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Old 04-13-2014, 03:14 PM   #61
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Wow, so unless you are 100% on program 100% of the time you are not welcome on any thread except the 90%er. How sad for these forums.

I come here for support and ideas. My work/school/life schedule makes it impossible for me to be 100%/100%. By that I mean I can't always eat 2 cups of veg and 8% of protein for dinner. Sometimes I have to eat 4 cups of veg at lunch with my protein in order to get it in.

And I would like to hear from other people with similar struggles. I don't post in the 100% thread because that doesn't define me everyday.

I guess I should just go hide in my pantry with my 2 year old Peeps and Candy Canes and hang my head in shame. But I won't, because what I am doing is working for me.
Please don't go into your pantry and hang your head in shame You have and will continue to receive support on this forum, no worries.
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Old 04-13-2014, 03:15 PM   #62
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Wow, so unless you are 100% on program 100% of the time you are not welcome on any thread except the 90%er. How sad for these forums.

I come here for support and ideas. My work/school/life schedule makes it impossible for me to be 100%/100%. By that I mean I can't always eat 2 cups of veg and 8% of protein for dinner. Sometimes I have to eat 4 cups of veg at lunch with my protein in order to get it in.

And I would like to hear from other people with similar struggles. I don't post in the 100% thread because that doesn't define me everyday.

I guess I should just go hide in my pantry with my 2 year old Peeps and Candy Canes and hang my head in shame. But I won't, because what I am doing is working for me.
Amen sister!
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Old 04-13-2014, 03:20 PM   #63
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Not everyone wants to be whipped into shape by strangers on the internet. Also, I don't think everyone who cheats and admits to it is asking for forgiveness on the forums. I think it's a mistake to assume that everyone who cheats wants an a*^ kicking or to be corrected. There's a respectful way to "correct" someone or to help someone get back on track. The stern, sanctimonious approach doesn't go over very well with most people, but I think most are afraid to stick up for themselves. I guess we're going to have to "agree to disagree on this one."

I think it's pointless to try to "clean up" the boards when every day multiple people will post the types of things you don't like to see. Have fun trying to force 100's of people you don't know to be 100% or get off of the boards. I think it would be better to focus on your own progress or maintenance instead of policing these boards and providing unsolicited or unwanted discipline to people who deviate from IP.

It's very ironic that people who aren't even on IP consider themselves 100% OP when they are not even using IP products. I know people are successful on alternatives, but get off of your high horses because it's impossible to claim you're 100% OP on an IDEAL PROTEIN forum, when you're not even doing IDEAL PROTEIN! The protocol says to use only Ideal Protein products and that anything not on the sheet is not allowed. If you're not following the IP protocol sheet, you're not even close to 100% OP. You're "testing the limits" of ketosis just as much as the people who deviate. There is such a bunch of hipocracy and self-righteousness on these boards by certain people it's unreal.
Wow, Kooky, you are very brave, I must admit I agree with you statement that it is better to focus on your own progress or maintenance instead of policing these boards and providing unsolicited or unwanted discipline.

But honestly, who cares, this is a pretty much faceless forum, full of very valuable information and sometimes support, and you should only take it at face value. No reason for anybody to get worked up over where something should be and should not be posted and what someone is eating.
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Old 04-13-2014, 03:57 PM   #64
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What I am getting from this is that we are all on a journey to the same place, a happy, healthier place. We just don't all travel the same exact path.
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Old 04-13-2014, 04:08 PM   #65
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I think several people have bent over backwards to make a distinction between "making it work in a pinch" (and/or a slip) and recreating IP altogether. It's becoming exhausting and has an air of game to it at this point.
I think it's important for people to listen to what others who have a differing opinion than your own are saying. I've read this thread with interest. I am new to 'IP' (no coach, using all alternative foods) and have tried to stay on plan 100% since starting. Even if this thread isn't meant to make people feel like they're being judged, some people are saying that that's exactly how they're feeling. You can say that people are bending over backwards but if the recipient of the information feels like they're being targeted, then you have to give some credibility to that. There ARE two sides of this coin and the opinion of one side shouldn't cancel out the other.

