I'm relieved to hear you've reached a safe place and been able to relax and nurture your spirits with beautiful scenery and love from your dad. I've been thinking about you all weekend wondering how you were doing.

So...update.

I'm immensely confused right now, to say the least.

Sean and I talked on the phone for like 2.5 hours last night. It was a productive conversation, I suppose. One of the VERY few discussions in our marriage where we have been able to talk with level voices and just talk about important things. So, that was an improvement, at least.

He did agree to marriage counseling. He FINALLY admitted that he may have been in the wrong about some things (but he still gave justification after justification when I gave him a few examples...he'd say "well I'm sorry if that hurt you, but I just did it because of this this and this"). For example, he said he threw his wedding ring and tossed the end table because he thought it was the only way he could get me to listen. Psh, nonsense. He has made it very clear that leaving was my fault, and he hasn't really connected the dots that I may have left because I truly felt it was the best and only option, and that he has a big part in that. I'm a rational person, and it takes me forever to decide what I want at Applebees, I do not make decisions like walking out on my husband lightly. I had been laying in bed for a month prior considering what the possible consequences and benefits of leaving would be.

So the discussion we had last night sounded somewhat like a decent conversation between two married people about normal marital issues. "I need this from you," "Well I need this from you," "It hurts me, and I don't understand when you do this," "I'm sorry I hurt you, I did it because of this, but I'll try to do that in the future." So now I'm sitting here, after having driven across the country, and I'm thinking...maybe I was just silly to leave over a normal marital issue. Maybe I am a cowardly jerk for it. I feel kind of foolish. But I keep reminding myself that I was sooo miiiiiiiiserable! And there WERE signs of abuse. I swear that I'm not crazy! The discussion we had last night was the kind of discussions we were supposed to be having all along. It was just too little too late. But at the same time, I still *want* my marriage to work...but only if it significantly changes. It was not working before I left.

In addition to making it clear that this whole mess of me leaving was MY failure to be able to communicate properly, he has let me know that his trust in me is very low at this point. And it would need to be built back up. I told him the feeling was mutual. The way he treated me for our entire marriage had lowered my trust so much, that I felt my only option was to leave. But I still don't think he "got" that. He told me that the longer I stayed away, the lower his trust would go, and the closer he'd get to believing I was never coming back.

When we were closing the conversation, there was an awkward silence. I asked if we were going to say the "L" word. He asked if I was going to say it. I said I'd say it and mean it, but I would not say it if it was not going to be reciprocated. I ended up saying "goodnight, Sean, I love you." And he said "I love you too" back.

So I'm feeling quite conflicted at the moment. My resolve and absolute belief that I had left an abusive situation has been shaken. Now I'm feeling that I may have just made a foolish decision and left over a normal marital issue. I still have an inkling of hope that we can have a happy marriage (again, possibly foolish). Now I feel like I'm being rushed to go back, like I'm on a timeline of leave-tomorrow-or-else. But I don't want to go back to a situation that I've already lost, if he holds this over my head and never works on his own issues because his "trust is too low" after me leaving. I told him that I'd like to stay for at least a week, and he repeated that the longer I was gone, the lower his trust would get.

So I'm conflicted and confused. And I feel foolish in a few different ways.

And it's my birthday. Happy birthday to me, happy birthday too me...

Megan, it sounds like he's still trying to manipulate you. For one, people who truly care for your well-being wouldn't put a clock on you trying to figure things out.

Can you see a counselor where you are? Preferably someone who has worked with women in your situation? I think you'd benefit from an outside perspective. Everything you've told us on this forum suggests that these are not "normal" issues.

But I do think it's COMPLETELY normal to be having these 2nd, 3rd and 4th thoughts.

Happy birthday! No matter what, know that you are beautiful, smart, and strong and deserving of true love.

Stop talking to him. Get yourself to a counselor who deals with women who have been in abusive situations. Stop talking to him. Your last post is frightening and sad. You and he are trying to justify the way he treated you. It will get worse and worse if you return. And it will be harder to leave. Or impossible.

"Normal" married people don't need to talk about why one of them threw and end table, or took all the resources (ATM cards, Military ID, etc) of the other, or blocked her car in, or mistreated her animals, or justified cruel behaviors. Oh yeah, didn't his last girlfriend get a restraining order against him?

He doesn't trust you? It was your fault you left? How are you planning on making him trust you again? Not questioning his actions? Not involving your family when he mistreats you? Crawling on your knees behind him hanging on his every word and letting him kick you in the face?

Girl, give yourself the biggest and best birthday present ever. Cut off all contact with him. He can get help on his own if he wants to (marriage counseling doesn't work in an abuse situation), but you need to work on yourself without him. Talking to him is dangerous. Like a drunk going back into a bar and justifying why it's ok and she won't drink so much this time and it will be different.

Stop talking to him, block his emails, texts, phone calls, tweets, facebook messages and smoke signals. Free yourself.

http://www.heart-2-heart.ca/women/page5.htm
Some good information on the cycle of abuse.

