine and don't do well at all and there will be jet lag on top of existing sleep issues. Do any of you have any advice on how to handle travel?

Oh and with regards to sleep and calories...the only time I sleep better is when I have binged and fall into what I call a sugar coma. Otherwise, I am just not a good sleeper. My dad is exactly the same way. We both have daily headaches and we both can't tolerate medication.

luckymommmy, is your trip a vacation? Hope so! I have a vacation coming up on Nov and feel the same way--if I am on my own I love it, but this one will be a tour. I never realize how much I like my routines until I have to let go of them. You are pretty tall and I wonder if your body just thinks there isn't much to lose? I'm 5'4" and 150 is smack in the middle of my ideal range. The last 10-15 lbs takes the longest to shed!

Depending on where you are going, it may be possible to hang on to some of your routines. I like to google for a Whole Foods or farmer's market, a place to buy my beloved whey shakes; I also pack some protein snacks. If you have any flexibility, you can plan in some nap time to allow for jet lag.

I'm fortunate because I love looking at birds so a strange place is always an opportunity--even the 'parking lot' birds are a treat, and it makes me feel at home to look for them. Also journaling a trip--pen & paper, not smartphone--grounds me. And, sounding like a broken record here, and of course feel free to ignore , Healthjourneys.com guided imagery and affirmations. You can listen to sample before buying, the ones with Belleruth Naperstek are great. I was surprised how effective that has been to get me out of negative thinking, which is my default. She has one on relaxation that I have not yet tried.

Re sleep....I totally agree with you about studies being used to confirm a bias and I'm sorry they didn't find an 'aha' solution for you. Have you found that your WOE makes any difference? For me, it's like night & day--when I diet, I wake up 330-4a and when I don't, 5a. I'm not sure if the low calories or low carbs that change the pattern. I've read that serotonin is necessary for sleep and that carbs are required for its synthesis. I did try taking L-tryptophan a few times--it's the precursor to serotonin---and it helped.

The nutritionist did not really help me for the reasons you described. Nutritonists in my opinion do not think out of the box They have a tried and true party line about eating well, blah blah blah. Nowadays they base it on research more than in the past, but they in no way know what to do for crazy addictive eaters like us. If you have anorexia, maybe bulimia, they might be of help. But not plain old compulsive overeating with a few binges. So mine turned out not to that helpful in providing me any solutions. But I did like her explanation of why we get the powerful urges to binge right after a diet--the famine reaction thing. I relaized that I experienced that in a big way. Her conclusion was 'don't diet' but mine was 'I'm not in a famine so I can choose to ignore those urges--they aren't relevant to my survival right now'.

IE is based on such flawed logic, imo, that I just can't wrap my mind around it, though I am glad others apparently find some help from it. Anything espoused by a nutritionist has been absolutely useless in my experience. There, I said it! So done with people telling me how I should eat when they have NO CLUE as to what works. There, I feel better now that that's off my chest, too lm!

Not sure if you are a reader of addiction/diet books. I didn't used to be but I liked this book; Addiction & Grace by Gerald May. (He was a shrink, also a Jesuit priest, so you have to just overlook the religious stuff, unless that appeals). It's a good read though.

Uh-oh, time is flying by and gotta get ready or work. Rain on the first day of June in NoCal. Too weird, but we'll take it!

mars, thanks so much! You're so intelligent and you get it, making you a great inspiration for me. Sorry that the nutritionist didn't help you, but it really doesn't surprise me at all....but you saved me some money because I've been curious to try someone and I definitely won't.

I'm traveling to a few countries with my husband and two kids. There are no whole foods or anything of the sort. We will be eating out most of the time but we're staying in apartments where we'll at least be in control of breakfast. I'll go to a market and buy eggs, fruits and veggies so at least I"ll start my day off right. I like to snack on pistachios so hopefully, I can find some of those. The rest of the time, I'll try to only eat meat with salad. All that sounds great in theory, but you know how it is once we're confronted with so many temptations.

I will check out heathyjourneys! Sounds great actually. I've read lots of books on binge eating and none have helped yet. Do you think Addiction and Grace is really different? I"m not religious but I can definitely overlook that stuff easily.

Well, time has flown for me as well and I have to go. I'm in Southern Cal and no rain yet, but we're really hoping for some. Hope you have a great day.

Nutritionists... I have limited patience. Their "tried and true" help is well, tried and true for many, but not all. PLUS, they contradict each other.

I had to have a nutritionist when I was pregnant with my second son if I wanted to stay with my CNMs as I developed gestational diabetes. That nutritionalist said to go on a low carb diet - as low as I could make it - and not to worry about fat levels. It worked BRILLIANTLY and all my bloodwork improved across the board.

