Because BoB is based on SMART Recovery, originally developed for drug and alcohol addiction. For this reason programs like it and Overeaters Anonymous focus on "abstinence" from problematic behaviors rather than moderation or a harm reduction approach.

Ahh, I definitely would not compare Overeaters Anonymous to BoB in any way. I think Kathryn even calls out OA in her book for how much their philosophy didn't resonate with her.

OA actually places a lot of the control out of the individual. From what I've read they tell members that white sugar/carbs are to be abstained from because those "cause" binging (which is simply not true, I've been eating as many carbs/white sugar as I feel like). BoB has no sorts of food restraints whatsover. Also one of the principles is "We admit that we're powerless over food" /: And it's super drenched in religion, like relying on god to help them stop overeating. Which I guess is fine if you're religious but all in all the whole program doesn't seem to do much to empower the individual.

BoB only really focuses on avoiding binge eating - that specific behavior. Not avoiding any specific foods, and there is no prescribed diet plan to go off of or anything. Outside of binging, the individual is free to enjoy food however they feel is best. It's focus is only on recognizing the urges that lead to binging and learning to sit with them without giving them unnecessary significance or power. Then going back to your regular life once they pass.

I like to see the technique in BoB more as a skill one learns, then builds upon and gets better at as they go along, rather than merely an iron fist willpower-driven commitment to stop binging forever no matter what. I mean we've all done that at one point and as we've learned through experience it doesn't mean much on its own.

Sorry, I just wanted to make that distinction!

I think the perception that IE gives permission to binge eat stems from the fact that in IE there are valid explanations for binge eating. There are "reasons" for it besides just having an urge then giving in to that urge. The reasons could be emotional, situational, whatever. But because the individual is allowed valid reasons and explanations for their binge eating, it becomes rather easy to accomodate for. It's like, "well, I was feeling anxiety, so it makes sense that I binged. Well I haven't solved my stress issues yet, so of course I'd binge." With BoB there is never any valid reason for binge eating. You just felt the urge to do it, and so you gave in to that urge to get rid of the discomfort of the urge.

I guess the issue for people who go from IE to a more direct approach like BoB is because they feel like they already know how they're going to feel after a binge. I used to tell myself during my urges, "I'll feel so much better if I make good choices for my body!" but many, many times I would still binge because the monkey brain isn't logical. It won't be like "Oh yeah, you're right, let's not overeat/binge" and turn off the urges. No, most of the time it will still keep pumping out that adrenaline, trying to get you to give in. It's automatic and does not listen to reasoning. It's a machine.

I agree with the permission to eat junk food thing. For me, eating junk food, or any specific type of food, is no longer connected to binge eating. I don't have "trigger foods" anymore and I recognize that any food can get me from hungry to comfortably full so I don't really focus on specific foods, besides what I'm in the mood for when I get hungry (which is pretty often healthy food, surprisingly enough. That's one cool thing I learned from IE). For me, "neutralizing" junk food was one of the first steps for sure.

But past that I had to get to a point where binging was just not something that had any place in my life anymore. I didn't see binging as an opportunity to "learn more about myself"; the only thing I could really learn from binging is that I had an urge to binge, and then I gave in to it. (Also a big key with BoB is to not look at yourself as a "binge eater" - you don't want to identify with the behavior so closely. You want to remain as mentally separate from it as possible, because when the line between what you want and what "it" wants start to blur, that's when overcoming urges becomes unnecessarily difficult.)

Of course, as per BoB, it's incredibly helpful to try to look back and see what your mindstate was when you decided to binge and why you gave in to it - but not really in the context that IE recommends. BoB advises one to look at what they were doing mentally when the urge came up - Were you struggling/arguing with the urge? Were you resisting it instead of just letting it flow through you freely? Were you tricked into thinking it was truly you who wanted to binge, if so what thoughts caused that temporary blur?

This is pretty different from the take in IE where you analyze each binge to figure out what was missing in your life emotionally that "caused" the binge. Or the one you mentioned, where you look at the adverse effects of a certain way of eating, in hopes that you'll simply decide not to do it later because you remember how that felt. The latter is a good idea in theory and might work for less intense eating issues, but its simply not enough for some people in the context of actual binge eating. A lot of times the urge will persist regardless, and if you don't know how to sit with it without struggling, then a binge is often inevitable.

I don't have enough time to argue with you point by point. However, you have a very simplistic view of intuitive eating. On many of the points you're just plain wrong. Remember that there is no one way to eat intuitively. There are several different authors and health professionals who have written books on the subject, each with a slightly different take on the concept and methodology for helping with overeating. Of course it's easy to compare one woman's work (BoB) to a body of work that isn't cohesive.

