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Old 02-14-2009, 04:04 PM   #1  
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Default Excess fat on the body comes from excess CALORIES

Could someone really explain low carb diets to me? What's the difference what my body uses as fuel? EXCESS FAT COMES FROM EXCESS CALORIES. Say I eat a 100 calorie cookie and then I don't know, sit for an hour. Just as an example. So yeah, my body burns the sugar from the cookie for that hour (just pretend that's what my body uses to survive, 100 calories an hour, for the sake of example). Instead, say I eat a chicken drumstick (or about 100 calories of protein). My body needs, hypothetically, 100 calories for the next hour, still, right? So WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE really?????? MY BODY IS NOT GOING TO START BURNING FAT EITHER WAY UNLESS I EAT LESS THAN THE AMOUNT IT NEEDS FOR WHATEVER ACTIVITY IT'S DOING (or if none, just to stay alive) and it's going to burn it at the same rate. Does protein raise your metabolism?? No, in fact CARBS raise your metabolism.

Really, I just don't understand this whole thing. My body doesn't start burning fat because it's going into ketosis. On the contrary, I go into ketosis simply because I'M EATING FAT. But who cares? Ketosis has nothing to do with fat loss, or if it does, I don't understand why. If I don't restrict my calories, it's not going to use the fat in my body as fuel, it's still just using my food, which is useless if I want it to use the fat on my BODY -- and the only way my body will do that is if it DOESN'T GET ENOUGH CALORIES FROM FOOD -- ANY TYPE OF FOOD.
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Old 02-14-2009, 05:01 PM   #2  
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If you only eat fat and protein then your body starts making glucouse out of the fat instead of the carbs.

It has a transition period of a couple of days while the body uses up the stored carbs,
If you eat fat and protein the body will continue to consume fat. And if you does´nt eat it it will take it from the best source of nutrition that is... your body fat.

Someone who eats only fat and proteins does´nt eat as much as someone who adds carbs since fat get you full and keep you there for hours.

I hope I´m making my self understood... I so need to practise my english

Carbs and proteins each hold 4 calories while fat have 9 calories/gram

Seems kinda wise for the body to go for the one that gives it more energy Right?
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Old 02-14-2009, 05:07 PM   #3  
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It starts making glucose out of the fat you eat, not the fat in your body, UNLESS you just aren't eating enough. But that happens no matter WHAT you eat. The only thing that will make your body go to your fat deposits is a CALORIE DEFICIT. If you're getting energy (=calories) from food, no matter WHAT form it's in originally, your body HAS NO REASON TO GO TO YOUR FAT DEPOSITS.

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Old 02-14-2009, 05:58 PM   #4  
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Why are you yelling?
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Old 02-14-2009, 06:02 PM   #5  
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Ok I will repeat myself


Someone who eats only fat and proteins does´nt eat as much as someone who adds carbs since fat get you full and keep you there for hours.
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Old 02-14-2009, 06:45 PM   #6  
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Why are you yelling?
Because I'm SO frustrated about my weight. I have tried every diet known to man on top of the fact that when not dieting, I don't overeat more than once a week, and then only to a "reasonable" extent -- in other words, not a whole big serving of something at a diner AND dessert, or a pint of ice cream or box of cookies, but maybe a hamburger with the bun with a side of slaw, or ONE slice of pizza at lunch, or something... my calorie intake is usually around 1,000, and it will go over 1,500 once in a while and not much over!! Yes, I've tried eating more in case my body was low metabolism cause it needed more calories. I GAIN WEIGHT. I'VE TRIED IT ALL -- VEGAN, Weight Watchers, rice diet, Somersizing, slow carb, writing down my intake .. I go by the book but the book doesn't help me. There have been only three things that have ever caused weightloss for me --

1) My oatmeal and chicken "diet", my own system when I had very little money but didn't want to give up on trying to lose weight. NOT brown rice, whole grain breads and beans. I lose no weight when I eat those. Problem here is obvious: who wants to eat just those two for the rest of their lives? Plus, when I went on an antidepressant, it stopped working anyway and that's the real reason I stopped -- the scale started going up anyway.

2) My own "cabbage soup" diet inspired system. The soup doesn't sound good, so I figured it would be the same if I ate just the vegetables alone, not all together in a soup. What it amounts to is

a. four days of the week you either either/and ONLY fruit and vegetables. Obviously anyone would lose weight on that.
b. the other days you eat an extremely controlled diet that really does seem to work with the other four days.

I guess I'm just doomed to eat one of those two ways, or combine them, for the rest of my life. Oh yes and I forgot to mention, I'm not sure if it was the antidepressant that made me start gaining back or the fact that it made me so tired I didn't take my 3/wk one hour walk. I'm off them though anyway.

