3 Fat Chicks on a Diet Weight Loss Community

3 Fat Chicks on a Diet Weight Loss Community (https://www.3fatchicks.com/forum/)
-   Chicks in Control (https://www.3fatchicks.com/forum/chicks-control-64/)
-   -   Hungry All the Time (Not Just When Dietting) (https://www.3fatchicks.com/forum/chicks-control/299147-hungry-all-time-not-just-when-dietting.html)

tefrey 09-10-2014 10:23 AM

Hungry All the Time (Not Just When Dietting)
 
Hey everyone!

Last year I lost over 60 pounds and was a frequent contributor to this group. The loss stalled out in December and I switched my focus to exercise (mostly running). I was able to maintain for a while, but my weight started inching up, then skyrocketting up. I have now regained 30 pounds.

The reason? I'm always hungry. Always always always. I just had a yogurt and fiber one for breakfast 30 minutes ago and my tummy is already growling.

This is not emotional eating. If anything, it feels like my body has decided it needs to get back to 233 pounds as fast as possible.

I have been trying desperately to stop the starvation feelings for months and nothing works. Does anyone have any ideas?

nonameslob 09-10-2014 10:26 AM

Are you on any sort of medication? Change in medication? Change in what types of food you're eating?

tefrey 09-10-2014 10:29 AM

No change in medication. Food has changed ... but as a result of being hungry. I could eat the way I did when I was dieting easily ... it's just that my body is demanding all sorts of high calorie stuff ... and I cave, which of course makes the cravings worse.

mars735 09-10-2014 11:36 AM

Hi tefrey,
That sounds so frustrating! I think you are on the right track, ie, your body is probably reacting to the earlier calorie restriction. There are a lot of different viewpoints about this phenomenon, which is all too common among us dieters. Here are some suggestions fwiw, based on what i experienced after phasing off low cal/low carb/low fat:
1)For the moment, just try to hold the line with your weight while you figure things out. Avoid trying to white knuckle it and re-lose the weight--just for the moment.
2) Feed yourself with whole foods that you like. There is a website that helps to figure out your caloric needs or TDEE (I think that's total daily energy expenditure).

Are you by any chance undereating, then overeating in response to that and then frantically trying to get back"in control" and make up for it by undereating again? This was me for much of the past year. Once I looked at my TDEE, I realized I was undereating, even in maintenance. It freaked me out to eat 1300-1500 cal/day (and still does). But I no longer have the overwhelming urge to binge and eat calorie dense junk food lately.

As someone who is almost always hungry 24/7 both before and after dieting, I find that lower carb works best--for me that 40-70g. Protein is most effective for stemming hunger, for me, and I make sure to get in some healthy fats. I avoid nuts though, because it's too hard to control the amount.

If you feel like posting your weight loss WOE and afterward WOE, maybe we can add some suggestions. :)

Palestrina 09-10-2014 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tefrey (Post 5067929)
This is not emotional eating. If anything, it feels like my body has decided it needs to get back to 233 pounds as fast as possible.

This exact thing is happening to me right now!

You may think this is not emotional eating but it is, in a certain way. Unless there is a health or medication issue there is no reason that your body would suddenly decide that it needs to get back up to 233 asap without a good reason. Chances are that the diet that "worked" was a little restrictive. Maybe you suppressed your hunger often, maybe you constantly chose "good" foods over the foods you really wanted to eat, maybe you deprived yourself of too many things, maybe you relied a lot on will power to get you through that diet. The problem with diets is that they work - they'll get the weight off. But they also don't keep the weight off, restriction never does. You're in the throws of a yoyo right now. Being on a diet means tuning out your body's needs. If you deny your body what it asks of you for too long it starts to rebel, hence the perceived decision that it needs to gain the weight back asap.

With intuitive eating I've learned that all the restricting I was doing over the years is what really contributed to my weight gain, just in the way you describe. So now I spend my time repairing my body image, maintaining a neutral relationship with food (no more good food vs. bad food), and building a better communication with my body's natural hunger signals. In diet-terms this means that I eat anything I want, whenever I want it. But I only eat when I'm hungry, stop when I' full, and I am satisfied with small portions.

