[impossible princess]

Well I'll admit it now despite snapping at everyone and going I'm not depressed I am at the moment I feel very stressed and unhappy with my life. but i'm not good with medicine I hate putting chemicals in my body so anyone got any ideas I can try first for herbal alternatives before going to the doctors?

[Marie]

Princess, I cold turkeyed all my meds in August and am doing better than I have in years. I'm using light therapy and exercise daily (recommend by p-doc although the cold turkey wasn't). I can't say through deep depressions this would work, but it's definitely working for me now.

Also, I know that St. John's Wort is supposed to be okay but I hear that SAM-e is better. All is heresay and I don't know for sure.

Good luck.
Marie

[sweet_pea]

impossible princess it is a common misconception that herbal meds are "better" they're not. they're all chemicals no matter which way you look at it, and they all have side effects. Marijuana and opium are all "natural" or "herbal" but they are dangerous. Drugs are drugs natural or otherwise. The main advantage of herbals is that you don't need a prescription as you can get them OTC.

A lot of the stuff Marie has said helps - natural light or a light box, exercise, diet etc. Boring but true

Depending on how long you have been depressed it may be worth a visit to the doc. Also as depression can have other causes e.g. thyroid etc etc a doc may be able to help you with something that doesn't involve antidepressants

Also have you read the articles in the stickies section at the top? they have lots of helpful info

[impossible princess]

I do most of it really. Lots of exercise, good diet etc.

I think its because its horrible exam time and the st johns wort hasn't kicked back in. i used to take it and it was great then had to stop because of the pill and now I'm back off the pill and on it, it doesn't seem to have the same effect really which is a bit rubbish. Maybe it just hasn't kicked back in my system yet.

I've been to the doctors actually but he was a bit useless. i went with flu but mentioned that I was pretty depressed and had been for a while and he didn't really help or suggest anything or prescribe me anything.

I think alot of it might be lack of sleep, my sleep pattern is buggered again. I had temazepam for that before a while ago which is a tranquliser but it made me too tranquil I was really out of it most of the day so I came off it but the doctor didn't give me anything else.

Ive upped the gym and I'll see whether the st johns wort kicks back in, if it doesn't I'll have to suffer my useless patronising doctor again.

[Peanut_butter]

5-HTP is known to help depression. Here's an article:
What it is

5-hydroxytryptophan (5-HTP) is an amino acid that occurs naturally in the body and is the final step in the production of the neurotransmitter serotonin, an important chemical that’s responsible for many of the brain impulses involving satisfaction and well being. 5-HTP is created through the hydroxylating of Tryptophan. Tryptophan is an essential amino acid that must be taken in through protein containing foods since the body can not synthesize it. Of the eight essential amino acids, tryptophan is the least common, accounting for only about one percent of protein content, and it is used up rapidly by the body. About ninety-percent is used in protein synthesis. The rest is divided between serotonin production and niacin production, which requires 60mg for every 1mg of niacin produced. However, 5-HTP is only used in serotonin production. 5-hydroxytryptophan is also able to pass through the blood-brain barrier easily, unlike tryptophan, which can only pass through the barrier by using the same transport molecule that caries leucine, isoleucine, and valine.

Unlike tryptophan supplements, 5-HTP supplements are not produced commercially by the fermentation of bacteria. Instead, it is extracted from the seeds of Griffonia simplicifolia, an African tree that is grown mostly in Ghana and the Ivory Coast. The extraction process uses alcohol and produces an oily solid. The oily extract is then purified into a dry solid. 5-HTP can also be made synthetically in the laboratory. The final product is the same as the one made by the body. .

On November 17th, 1989 the FDA recalled all L-Tryptophan supplements. The reason was an increasing worry that the supplements may be causing eosinophilia-myalgia syndrome. A syndrome that is characterized by severe muscle and joint pain, swelling of the arms and legs, skin rash and, sometimes, fever. At the time of this recall, tryptophan was gaining popularity in the treatment of insomnia, depression and obesity (among other uses). Today, 5-hydroxytrptophan is considered a safer and more effective treatment for these conditions.