I haven't gotten to the gist of your question really though, but this was necessary background. I'm yelling because there is no miracle in the diets and I resent everyone saying there is when there is no truth behind it. The truth is somewhere, obviously, but no one's really come up with it yet. To me, it's clearly genetic. Some people really eat a lot, don't do much exercise, and don't gain an ounce, some people gain weight just by breathing -- me. Some people do gain weight when they eat a lot -- those are the ones who lose weight when they go on a "diet" -- but it could be ANY diet that RESTRICTS THEIR CALORIES PAST THE POINT OF THEIR TOLERANCE, which is HIGH. I'm not sure why oatmeal works when brown rice doesn't for me, and no one explains that. And I have no idea why calorie restriction alone doesn't work for me. In fact, I'm sort of leaning towards the idea that it doesn't really matter what I eat if I get in one hour of walking EVERY DAY in, even though somehow last week I gained THREE POUNDS while I did two hours I haven't been doing at all. I didn't have a scale when I did that cabbage soup thing so I don't know, I do think I lost more, but I only lost ONE POUND A MONTH on the oatmeal thing and I was walking 3/week for an hour. The only reason I kept it up was because, as I said, I was low on money so I figured this was the cheapest I could eat healthy anyway, whether I lost any weight or not.
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Old 02-14-2009, 06:47 PM   #7  
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Well that's just a matter of taste, not science. I would prefer to eat a 300 calorie muffin than three eggs for breakfast. I will be hungry at lunch both ways.

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Ok I will repeat myself


Someone who eats only fat and proteins does´nt eat as much as someone who adds carbs since fat get you full and keep you there for hours.
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Old 02-14-2009, 06:54 PM   #8  
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Have you been to your doc to see if you have a medical reason that your body metabolism is slower than normal?
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Old 02-14-2009, 07:12 PM   #9  
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Well that's just a matter of taste, not science. I would prefer to eat a 300 calorie muffin than three eggs for breakfast. I will be hungry at lunch both ways.

No it´s not. If I eat a 300 cal muffin I´ll be hungry again in less than an hour. If I eat a bacon and scrambled egg breakfast I´ll stay full a bit after lunch... Its actually hard to eat lunch...

So I do´nt... I eat when I´m hungry. I eat until I´m content with my meal and then I stop. And repeat over the day. Sometimes I eat 4 times a day and sometimes I eat 2. But I´m happy! I feel great and it works for me.

This lifestyle got the doctor who came up with it (I am talking sweden) fired because it went against all "proven" science... Well.. It works and now everybody is getting on the fatty train...

Get checked out by a doctor. And then... Why not try this for a couple of months? Cut away all carbs. Only eat veggis that grow on the surface... no potato, carrot and so on.
Eat a lot of fat. It is good for you.. And you need to replace the carbs with something.

I know that it sucks... I had surgery because I colud not lose weight. And then, of course... gained it all back but now I`m back on track and feeling good.
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Old 02-14-2009, 07:48 PM   #10  
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The calories in/calories out model, isn't perfect. For one thing calories are a unit of energy, thermal energy or "burnability" to think of them in other terms. Cellulose (plant fiber) has calories, but you could eat 5000 calories of hay or wood and wouldn't gain an ounce, because humans can't digest cellulose. So a calorie isn't always a calorie for weight loss purposes, because sometimes there are calories that aren't useable.

There are other theories about ways in which a calorie isn't always a calorie (as described in various diet books, especially those regarding low carb lifestyles).

I'm not confident in the truth of many of these theories, but I have found some personal truths through my own experimentation. On 1800 calories of high carb foods, I lose very slowly (crazy slow for a person of my weight). On 1800 calories of extremely low carb eating (Atkins induction level of 20g of carbs or less), I lose weight much more rapidly, but feel terrible and have blood sugar drops severe enough that I feel like passing out. On 1800 calories of a relatively low carb diet I can reach the balance of feeling decent and yet losing consistently.

I don't know all of the reasons, but it's not as simple as calories in/out. In addition to a food log, I also kept a symptoms log - and can say that high carb eating, especially with processed foods I was hungrier and yet exhausted all of the time. I slept more (but not as well) and exercise seemed out of the question because of the exhaustion. The hunger was crazy, especially for cravings of more junk. On the extremely low carb eating, I was never hungry (miraculous for me), in fact often somewhat nauseous, and while I'd have bursts of energy and could exercise (at least if timed closely after eating), I had headaches, frequent insomnia, and blood sugar drops that would make me feel dizzy or faint. On the right level of carbs, I can lose weight gradually, but consistently, have energy for exercise, reasonably control hunger and feel my best overall.

