I've said it a million times and i'll say it again -- With men, the cards are in your favor before he even knows you're after him. Don't give them the advantage by letting that oh-so-typical female sense of self-doubt start clouding up your judgement. Too many women project their own insecurities onto the men they like and end up driving them away before a burgeoning relationship can even begin because they start giving off 'i'm batsh*t crazy and desperately need love and if you don't give it to me i'll slash your tires and get you fired from your job' vibes (don't laugh. We all know someone who did that.) Not because the guy doesn't like them initially. You're much more clever than they are. It's genetic, so stop acting like they've got some sort of magical forcefield that makes them impervious to your feminine wiles **provided he is not gay**. If you want him, he is yours. All you have to do is put on your sexy smile, pretend he's interesting, and then say when. <---Sexy smile.
That is seriously how it works. I don't know how it got so convoluted and complicated. Too many lonely self-help authors trying to pass off conspiracy theories as to why they couldn't get a date I suppose.
Jerzy, I wouldn't count him out because his orientation is slightly suspect. There are ways to find out for sure, but none of the ones I know that work 100% of the time are anything I think you would be up for. Try the light touching and looking pretty. If he stays oblivious then there is a good chance you're barking up the wrong tree.
...If that is the case you need to slap him across the face dramatically, tell him to cut the crap, get some peen, and do some 3rd party networking so you can get hooked up with a stylist or something dangit. My BFF has friends of friends, one of whom is a queen with luxurious taste who wears the same size shoes. Homegirl wears an outfit once, then guess what? Christian Louboutin heels come straight to moi. Another is a buyer for MAC, and my eyeshadow pigment collection makes angels sing every time I open my Caboodle. And yes you read that correctly. I still have a Caboodle.
Last edited by NishKitten; 05-12-2009 at 10:33 PM.
OMG I CAN'T BELIEVE I DIDN'T SEE THIS THREAD EARLIER!!!!!!!
Ummm this is reaaaaalllll close to my situation!!!! Only I have: told him I'm interested, know he isn't gay and we are physically close everytime we are together (nothing more than flirty touching hugging handsies etc tho lol).
I HATE this--- but it helps to know we aren't alone!!!!
Well, the more I'm reading from you guys the more I realize that I just need to "shake him like a coconut"! We spend so much time together alone, there are tender moments and touches and there are *definitely* things he's said that could have been an opening for me make the move like he was feeling me out.
So now it's just a matter of catching those moments before I get home and realize...duh!
I saw him last night while we were helping a friend move furniture and he mentioned the Biggest Loser finale tonight.
Because he didn't invite me over to watch it (I don't have t.v. so I spend a lot of time at his place watching shows), I didn't say anything about going to see it. Totally because I was insecure.
BUT because of this thread, I had the courage to call tonight and see if he was watching. Turns out he was at a class tonight and that's why he didn't invite me. But holy crap guys! If it hadn't been for you all I wouldn't have called him and just assumed he wanted to watch alone!
As for you shrinkingchica, we are in the same situation except that my friend has made it clear that his family is not very affectionate so he is awkward with it. (Though I am pretty affectionate with him because that's *my* style and he doesn't tense up! I just stop myself sometimes because he doesn't like it...maybe not anymore though, right Nish?!)
It's also funny that you guys wrote about looking pretty. That just started happening recently because I realized I wanted to look my best around him. And it makes me way more confident to flirt.
I totally see where I can do better with the flirting and even get the courage to make a conversation go in the right direction for me!
Tomorrow we pick up our CSA share (we split a Couples' Share of our local produce co-op). I'll be looking for the right moments to be sneaky!
If I go according to "he's just not that into you" he's just not that into me, but he's an odd duck. My friend Jessie wants to get more time alone with him (and alcohol) to trick it out of him, but eh. I dunno. He was a big support to me after my mom died, like huge, so I also question whether he's just attentive b/c he's making sure I'm okay, or if he likes me.
I want to know what makes it seem like "he's just not that into you". Because it sounds like he gives you a lot of attention...
Congrats jerzygal!! I'm so glad you got up the courage to phone! It definitely sounds to me like he's into you.
I was EXACTLY the same about dating. I came to university without ever having had a boyfriend, and didn't meet the one I'm with now until the start of third year. I'm still very insecure and always have been and having had no experience with boys (I hadn't even kissed one!) I didn't know what to do! I was so chicken but so was he, and I think that's natural if you're friends with someone and you're worried about screwing that up. We didn't spend much time alone together before we started dating - you already seem to spend quite some time with your guy one-on-one! You've received some great advice here I think, things I could have used for sure before Christmas! Whatever you do, don't act too differently or change yourself too much for him (I'm sure you wouldn't, but there are a lot of girls that would), because it sounds like he likes you just the way you are now. Good luck, keep us posted!
Last edited by freedomreins; 05-13-2009 at 04:36 AM.
I want to know what makes it seem like "he's just not that into you". Because it sounds like he gives you a lot of attention...
Do you spend time alone together?
Oh, because the book says "if he's into you, he'll find a way to be with you (in the biblical sense ). That only happened once, with loads of alcohol in his system, so I'm doubtful. We do spend time alone together - usually before everyone in the house gets home from work, we're the only two there, and of course that means I think he only hangs out with me due to boredom. Sorry Nish, its the self-doubt. I'm trying to be better about it, I really am.
And woo hoo! I'm from Hudson County! We're neighbors!!
Oh, because the book says "if he's into you, he'll find a way to be with you (in the biblical sense ). That only happened once, with loads of alcohol in his system, so I'm doubtful. We do spend time alone together - usually before everyone in the house gets home from work, we're the only two there, and of course that means I think he only hangs out with me due to boredom. Sorry Nish, its the self-doubt. I'm trying to be better about it, I really am.
