Wise words for sure. I too was on the WW for a year and lost 30 pounds, but it was definitely a struggle. I've been reading a lot these days and two excellent books that talk about low carb/glycemic index are 'The Blood Sugar Solution' by Mark Hyman, as well as 'Ultra-Metabolism' by the same author. I find with the IP, the protein is keeping me full, without cravings and my pancreas isn't overworking. Not having that sugar spike that fuels the hunger over and over again with eating too many carbs, has made me feel full and lose weight.

I definitely am thinking about maintenance even at this early stage, because I want to keep my carbs low enough so I'm not having that sugar spike which can totally cause disease like diabetes (which runs in my family), heart disease and cancers.

What do you all think about 'Wheat' in the diet? I just finished reading, 'The Wheat Belly' and I think wheat could be keeping us fat and making the rolls on our stomachs.

Being GF is probably a plus.

The chiro who coaches me at my IP site said I would have an easier time in maintenance because I am GF. We have celiac in our immediate family and a lot of food sensitivities. As a result I discovered my own sensitivity to gluten years ago...(Wheat / gluten sensitivity is also an auto immune thing...and seems to go along with and can exacerbate thyroid disease and diabetes in some...all rampant in my family).

It's easy to get passionate about adhering to the IP diet when all of this starts to come together and you see what the effect this most probably has had on yourself.

The Paleo diet is GF and low glycemic...and that's the way I'm headed for the rest of my life!

I haven't been told that I have celiac's, but I just know that 'grains' which are carbs can wreak havoc on our systems. I am also highly thinking of going Paleo after the IP. You look great by the way!
A few questions if you don't mind. How many carbs do you allow yourself a day? I was reading that eating something like 50-100 grams of carbs a day will keep you in ketosis and keep you maintaining. I am realizing on this IP program that because I am eating so much protein and cutting the sugar and carbs...I don't crave sweets which is amazing. The more high glycemic carbs/sugar you eat, the more you crave more and more.

I went to a seminar on nutrition last night by the owner of my gym who developed a program that is not called the IP program, but he put his own spin on it using the IP foods of course. He is really opening the eyes of many people who believe that having a bowl of cereal and milk/yogurt is healthy. Whereas it will spike your blood sugar and then you'll crash and crave more and more carbs/sugar.

Good information, thanks everyone.
I have done well on low carb diets before, but the losses are slower since there is more room to eat fat and you don't count calories.

I will get a copy of the boom and read it so I can better understand the science

I do think it's true that you can lose weight on ANY diet with restricted calories. I designed a "Macaroni and Cheeese / Chocolate Chip Cookie Diet" back in 2001 where all I ate was macaroni and cheese (with a can of tuna) and chocolate chip cookies (BUT I was restricting my self to only 1200 calories a day on those items) ... and proceeded to lose 100 pounds over a 9 month period (about 11 pounds a month on average). So I do think a "calories in / calories out" sort of budget does work. That being said, I think I lost a lot of muscle mass on that diet as I was not getting enough protein ... and then (as is typical) gained all that weight back plus 20 pounds over the following year after ending that crazy diet.

I think one thing that's 'different" about the IP diet (for me at least) is if you follow protocol 100%, you lose your sugar and carb addiction so it's REALLY EASY not to cheat (you don't actually have cravings for carbs and sugar, at least I don't) ... one result of that is STEADY LOSES with no plateaus at all (at least for me so far). I have never been on a diet where I lost 50 pounds ... STEADILY ... without a plateau ... so its very motivating to stay on program.

Another perk for me at least is how great/healthy my blood (bloodwork) got in just a few days. I was struggling with high blood sugar and high cholesterol (metabolic syndrome) on my own. One week after starting IP, my blood sugar range dropped from 120-180 to 90-119. And 3 weeks after that, my cholesterol dropped into the 100s (from 230). So there are really great health benefits to deleting (greatly reducing) carbs and sugar. Though any diet that greatly reduced carbs and sugar would do the same (IMHO). (Note that I don't take ANY prescription drugs for cholesterol or blood sugar -- I am getting these great numbers via diet only.)