I'm not saying that any of the above is true for anyone other than me, and maybe a few other folks. I also don't know what about me makes the above true. I have several health issues that probably contribute. I'm insulin resistant and have the combination of health issues doctors refer to as metabolic syndrome or syndrome x. I've been told by several doctors now, that for the insulin syndrome especially, lower carb dieting tends to be more effective for weight loss. I don't know whether it's me or the medication I'm on that makes me sick on very low carb. I am taking metformin (which helps control blood sugar), and that may be one of the reasons I can't go "too low" carb. I also have fibromyalgia, and there's some evidence (and a lot of patient reports) that high carb, especially high grain diets seem to aggravate the symptoms of fibro (definitely true for me). If all I worried about was weight loss, I would aim for no more than 20g of carbs a day. I would lose 5 lbs a week, but I'd feel like fainting or puking most of the time, and I'd be unable to sleep and have more pain and brain fog from the fibro.

What does any of that have to do with you?

Maybe absolutely nothing, but it seems to me that you're arguing that low carb diets aren't effective - if that's true for you, then don't use them. Trial and error, and a whole lot of reading on the subject has proven to me that for me there is a big difference, and one more important to me than rate of weight loss, is that of feeling good and hunger control. If I eat too many carbs (especially if they're processed carbs, but even small chain "healthy" carbs like high sugar fruits or starchy veggies) I get a hunger, I can only describe as crazy. Even after eating until physically full, I still feel a drive to eat more - I literally feel starved, especially for more carbs.

I'm not saying it's a universal experience, in fact, there seems to be a lot of evidence that while my experience is common, it isn't universal. There do seem to be people whose hunger is not affected appreciably by the source of calories - if that is you, more power to you. But for me, the distinction is so remarkable, that to feel my best and lose weight, I can't afford to include many simple or short chain carbohydrates (easily digestible carbs) into my diet, at this point.

Last edited by kaplods; 02-14-2009 at 08:15 PM.
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Old 02-14-2009, 07:53 PM   #11  
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Well that's just a matter of taste, not science. I would prefer to eat a 300 calorie muffin than three eggs for breakfast. I will be hungry at lunch both ways.

No it´s not. If I eat a 300 cal muffin I´ll be hungry again in less than an hour.
Well, not me. What I'm saying is, if it's a matter of how much you eat, why don't they just admit that?

P.S. I think I see that all of you understand this, but I'm not a skinny minny crazy to lose 5 pounds. I mean, in all honesty, I probably was at some stage in my 20s. Although no, not a skinny minny or someone who could eat anything she wanted. I've gained 3 lbs a year always watching what I eat -- and at 48, it makes a BIG difference. I'm 5'2" and 180 lbs -- up from 177 just last week, don't exactly know how, I guess it is those antidepressants after all -- I'm back on them -- really, only the past 3 years, on and off a lot of diets, so that's just part of it. Some people were just not made by god to be slender, it is starting to seem like -- and I am yelling because I wish, I WISH there was a different answer. The only one would be exercising all day. But not in diet. Unless of course one is just eating too many calories with junk food.

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Old 02-14-2009, 07:55 PM   #12  
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Kaplods just explained my thoughts exactly.

You arent going to find what works for you overnight. It takes a lot of trial and error and tweaking. I too feel best with moderate carbs, higher fats and protein. But 6 months into maintenence and I'm still learning, still messing up, but also still doing a lot of things right. It gets a lot easier over time, but it's never effortless.
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Old 02-14-2009, 07:56 PM   #13  
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Try looking at the book called "Intuitive Eating".
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Old 02-14-2009, 08:12 PM   #14  
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Quote:
and I am yelling because I wish, I WISH there was a different answer.
I understand your frustration, but yelling at people here who are just trying to help you is not going to give you the answers you want. We can only share what works for us.
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Old 02-14-2009, 08:24 PM   #15  
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Well, not me. What I'm saying is, if it's a matter of how much you eat, why don't they just admit that?
I think the answer to the "why don't they just admit that, " is there is no "that" to admit. There is no single answer that works for everyone. Some folks (like me) have found that it is NOT only a matter of how much we eat. I was as shocked as anyone could be that I actually lost more weight on 1800 calories of low carb than I did on 1800 calories of high carb - because I thought that the only, or at least primary reason I was losing more on low carb diets was because I was much less hungry and eating much less (which in itself would have been a great reason to stick with low carb eating).

I've found out a lot of things about how my body reacts to certain foods and combination/ratio of nutients. I've read alot, and have some theories of my own as to why some folks share certain traits when it comes to hunger/food and it's relationship to health.

We're still in the infancy of weight loss research. Far too many researchers are still looking for the single best diet for weight loss, or a weight loss strategy that will work for everyone (and not just in the lab, but in their daily lives) - and I think they're not finding answers, because they're not asking the right questions - it's like trying to find a cure for all headaches regardless of the cause, whether it be allergies, flu, sinus infection, blow to the head, or brain tumor.

I don't think all weight gain has the same cause, and I don't think all weight loss can be achieved by the same means.
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