It all depends on what you want to spend your calories on. Milk and milk products have a lot of calories in general.
I actually like skim milk to drink but hate it on cereal, I use half and half on cereal but measure it carefully to keep the calories down.
I hate non fat sour cream and I also hate non fat cream cheese.
Low fat cream cheese is good but not the non fat, yuck.
I only eat the low fat versions of all dairy products and not very much of them to save calories that way I can eat more of the other food groups. I take 500mg of calcium twice a day and a multi-vitamin so I’m sure I’m getting calcium. Most dairy products are fortified with calcium which means the manufactures adds it to the product.
I stopped drinking milk altogether, I find myself not eating as much milk products as I use to and I am leaning more towards fruits and vegetables which are more pleasing to me. The full fat versions of dairy products have some saturated and Trans fats in them and those are the Fats that get the bad rap. I use to be one of those people that couldn’t imagine living without a gallon of milk in the fridge and lived on cheese and loved all other dairy products. It was hard to cut down but it was making me fat.
FYI, the link from Harvard you posted is full of junk science nonsense that isn't supported by the most current literature. Saturated fat has been demonized with very little proof to back it up, and to the contrary has been exonerated thoroughly by far more research than ever condemned it. Hydrogenated, processed fats are an issue, especially regarding rancidity and the damage they can cause our cells, but the fat naturally occurring in coconut oil, palm oil, and animal products is among the healthiest to consume.
If you're interesting in reading the research contrasting the conventional wisdom that link is espousing with the actual facts regarding healthy human diets, I have some links I can share. Otherwise, take my word for it and perhaps do some hunting around for current research on saturated fat and its' health benefits
I eat full fat cheese (except for the occasional 2% swiss), because cheese is sacred to me and I'd rather have a little of the good stuff than a bunch of the fat free ick that tastes like plastic.
I drink my coffee with half and half. I use full fat sour cream. These caloric difference in these things is negligible in some cases, but whatever the difference I account for it. The only place I go nonfat is with milk in my cereal, or with a latte on an occasional Starbucks run. Besides that, give me the good stuff or no stuff at all.
FYI, the link from Harvard you posted is full of junk science nonsense that isn't supported by the most current literature. Saturated fat has been demonized with very little proof to back it up, and to the contrary has been exonerated thoroughly by far more research than ever condemned it. Hydrogenated, processed fats are an issue, especially regarding rancidity and the damage they can cause our cells, but the fat naturally occurring in coconut oil, palm oil, and animal products is among the healthiest to consume.
If you're interesting in reading the research contrasting the conventional wisdom that link is espousing with the actual facts regarding healthy human diets, I have some links I can share. Otherwise, take my word for it and perhaps do some hunting around for current research on saturated fat and its' health benefits
I prefer to believe researchers and scientists at leading Medical Universities and prestigious hospitals before I would believe junk science OR some off the wall study done by an unqualified group in some foreign country.
Saturated Fats and trans fats are scientifically known to clog arteries and cause an array of diseases. If people want to eat bad fats that’s up to them but they should at least know the true facts. Clogged arteries cause heart attacks and strokes point blank.
6. Opt for low-fat dairy products
7. Cut down on saturated fat in cooking
8. Avoid palm and coconut oils
9. Avoid trans fats
10. Reduce dietary cholesterol
When choosing fats, pick unsaturated fat over saturated or trans fat. Here's how to know the difference.
Harmful dietary fat
The two main types of potentially harmful dietary fat:
Saturated fat. This is a type of fat that comes mainly from animal sources of food. Saturated fat raises total blood cholesterol levels and low-density lipoprotein (LDL) cholesterol levels, which can increase your risk of cardiovascular disease. Saturated fat may also increase your risk of type 2 diabetes.
Trans fat. This is a type of fat that occurs naturally in some foods, especially foods from animals. But most trans fats are made during food processing through partial hydrogenation of unsaturated fats. This process creates fats that are easier to cook with and less likely to spoil than are naturally occurring oils. These trans fats are called industrial or synthetic trans fats. Research studies show that synthetic trans fat can increase unhealthy LDL cholesterol and lower healthy high-density lipoprotein (HDL) cholesterol. This can increase your risk of cardiovascular disease.
Most fats that have a high percentage of saturated fat or trans fat are solid at room temperature. Because of this, they're typically referred to as solid fats. They include beef fat, pork fat, shortening, stick margarine and butter.
I eat TONS of eggs, full fat dairy, and coconut oil... I had high Cholesterol when I was overweight. My numbers are PERFECT now.