Also understand that BoB was written specifically for people with eating disorders and not for people with different patterns of disordered eating who are not on the eating disorder spectrum. Of course IE isn't going to help someone with AN/BN/EDNOS/BED alone. Neither is BoB. They're each a single tool in the arsenal that it takes to overcome an ED. BoB helped me immensely in sorting out my disordered thoughts. Did I gain recovery through that book alone? **** no! In my program we've learned all sorts of different ways to deal with urges, including IE and some aspects of SMART recovery. I've also had to start taking drugs to help with depression and anxiety.

If you've been helped with BoB good for you. There are a lot of people who have. There are also many people with ED that aren't helped at all by it (I've talked personally to several). In the end you have to do what works for you. Coming in and trashing a method that is working for others here because you think you've figured it all out is really not helpful for those who are struggling and on a different path. I'm all for having good arguments but this is just getting silly.

So this is the part that makes sense to me. And I'm definitely inspecting these thoughts closely. I do recognize in myself that I am on a constant quest to aleviate my anxiety, to be "happy" and "not stressed out" and falling short because duh, stress is there. Furthermore, there is one aspect of IE that may totally embrace what you point out here which is to sit with one's feelings. I've talked to my NT a little bit about NT and the general idea is to allow the feelings to just be, don't try to control them, don't try to change them, and I think that idea really ties or at least I think it ties in with what you describe.

That said, I don't think it's beneficial to anyone here to do an IE vs BoB analysis. There is much to agree upon, mainly that diets do not work, food is not the enemy, and we are not food addicts. We can all agree that eating/binging is a behavioral issue. But let's not derail the IE thread, it's the only thread that the IEers have on the forum amidst the diet noise. It might be a good idea to start a BoB support thread similar to this one, I'll be sure to participate there without having to go into an IE vs Bob thing.

Oh, my apologies Locke & Palestrina! I wasn't trying to start an argument lol, I was just explaining my interpretation of some aspects of both methods and why I believe the principles in BoB might be more effective for some people in case IE isn't enough for them. Not necessarily trying to pit them against each other one on one, especially since I follow a lot of the principles of IE too so I'm definitely not trying to trash it altogether. Like you said, Locke, usually not one single thing will be the answer for everyone and it also depends on the persons own ED/dieting history. My approach is actually a slurry of both IE aspects and BoB aspects that seem to fit me & my history the best after lots of trial and error.

My take was that quite a few people doing IE were still struggling in some ways so I tried to point out why that might be, esp. since at one point I was still struggling despite thinking IE had all the answers. So anything I have to say about BoB is to help those who are having problems with IE and might benefit from it. DEFINITELY not to stop anyone who's doing a purely IE approach and its working smoothly for them. This isn't my cult or religion or anything, I'm not trying to coerce people to take my side just for the heck of it lol. Anyone who doesn't benefit from my posts is free to ignore them. But I'd be glad to help anyone who they do resonate with.

They do resonate with me, that's why I would really enjoy a bob thread.

I have read the BOB and the IE threads with much interest. I can see how they both have powerful uses but in my experience, BOB was useless without intuitive eating. I think its a great idea to make a separate BOB thread.

So, I have been working on my self image/ self esteem. I have been exercising and feeling really good about myself. My mom is visiting and we got into a discussion of a "strapping" woman she was friends with when I was little. Also talked about how they never thought she would get married because she was "strapping" and everyone was surprised when she did.

She said something like "you think YOU are strapping..." I said, " I think I am athletic. Tall and broad shouldered with muscle. " Because I am. And then she says that I look just like my aunt (who she always told me was voluptuous and she needed to be careful of her weight and I took after her so I needed to be careful of my weight. ) and then she goes on about how my aunt looked like the women in the paintings. (raphaelite) really white, soft and rounded.

It seriously felt like a kick in the gut. I am so healthy looking and feeling right now. Im not soft and rounded. I want to cry into a pan of brownies. But in reality I feel sick to my stomach. I know from past experience I won't eat until I am alone. :( I am almost a 40 year old woman and I need to get over caring what preconceived notions my mom has about how I look and my body. I can't believe it hurts this much. I really hope I do not unconsciously do this to my daughters.

Thanks for listening. I am just trying to cope with these old issues that sound pretty stupid typed out.

