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Old 05-20-2006, 02:49 AM   #16  
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Sorry to hear you've hit a rough spot. You'll smash through it I'm sure.

I've been there and it is just recently I've been getting it back together.
My relapse started in October when I started working at a local 'supercenter' as a cashier. Suddenly I was confronted daily, by all my favorite junk-cookies, donuts, **ice cream**, cake, etc. Before I was working there I was good about avoiding those isles and for me if I can't see it, I don't crave it. But as a cashier, all kinds of stuff is brought to me and just seeing all of that stuff brought on cravings. I ignored them for a while, but then I started making up reasons to buy ice cream and oreos (They were snacks for the kids. :rolleye: Ya, right! Like my kids really need that junk either.)
Got to the point I was buying 3 or 4 packages of oreos a week and eating most of them, by the way. Slowly gaining weight and hating myself for it, but rationalizing it all in my head anyway. Finally, I chose to stop buying it and when I'm shopping after work I walk quickly to what I need and get out. It is like I'm wearing blinders and cannot see where the junk is lurking. What ever I have to do to keep it out of my house, cuz if it is in the house, it's in my hand heading towards my mouth.
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Old 05-20-2006, 10:18 AM   #17  
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Sounds like you've been in a bad place - a not unfamiliar one though! I know, for me, I was like that when I was depressed. If I knew what I was eating was hurting me but I still did it then I didn't like me very much. Maybe that's the way to go - work on liking you.

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Old 05-20-2006, 10:28 AM   #18  
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Lakegirl~I love your analogy with the antibiotics! To carry it even further, stopping antibiotics early encourages resistant bacteria, and stopping weight loss efforts encourages yo-yoing and (from what I understand) does very bad things to our metabolisms.

Thanks for those words of genius. I am going to chew them over and use them on an as needed basis for my own motivation and discipline.
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Old 05-20-2006, 07:31 PM   #19  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LakeGirl
I think that learning what our triggers are is a work in progress. ****, I'm almost 40 and just discovered last week that stress makes me want to eat bad stuff (I'm talking out of the ordinary stress, not the day to day stress). But once we learn one thing that causes us to want to eat bad crap, we have to counteract our urge with something else. Put something in place of the food or between us and the food.

Hi, Linda, hang in there! I've slipped so many times. I get mad because I know I'm just delaying getting this weight off, and I want to lose it badly, let me tell you. The above read like words of wisdom to me. I think keeping the trigger food out of sight, mostly out of mind, and figuring out what makes me go for the food when what I really want is to get rid of anxiety, rest, scream, etc. Sometimes it just is me wanting comfort and pleasure.

Dealing with the emotional side over overeating may be the scariest aspect of it (at least for me). I also think I wouldn't have lost a single lb and kept it off if I hadn't taken the time and effort to deal with some of emotional aspects.

I'm still working on figuring this all out, obviously, heh heh. You're a gorgeous and strong person, I know you'll do whatever you set your mind to.
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Old 05-21-2006, 02:17 PM   #20  
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Thank you so much...my wonderful friends

You mean the world to me.

I do think that Thursday night was my most recent bottom. You can only go up (or down ) from the bottom, right?

I've done very well the past 2 days and my scale shows a preview water loss of 3.6 pounds over those 2 days....which I will take...water, fat or otherwise!!!! I treadmilled on Friday, and swam with the kids yesterday...and I can already feel that tingly losing weight feeling in my body.

I already feel so much better, and even though I had to hit a very hard place (again)...it is food for change.

I love you guys so much
Linda
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Old 05-21-2006, 04:44 PM   #21  
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I'm so sorry that you hit rock bottom, but am glad you've found the "up" button on the elevator.

I'll never understand all this head stuff that goes along with weight loss. We know what is good, and what works, but that urge to just eat, and to have comfort, and to rebel is just so strong at times.