I used (and still use) this supplement; it can be found at health stores...about $20 per bottle. I can't say it cures depression, but it really relieves stress and it allows me to sleep at night. On the plus side, it suppresses appetite!!! I read in another forum that someone 'got over' depression just with 5-HTP and lots of exercise. I guess it depends on your severity.

Hope this helped!

[icmethinner]

Hi impossible princess:

If you are just looking for something to help you through periods of anxiety or stress you could use valerian root. Large doses of it help you sleep, smaller amounts just help you feel more calm. This is the herb they make valium from so it is like getting a smaller dose of valium, depending on how much you take. You can get it at almost any health food store. It is smelly though! Some places sell tablets instead of capsules and they are much less smelly. It doesn't make you smell, it just smells bad when you open the bottle and you have to wash your hands after touching it! But it is very effective.

[sweet_pea]

hi again
yes you're right bad sleep patterns completely muck up mood so getting that right would be a big help. meditation/yoga is supposed to help too but i've never mastered meditation myself so i'm only going by what others say. people who do it swear by it!!!

valerian didn't work for me for sleep but i'm hopeless with sleep LOL not much works.

you could maybe try another doc or a naturopath??? he really should have checked other stuff as thyroid, hypoglycaemia etc etc can affect mood so it's worth taking a look.

as for the SJW sometimes your own biochemistry changes and so meds become more or less effective - that's one possibility. the other is that you are using a different brand, some brands are less effective than others or have less active ingredients???

other times drugs can't override if your thinking patterns are the problem. sometimes therapy helps altho personally i prefer doing it myself through books than talking to a therapist. cognitive therapy helped me a lot. i read lots about it and did the exercises in the books and it helped me handle stressful situations better

peanut are you using 5HTP together with ADs??? they can interact and cause problems so you might want to check that out with your doc to be safe

i've used this site a lot and it has reviews of things people have tried for insomnia and depression. it has everything: drugs, therapy, herbal stuff etc etc. you could go read the reviews of things people have tried and see if anything looks helpful. maybe you could rate things you've tried so it can help other people. www.remedyfind.com the site is neutral (it's not paid for by drug companies or anything so you can trust the reviews, lots of good info there)

[impossible princess]

Originally Posted by sweet_pea

hi again


valerian didn't work for me for sleep but i'm hopeless with sleep LOL not much works.

you could maybe try another doc or a naturopath??? he really should have checked other stuff as thyroid, hypoglycaemia etc etc can affect mood so it's worth taking a look.

Thanks for the help i've tried valerian before too and found it didn't make me sleep.

I've already had my thyroid tested only a few months before I went with the depression when I was having alopecia and fainting spells due to my blood pressure dipping (yes I'm healthy honest ). I had my bloods done It was all ok no dodgy hormone levels, no thyroid problems, I'm slightly anaemic but thats it and have been seriously hitting the iron tablets and the leafy greens to get on top of that, and everything else came out pretty fine. I do have period problems though which definitely don't help the moods either which I think is one of the reasons I'm feeling a bit worse atm. Blood pressure is pretty normal atm too I think, well I've not been fainting everywhere anyway so its an improvement.


You might have a point about the brand I'll buy some more this week and see if it makes a difference. I've been trying relaxation tapes and the like before I sleep but it hasn't been making much of a difference at the moment. I went to the gym today to try and completely wipe myself out but its past midnight and I'm still awake again grr.
My docs response to most things is that some people are just more prone to things than others.

[Suzanne 3FC]

If you decide to treat your depression with herbs, PLEASE check with your doctor first.

It's my understanding that 5-HTP could be dangerous. Plus if you combine 5-HTP with St Johns Wort, you could experience serious complications.