I come here for support. Obviously since I am not near a clinic, I am not officially 100% because I am not using a coach or IP products. But I do have access to the phase 1 sheet and have not deviated from that at all. So, am I 100% or not 100%? Do I belong or not? I'm not sure anymore. That's what this thread has caused for some of us that are 1) new and 2)feeling 'targeted'.
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Old 04-13-2014, 04:16 PM   #66
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I think it's important for people to listen to what others who have a differing opinion than your own are saying. I've read this thread with interest. I am new to 'IP' (no coach, using all alternative foods) and have tried to stay on plan 100% since starting. Even if this thread isn't meant to make people feel like they're being judged, some people are saying that that's exactly how they're feeling. You can say that people are bending over backwards but if the recipient of the information feels like they're being targeted, then you have to give some credibility to that. There ARE two sides of this coin and the opinion of one side shouldn't cancel out the other.

I come here for support. Obviously since I am not near a clinic, I am not officially 100% because I am not using a coach or IP products. But I do have access to the phase 1 sheet and have not deviated from that at all. So, am I 100% or not 100%? Do I belong or not? I'm not sure anymore. That's what this thread has caused for some of us that are 1) new and 2)feeling 'targeted'.
Yup. You're 100%. It doesn't have to be IP products.
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Old 04-13-2014, 04:24 PM   #67
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Regarding any form of communication-including forums to quote a comment I saw- People either have the ability to communicate, understand others and or present their own view...or they don't and life no matter how its presented to someone, or the message, image or words get misinterpreted-
One of my favorite quotes-be who you are and say what you feel-those who matter don't mind and those who mind don't matter.....
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Old 04-13-2014, 04:49 PM   #68
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To clarify, I don't mean to offend those using alternatives. I was pointing out the hypocrisy of people using alternative products feeling superior and being condescending to those who might occasionally deviate from Ideal Protein.

Technically, those using alternatives, not going to an IP clinic, and not using IP products exclusively are not really doing Ideal Protein. These people are doing an unofficial program derivative of Ideal Protein which has not been tested scientifically. Essentially, when you're complaining about people not being 100% or deviating, you should look at what you're doing. You're not doing the official IP protocol, yet you complain or come down on people for not following protocol...very hypocritical and silly.

I'm saying this because I think the judging, policing, and bullying needs to stop because no one is perfect. We're all trying to better ourselves by doing IP or alternatives. How people choose to address their weight loss is their business. Gentle guidance to those who need help is great, but condemning or judging others is not cool. Also, telling people they need to post in the 90% thread unless they have been 100% OP is ridiculous. There are plenty of other threads where anyone should be able to post. Don't worry about me sullying the 100% board because I am not a 100%'er and don't want to be.
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Old 04-13-2014, 05:15 PM   #69
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To clarify, I don't mean to offend those using alternatives. I was pointing out the hypocrisy of people using alternative products feeling superior and being condescending to those who might occasionally deviate from Ideal Protein.

Technically, those using alternatives, not going to an IP clinic, and not using IP products exclusively are not really doing Ideal Protein. These people are doing an unofficial program derivative of Ideal Protein which has not been tested scientifically. Essentially, when you're complaining about people not being 100% or deviating, you should look at what you're doing. You're not doing the official IP protocol, yet you complain or come down on people for not following protocol...very hypocritical and silly.

See, this is exactly what NO ONE is saying. The very fact that you are calling me a hypocrite after I openly acknowledged that I, #1. use alternative products, yet #2. consider myself to be 100% should be illuminating. No one, but no one, is saying that you have to be 100% perfect, no alternatives, no slips, no finding-your-own-way-that-works. The very fact that I, and others, consider me to be 100% proves this.

This forum was my life-blood when I first began the program. I could not have made it if this forum was not the way it was when I started in 2/13. The way it was -- IP was explained in its most simple, as-written form. Strict (as possible) adherence was the gold-standard and was unquestioningly what everyone agreed was ideal. When people slipped up, they slipped up and were given encouragement to pick themselves up and keep going. No one was ever asked to leave or to get out. That was never even implied. Many, many times, someone would say something along the lines of, "well, I've always [insert the improvisation here] and it has not affected my weight loss." That way, people can tell that the poster has deviated from the program in this regard and make their own decisions about whether they want to try that or not. I don't see what the problem is about that.