I had a 'cardiac event' last year, WITH low cholesterol, and low blood pressure. For me, these are not at all related. The only thing I've changed since then is completely cutting out processed trans fats. I still consume coconut oils and eggs, probably more than I did before.
After biweekly visits with the cardiologist for the last 12 months, I'm finally in the 'clear'. I only have to go see her every 6 months now.
It may be anectdotal, but my doctor has certainly taken note... it's interesting.
Again, are you considering the paradigm that research falls into, and that there is a particular narrative that mainstream nutritional philosophy has adopted that ignores data it disagrees with or manipulates the data to draw misleading statistical 'conclusions'? That lipid theory has been debunked almost entirely, and while I have no time or interest in tearing up the information in each one of your links, I would encourage you to do a little reading into more current data on the subject. As I said before, saturated fats have been exonerated and dietary cholesterol has little to no impact on blood serum cholesterol.
If you want to categorize some fats as 'bad', you're villainizing the wrong ones. Here is some food for thought on cholesterol (food and blood serum), fats, and a quick take on the studies looking into them. Being a prior believer in conventional wisdom it was quite gratifying to be educated beyond the bad science I was being fed by the mainstream nutrition industry. I was well enough convinced to do a complete 180.
I always ate full fat dairy products. I grew up on a dairy farm. Loved the taste, The only side effect for me was the open heart surgery cardiac bypass I had in April last year. My main heart artery called the widow maker by my cardiologist was 85% blocked by fatty deposits. My cardiologist suggested a diet change, he said my blockage did not come from eating fruits and vegetables.
I reluctantly changed my diet and now a year later I am fully used to the low and non fat dairy products.
Glad to hear you're on the mend. There is nothing better than modern American medical science. I also, know someone who has been thin all his life and after 52 years of eating whole fat foods, sugar, butter and refined flour had a heart artery that was 90% blocked and Polyps in his colon.
My friend had great insurance and it still cost him around 6 grand out of pocket to mend himself the insurance paid around 70k. That was over a year ago and he still is on meds and has doctor appointments and the out of pocket costs haven't stopped.
He told me that he thought his mother tried to kill him by feeding him baked goods and trans fats all his life and making him get hooked on them. What people don't realize is it takes a long time for your body to break down to the point to where you have a heart attack and other health problems.
I'm glad to see you have changed your ways and you’re on the right path to good health. I am taking the safe road to old age and watching what I eat.
As, for those who choose to ignore the warnings signs: You know what they say, "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink."
my cholestrol is also perfect even being as overweight as i am .... my doctor says dairy is important to my overall wellbeing as i dont eat much meat ...
Glad to hear you're on the mend. There is nothing better than modern American medical science. I also, know someone who has been thin all his life and after 52 years of eating whole fat foods, sugar, butter and refined flour had a heart artery that was 90% blocked and Polyps in his colon.
My friend had great insurance and it still cost him around 6 grand out of pocket to mend himself the insurance paid around 70k. That was over a year ago and he still is on meds and has doctor appointments and the out of pocket costs haven't stopped.
He told me that he thought his mother tried to kill him by feeding him baked goods and trans fats all his life and making him get hooked on them. What people don't realize is it takes a long time for your body to break down to the point to where you have a heart attack and other health problems.
I'm glad to see you have changed your ways and you’re on the right path to good health. I am taking the safe road to old age and watching what I eat.
As, for those who choose to ignore the warnings signs: You know what they say, "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink."
.
O_o
Wait. So I linked both the soundly scientific basis of lipid metabolism AND easy-to-understand analysis of the latest, most cutting edge research into the field from a well respected analyst (Lyle McDonald is great, I highly recommend his work!) and you come back with a tangential, slightly jingoistic jab that doesn't even apply, given that the bulk of the studies cited were conducted by American research groups and Universities after the older recommendations were called into questions based on their poor methodology?
We ALL watch what we eat here and are looking for the best health possible. And yet you would not consider for a moment that the conclusions and recommendations that have correlated strongly with a fatter, sicker America might be suspect and more research into that area supports it?
To turn a phrase, I've given you an excellent watering hole to delve into if you're interested in learning. If not, by all means enjoy your diet.
Wait. So I linked both the soundly scientific basis of lipid metabolism AND easy-to-understand analysis of the latest, most cutting edge research into the field from a well respected analyst (Lyle McDonald is great, I highly recommend his work!) and you come back with a tangential, slightly jingoistic jab that doesn't even apply, given that the bulk of the studies cited were conducted by American research groups and Universities after the older recommendations were called into questions based on their poor methodology?