And woo hoo! I'm from Hudson County! We're neighbors!!
I put in bold the part of that statement that is true testament to your extra lame scaredy cat-ness. Didja ever stop and think that maybe, just *maybe*, he's thinking the same thing about you? Hmmmmmm? You had better jump on that hot piece before some skank snatches him up and you regret it forever. Even if it doesn't last, and you find out he's a jackass at least you know. Yanno? Better to have loved and found out he was dumb as a box of rocks than not at all. *Sips coffee*
Edited to add: Okay, I keep hearing about this insane book and every quote I see from it irritates me. I don't know if its because it's out of context or what, but WHAT is it, and was it written in the freakin' Victorian era!? Why are they urging women to wait around like a delicate fainting flower for a man to initiate a relationship, and to happily settle for whatever man is willing to take them because he's the one that is 'into' you? I thought we stopped being property (at least in the USA) a few decades ago...
Last edited by NishKitten; 05-13-2009 at 10:15 AM.
I cannot say I know enough - and be ashamed at the same time I haven't done anything.
The book isn't so bad - it doesn't talk about us not pursuing them, but mostly goes into how to read if our pursuit is just us deluding ourselves or what.
Stella, I think a good line would be to make a joke...like "Do you think the cops are the only reason we're not dating right now?" or something like that. Don't go by what everyone else is saying or thinking--go to the source! You've already hooked up so I wouldn't worry about awkwardness.
Haha, I've said that before, just not around him. Oh, the hook up was slightly awkward as in I had no idea what was going on, yet I was the sober one. I was just like wait, what, this is happening, what, why is my bra on the floor WHAT JUST HAPPENED.
ive been in a similar situation. readers digest version: best friends, really liked each other, timing was never right, hooked up, now we dont speak to each other. so since that was a complete failure, i dont feel in a position to give you advice. but, youll never know unless you try. but you HAVE to post an update on what you decided to do and how it worked out. im dying to know! good luck!
Okay, tonight's update. I've been out of town for a few days. Got one text yesterday from the boy asking when I was getting back. Nice and attentive. Made me feel good.
So today...we talked on gmail chat for a bit. I have to take him to the airport tomorrow so we were talking details. Then he went to take a shower.
I totally figured we wouldn't see each other but then I got anxious and wanted to see him tonight.
So I texted him to see if I could bring over wine and hang out while he packed.
Then he said he was cooking dinner and invited me over.
It was a nice night, we had wine and dinner and watched a movie and some of SNL.
So the whole time I was just awkward (in my mind) about what to do. I really hold back with him. If it were other friends, I would snuggle on the couch and spend more time touching.
But I think because I want it to be something more, I freak out and stay far away.
And I mentioned earlier that he is awkward with touching. But there are glances and touches, etc. that seem to me to be signs...but I am SO inexperienced that I feel like I could be misreading or we're just both bumbling around. (remember, of course, my insecurity makes me decide that he is just not interested. -- I have decided that I can't assume that, however, and I will figure it out. I am just feeling around blind and need help!!)
So I did say something. This boy and another friend of mine spend a lot of time together. He said that they had gone to dinner while I was out of town. I told him that it freaks me out because I worry that he and this friend will make out. Because that's true...but then I am freaked out about it! Why did I say that?? He laughed and said, "But that would ruin everything." Which makes me so confused and I am picking that apart.
UGH. I had so many openings tonight but I was just freaked out about sending the "wrong" message -- which is the message I WANT to send -- but then I also don't want us to lose the friendship we have when we are alone together watching movies or cooking dinner.
I am just completely insecure and worry that maybe he's just a friend guy. He has male and female friends and spends time with both.
I keep leaning towards the idea that I need to just put it out there and see. But I don't want to lose my friend. EFF.
OK First, let me just say, I have thoroughly enjoyed reading this whole entire thread.
Now, let's get down the nitty gritty...
So I did say something. This boy and another friend of mine spend a lot of time together. He said that they had gone to dinner while I was out of town. I told him that it freaks me out because I worry that he and this friend will make out. Because that's true...but then I am freaked out about it! Why did I say that?? He laughed and said, "But that would ruin everything." Which makes me so confused and I am picking that apart.
Congrats for saying something- next time, FOLLOW THROUGH. Leaving it open ended, letting him say "But that would ruin everything" without explanation leaves both of you equally in the dark.
I had so many openings tonight but I was just freaked out about sending the "wrong" message -- which is the message I WANT to send
Don't be afraid to send the message you want to send- the right guy for you will appreciate that you were honest about your feelings. And if this guy feels that your feelings for him ruin the friendship, and you lose out on what you have now, that is okay. That's part of life- at least you know you didn't waste more time with a friendship that was not deeply rooted enough to withstand that, and that you also aren't wasting your time waiting for something that will never happen.
Instead, you can move on to bigger and better things- you'll find that man that makes dinner and you just do romantic fun things with- and you'll have a mutual love for each other.
I have dated a lot of guys, and I'm now married to the best guy I'd ever dated. I love him so much- and let me tell you, the first few relationships I had, that I thought THIS IS IT!! absolutely pale in comparison to the kind of love my hubby and I have.
I keep leaning towards the idea that I need to just put it out there and see. But I don't want to lose my friend.
Trust in yourself, girl! If you do make a move and it receives positive reciprocation, than YAY!!! But do you see why lacking confidence is really just hurting the both of you??
<---Sexy smile. 
Try the light touching and looking pretty. If he stays oblivious then there is a good chance you're barking up the wrong tree. 
And yes you read that correctly. I still have a Caboodle.
Good luck, keep us posted!