And there is no worse feeling than sliding away. I remember when I lost 40lbs and started to put them back on again a few years ago, I could feel new roles of fat when I was trying to get to sleep, I even started to get sleep apnoea, but did I reverse what I was doing and get back on the horse.....??? Nope, I regained every one of those 40 pounds and 40 of their friends.

This time, I don't care how slowly I do it. If I need a week off, I'll take it. Never a week off the exercise, but if I need to just relax the food, I will do. But "relax" is not going back to my old eating habits. "relax" is having one chocolate bar. Or one treat meal. Just to feel like I am still in the human race and not living on "planet lettuce leaf" which sometimes seems like the loneliest place on earth!

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Old 05-22-2006, 11:29 AM   #22  
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Thank-you for posting this & believe me when I say my heart goes out to you. Reading your words were like reading my own.

Sometimes it seems like we need to hit rock bottom before we can stop the downward spiral. I just don't understand this at all. A couple of weeks ago was my rock bottom ( at least I hope it was!). I had one of the worst depressive episodes I've ever had (it has been a 10 year ongoing battle) & found myself sitting on the couch, alone, crying with my stomach in knots & still eating. Just stuffing myself with food that I was neither tasting or enjoying. I had the same out of body experience you described.

Oh my poor, wonderful husband came home to this. He threw out the food, held me & tucked me into bed for the night. It's all so crazy. In my head I can see that this is what's making things so terrible for me but at the same time I'm thinking: "Just eat it & get huge -then you'll have a reason to feel so bad." I guess because we can't find a reason for the depression (damn broken brain) I feel like I need to create a reason. Twisted!

Anyway, I hope that you are able to move upwards from here & keep this as a reminder of why you need your healthier habits.
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Old 05-23-2006, 09:13 AM   #23  
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Linda I am a late to post, but I wanted to say we are here for you. You inner dialoge rang so true with me, because I have caught myself having the same discussion with my inner child. It sounds like you have your click back. I am getting there myself. We are all in this together.
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Old 05-23-2006, 10:23 AM   #24  
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Interesting comments from all of you. Especially that "one cookie" thought. I think the problem there is that when we say no to the first cookie, we feel strong, we feel powerful, we feel righteous. We've made a decision and we've stuck with it. Once we cave and have that one cookie, it is like a dam letting out a little bit of water. We know that a dam with a little leak in it won't stay strong, that water comes rushing through until the whole dam breaks.

It isn't that we can't plug the dam and stop at the one cookie IF we could feel as powerful and strong as we did originally. The problem is we feel weak after letting the one cookie in.

Some day I hope to be the sort of person who can make a decision about how much of something I will allow and learn to feel STRONG about making that decision and sticking to it.

I don't think it is a physical thing. I don't think there is something about that cookie that does something to our bodies and makes us need another. I really believe that it is a mental thing. We beat ourselves up in our perfectionism. "Oh well I already had one, I'm a failure, might as well have another."

Maybe in time we can learn to change those mental messages. Say HEY I did good. I only had ONE. I CAN learn to eat things I love in moderation.

For me it is easier not to go there in the first place too. But I'm sure that it is because I demand from myself too much perfectionism and if I can't do what I've set out to do "well enough", I tend to give up and let other things take over, instead of learning to have control while allowing small deviations.

About the feeling "crazy" thing. Oh yeah. Haven't I done that enough? In fact I tend to have those moments that "click" and make me decide I HAVE to start working at it again, (and I do) and then I have those "I don't give a ...." times too. I can never figure out why I will go from being SO good to total meltdown. I think it often has to do with the scale and the fact that "being good" doesn't always give me the results I'm looking for. Perfectionism again. Looking for tangible results, rather than just trying to live healthier.

Consistent healthier living should be the goal, not weight loss. The weight loss will follow in time if you do what you should be doing to treat your body well. We lose sight of that though. We tend to think (or at least I do) "I'm doing all this hard work, giving up things I love and what do I have to show for it? I'm still FAT FAT FAT". Duh. I didn't get here overnight and it isn't going away overnight, but for some stupid reason I keep wanting it to.