And I don't see a single person here -- myself included, since that seems to be to whom you are referring -- who feels superior to anyone else here in any way. You've got to be kidding. I feel like I've won the damned lottery over here in regard to my weight loss. I'm not sure I even deserve it, I feel that "lucky." But I am so much happier and healthier since I have gotten this weight off, I cannot even put it into words. I have begun feeling a bit unworthy, to be honest. (That's not the exact right word, but it is close.) I very much want to do what I can to give back to the forum that really changed my life. I want to help others who are right where I was a year ago. Many of us do. But now, suddenly, we are to move over, keep quiet, and no longer maintain the forum in the manner which we all found to be so helpful.

I really hate to see this forum become so war torn. Some people here may rub some other people the wrong way from time to time. That is an internet forum for you. I can say that I used to feel that way, but, looking back, it was all helpful and necessary and that no one here intends to hurt anyone in any way. There is so much valuable information here, and I really do believe it is critical to success.
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Old 04-13-2014, 05:37 PM   #70
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I'm not saying that everyone who is using alternatives is a hypocrite. I'm saying that using alternatives AND judging/making condescending remarks to others for not being 100% OP with Ideal Protein is hypocritical.

I'm saying this because using alternatives is not compliant with the Ideal Protein protocol. Using alternatives is complying with the alternatives protocol someone created.

I'm not debating the effectiveness of Ideal Protein vs. alternatives, I'm just stating the simple fact that the two protocols and the products involved are not the same. Also, I'm saying that those doing alternative products are not truly doing Ideal Protein. When an individual is not actually doing Ideal Protein, what right does she/he have to call out people for being non-IP compliant? Using alternative products consistently would get you kicked out of my IP clinic because doing that is not following the IP protocol.
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Old 04-13-2014, 05:46 PM   #71
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It seems a lot need to take a breath and reread the 1st post in this thread, because the intent has gotten lost. And I did not lose it.

In all of this, the only reference I personally ever made to 100% was in this paragraph in the 1st post:


"Keeping that separate on the IP forum has allowed us to create striving for the 100% culture that is needed and not available ANYWHERE else. All other diets allow for cheats...they can be adjusted and hijacked to fix a stray quickly. Those diets did not work for a large number of people on IP. The forums where support is given for needing to allow for weekend transgressions, planned weekends, holidays birthdays or anniversaries are in abundance...they are the norm. Regularly people fall off the wagon and it's acceptable to do it, talk openly about it, and get back on. Cravings are part of any diet. IP for the most part reduces the physical craving but the psychological/emotional and social pieces of eating are still battles that need to be conquered. With the physical piece being addressed nicely for most after a few days/weeks...the opportunity to get the other pieces together for a successful maintenance and life ever after are the bonus for those who recognize and are looking for the tools to get prepared for that golden part of happily ever after..... "


The emphasis was on striving (Please note...these words in the first post) to make this work at the level the diet was designed to work. At it's best according to the people who designed and sell the plan.... And more importantly, to many making sure that support IS available in the way both the marketed protocol and philosophy are meant to be delivered and used for IP to those who"want or want to try" to do it. Alternatives meet the philosophy...falling off and getting back on meets philosophy.

Intentionally deciding to hijack the plan does not mesh with the philosophy. It is a good idea to keep the philosophy (which I don't own..it is not my invention...) in tact SO this does not become just another lo carb forum.

I do own believing and suggesting the philosphy is worth protecting for those who think that is what they are getting on here.


Offending and antagonizing was not my intent...and I do apologize to anyone who mistakenly got that idea by other posters. I believe things are being attributed to me which were never said let alone intended..

In addition, the idea that following the IP protocol with or with out a coach and with or with out IP products is less than acceptable has never been a concept that I wrote about, believed or encouraged. So please folks...someone else own that too.

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Old 04-13-2014, 05:55 PM   #72
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I'm not saying that everyone who is using alternatives is a hypocrite. I'm saying that using alternatives AND judging/making condescending remarks to others for not being 100% OP with Ideal Protein is hypocritical.