Eta: Just coming here and typing this out helped me feel better and see the issue as what it really is. I was able to get over it and enjoy my mom's visit. She loves me and she talks about how beautiful I am and how good I look today and I know she means it. It's crazy how she can't hear what comes out of her mouth regarding weight. I know she gets it from my grandma though. I remember when I visited her one summer and I guess I was going through a growth spurt as I ate quite a bit more than usual. I still remember her saying " We are going to have to roll you on to the plane". hah hah. Its amazing how these little comments can sting and last.

Pinkhippie it's good to see you here, you visit us so little lately :) I think we can all relate to the power of our Mother's words. After all she is our everything for most of our life growing up. We hang on her every word, she is the model we have for who we may be when we grow up. But part of growing up is learning now to separate our identity from our Mother. I have struggled with some of these same issues and I feel like I"m in a good place now with my mother where I can hear what she says without letting it affect me.

Getting there though required a great deal of compassion for her. Eventhough I would classify my Mother as an intuitive eater all her life and she's always been thin, fit and healthy, she is not immune to the diet mentality. In fact many intuitive eaters are susceptible to the diet mentality from what I see, they can't help it when every magazine lectures us about the best way to shed 10lbs by summer and the ideal beauty is constantly reinforced in the media. So be compassionate that our mothers fall prey the diet mentality, perhaps in a different manifestation than us.

For me it's important to call my Mother out on all the little remarks she makes. Truly I believe that women are conditioned to be critical of each other. We are pinned against eachother and the only way to stop it is if we step up and stop it. So for example if I hear my mother make a comment about any woman in our lives (aunt, cousin, friend) I stop it. She might say "wow, Mary gained a bunch of weight since last year" I immediately tell her "you don't know what she's going through, she hasn't committed a crime, let's not judge her. She's still beautiful and she was really there for you when you were going through a hard time last year." I always try to demonstrate compassion towards people and I believe it is contagious. I cannot tolerate gossip and body bashing of other people. I actually feel very empowered when I stand up for a woman.

Can you try doing something similar? Like when you hear your mother talking about your strapping aunt, can you put a stop to it and defend your aunt not only in appearance but in character? The more we talk about a person's character the more obvious it becomes that focusing on outer appearances is petty. Defending other women also gives you language to start defending yourself eventually so that you are not constantly being knocked down by these comments.

Hi Palestrina!

I often do read but don't comment. Sometimes I feel like I either have nothing to say or that what I say will be negative. I feel kind of boring just typing about how I eat when Im hungry. lol Thank you though.

Thank you for your thoughts about my mom and your understanding and empathy. My husband told me much the same and I know you are both right. I have a very hard time standing up to either parent really and setting boundaries. I have gotten better with my mom but when it comes to my physical appearance and those little slicy comments she makes I still am not there yet. I know that that is a priority and Im going to work on it. I have been so protective of my mom and my family in general I guess I tend to be the one that lays on the grenade for them, so to speak. I have a lifetime of conditioning to overcome but I am working on it. That is a great idea to start by speaking up for others. I know that would be easier for me to begin with. Still a big deal, but easier. I will do that next time a situation like that arises.

I am happy to say that I did not dive into a pan of brownies. I shared a giant homemade cookie with my husband and enjoyed every bite. Usually after I see my mom I become more of an eating machine, just nibbling bits of food here and there and that didn't happen this time. I think seriously just coming here and typing out how I was feeling while I was in the thick of feeling it helped a LOT. Yay for progress!

I have really been coming to a better place with exercise lately. I realized a little bit ago that exercise is self care and I have a REALLY hard time taking care of myself. Once I made that connection, something has clicked and I now take the time to exercise in some way almost every day. I enjoy exercise and I love taking care of myself in that way, I guess I just had a block because I have to put myself first and make my needs top priority to get the time to exercise and I am still working on that.

yesterday my husband and I rode 10 miles with the kids in the bike trailer and it was so awesome! I loved having the strength to do that and the ability to push myself more. I look forward to building even more strength and getting out there and seeing what else I can do. I know I couldn't have done that if I hadn't been exercising regularly and taking care of myself these past few weeks.

Wow. So much has happened since I last posted. I do want to say that IE has been the game changer for me.

I realize no one plan is for everyone, but IE is the one for me.

A separate BoB thread sounds like a great idea!

What is SMART recovery?

SMART is a recovery program that competes with AA.

http://www.smartrecovery.org/resourc...aboutsmart.htm

It's based on recognizing and fighting urges to engage in addict behavior as they arise.