A few years later and I joined fitness/weightloss thing at my gym and you had to go to a nutritionist. She was spouting the old verbage of balance between carbs and protein and eating low fat. I ignored her.

Even the Diabetes Association is slow to take up low carb for type 2 diabetes, even though my primary care told me to eat low carb when my blood sugars were out of whack (turns out it was thyroid related). There is so much misinformation and every expert thinks they are the ONLY expert and their way is the ONLY way. It's not that simple because we're not that simple.

I saw a dietitian and she was a big help. She got me a discount on My Net Diary, too. I kind of love that app. After trying Spark, Lose It, Fitness Pal and one other, I could appreciate how good it is. So, seeing the dietitian was worth it just for that.

The dietitian isn't a great idea if you want mental assistance. They're not counselors. But if you have food questions, are on a special diet or just want a personalized plan to stick to, they're great. Mine was, anyway.

I love MyNetDiary too - except for this one thing that pops up every time I look at my weight. Today it reads.

That drives me buggy! BMI is for populations, not individuals and I will NEVER EVER weigh 158.8 nor would any doctor recommend that weight for me expecially as the "maximum" I should weigh. Maybe minimum!!!

It totally ignores my goal which is 175. (165 probably being "ideal" weight for me, but also nearly impossible for me to attain and/or maintain). But almost ALLLLL fitness/nutrition apps do crap like that. So, I live with it and curse at it's inappropriateness. Most people aren't outliers though... but there are always outliers!

That has to suck for you. There should be a way to customize!

I'm like most people and fit into the BMI thing. I'm not overweight because I'm so extremely muscular or have big bones or a unique body shape or anything. For me, it's fat, for sure. I have to hit about 162 to get into the chart's normal range and I will still be too fat when I hit it.

I know it's not an individualized thing, but I want that Normal BMI and I want it bad. A little shallow. I'll own that.

I have been waiting a long time to have a Normal BMI. I was THRILLED when I went from Obese to Overweight. Nobody was ever so happy to be classed as Overweight as I was on that day. I was all, "I'm OVERWEIGHT!!! YAY!! I'm Overrrweeei-eight! I'm not Obeee-eese. I'm overweight! Yay me!" That was a great day.

Being overweight is now less of a thrill. I want to be "Normal."

Where do you get the little lecture? I get like two sentences and I'm wondering if we're in the same place. Is it the app or online and where, exactly? Mine comes in the app, under the details tab, where you enter your Daily Weight. I reset myself in January, so it tell me that "You've lost about 5.2 pounds since Monday, January 5. Your BMI is 26.6, which means overweight." That's all I get there.

I added wheat back into my diet about 4 months ago and let me tell you - that stuff is dangerous! It is my trigger food. I went low carb and gluten free in May of 2013 and lost a lot of weight. When I tried to add wheat (low carb wraps- ezekiel bread ect) I was ravenous. Gained 10 pounds that I've been fighting with ever since. I got off the gluten and I am much more in control again, but still losing and gaining the same 10 pounds.

Thank-you for the compliment, luckymommy! I hope the rain reaches you. As for the book, I just found that the way he talked about addiction was really useful for me. He views it as an integral part of the human condition & has a list of many many addictions. it's really about the quality of the attachment to something & the tendency is hard-wired into our brains. I'll dig it up & cut & paste some quotes. Like David Kessler, he does not offer a quick fix, which is why I like them so much--more intellectually humble and willing to admit when something is not yet known. As opposed to the nutrition industry that loves to come up with press releases about what EVERY one should be eating, which are then found to be completely wrong. Oh here i go again on the nutritionists!

I guess travel with hubby & kids does not equal R & R! It sounds like you will have a fantastic time. All you can do is make the best choices you can with what is available. You might even be pleasantly surprised. As for temptations, i think on a vacation, it is possible to strike a balance between having enough to avoid feeling deprived while avoiding the addicitve mode of diving in with abandon. The way I know the difference is that when I do the latter, there is no end point of satisfaction. I can actually sense that beforehand--the 'more more more' feeling. It's a delicate balance, though. Sounds like you will be walking a lot, and that will be great on many levels--just bring some lotion or mineral oil for rubbing thighs.

Not sure if this would help, but I sometimes use liquid benadryl to sleep on the plane. I'll still be able to wake if needed (eg meal, lol), but basically I can sleep until landing and feel pretty refreshed, no drugged hangover feeling.