It sounds like he is continuing to try to manipulate you and control the situation. Why would he not trust you being alone with your family? Why can't you just clear your head and spend some time with them? He is still blaming you for all of this and this is not your fault!
Please stay strong and remember why you left. You were miserable.
We love you and want you to be safe.

[QUOTE=mkendrick;3777159].

1 - For example, he said he threw his wedding ring and tossed the end table because he thought it was the only way he could get me to listen. ...

2 - He has made it very clear that leaving was my fault, and he hasn't really connected the dots that I may have left because I truly felt it was the best and only option,

3 -...maybe I was just silly to leave over a normal marital issue. ... But I keep reminding myself that I was sooo miiiiiiiiserable! And there WERE signs of abuse. ...It was not working before I left.

4 - MY failure to be able to communicate properly,
his trust in me is very low at this point.
...my only option was to leave.

5 - Now I feel like I'm being rushed to go back, like I'm on a timeline of leave-tomorrow-or-else.

6 - he repeated that the longer I was gone, the lower his trust would get.QUOTE]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 - A sign of abuse...indirect aggression. Someday he will hit you on the head, or worse..."to get you to listen"
2 - A sign of abuse...Everything is your fault
3 - More signs of abuse
4 - You sensed an abusive realtionship escalating, so you left.
5 - Another sign of abuse. He is taking control of you again. Forcing you to return to an abusive situation that will only escalate.
6 - More abusive behavior. He is trying to force you to return by playing on your guilt feelings.



You want a failed marraige to work. Stay where you are, where you are safe and can return mentally to a normal, happy young lady. You have not arrived at that point yet.
Your decision to leave was well thought out over a long period of time. It was the right decision.

And what about the 2 little kitties? If you can't trust him around cats, you can't trust him around you.

I don't see his first ex-wife longing to return to him. Do you?

Megan,

I really wish I was there to shake you!

I was in an abusive relationship myself and what saved me was distance form the guy. But even in that abusive relationship, I still had phone conversations with him that affected me even if he was thousand of miles away. So, what you're going through is perfectly normal, it's a way of mourning the relationship..... AS LONG AS YOU DO NOT GO BACK.

Look, marriage is not like this. A healthy relationship is NOT like this.

There are so many red flags, you had different counselors say that he might be a sociopath, you've been miserable. That's not normal. That's not normal for NEWLYWEDS!

This is supposed to be the happiest part of your marriage. And it hasn't been. Sadly, it will get worse, because if it's not great now when you guys are supposedly so in love with each other, then it's not going to get any better than this.

He's not taking responsibility for his part in this relationship and for the unfair demands and expectations he's had on you. He hasn't taken responsibility for scaring you, for having a violent temper, for trying to lock you out financially and physically. He hasn't apologized for mistreating your cats, for trying to keep you from having a close relationship with your dad, and for being unreasonable in his jealousy.

He is NOT a prize.

You are feeling crappy because you are feeling like you're some kind of failure, but this thread should indicate to you that there are plenty of women out there who have been in your shoes in the past. And for us who have gotten out, we can tell you unequivocally that it IS much better when you stay out of the relationship than when you get in there.

The problem with what you're doing now is you're going to end up compromising with him on some very big issues, mainly what is acceptable treatment of you.

A normal guy (and take this from someone who had dated a lot more than you have!) will have been groveling and apologizing and would be doing everything he can to beg your forgiveness.

Do you know why Sean isn't doing that? It has nothing to do with YOU or how much he loves you.

He's not doing that because he wants to have control over you and the relationship. That's not a healthy decision.

If you go back to him, understand that the relationship will ALWAYS be on his terms. At any moment from now on, he'll be the one to determine how you interact with others, what you're allowed to do, and the expectations of you in his home.

He'll do that because he really can't "trust" you...... he knows you have the resources (your dad, friends) to leave at any moment the relationship doesn't work for you. This is means he doesn't have control over you. He'll limit your access to friends, because they might give tell you that he's not good enough for you because he's a controlling jerk. He won't like that you are close to your dad and start poisoning you against him because your dad will not forgive Sean for everything that happened this time around.... of course, he'll continue to be jealous of any other man, woman, child or hobby (including dieting/maintenance) that takes away your energy, focus, and attention from him.

Think about it, Megan.

Why did he not like that you were eating healthy? Why did he feel threatened that you were making different choices for food than he was?

I'm in a healthy relationship now and my boyfriend LOVES that I am taking care of myself. He supports it, even if it means we eat separate meals. He's always thinking of what restaurant we can go to where I can eat healthy. He buys me healthy food, he'll get me healthy snacks when we travel, he'll worry about whether or not I get to the gym. He'd rather miss out on time with me because I'm in the process of doing something healthy for myself.

Sean was never like that. He felt threatened by the fact that you were taking on something that was out of his control. When you were severely restricting and he panicked at your eating, it was not so much out of concern, but rather his inability to control what you were eating. So, ask yourself, why were you trying to restrict so severely then? Couldn't it be because you felt out of control in your own household?

Why would you want to go back to that type of relationship? Don't you want to be someone who supports you in every thing that you do? Someone who will eat healthy with you and won't tempt you with trigger food?