I've managed to lose 19lbs since Feb this way. Sometimes stress, anxiety and pressure can build and I can start to fall into old binge patterns again. I avoided the scale for 6wks and when I got back on recently I saw that I had lost 9lbs! Well that made me really nervous and anxious to keep it off and keep losing and all that pressure and stress made me start binging! It's like you say, it's a weird sense that my body wants to gain those 9lbs back as soon as possible! That's emotional my friend, it's not real hunger.

mars735 09-10-2014 11:42 AM

Here is a link to a TDEE calculator.
http://www.fat2fittools.com/tools/bmr/

If 3FC deletes external link, you can google TDEE. I like the fat 2 fit website--very use friendly. Good luck!

tefrey 09-10-2014 12:27 PM

You guys are absolutely right! I was restricting my calories too much. But that's why I took a break in December ... I thought if I switched to maintenance I could reset. But over time the cravings have gotten worse, not better. I thought maybe I was overexercising, but easing back on the exercise didn't help either.

I have done this before (most dieters have I think) and I struggle and regain until I can find a shock to the system big enough to make me start losing again. Last time it was a diagnosis of pre-diabetes. I don't want to have to get back to my old weight or more before I regain control. I want control NOW.

So I've always relied on something big and sudden to launch weight loss. When I try to be more casual, I seem to lose focus after one meal. So clearly, I'm not doing something right. I thought it was a lack of will power, but maybe I'm trying to be too restrictive.

The diet that has worked best for me is the iDiet ... it's balanced so nothing is completely off limits. I start off good, following it to the letter, then I start cutting out more and more calories.

mars735: According to the calculator, I need to be eating 1500-1600 calories ... and possibly up to 2000 based on the exercise I am doing. Yowza!

WannaBeSkinny: I've heard about Intuitive Eating but I don't know how to go about it. Where do you suggest I go to learn more?

Thanks so much for your help!

mars735 09-10-2014 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tefrey (Post 5068021)
I have done this before (most dieters have I think) and I struggle and regain until I can find a shock to the system big enough to make me start losing again. Last time it was a diagnosis of pre-diabetes. I don't want to have to get back to my old weight or more before I regain control. I want control NOW.

So I've always relied on something big and sudden to launch weight loss. When I try to be more casual, I seem to lose focus after one meal. So clearly, I'm not doing something right. I thought it was a lack of will power, but maybe I'm trying to be too restrictive.

The diet that has worked best for me is the iDiet ... it's balanced so nothing is completely off limits. I start off good, following it to the letter, then I start cutting out more and more calories.

mars735: According to the calculator, I need to be eating 1500-1600 calories ... and possibly up to 2000 based on the exercise I am doing. Yowza!

I think you have control--you had to to have lost the weight. I'm like you with the diet approach in that I need some structure, and maybe you do too. just try to keep in mind that your method needs to keep you fed well enough to avoid this phenomenon of bingeing--some call it the Famine Reaction and there are other names for it. It's probably a neuro/hormonal mediated survival response to perceived starvation.

Isn't that TDEE eye-opening? :) I'm still playing around with it to figure out where I fit. Right now, I'm gonna guess that your body and hunger will tell you if you are on the too low side, so maybe pick a middle ground and work from there. If you can hold the line at your current weight, things will stabilize and then you can take it down again. Remember that losing just 10% of your weight gives a big health benefit in terms of diabetes and hypertension--you've accomplished that so maybe you don't have to feel the over riding urgency to lose as fast as possible.

Just know you are experiencing something apparently hard-wired into our brains, not that you lack will power or have some sort of pathological flaw. There's good literature on this at Overeaters Anonymous, not sure if it's on their website or if you have to go. Also Brain Over Binge describes it, and The Don't Go Hungry Diet, both very readable.

ReNew Me 09-10-2014 01:06 PM

I've noticed that high GI carbs play a HUGE factor in my appetite. I can eat exactly the same calories for two meals but if one meal features the wrong type of fuel (heavily weighted in carbs and sugars, even if they're unrefined carbs and healthy sugars, like in fruit) I will be famished very, very fast. If I do this for breakfast I'll have problems with my appetite all day long.

If I have a breakfast heavy with good fats and protein I'll stay satiated for a long time and it will also have a positive influence throughout the rest of the day.

I've actually had this problem my entire life, it's only been the past few years I recognized the pattern. I remember as a child in elementary school I would be so terribly hungry when breakfast consisted of cold cereal, even healthy cereals. It was just this gnawing hollowness. I was actually happy when my mother stopped making me eat breakfast and let me just have coffee! No breakfast left me with less hunger and more importantly, a manageable hunger! (believe it or not) Part of this, I believe, is because I have mild (then undiagnosed) gluten intolerance that causes heartburn, but the rest is absolutely the sugar spike from high GI foods.