And then there is that other point. The one that really scares me. The point where I'm not really thin. I'm not any where close to my goal, but I start feeling better within my own body. I start feeling satisfied with just being "this fat". When the continued effort to lose more, seems silly when I feel good now. I didn't feel good at 282. I didn't feel good at 268 (both click points where I got back on plan). I didn't feel good yesterday when the scale had climbed back up to 248. So I'm back on plan. But I felt pretty good at 223. I felt pretty strong, pretty healthy and although not thin, I felt like I didn't have to keep on pushing for more weight loss (and the more pushing I did, the more frustrated I got when it wasn't happening).

I'm almost afraid to get to that point again. Why? I was so frustrated then. Didn't really care if I lost more, but as long as I was working so hard to lose, I wanted to see some results from my work, and it wasn't happening. I was at an ambivalent point and that is NO place to be when you are trying to lose weight.

That is when I really felt crazy.
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Old 05-23-2006, 10:34 AM   #25  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SherryA
It isn't that we can't plug the dam and stop at the one cookie IF we could feel as powerful and strong as we did originally. The problem is we feel weak after letting the one cookie in.
My body has a physical reaction to sugar. I don't like your implication that I'm mentally weak. Is an alcoholic mentally weak? Moderation is a great thing for everyone who is able to enjoy the one cookie. For me, I'm like a recovering drunk and I'll skip the cookie.

Last edited by Glory87; 05-27-2006 at 01:37 PM.
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Old 05-23-2006, 11:07 AM   #26  
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I don't think that she was saying that those who, through strength of will or personal choice, abstain from cookies are mentally weak.

The weakness is in the fact that we set ourselves up to be "Dietary Saints", and then if we "Sin", and eat the cookie, it becomes too easy to let ourselves fall from grace completely. Isn't it better to remain a human being? One who can sometimes faulter, but since that is the nature of being a human being that failure has no impact on our progress towards bettering ourselves?

Sometimes a cookie is just a cookie. It only becomes more when we give it that power.
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Old 05-23-2006, 11:21 AM   #27  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SherryA
It isn't that we can't plug the dam and stop at the one cookie IF we could feel as powerful and strong as we did originally. The problem is we feel weak after letting the one cookie in.
I really agree with this point. There are times when I'm doing well that I can have one cookie, or one dorito, or one french fry (which I did yesterday!)
But when I'm down, and making bad choices...there's no way. At those times, one DOES mean failure and that is my justification for eating the whole bag, or box, or whatever


Quote:
Originally Posted by SherryA
And then there is that other point. The one that really scares me. The point where I'm not really thin. I'm not any where close to my goal, but I start feeling better within my own body. I start feeling satisfied with just being "this fat". When the continued effort to lose more, seems silly when I feel good now.

This...is EXACTLY what happened to me! I hit 187 virgin fat territiory just before last Thanksgiving in October...I hadn't weighed that little since I gave birth to Liam when I was almost 20. I was feeling sexy, and proud, and my "free" days just started to increase. BUT, there was also this little fear in the back of my mind of what it would be like if I got past that point. Who would I be...I'd never been that thin, and I was really scared deep down.



Linda
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Old 05-23-2006, 01:11 PM   #28  
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good heavens Glory I didn't mean at all that you are mentally weak. I think sugar does affect us physically, but I don't think that one cookie means we have to eat the whole bag. I think that we just FEEL like we've failed when we eat the one, and then afterwards that feeling of no longer being proud of ourselves leads to more "failure". Most people CAN stop after one cookie if they are determined enough to. I mean if you are determined enough to not have the first one, isn't it possible to be AS determined to not have the second, but allow the first? I feel like for me it should be. But it isn't. Why? Because of my all or nothing attitude that I keep trying to get the better of.

Once I've let that little "sin" in the attitude tends to be "in for an inch, in for a mile". Why not let the inch be it? For many people it is enough. Thin people, don't deny themselves everything they love, they just make up thier minds how much of something they can have and then they stop themselves from going further. Us fatties tend to say "Oh well I blew it for today, I'll start again tomorrow." And then sometimes if we are really on a roll, tomorrow never comes.