Another thing is the camaraderie you get on boards like this ... tho I would think that other diets might have similar groups ... I do like the people here.

I have tried a lot of diets over the past 20 years, and none have got me AS FAR and AS FAST and AS STEADY as the IP Diet ... I challenge you to find a diet where you can mimic the kind of 10 week losses that I have seen on IP. Fifty pounds practically straight down in 10 weeks.

https://mindstar.com/scratch/WL_2013_10_11_Rab_sml.jpg

Finally, I LOVE the way the IP Diet targets FAT ... as seen by scorchingly fast and dramatic losses in ones waist measurement. Losing 9" + on ones waistline in 10 weeks in just INSANELY GREAT. I think you would be hard pressed to find a diet that produces as FAST waistline measurement losses.

https://mindstar.com/scratch/ML_2013_10_11_Rab_sml.jpg

So bottom line is even thought I TRULY LOVE the IP Diet and think it's absolutely fantastic ... I still have a feeling that if you could design your own diet with daily numbers that mimic the IP totals, you could possibly/probably fairly closely approximate the losses. Although I have not personally tried that (it would be a cool experiment to try though!)

Calories ~ 950
Fat ~ 26g
Sat Fat ~ 8g
Cholesterol ~ 180 mg
Sodium ~ 1500 mg
Carbs ~ 80g
Sugars ~25g
Fiber ~14g
Protein ~110g

(Shown above is roughly the numbers I am eating everyday being 100% on IP with my specific selections.)

The thing is I am not sure about ... is without the whole structure and support that the IP Diet offers with your clinic and coach, and with online support groups, if it would be as easy to stick to. Plus most people don't want to count, measure, and calculate so much. I think most people appreciate the simplicity of the IP Diet as there is just not that much to think about.

So bottom line, is my gut feeling is that there is possibly/probably not anything magical about the IP Products themselves (at least I don't think there is, but I could be wrong) ... but there is at least some magic in those target numbers. If you can get close to those numbers on your own without IP, go for it. You would definitely need to use some sort of high protein powder and non-starchy vegetables and lean meat to have a shot at getting the numbers in line.

I think that is what people are trying to do when they say they are "on IP but with alternates".

I would add that from the "grapevine" on this board, I have heard a few people say that they don't lose "as much / as fast" on alternates as some of the people that are on the full IP program (like me). So it's possible that there IS something magical about the protein used in the IP packaged foods (but I cannot prove that without stopping what I am doing, and trying alternates, and I am just not willing to do that right now due to my current momentum on IP).

I also wonder if outside of the IP paradigm, if it might be easier to cheat. There is something about being on a formal "program" that keeps me more in line. And I really like the fact that 3 meals a day come out of pre-measured foil packets ... when it's done it's done ... a different sort of experience when you cook a pot of food and you have a motherload "waiting for you" for potential second helpings.

That being said, I do have to admit that I am "pseudo-addicted" to the IP Chocolate Drink (LOL), which I drink twice a day -- one at 9am and one at 9pm. That one product alone keeps me in-line as it just completely satisfies any hankering I have for chocolate and sweets.

Just my thoughts and opinions!

Avalon..sadly..the calorie thing alone does not always work for some.
After over 2 years of WW failures, Jenny Craig and finally trying calorie counting and logging things alone...I joined a small private..(pricey) gym near my work.Continued with under 1000 cal a day.. ...began working with personal trainer 3X a week ($600 for 8 sessions) and walking 1 hr a day 5X a week on a treadmill there or at home, for close to 2 more years . Kept a food diary the whole time and lost only 10 pounds in over a year and a half...(why I have trouble logging things now...such bad memories).
(Now THAT was an expensive diet ..!!!)

She, the owner, and my Drs could not figure out why I wasn't losing. After that...I simply gave up. Saw 3 endocrinologists and changed PCPs several times.

Then I tried IP a few years after retirement....that was almost a year ago. I read, then played around with it on my own during the holidays last year using EAS..and lost almost 10 pounds...during the holidays..not being strict...and not even having complete info. on how to do it! January began it for real....