Palestrina 09-10-2014 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tefrey (Post 5068021)
So I've always relied on something big and sudden to launch weight loss. When I try to be more casual, I seem to lose focus after one meal. So clearly, I'm not doing something right. I thought it was a lack of will power, but maybe I'm trying to be too restrictive.


WannaBeSkinny: I've heard about Intuitive Eating but I don't know how to go about it. Where do you suggest I go to learn more?

The problem with big and sudden is that life is rather mundane. Breakfast lunch and dinner happen every day no matter what big sudden things are happening. We can't build up every meal to be monumentous, nobody gains weight by eating one big meal, and nobody loses weight by eating one salad. It's how you approach food on a daily MUNDANE basis that counts in the long run.

A good introduction to the concept of IE is by reading the Overfed Head. It's a quick read. You can gain more understanding of how your inner rebel works by reading Intuitive Eating by Evelyn Tribole. You can always visit the IE forum here on 3FC. A really good intro if you want some info in the next few minutes is to watch great videos by Josie Spinardi like this one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQFR7Qu_2QM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mars735 (Post 5068030)
I think you have control--you had to to have lost the weight. I'm like you with the diet approach in that I need some structure, and maybe you do too. just try to keep in mind that your method needs to keep you fed well enough to avoid this phenomenon of bingeing--some call it the Famine Reaction and there are other names for it. It's probably a neuro/hormonal mediated survival response to perceived starvation.

Just know you are experiencing something apparently hard-wired into our brains, not that you lack will power or have some sort of pathological flaw.

In IE it's called the Inner Rebel. It's often described as a bow and arrow effect. The tauter you pull the bow the faster and further the arrow will go when you release it. In diet terms the diet serves as the bow, and the inner rebel serves as the arrow. The tauter and more restrictive your diet is the more fierce your inner rebel will react.

Agreed, there is nothing inherently wrong with us, this is a normal response to over restriction.

apo9 09-10-2014 03:42 PM

I agree with Mars advice.Sometimes in the beginning you have to absolutely measure everything and count calories and white knuckle it through the hungry bits.I timed my meals and if I was hungry at 10am,I drank more water and waited till 12 to eat.I did not eat till 5 or 6pm and drank lots of water.After a while the signal seems to get weaker and I think the fasts between meals kept the insulin from stimulating my appetite.
I am now able to hold off my hunger till my time to eat.In the very beginning I drank 1 scoop whey protein powder in water to ward off a few hunger pangs or hold me till the next meal.
You can do it...its a matter of measuring and timing,but you really have to want it.Good luck

tefrey 09-10-2014 07:04 PM

Thanks everyone!

I had a huge breakthrough today. I went to enter my morning food into 'My Fitness Pal' and realized that all that time I was doing 'maintenance' my target calories were still 1200. I was setting myself up for failure right there!!!!

No wonder I gave up logging my meals before lunch. A little extra food at my breakfasts (I run in the morning so I end up eating twice before 9 am) and all of a sudden there's nothing left for dinner!

I hate the idea of carefully upping my calories but it's definitely one thing I haven't tried. And the more I think about it, the more it makes sense. I'm still hungry today, but I haven't overeaten.

mars735 09-10-2014 07:45 PM

Sounds like you're figuring it out tefrey! It's so counterintuitive to work on getting enough nutrition rather than just restricting it. I was overweight ost of my 61 yrs so i really had no clue what was the right amount to eat. Our culture tells us eating less means we're more feminine, better character, you name it. You may find it takes practice and patience to eat enough. I lost weight on Ideal Protein, about 900 cal and have a persistent tendency to try to keep it under 1100 on maintenance. Might as well wave a flag saying Binge if I do that!

mars735 09-10-2014 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ReNew Me (Post 5068041)
I've noticed that high GI carbs play a HUGE factor in my appetite. I can eat exactly the same calories for two meals but if one meal features the wrong type of fuel (heavily weighted in carbs and sugars, even if they're unrefined carbs and healthy sugars, like in fruit) I will be famished very, very fast. If I do this for breakfast I'll have problems with my appetite all day long.

If I have a breakfast heavy with good fats and protein I'll stay satiated for a long time and it will also have a positive influence throughout the rest of the day.