I agree with you that you shouldn't have the first one if you know yourself and know that you can't stop at one. I tend to be the same way. I think that is STRENGTH, not weakness.

I would just like to find a way to train myself to know my limits, and find a way to limit quantity and still feel as good about myself as I feel when I don't have any. I really think that if I could reach that point, where I can say "yes" but in limited amounts, I will have conquered my weight issues.

My mother once told me something about conscience that I thought was really valuable. She told me that a strong conscience isn't something that says no to everything. Sometimes a strong conscience knows how to say yes too. A person who condemns themselves for every thing they do, doesn't have a strong conscience they can have a weak one, because they don't understand that there are times when it is ok to say yes to some things.

I realize that matters of conscience aren't the same as matters of weight loss and weight management, but I think there are parallels. If we feel guilty about every choice we make, we aren't strong. Someone strong is able to make choices without guilt, and make wise choices. I'm not there. I'd like to be, but I'm not. Sometimes I decide to lose weight and before I know it I'm feeling guilty about everything I eat and everything I don't eat. I'm feeling like I am not doing anything right. That state of mind is crazy making and scary, and it is counter productive too. Because after awhile of feeling that confused and bad, all I want to do is give up on my diet. NOT because I can't do it physically. Not because the foods I've made up my mind to not eat are calling to me so intensely, but because if I do screw up a little I condemn myself so fiercely for being "weak".

In reality, some elements of being strong are knowing when it is ok to allow a "little" but also to know how to limit that little. I wish I was there. Wish I knew how to do that. But I usually don't. I'm working on it though. Perfectionism defeats me, and so I'm working on trying to learn to be good "most of the time" rather than "all of the time" (until I'm not).

I tend to think deeply about the processes we are all going through, but mostly anything I write about is about myself and my personal thoughts and feelings on a matter. No one has to agree with me. If it doesn't hold true for you, that is fine. But please don't feel offended and please don't feel I'm attacking anyone, because I'm not. In reality I was agreeing with you, but also pointing out how I feel I should be able to handle it differently. It was not meant as any sort of judgment on anyone else.
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Old 05-23-2006, 01:20 PM   #29  
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Oh and Linda I know that scared feeling. It is weird isn't it? To be afraid of being thin? As though we had lost some part of ourselves and now won't know who we are anymore? Creepy and strange. Like a part of your mind starts sabotaging because it is scared and doesn't feel comfortable anymore. Wants everything to feel "normal" again even if normal was an area where we were miserable.

That is why I think weight loss has to be more than about what we put in our bodies, or how much exercise we get. We also have to explore why we do the things we do. Get to understand ourselves from the inside out. Ask ourselves what it is that we are REALLY afraid of? I think fear is sort of one of those things that really can't stand the light of day. It is like a vampire that will expire if you pull it out into the sun and really get a good look at it.

Fears can be conquered sometimes with simple questions like "What is the worst thing that can happen? And IF that worst thing happens CAN I deal with it?" Sometimes they then vanish in the mist, because that worst thing isn't near as bad as the unmentioned threat that our fears aren't really defining for us. Mention them, look at them, and suddenly they don't seem so scary. If we decide that the worst thing IS really as horrible as we imagine, and the answer is "no I couldn't handle that". Then we can take steps to make sure that worst thing doesn't happen. Then you kind of have to go on faith and take it slow. Allow yourself time to get used to the idea. To feel out the water as it were.
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Old 05-23-2006, 06:36 PM   #30  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SherryA
My mother once told me something about conscience that I thought was really valuable. She told me that a strong conscience isn't something that says no to everything. Sometimes a strong conscience knows how to say yes too. A person who condemns themselves for every thing they do, doesn't have a strong conscience they can have a weak one, because they don't understand that there are times when it is ok to say yes to some things.
That's an interesting idea! You've been raising some great points in your posts about moderation... something non-caloric to "chew on"
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