Today I had a very stressful situation arise with a family member. It is ongoing, not sure where the end will be. Lots and lots of complex sad emotions. I felt pretty sick most of the day and didn't eat much. For dinner I ate a very small helping of the dinner I had made. Then I stopped and waited. I knew that what I really wanted was ice cream and cookies. After I got the kids in bed I made myself a big bowl of ice cream with a giant cookie and some chocolate sauce and I ate it and enjoyed every bite. I also ate a granola bar and I could tell I didn't really want it but I ate it anyway. Not sure why I did that. However. I feel pretty good. I didn't overeat. I don't feel guilty. my stomach doesn't hurt. I didn't switch into my usual mode of now that I ate THAT, I will eat all the things until I hurt and then eat more. It's amazing how long it takes to overcome that. I just wanted to share an IE victory of sorts. I can't tell you how good I feel all the way to my toes. Usually I just tried to not feel guilty but I really did which led to me eating more than my body needed. I still have my stressful situation with my family member and I really wanted ice cream but I didn't feel like I was emotionally eating so screw it, Im going to eat it all. Know what I mean? It was a very significant shift and Im excited about it. I hope someone understands, it sounds kind of silly typed out. I am re reading Beyond Chocolate and it is really helping.

Thanks for clarifying Locke. OA scares me.

Pinkhippie that doesn't sound silly at all. The work we do in IE is slow but when the pay off comes its big! So glad you're not bogged down in guilt.

Thanks Palestrina, it IS slow but the changes are life changing and lasting. It does take patience though, that is for sure. I have gotten to the point where I can hear what my body is saying, just have a hard time actually following what its telling me sometimes. It's strange how much I want to eat sometimes even when my body physically doesn't need it. Fortunately the less often that happens, the more noticeable it becomes when I do eat when Im not really hungry and I become more aware and can choose whether to eat or not.

Hi All,
I haven't caught up on this entire thread, but it is so great to know this is here! I'm signing on to 3FC again after 10+ years of OA work. I just got tired of the meetings, the feeling that I wasn't "working hard enough" etc etc.

I'm so tired of food and weight being central in my life! And I'm tired of regaining, which I have done since reintroducing all my restricted foods. It's confusing, but the concepts of EI for learning intuitive portioning resonate with me. I just wanna be normal here!

Glad you are here. Hope to become active on this board.

Welcome Georgette! It's great to see you here! IE for me has definitely been the key to "normal" eating.

So, I still have this thing going on with my family member. I am still super tense, super anxious, and I feel like my heart is racing and I want to jump out of my skin. I can't stop thinking about all the things surrounding it and I just want to feel ok and for these feelings to go away. I realized that in the past, this would be PRIME eating time. If I ate, these feelings would go away. I would start focusing on the food, and how it made me feel, and if I should eat that, and in the past, maybe another diet to go on. But today, I am not eating. I COULD eat but I don't want to. Im not hungry and all that cookie sugar yesterday was too much for me. Today I have eaten nothing but protein type stuff because I haven't wanted anything grainy or sweet. Anyway, what can I fill the hole with? How can I feel better? It's interesting to realize what power food has had to help me. wow. I just want to get out of my head for a little bit. meditating kind of seems to do the opposite for me and makes my heart race even more. I have a call in to my closest friend but she is busy and probably can't talk until Sunday. I have talked to my husband a LOT but it doesn't make this feeling go away. Oh well, if nothing else this is a great learning experience.

Pinkhippie, have you tried sitting with this feeling and trying to feel it as intensely as possible? I've been having good luck doing this, experiencing the feeling like a wave washing over me. Sit at the edge of the water and don't fight the wave, let it consume you entirely and embrace it out of curiosity rather than fear. Don't try to control it.

I'm reading "Eating by the Light of the Moon" right now and trying to take this message in. I'm realizing that my feelings are not something to be afraid of, they come and go and can't be controlled, only our actions can be controlled but not our feelings. The only thing our feelings demand of us is to be felt.

Yikes to be honest Palestrina that sounds TERRIFYING. So, that probably means its something I need to do. I have been an emotion supressor my whole life, its how I survived my very dysfunctional childhood. I have been working hard on getting better about feeling emotions but I guess I still regard them as something scary and something I want to go away. I will try this. I also am going to check out eating by the light of the moon. I think my library has it. Thanks. :)

Something else I've been thinking about is "talking out" my feelings. Like you I talk to my husband, I talk to my friends, therapist, whoever will listen. And it doesn't work, it doesn't seem to come out and go away. You'd think that by talking it out we'd get through it but I'm realizing it doesn't work this way.

Talking about our feelings with others doesn't mean we're actually feeling our feelings. We're emoting for sure, but not for our own sake. Instead I think we're trying to get others to validate our feelings, get them on our side, we're painting a picture for them. It's a song and a dance and it's very different from just feeling our feelings.