I agree & I really shouldn't unequivically bash them. They are great for medical diets and pregnancy, and sometimes with eating disorders too. Absolutely essential, imo. Based on my experience with them, though, they never retreat. Instead of saying 'we do not treat mental issues with overeating' they hang out the shingle and invite people with compulsive overeating issues and then do absolutely nothing besides prescribe a healthy diet with the admonition that 'preventing physical hunger makes it easier to deal with emotional eating.' While that is useful to a point, it leaves a huge gap. I know there are notable exceptions among clinical nutritionists. But they are exceptions and likely have some sort of mental health credentials. ok rant over!

Hi lotsakids Wow sounds like you have gleaned some major info! I think getting some control is the first step and will give some breathing room to work on a weight loss plan. I always have to withdraw first from the trigger by eating a LOT of non-trigger food. Then it's easier to taper back on calories, etc. Good luck!

luckymommy Re Healthjournerys (Bellerruth Naperstak) Each of her recording contains an intro, a guided imagery ~25 min, and then affirmations. The guided imagery is best done where you can relax--some people fall asleep. The affirmations can be listened to while driving, even. Just a heads up....For some reason she says at the end of the affirmations something about being utterly safe & resting in the hands of god. That is a little jolting to me--but i learned to screen it out, as she suggests with things that don't fit.

I most liked the one on trauma, sometimes I enjoy the one on anger/forgiveness, and also weightloss affirmations. Did not particularly like the spirituality one. They are all a little similar, but the trauma one has beautiful imagery and I like the music. I don't have PTSD or anything like some of the trauma I've read about from 3FCers, but like the rest of humanity, I've experienced some tough times. I think this recording might have a broad appeal).

Ran across this interesting article today on food addiction:
http://authoritynutrition.com/how-to...ood-addiction/

Thank you for posting this article. I am so inspired by how directly they write about addiction. I mean, how ridiculous would we all think alcoholics are if they say they will allow themselves to have just one beer each day.

It is somehow inspiring to have someone say that the "not one bite of bad" is the real mindset for a food addict like myself. For years in my mind I have literally believed that I was doing really good in that I didn't eat everything that ever crossed my mind. That I could eat 3 donuts at the office and not 20. That I am doing good because I eat only one piece of cake (knowing that I could easily eat the whole thing if I were by myself). Diets DO work for addicts because they REMOVE the work of living "normal". I think that if I have to hold back and act "normal" that it is WAY harder and mentally exhausting than to have a rock solid mantra of NO addiction foods PERIOD. I think that every alcoholic and drug addict would agree -- nothing is better than something that will throw us into the awful downward spiral of food sneaking, binging and cravings.

Our goal of staying clean is a much better one. We might slip and we might fail but at least we know there is a real solution of abstinence. Somehow,mas crazy as it sounds, abstinence sounds easier. I have never tried it except when I did the Ideal Protein Diet with a coach. I can't afford that now, but I also thought I could get to goal weight and eat "normally" ... Which for a food addict is absolutely not true.

Thanks again for your story and all power to us all who are getting on top of this hard problem. Thanks for the hope and helpful posts.

This is a fantastic article. Thank-you thank-you thank-you for sharing ladynredd. I think this is the path for me, meaning abstinence. The social pressure thing is the hardest at this point--going to someone's house and explaining no sugar. They just don't get it.I love the simplicity and the 'here's what to do' prescription in this short article.

amyniagara Agreed! I had a similar experience with Ideal Protein. If you are thinking IP would be a good way to go, have you considered alternatives, ie, similar foods to IP at 1/2 the price and using 3FC Ideal or another forum for your support? They are an active group with a lot of helpful threads. I found that IP bars were very triggering so stuck to a few savories & shakes. I am coming to realize that artificially sweetened things can be as triggering as regular sugared things.

Here is the Alternatives thread--first post lists IP compliant macros.
http://www.3fatchicks.com/forum/idea...-part-6-a.html

ladynredd, thanks so much for posting this article. I wish everyone in the world would read it and watch the video included. Perhaps then, people would stop the judging and treat us food addicts with a little more compassion. We didn't ask for this problem and we're not gluttons.

Yes - after so much learning from IP i am doing great with alternatives (i also found the bars to be triggering so i use ProtiDiet foods and get savory soups, hot chocolate and oatmeal but i put the oatmeal with lots of egg whites and make that into a crepe with Walden Farms sugar free syrup).

I have spent the last year trying to calorie count and stay under 60 carbs each day but it has been an uphill climb to do this while battling the addiction. I think it is just simpler/easier to have a strict guideline of "faux IP" which keeps my pancreas happy and my insulin dreamy.

I am on day 6 of ketosis and already feel soooo much calmer and relaxed. This Friday I have family coming and I wish there was something I could tell them that would help them to help me but people just think its a silly thing, to refuse any sugar at all. We need to invent a word for this problem that the world will take seriously. Wouldn't that be great?

Thanks for this link to the alternatives group ... I will join it!