I've actually had this problem my entire life, it's only been the past few years I recognized the pattern. I remember as a child in elementary school I would be so terribly hungry when breakfast consisted of cold cereal, even healthy cereals. It was just this gnawing hollowness. I was actually happy when my mother stopped making me eat breakfast and let me just have coffee! No breakfast left me with less hunger and more importantly, a manageable hunger! (believe it or not)

Hope I'm not hijacking the thread but this is so ME!!! If not for my work schedule, I would eat my first meal at 10 am and it would be an Israeli-style brunch with lots of veggies and HB eggs.

girl81 09-10-2014 11:58 PM

I always gain weight when I switch from walking to running. Have you tried walking?

Palestrina 09-11-2014 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apo9 (Post 5068132)
You can do it...its a matter of measuring and timing,but you really have to want it.

This well-intended bit of advice that pops up can be very disheartening for most of the people who fail on their diet. Does failing mean they didn't really want it to begin with? Does it mean they didn't try hard enough? Does it mean that they possibly don't deserve it? What exactly does "you really have to want it" mean if someone should by chance regain?

apo9 09-11-2014 09:46 AM

That "you really have to want it "comment was not meant quite as it sounded.It is more like an in the moment decision.During the urge what do I want more...to remain fat or lose weight..Of course it was not meant to imply that one does not try hard enough,

Palestrina 09-11-2014 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apo9 (Post 5068413)
That "you really have to want it "comment was not meant quite as it sounded.It is more like an in the moment decision.During the urge what do I want more...to remain fat or lose weight..Of course it was not meant to imply that one does not try hard enough,

When you give in to an urge does it mean you want to remain fat?

All I'm saying is that nobody wants to be fat, everyone is motivated, white knuckling does not work all the time and usually backfires, and that there is more at play here than simply wanting it enough. We all want it, we all want good things for ourselves, but sometimes a compulsion takes over that is hard to control. Do I want to remain fat or do I want to lose weight is an unfair question to ask oneself. We don't eat so that we get fat, we eat for comfort/habit/anxiety/zoning out/etc, and if we are eating for reasons that are truly unrelated to hunger then wanting it bad enough doesn't play a role at all. We tend to also want whatever relief and comfort food brings us and if we don't have something set up to provide that comfort and relief then chances are we'll go back to food and then hate ourselves because we didn't try hard enough or maybe we didn't want it enough. And that only provides a lot of self judgement, self doubt, and guilt.

IanG 09-11-2014 11:23 AM

You's need to be getting more lean protein in ya!

Fish. Or eggs. Job done.

Even chicken or turkey if you are one of the regular complainers I keep coming across that "don't like seafood"!

That will kill the hunger in a calorie-efficient manner.

Keep running. Running is awesome. But you need to fuel it with good stuff (may I suggest a banana before the run and complex carbs like a bowl of oats after and/or aforementioned protein).

It sounds like you are getting hungry by eating the wrong stuff, working out which makes the hunger worse and then eating the wrong stuff even more.

I don't do emotional. That has nothing to do with my mouth.

(Actually it does. Some foods can help reduce anxiety. And exercise definitely does.)

ubergirl 09-11-2014 03:58 PM

Tefrey You'll recognize me from over on the releasers thread. I lost 110 lbs between 2009 and 2010 and kept it off until 2012 when I literally almost overnight just snapped, started bingeing, and "woke up" about 5 months later to find myself 70 lbs heavier. Believe me it was a catastrophe as I had gotten rid of my entire large-sized wardrobe and bought all new clothes.

What really struck me in your post is this:

Quote:

The diet that has worked best for me is the iDiet ... it's balanced so nothing is completely off limits. I start off good, following it to the letter, then I start cutting out more and more calories.
This is very much my pattern as well. I have a tendency to go lower and lower on my calories. I used to consistently eat under 1000 calories a day, while running 3 miles a day. I weighed in the 180s, but I had it in my mind that I needed to lose another 20-30 lbs. I knew that I would read 3FC threads and people were always saying don't eat too little, etc. etc. but I just thought it didn't apply to me. Even with those low calories and that much exercise, once I got into the 190s my pace of weight loss was glacial. Now, mind you, I had my body fat composition tested, and it was within the normal range for my age, which might have clued me in, but it didn't. What happened to me is exactly like what wannabe described. I pulled that string tight for 3 straight years, but when I let go, I let go in a big way in a hurry.