So I'm trying very hard to just feel my feelings and being aware all the while that feelings are not permanent. They come and go and I shouldn't try to control them or change them.

Well, I did it. Its funny, I had a hard time actually FEELING my emotions once I focused on them. It really helped to visualize my feelings as the ocean, rolling toward me in waves. When I did that, I was able to get in touch with my feelings and discover much to my shock that the anxiety feeling is actually masking a deep anger. I am MAD. I am so mad. That is the hardest emotion I have to feel for some reason. I am always trying to deny my anger. I know in the past I have definitely tried to eat my anger away. Anyway. Thanks very much for that Palestrina. That was so helpful and Im going to continue to do that. It also wasn't as scary as I thought it would be. I thought my feelings would be so terrible they would suck me under in paroxysms of anxiety and dread. But, thats not what happened. It was actually pretty amazing. Wow.

Yes absolutely. This really resonates with me. Especially when I talk to my husband, I feel like I am trying to justify my feelings so he will understand me.

In fact, until I pictured my feelings as the ocean, I noticed I kept just trying to do the same thing to myself. Emote the feelings, label them, anything but FEEL them.

I've decided to take a dance class. I need to get in touch with my body in a primal way and there is.l no better way to do that than dancing.

What's funny is that I've been looking for a class to take and been focusing on finding a meditation class. I have so much stress in my life and I need to be able to defuse. Well I was talking to one of my BFF about this and she rolled her eyes at me. She said "do you really need more inner peace stuff? You see and osteopath, a nutritional therapist, an acupuncturist, you do tai chi and now you're going to go to meditation class??? Why don't you do something FUN instead?"
I took that to heart, she's right. Enough with the self improvement already, time to live!

That sounds awesome Palestrina, what kind of dance are you thinking about?

Hip hop. Don't ask me why. I'm as white as you can get, I only listen to classical music and my idea of fun is spending the afternoon taking in a lecture and visiting the museum. But I've always wanted to know how to breakdance lol.

I'm experiencing something similar.

I have three sisters. One has remained thin. The rest of us are fat. One diets and doesn't really talk about it.

The one that's throwing me off is the sister who has hired a personal trainer and is hardcore dieting. She's done this in the past, but has fallen off each time. This time she's very serious, and is making tons of progress at losing. She's already down a size and doesn't show signs of slowing down yet.

As for me, I'm the biggest sister at this point, and have been for several years.

Over the last couple of years, I've managed to take off 22 pounds by doing my own thing, not dieting, walking a lot, etc., but I still have a LONG way to go.

Now that my sister is making so much progress, I feel like a failure and I feel like I'm being left far, far behind.

I'm regaining pounds now, and I know that most of it is due to the pressure I feel from the hardcore dieting sister. She's on My Fitness Pal, so I went back over there and began tracking too--but all that does is make me want to eat.

I feel pressured because my three sisters are going to be at "normal" weights soon, and here I'll be, still nearly 100 pounds from being a decent size myself.

It makes me feel even more that the pounds I've lost are just a drop in the bucket, and why bother, when I'm just going to end up being the biggest one anyway?

This morning I decided that I have to go back to doing it my way. I'm putting away my scale, staying away from My Fitness Pal, and will work at not letting what my sister does put the pressure on me.

That is easier said than done, but I have to do it or I'm going to end up regaining what I've lost and most likely adding more besides. :(

Hope you all don't mind me just jumping in here!

Palestrina, I hope you like your dance class. Hip Hop is super high-impact usually, but could be really fun too. I personally love Zumba classes. It's not my personal heritage, but I really love latin rhythms like salsa and regeton. I hadn't taken a class in about 9 months, but I just signed up for a once-a-week class.

Re: comparing ourselves to the efforts of others...that's so sticky, and I've found it in many areas of my life. I know I do much less of this when I'm not so self-focused. I'm a lot more than my weight, but I forget that and return to being food and weight obsessed so quickly!

Have any of you done CBT or DBT work around food and weight? I got a DIY DBT book from the library lately called "end emotional eating". I'm a binger and the idea is to break that binge cycle through awareness and acceptance of uncomfortable feelings. Bleh, easier said than done!