From Berkeley Wellness, University of California:
http://www.berkeleywellness.com/html/ds/ds5HTP.php

Reported side effects include nausea, vomiting, and difficulty breathing. High doses of 5-HTP can cause agitation, fast heart rate, a boost in blood pressure—and in rare cases, coma and even death. Combining it with an antidepressant, any other drug that affects serotonin levels (such naratriptan or sumatriptan, used to treat headaches), or “herbal antidepressants” such as St. John’s wort can also cause such side effects. People who have heart disease, peptic ulcers, kidney disease, or clotting disorders should definitely not take this supplement.

Final thoughts: Some dietary supplements, notably 5-HTP, can influence brain chemicals. As the tryptophan story showed, even though they are marketed as “natural,” they can have serious adverse effects—just like traditional antidepressants. The potential dangers of 5-HTP outweigh any possible benefits.

[sweet_pea]

hi again
suzanne is right, i forgot that you were already on SJW. it's definitely NOT SAFE to combine it with 5HTP. actually there's a whole pile of things you need to be careful of with SJW including sunburn! as i said in my original post the side effects are just as bad as with ADs prescribed by docs. they are still drugs no matter how natural. and truthfully they may be less safe as there is less testing of natural remedies. drug companies have to do extensive testing before they are allowed to release drugs into the market. there are less controls over herbals

was the alopecia due to stress? sounds like you have a lot going on in your life. maybe all you need is a holiday

not sleeping is an ongoing battle for me. and the harder you try the harder it gets. you can't force sleep the relaxation tapes etc only worked on rare occasions for me but it's worth giving everything a go

[impossible princess]

No I've always had probs with the pill but had to go back on it for period problems and that particular brand seemed to make my hair drop out. I stopped taking it and within 4 months it'd started growing back and is all back now. My hair def isn't the same as it was before it used to be really thick but its so much better now I'm sure it wasn't stress because it happened when I wasn't stressed and grew back so quickly.


St Johns did used to work for me with the min of side effects. I'm a red head and burn if I so much as look at the sun anyway so haven't really noticed any difference with it in comparison temazepam which I didn't realise could have an effect gave me blisters when I went out in the sun which didn't best please me.

I feel better in myself today but I absolutely killed myself at the gym yesterday to achieve it. i can hardly walk today i'm so stiff which means I can't go again today which is annoying.

The doctor did say its fine for me to take st johns wort but I haven't asked about anything else i'll ring up if I do try something else.

[Marie]

Hey, impossible, you might want to look at finding another doctor. That your doctor blew you off when you found the courage to mention depression is a big red flag to me. Seeking help is so hard and your dr. just discounted it. I think that a second opinion would be your best bet.

Also, there is one med that I still take and it's for sleep. It works for some and for other it doesn't. It's trazedone - a prescription drug that's actually an antidepressant but is usually prescribed to bi-polars with sleep problems. I'm prescribed 1-2 100 mg tablets and I cut the tablet into quarters so I'm only using 25 mg. Anything more than that I'm a zombie the next day and none at all I'm a zombie since I'd been up all night. The 25 mg dose was found by trial and error. I do admit that I have a good thing going with it. My co-pay for the prescription is $5 and the dr. wrote the prescription for 1-2 tablets so for my 30 day supply, they have to give me 60 tablets. Multiplied by quarters, I have a 240 day supply. Not bad. Someday, someone will catch on and prescribe the lesser amount, but for now I cut my tablets and save money. So anyway, you might want to as a new dr. about trazedone also.
Marie

[impossible princess]

Yeah I will have to ask I can't go on like this am not sleeping hardly at all its past half 2 here now and I have to be up at 6 and I'm not at all sleepy and I cut down my caffeine today and only had 3 cups all day and nothing past 6.

[sweet_pea]

in that case imposs you definitely need to go see a doc and probably a new one. your doc can assess you and decide if you have depression or bipolar etc or if it's just stress or some sort of hormonal or other problem. the correct diagnosis is always the first step lol

Marie i am going to look up trazedone and see if it is in NZ

[sweet_pea]

Marie is it perhaps Trazodone??? i remember looking this up once before when you mentioned it and couldn't find it

or do you know the active ingredient?