After thought edit:
***I never count that 5 week 8.5 lbs I lost before I started formally with IP...but if I think about it...that may have actually been the initial weight loss burst a lot get when they start. I should count it since I did NOT gain it back before I went for my first weigh in.

65x65, yes Mother Nature is a mad scientist! I do think it's totally true that every human body is different and reacts to different things in different ways. I should have written that "calories in / calories out" budgets work great for me at least (and for some people). I should not have made that a blanket statement.

Gosh you have really been through A LOT with your dieting. What a trial that must have been. I am glad that you finally found IP and were able to get that pesky weight off. You really did fantastic given the backdrop of your story.

Yes, everyone seems to get that burst of loss right at the start, I think it's a sodium reaction and water weight loss that adds to the big first week loss total, but I am not 100% sure of that.

That history is what made me desperate ...desperate enough to follow this 100% right out of the starting gate. I think I would have drunk snake venom if that was on the sheet!

My husband is the one who next to me is most amazed at how my body has re-shapped. He remembers my bony butt and hip bones from when we were young...and probably thought my skeleton just plain dissolved or went to rubber as I aged!! Now, he never complains, but "comments" if I sit on his knee that my bum is sharp! I have 4 younger sisters and two of them would really benefit from this diet...I guess they are not desperate enough yet. One of them made the "too restrictive for me" comment, to which I replied..."No...being overweight is restrictive".

Rolling on the floor and playing with my 2 1/2 YO and 10 month old granddaughters and then getting up...alone and with out it being a major embarrassment is a major accomplishment. Looking forward to sledding & iceskating with the 11 and 8 year olds in Chicago at Christmas this year instead of watching them and being the one taking the pictures. By darn.... We better get some snow!..
(and I better get a warm parka that fits before we go.) :snow4::coolsnow: I've not been this cold in years. And I can't say it is annoying, knowing why! I must get used to putting layers on again!

65x65,

so true about needed to feel desperate before starting a successful diet -- that is really true for me too.

Snake venom ... funny!

Certainly being able to feel your bones is a good "tell" ... that's a funny story. And the freedom to play with your grandkids must feel so liberating.

Chicago is good snow country! Go for that parka!!

65x65 - I think everything you said is important. As someone who was diagnosed with insulin resistance after trying every &*$&%^* diet out there with little to no results, IP is the ONLY thing that has worked for me. I can honestly say that while there is no magic in the little silver packets, there is some magic biochemical reaction going on in my body that makes sense for me. I did Jenny Craig in 2007 and lost 35 lbs in a year. That was the most successful I had ever been on a diet. Needless to say, I gained it all back and then some in a short time. On IP, I have lost (almost) 50 lbs. in 5 months and feel great. BIG difference between the two! I am wondering - what is syndrome x? Is that something specific, or just a phantom metabolic disorder that can't be identified?

I think this may be the most inspiring and thought provoking thread that I have read yet. Thank you all.

Kathy

There is nothing special about the IP diet.

From the standpoint of the what you eat your body cannot tell the difference between whey protein in an IP packet and why protein from a tub bought at costco because whey protein is whey protein.

The set up of the diet is also nothing special. It is a PSMF diet. There are many such diets. Contrary to what some might believe the macro nutrient ratio on this diet is nothing special. Protein to fat ratio ideal? No. Furthermore there is very little customization for the individual on this diet. That is far from ideal.

The protocol is not special. There are phases which are merely reintroducing carbs into the equation with phase 4 being some rules designed to limit caloric intake. Rules not everyone can or should follow. (Or might want to follow)

The only thing that is special is that you pay so much to be on the diet and if you don't know what a PSMF diet it you'll buy into the marketing and because it is a PSMF diet you will lose weight fast. Compliance to the protocol is likely higher than the average diet because of these two factors. Belief is a powerful thing. I fully expect that a true believer will respond to me and tell me how I'm wrong with one of more of my statements above.

None of this means the IP diet doesn't work. It does work. Any PSMF diet works and works great if you follow it.