A bit about me: Have PCOS, spent 10+ years in OA, in and out, with a 60 lb loss. But annoyed at having to keep going to meetings etc. Have been at a "normal" weight since 2006-ish. OA's method of avoiding all binge foods (for me, included sugar and cheese) worked very well, though I would still overeat, but I got tired of all the meetings and avoiding whole groups of foods. I reintroduced all my "binge" foods a few times, and started working on ideas of IE in Jan 2015. Currently 20 lbs up from my lowest weight (no sugar and breastfeeding weight in 2009 :) )

198/158.5/150 (dream weight 140)

I got a lot of candy from my parents for Easter. Part of me wants to hold onto it and eat it in small amounts over time. Another part of me wants to put it out to share with my coworkers so I can be rid of it and not tempted to binge. I set it out this morning early and was overwhelmed with sadness. I felt like I was rejecting my mom's love by not eating it. I know this is irrational, but it made me start to tear up.

You're not rejecting your mom's love, you're spreading the love! It's the thought that counts! My inlaws give us tons of candy, chocolate, sweets and food every week. Almost all of it goes in the bin, we can't eat it and if we keep it around my 3 yr old can't stop eating it. Of course we appreciate the gesture but it's not something we need, is there a way to ask your non for something you actually need and tell her not to bother with the candy? I've tried to do that with my inlaws but they're not the type to listen to us.

Locke, isn't that interesting how attached we become to the meanings of love behind others feeding us? For me, also the sentimentality of certain foods gets me. I remember eating this when... I guess it's good to sit with those feelings and feel them.

I also got a bunch of candy for Easter, and I haven't given it all away, but I'm handing it out to visitors as they come by.

Haven't posted in a while. About the time I started gaining weight, my Daddy made little remarks like "you've put on a little weight". At the time, my favorite food was chips. When my sister closest to my age and I were growing up, we were always given exactly what we were pretty much expected to eat. I remember us begging Daddy at times to stop and get us a certain food, but he would make excused. I remember one time when my baby sister was little, he gave her and my cousin who was about her age "maybe 4 or 5 yrs old" a huge bag of potato chips each to carry around and just eat by themselves. I remember thinking that he loved her more than me. Strange that I would think that, but he and I never got a long at all until after Mama passed away. She would try to get us to talk whatever and we didn't know what to say. I associated his love for me with food and my weight and I never felt good enough for him.

There was a lot of things like him being gone during the war while I was born and when he came home I didn't know who he as and he didn't know how to relate to me and I had lived with my Mama and her family and with all he was going through to adjust to home and a family, we butted heads from day one because I just thought he was mean and he yelled at me all the time.

Now we are good friends and I've learned that he was hurt because he felt I never accepted and loved him. He felt the exact way about me that I felt about him. It is so sad that we couldn't have set down and talked when I was younger. He didn't know what to do and neither did I. We lost so much. Funny thing is that my sister #2 feels the same way I do and has a weight problem worse than mine. And our baby sister doesn't come around any more because I think she has gained some weight and she can't be "Daddy's perfect" little girl any more.

I don't look at potato chips or candy (was Mama's way of loving us) the same way any more. I love the Easter peeps. Bought one package the 1st week Wamart had them and yes I ate the whole package myself. I bought our 21 yr old a chocolate chic for Easter, put it up and forgot it until Saturday morning when I gave it to him on my way out to beauty shop. Funny thing is when I went to Walmart, I passed all the Easter goodies display and I remember thinking "I'm not even tempted with any of that. I have no desire for any of it at all".

Will I be able to do that next time I pass candy? I don't know. I hope so, but for now I'm just glad for one moment when it did not bother me at all.

It would be good if we could always figure out why we associate love with food. I think we are taught it.

Sorry this is long, but let me share something that happened yesterday. When I got to church yesterday morning, I saw a college friend of DGS was there. I approached her to let her know she could sit with us if she liked as he was part of the service team and would be working screens. She told me that she and DGS had gone to Easter Sunrise services at 7 am at another church. I mentioned that I was surprised she could get him up to be anywhere at 7 in the morning as he has missed a lot of his 8 am classes this semester. She said to me "Oh, there was food involved or he probably wouldn't have gone. They served breakfast after the service". When I mentioned it to him later, he said she was right. We associate food with so many occasions where we feel loved and accepted. Then we teach our children the same thing. I remember learning as a young girl that the way to a man's heart was through his stomach. So we learned to cook.

When I married my husband and raised 3 children, I was thin like most of us, but I loved my husband and children by cooking good meals and sweets were always involved because that was how I was taught. Guess who gained weight... me first and then 2 of my children and 2 of my grandchildren. So, so sad. I just thought that was what I was supposed to do because everyone did it. We didn't know any better.

That sounds like a lot of fun! :)

Its true that food really can feel like love. I guess because food does actually nourish us and nurture us too. So, its only natural that when someone wants to show us love, one way would be to try to nourish us. I know that that is a hard line to balance with my own kids sometimes.