I really and truly believed that I had developed a new lifestyle and changed my way of eating, but in reality, all that happened was that I used the old method with (restrict restrict restrict) for a longer continuous period of time than I had ever managed before. But in the end, the pattern was still the same: restrict restrict restrict followed by binge binge binge. I've done that a million times in my life-- managed to lose 10-15 lbs, then gained it back. I had just never managed to restrict long enough to lose 110 lbs before.

It took me eighteen months to be able to get back in the groove again after I shot that arrow and this time I'm really and truly taking a different approach. I'm actively fighting my tendency to over-restrict, and I'm allowing myself to wander off my plan on a regular basis.

I definitely encourage you to add more calories to your plan, and to work on not freaking out if you don't see fast loss. The other way, while it may work temporarily, triggers disordered eating in a lot of people and I'm one of them.

Terra1984 11-28-2014 12:09 PM

This is exactly my problem also, I dont know what to do about it anymore.

faiora 11-28-2014 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tefrey (Post 5067929)
Hey everyone!

Last year I lost over 60 pounds and was a frequent contributor to this group. The loss stalled out in December and I switched my focus to exercise (mostly running). I was able to maintain for a while, but my weight started inching up, then skyrocketting up. I have now regained 30 pounds.

The reason? I'm always hungry. Always always always. I just had a yogurt and fiber one for breakfast 30 minutes ago and my tummy is already growling.

This is not emotional eating. If anything, it feels like my body has decided it needs to get back to 233 pounds as fast as possible.

I have been trying desperately to stop the starvation feelings for months and nothing works. Does anyone have any ideas?

As a lot of other people have mentioned on this thread, a yogurt and a fibre one bar are both carby foods (depending on the sugar in the yogurt, but milk sugars are still sugars). Neither of those has enough fat or protein to give you any kind of long-term hunger satiation.

I felt exactly the way you do, I think, about 3 months ago. I wasn't eating really unhealthy food all the time, but I felt hungry constantly no matter what I ate, to the point where I told my doctor about it. The advice I was given was that dehydration often feels like hunger, and that I should try and drink more water between (but not with or really close to) meals. I have to begrudgingly admit that helped.

However, there's more to it than that.

I've been doing a lot of experimenting with what makes me feel full and what doesn't. And I'd suggest you try out the same thing for yourself. Try eating different foods and paying attention to when you get hunger feelings later.

For me, fattier foods with protein in them - like steak, for instance - make me feel full the longest. Second to those are leaner proteins like fish, and last are carbs. But within all those groups are variations. For instance, whole grain carbs like steel cut oats can keep me full for hours, and refined carbs can't, but also triscuits (which I got excited about because they're whole grain) make me hungry really soon after I eat them.

Another thing that may be holding you back, as weird as it sounds, is cardio. Cardio does a lot of things. Burning calories is one of those, but toning and apparently LOSING lean mass is another (we also usually lose lean mass along with fat when we lose weight). And lean mass is what keeps burning calories when you're lazing around or sleeping, so you want to keep that. You don't have to stop doing cardio, but I'd add weights to the routine, or even just some squats in the morning or something. And make sure you're getting enough protein in your diet, too!

It might be good to have one session with a fitness trainer to talk about lean mass and your goals. Most of them are pretty good at that stuff.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tefrey (Post 5067939)
No change in medication. Food has changed ... but as a result of being hungry. I could eat the way I did when I was dieting easily ... it's just that my body is demanding all sorts of high calorie stuff ... and I cave, which of course makes the cravings worse.

Personally, I don't think it's possible to interpret what your body is craving with this level of specificity. That is, unless you're saying your mind (which is admittedly part of your body) is craving high calorie stuff.

The thing is, I thought I was starving all the time and apparently I was dehydrated. It felt the same. And anyway, if your body is telling you it's hungry, but you're not hungry enough to eat something healthy, then you're not really hungry. That's your mind playing tricks on you.

Even if it is possible to know what precisely your body wants, I think that level of perception would mean you would also be able to tell the difference between hunger and a craving. And I'm not sure how many of us have mastered that yet! But, I may be projecting my own experiences on to you, and I don't mean to do that.

My body is a dirty liar. Yours might not be.

ratfancy 11-28-2014 08:09 PM

Quite a brilliant description of the syndrome many of us experience. Thank you.


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:13 AM.


Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.