It just isn't unique or special. At the end of the day you're eating veggies, lean meats, and some pre-packaged low carb protein heavy foods. You're consuming 700-900 calories a day. You'll be in ketosis which for many improve mood and energy. Your body gets used to the lowered intake and hunger remains controlled at least for a while. You lose fat fast. Magic! :D

I lost the bulk of my weight following a similar diet called "Rapid Fat Loss" which in my opinion is superior in every way to the IP diet with one exception. The IP diet offers in person support which for many people is criticial to compliance.

There are certain conditions where the calories in/calories out mantra simply does not quite fit. Hypothyroidism is one and particularly subclinical HT is common in women above 40 yrs old and almost never acknowledged (or even recognized) by doctors. HT slows the metabolism sufficiently to make weight loss very hard to achieve.

Then, you can be insulin-resistant (at least doctors heard about this one, but likely never inquire WHY people are insulin-resistant). Leptin-resistance is the other condition and most doctors will have no clue about it or test for it. Many obese people are actually leptin-resistant. Weight loss may reverse these conditions. But in women, insulin/leptin influence sex-hormones and you may go into a negative feedback cycle that makes your body want to keep that fat a bit longer. PCOS may be another example for an interplay between hormonal systems that promote weight gain. Men are much less hormone-driven and also have a higher muscle mass. They may have less trouble loosing weight. Particularly, when compared to peri- or postmenopausal women.

Therefore, there may be cases where you may only be able to loose significantly on a low carb diet. I have tried various diets and I know I only loose efficiently when going low carb. I can loose on a high carb diet, but I have to lead a very active lifestyle. This is hard to do when you work on the computer.

Furthermore, I do think ketosis does favor fat loss to some extent. in my experience, if you already have trained muscles and you keep on training them during dieting, a ketogenic diet does maintain muscle mass well.

But IP is indeed nothing special. Medifast also works and so do other products that are low carb. Atkins may even be healthier long-term when calories are restricted to the same low amount. All these diets use ketosis to curb appetite. IP of course tries to sell their diet as "special science", but they really do not provide any evidence that they actively do any research. It is also untrue that you let your pancreas completely rest on this diet, since you will still produce insulin spikes after eating their product, just not to the same extent as you would on a cake/fries/pizza lifestyle. Indeed, a ketogenic diet may harm liver function over time. Ketosis is a stress response by your body to starvation and designed to improve survival. It may not be a good idea to live a very low carb lifestyle permanently. The science there is definitely lacking.

Finally, I consider IP prices as a bit of an insult to my intelligence, since other companies sell the exact same products in a different packaging system for 1/3 of the price. Without the humiliation by coaches. But I agree that many people will do better with accountability.

John: Yup. pretty succinct. I believe it is what I was "going for" in what I said, as well. You just took the explanation a little further.

The personal support kept me compliant for many months. Then the success did.

Agreed. No magic in the packets.

The only thing I'd add re: compliance: Sticking with a set of black & white rules worked very well for me, when plans with more gray areas gave me too many loopholes.

I would add one thing. I knew about the IP Diet a full 15 months before I started the IP Diet in late July 2013 (and had all the subsequent incredible success). I actually had a copy of the official Phase 1 sheet in April 2012 and thought to myself: "Shoot I don't need to buy the IP packets, I can do this on my own". Fifteen months later after trying it "on my own" I found myself 40 pounds heavier than where I started ... Mostly because I found that "on my own" I couldn't or wouldn't stick with it.

Sometimes we all just have to figure out what works for us and do that. Even if "logically" there is no reason why we couldn't do it on our own.

I had basically given up hope of ever losing weight again in the weeks before I officially started IP ... And about a week into the program, I knew this was the right diet plan for me. Ten weeks and fifty pounds later, look where I am now.

So I hear you about there being nothing "special" about the IP Diet. But for some of us out here (or me specifically at least), it saved our lives. (Because at 326 pounds, I was a heart-attack time bomb and already showing the early signs of congestive heart failure.)

So honestly I don't really care if it was the color green on the IP box that motivated me to stick with it ... or saying the matra "Ideal Protein" and clicking my red high heels together 3 times that got me here ... but I know for a fact that I could not have gotten to where I am today by trying to mimic IP "on my own" (As I had already tried that for 15 months).

Ultimately we all have to find what works for us. And for me this works.