So, Im sitll going through my annoying stuff with my family member. I have definitely been running the gamut of emotions and today Im feeling depressed and anxious. I also feel sad because I lost my biggest tool in my toolbox to feel better. Food. I know that it is good, yet its hard too. Food used to be guaranteed to make me feel better. Every single time. And now, if Im not hungry, food is just no longer pleasurable. Yesterday I saw my dad and his wife for the first time in a couple of months. They could not stop going on about how I had " slimmed down" and how great i looked. ( I have lost about 7 pounds) I know they meant well, they even tried to be aware and said that it didn't mean I didn't look great before, and that I looked great at any size... ) But yeah it automatically put the pressure on in my typical pattern food relationship head.

I noticed last night that I kept trying to eat when I wasn't hungry but it felt bad. I think that I am so used to eating mostly only when my stomach is empty that I really feel it when I try to eat when its full. But I thought I felt hungry. Finally after trying to eat a snack that really was just not hitting the spot because I wasn't really hungry, I tuned in and realized my body was not physically hungry, only my head was. I recognized that even though I didn't want to feel anxious about whats going on in my life and the weight loss comments, that I WAS. I have this thing where if I don't like the emotion or I don't feel like I should have it, I try to pretend that I feel differently, or that I am not bothered. Even to myself. Once I recognized my emotions, the head hunger went away and I was able to feel how physically stuffed I really was. Head/ emotion hunger whatever you want to call it is amazingly powerful. It really can override what your body is telling you. Anyway, I notice today I haven't really been hungry and I assume its because I ate so much more than my body really needed yesterday. I think if we listen to our body, it will naturally keep us in balance.

Pinkhippie You hit a nerve. I notice that when I lose enough weight that people start telling how great I look that it makes me feel good at the moment, but soon fizzles. And for some reason that I cannot put my finger on at this moment, I end up going off plan and put on some of the weight back on. For some reason, it causes me to lose it. I do remember wondering some time... does that mean I didn't look so great before? I'm still the same person I was with the weight. I remember hearing people saying to me when I was younger "You have a pretty face, if you were thin, you would be beautiful". I really hated that one. I think people just don't realize what they are "really" saying and how it makes us feel.

I'm going to have to figure out why it hits a nerve so bad as to cause me to get off plan. I really do need to get this part of my life under control.

Trish, I too feel very uncomfortable when people comment on my weight loss. It's very personal to me, and feels like an inappropriate thing to comment on without some kind of permission. I would usually handle it by getting even MORE personal, out of spite and an attempt to answer the real question of "how I did it". I never really felt great about how I handled it.

On the opposite end, now that I have regained, I find myself bringing that up to people, who invariably tell me "you look great, I hadn't noticed". Which doesn't bother me! Weird stuff.

@Pinkhippie

I totally get what you're saying about being head hungry. I think when you've struggled with your weight or don't like your body it's hard to be present with it all the time. I find exercise really helps me be in tune with my body. Starting the day with a gentle walk is all it takes for me to really be present with myself.

@Georgette and Patty

Yes, it's really hard for me to hear about how "great" I'm looking. I've lost weight through restrictive dieting and purging. When people tell me I'm doing great it's like "no, no I'm not. I feel like utter sh$t right now". It is really triggering.


I've been trying to eat according to the meal plan that my dietitian has given me as part of my eating disorder program. Honestly, I'm done with it. It's really triggering for me to try to eat on a plan. It just ends up leading to restriction every time. So I'm eating intuitively. It's so great. My plan had me eating three meals and three snacks a day. My body doesn't want to eat that often! I ate two meals yesterday- lunch and a later dinner. I feel so much better. I'm eating a lot of junk food because I've been craving it trying to eat healthy "balanced" meals. I'm sure I'll swing back to eating in a more health-supportive pattern once my body recognizes I'm now eating freely.

It's good to be back, ladies! I was put on prozac three weeks ago for anxiety. It made my anxiety and depression worse, and I started having suicidal thoughts. So now I'm off the pills. I don't think I'm going to go back on meds. I'd rather be nervous than have all those side effects.

P.S.- I shared my candy with the rest of the office and enjoyed a few pieces myself. Thanks for the support everyone! :)

Hi, I've been reading through these boards for a long time. I love them. I just made a membership. First off, I'd like to say, that all of you are very inspiring to me. At 20 years old, for the past 5 years or so I have been battling a OCD type calorie-counting binge-eating disorder.

I swore up and down that I was crazy, there was something wrong with me. All of my friends, everyone on Myfitnesspal could count calories no big deal. Then, here I am, logging and tracking perfectly up until lunch, dinner... Heck, sometimes I would even give up before having my breakfast.