But more than that, get very worried about the fact that Sean wants to control who you talk to and who you confide in. I made that mistake in my abusive relationship too. I gave up a lot of good friends because my boyfriend and it took a long time to rebuild new friendships and to trust myself again.

I already read in your messages (read them again!!!) how he seems to have been doing that to you. Be wary.

I also second the idea of going to a counselor in WY. It will help you decide if you want to work on the marriage and work with all the stuff that's happened in the last six months since he came back stateside.

I'm sorry for the long message, I just couldn't stay more silent. I know where you are right now and I really hope you trust all of us that tell you it's better on the other side.

Hi Megan,

I am completely unqualified to give you advice how you should interact with your husband and where to go from here. BUT I can say with absolute confidence that your leaving was based on very sound analysis of the situation and emotional and physical danger you were facing. (I use these words because you, like me, seem to be an extremely rational person who grounds decision is reason, not emotion). You removed yourself from an unhealthy, dangerous environment. You have not made any rash choices, and you have not made any permanent choices. I hope you can rest easy that your decision to remove yourself from a dangerous household and put yourself into a supportive environment was the right one for now. Only you, your loved ones, and marriage/family counselors can help you decide where to go from here, but there is no reason you should doubt at all decisions you have made up until this point.

I've been married a long time and nothing you've described sounds like a normal marital problem

Another quick comment on something you said- "another normal marital issue." Like a previous poster said, in a normal marital/committed relationship someone who cared about you would be devastated by the way he treated another human being, let alone someone he loved, let alone his WIFE.

My boyfriend of 4 years gets upset seeing my cry, even if it's for a reason completely unrelated to him. He just hates seeing me anything other than happy. I'm saying to give you another example of normal partnership behavior, since you've only been around abusive behavior lately. Being completely torn up inside for hurting you is how most partners would react, and *that* is normal behavior, not justifying why he's throwing things and screaming.

Another look at "normal behavior" - if a marriage got so bad that the wife actually had to leave and move a few states away, a "normal" husband who was looking for a long term healthy relationship would not pressure his wife to return ASAP or all trust would be eroded, he would tell her to take her time, and he would get himself into counseling ASAP regardless of whether she was going to join him.

You made the right choice in getting - and STAYING - away.

Do not let him shake your resolve. Why should he distrust you, and plant such guilt in your head? This is not normal.

Think about how unsteady and off-balance you feel. This is not an accident. He is manipulating you, plain and simple.

I truly think things would get much worse if you returned. You deserve someone who honestly loves you and can care for you. You should not be fearful of your husband.

Please stay with your family and do not return.

Megan, Happy Birthday ! Please consider carefully what your next move should be. Remember what the counselors at the shelter told you.

First of all -- Happy Birthday! I'm sorry you're having to go through all this.

Please celebrate your birthday by giving yourself freedom from judgment, criticism, and control inflicted by your husband.

It sounds like he is not listening to you yet again. Please read your most recent entry carefully. He has somehow got you to hear that he thinks you have caused all this and that he sees you as the reason for his horrible behavior. That is an abuser's mentality. He will blame the person he is hurting and will say "you made me do it" in one way or another. He is blaming you and not hearing you. He has not heard what you said -- you said it yourself, that he didn't really get it.

So... it's okay for you to hear him loud and clear but he doesn't have to take in what you have to say?

He never accepted that what he did was very wrong and that there was no excuse for that. He is violent toward your animals. He does not have self-control and made this clear by breaking that table to "get your attention." Don't you think that's excessive? I'm sure you do. So don't you think it's a problem that he shrugs this off?

He wants to control you. He knows he can. It's your job to stop this in its tracks. He wants to say that he's lost trust in you but so what? He is tugging at your heart strings and knows you will feel a pull when he says this. Remember that you were nervous in your own home and couldn't sleep. Remember how it felt to feel worthless because of him.

No you are not crazy and everything did happen the way you remember it. But you're in a vulnerable place and are being manipulated by this man.

He's doing it again. Please let go of your need to please him. He's feeding off this and using it to his advantage to get you right back where he wants you. Controlled, confused, with low self-esteem and wondering if this is all "normal." So what if he's upset? He is a grown man and can take care of himself.

You've lost trust in him and that is what should matter for your own well-being.

Ask yourself: when was the last time you really, really trusted him never to harm you (physically, emotionally, or otherwise)? Do you trust him right now? What has he done to earn trust? What has he done to apologize and really see the pain you were and are in? I think all the answers you come up with will be revealing.

Look -- if your husband really loves you, he would wait forever for your return and only when you're ready. In contrast, this controlling man has given you the deadline of a week. He should have empathy for everything you've gone through, any normal husband would, but instead he makes excuses and blames you.

What you have gone through with your husband, including that manipulative phone conversation you had, is not normal marital stuff. It just isn't. We have all been chanting in a chorus to you "this is not normal, this is not normal, this is not normal!" Please hear us.

Remember those 3 different counselors that referred to your husband as a sociopath? Do you want to return to that? That is a serious concern, which is an understatement.

Please find a counselor very soon. Please don't make any decisions until you speak with a counselor for at least a week.

I'm sorry... I know I have come on too strong in this post but I really care about what happens to you. Stay safe!