I'm saying this because using alternatives is not compliant with the Ideal Protein protocol. Using alternatives is complying with the alternatives protocol someone created.

I'm not debating the effectiveness of Ideal Protein vs. alternatives, I'm just stating the simple fact that the two protocols and the products involved are not the same. Also, I'm saying that those doing alternative products are not truly doing Ideal Protein. When an individual is not actually doing Ideal Protein, what right does she/he have to call out people for being non-IP compliant? Using alternative products consistently would get you kicked out of my IP clinic because doing that is not following the IP protocol.
I have not made condescending remarks or judgments, and please note, despite being called a hypocrite among other things by you, I have not called you, or anyone, anything.

I am bowing out of this conversation now. I no longer know what we are even talking about, and I am just getting attacked now.
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Old 04-13-2014, 05:56 PM   #73
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It seems a lot need to take a breath and reread the 1st post in this thread, because the intent has gotten lost. And I did not lose it.

In all of this, the only reference I personally ever made to 100% was in this paragraph in the 1st post:


"Keeping that separate on the IP forum has allowed us to create striving for the 100% culture that is needed and not available ANYWHERE else. All other diets allow for cheats...they can be adjusted and hijacked to fix a stray quickly. Those diets did not work for a large number of people on IP. The forums where support is given for needing to allow for weekend transgressions, planned weekends, holidays birthdays or anniversaries are in abundance...they are the norm. Regularly people fall off the wagon and it's acceptable to do it, talk openly about it, and get back on. Cravings are part of any diet. IP for the most part reduces the physical craving but the psychological/emotional and social pieces of eating are still battles that need to be conquered. With the physical piece being addressed nicely for most after a few days/weeks...the opportunity to get the other pieces together for a successful maintenance and life ever after are the bonus for those who recognize and are looking for the tools to get prepared for that golden part of happily ever after..... "


The emphasis was on striving (Please note...these words in the first post) to make this work at the level the diet was designed to work. At it's best according to the people who designed and sell the plan.... And more importantly, to many making sure that support IS available in the way both the marketed protocol and philosophy are meant to be delivered and used for IP to those who"want or want to try" to do it. Alternatives meet the philosophy...falling off and getting back on meets philosophy.

Intentionally deciding to hijack the plan does not mesh with the philosophy. It is a good idea to keep the philosophy (which I don't own..it is not my invention...) in tact SO this does not become just another lo carb forum.

I do own believing and suggesting the philosphy is worth protecting for those who think that is what they are getting on here.


Offending and antagonizing was not my intent...and I do apologize to anyone who mistakenly got that idea by other posters. I believe things are being attributed to me which were never said let alone intended..

In addition, the idea that following the IP protocol with or with out a coach and with or with out IP products is less than acceptable has never been a concept that I wrote about, believed or encouraged. So please folks...someone else own that too.
If you read my post(s) correctly, I SPECIFICALLY say that I am not debating the quality or efficacy of IP vs. alternatives. I AM saying that no one has the right to question the integrity and cleanliness of the IP board when it's not strictly an IP board. It's a both an IP and an IP alternatives board. Hope I made this more clear to you. Also, please don't play the victim when you create an inflammatory thread and people openly disagree with you. You opened the can of worms, so you should be able to handle others questioning your OPINION.

Also, I don't think people who deviate are trying to "hijack the plan." Could you BE anymore dramatic?! Wow! What's next...calling the occasionally non-compliant terrorists?! This is really becoming laughable.
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Old 04-13-2014, 05:59 PM   #74
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I have not made condescending remarks or judgments, and please note, despite being called a hypocrite among other things by you, I have not called you, or anyone, anything.

I am bowing out of this conversation now. I no longer know what we are even talking about, and I am just getting attacked now.
I never called you (or anyone else) a hypocrite for using alternatives. I said it's hypocritical for people not following the Ideal Protein protocol to be critical of those on IP who might deviate from time to time. If you have not criticized or judged people for deviating as 65x65 is doing, I am not referring to you, so no need to get offended.
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Old 04-13-2014, 06:02 PM   #75
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