The funny part is, I was never too restrictive. The most I restricted too was 1300, in the very beginning of my journey at about 16 years old. Never did I have anorexic type tendencies, or bulimic either. Any type of restriction, or diet mentality, however, sent me completely over the edge. I can remember the very first time I began dieting,

I was 15 years old. It was a great day, I ate healthy, I put myself in the 'no junk food you pig' type thought process. That very night, for some reason, never did it before, I went in the kitchen and ate a gigantic bowl of frosted flakes. No, not a gigantic bowl. I ate the whole box. I was so confused. Downward spiral from then on. Now, instead of having the box of cereal, it has gotten 10 times worse because once I realize I'll just *start my strict counting* tomorrow, I end up going out and spending money on things I plan to swallow whole for that evening.

This needs to stop, I refuse to give into this monster for the rest of my life. I find it amazing that I use to be so comfortable in my own skin, I use to be so happy. I ate what I wanted, when I wanted. I never felt the need to overeat. I can't even remember what came over me... It must have just been media, pressure, boys, no idea.

I actually don't have the book Intuitive Eating, but I did read Josie Spinardi's book and I loved it. If anyone can recommend a book, is Intuitive Eating worth the purchase? Happy to say that I deleted all of my calorie counting apps off of my phone and out of my life. Sorry for the rant! I have never spoke like this anywhere else to anyone, it has been my, how you say, dirty little secret. Lol.

@Locke, I'm so sorry to hear that, although medication helps many people it's not the right answer for everyone. It seems like you're at the point of rebeling against the meal plan. Just hang in there with IE and stay true to yourself. I can't help but think that we all get into trouble when we come down hard on ourselves. We must always remember to be our biggest cheerleader so don't forget to be kind to yourself and say the things that you need to hear!

Onelittlecreation, welcome to the forum. You're right that this is a monster. We don't cause it on ourselves alone, society and diet culture has a lot to do with it but it is indeed a formidable monster! Good for you not to feed into it, I wish I would have known about IE when I was 20.

I know exactly how you feel because I feel this way myself. But it has to be said that the prediction that your sisters will be normal weights soon is not necessarily true. It may be or it may not be. What's important here is that this is a prediction you are using to fuel how badly you feel for yourself. In my heart of hearts I know that nobody is looking at all of you and comparing who's losing what. Only you are doing that and by doing so you're only hurting yourself. Don't use this bit of info (that may or may not be true) as ammunition against your own self.

I had a family function this weekend and my slimming family member was there. I was nervous because I've gained a few stress pounds this month and was wallowing in self pity. But you know what, I pulled myself together and had a blast with my friends and family. Sure, I've been thinner and I've been fatter but the people who love me love me for who I am and I showed up! I spent the whole day laughing, eating, catching up and spending quality time with my people. I felt body stress leading up to the event but when the time came I was able to let it go.

I don't know what DBT is but I have read the Beck Diet Solution. Although ultimately the diet fell apart for me (as all diets do), I liked a lot of things about it. I liked the daily assignments and writing exercises. It was also the first time I realized that there was a difference between me and normal eaters and gave me my first glimpse of what I needed to do to become a normal eater.

Welcome. OA is very difficult. In my opinion from what I see it keeps people in a victim role and food as an enemy. But we all need support and I'm glad it worked for you while it did.

Because food is the first way we are loved. When we are babies we have very few needs and the primary need is to be fed. We cry, then we're fed. It goes on like that for a long time. Our whole childhood is about being fed if you think about it.

THIS is what restriction does:

So some of you know that I had some acid reflux issues that have gone on for many months. I had to change my diet a lot, I quit coffee for 6 months, stopped eating tomatoes, lemons, seltzer, spicy foods, eating after 7pm, etc. It's been a huge ordeal and very disruptive to my life in general. Well, I'm starting to feel a lot better now and have been able to incorporate some of these foods into my diet again. Lately I've added coffee back into my mornings.

So my relationship with coffee used to be very simple. For over 15yrs my habit has been one cup of coffee per day, in the morning. It was a super satisfying experience. I never craved coffee, I never thought about coffee, I never indulged in coffee at other times of day.

But now, after several months of restriction there is not enough coffee in the world to satisfy me. I have 2 cups in the morning now and I think about coffee during the day. I still have to limit my coffee, can't have a lot but 2 cups is really pushing it for me. How did I go from a one-cup-a-day girl to salivating over coffee all day long and feeling intense compulsion to drink coffee when I walk past a coffee shop?

RESTRICTION