We ALL watch what we eat here and are looking for the best health possible. And yet you would not consider for a moment that the conclusions and recommendations that have correlated strongly with a fatter, sicker America might be suspect and more research into that area supports it?
To turn a phrase, I've given you an excellent watering hole to delve into if you're interested in learning. If not, by all means enjoy your diet.
Thank you, as I said not everyone has a problem. On the other hand I consider the Mayo Clinic to be a very highly respected and a knowledgeable source of medical information.
About 5 years ago I had an angiogram and the cardiologist said I had the arteries of a teenager. No blockages what ever. I was over weight and I selected the Atkins Diet which I followed religiously.
In four years I went from no blockage to 85% blockage.
For me and only for me I have had a disastrous result from following a high fat low carb diet routine. It could be a coincidence but I choose to stop risking it based on my experience.
We need not be disagreeable but we should simply agree to disagree.
Larry, I'd never discount your personal experience with a condition - obviously you ended up with blocked arteries, as indicated by the surgery. But correlation doesn't equal causation and while something in Atkins may have exacerbated the inflammatory response in your vascular system, there is little support for animal fat having been that culprit, if we're talking about what the current body of research indicates. My bothering to link to additional information on the topic was for the educational purposes of those still touting the lipid theory of cholesterol/inflammation, which was a bad construing of the data at the time of its' conception and has since been widely disproved.
That doesn't been other dietary factors aren't linked with inflammation - quite the contrary, heredity aside (and that is by far the most dominant factor of arterial damage) many foods and chemicals are showing signs that they can precipitate immune responses within our blood and cause the protective effects of circulating cholesterol to kick in. It's fascinating research, actually!
Mayo is reliable on certain topics and less so on others, when it comes to their online article content. Their actual clinical interventions are where their reputation is well deserved and some of their epidemiology research is fabulous, too. But on this point, they are recycling conventional wisdom on the topic at hand more than interpreting the full body of data with fresh eyes and no preconceptions (in my opinion, obviously).
I can't comment on Atkins, for as many people as I know had great improvements in their blood chemistry still more encountered difficulties, and it isn't a mode of eating I ascribe to, but I am a big fan of everyone finding what works for them and sticking with it! If that is low fat, excellent. My contention with the original post referenced in this thread of discussion was the claims of low fat diets being health promoting and saturated fat being health deteriorating, which is contrary to the majority of literature on the subject available at this time. Things change as we learn more, and saturated fat as a causal factor in vascular and endocrine dysfunction is unsupported. The few studies that have been referenced to conclude that, including the ones the original dietary guidelines were established upon, were manipulated in intellectually grievous ways to show conclusions the data they gathered didn't actually support. That's where my bone to pick was, and what the links I provided discuss in detail.
I cannot argue with your n=1 sample, you are the authority and director of your own body, but the mechanisms that cause your (or my own!) experience aren't always what they appear to be based on simple observation. My appeal is to the science of animal and plant lipids as being more conclusive for understanding dietary recommendations, not to prove or disprove an individual's experiences, which are affected by many more complex factors than the absence or presence of saturated animal fat and saturated plant lipids.
And that's my .02
Last edited by Arctic Mama; 04-04-2012 at 07:59 PM.
About 5 years ago I had an angiogram and the cardiologist said I had the arteries of a teenager. No blockages what ever. I was over weight and I selected the Atkins Diet which I followed religiously. In four years I went from no blockage to 85% blockage.
Whoah, LARRY ~ I'm so glad that you are doing better now. Now that paragraph says more about a high-fat diet, than just dairy products. Now, we are not advocating eating high-fat diets per se, or high-fat dairy in copious amounts either -- well, I know I'm not.
I also eat a lower-fat diet -- I eat butter rarely, maybe once a year; low-fat meat all the time (removing skin & all visible fat), 1% or 2% milk; 10% cream only occasionally. My yogurt is lower or no fat simply becuz I eat the one I like, and I'm watching the sugar too.
For me, the biggest exception is CHEESE: I eat regular cheese (in measured portions) simply becuz the low fat ones are like rubber with no taste at all, or they have some weird flavor that I haven't quite put my finger on yet ...
Overall, I wouldn't say that I eat a lot of dairy though, but I think we have to remember what the original question was. OP just wanted to know if we ate lowfat or nofat verses regular fat dairy products.
Thanks for sharing your experience though; it was interesting to read, and once again, I'm glad you have recovered from that ...
Whoah, LARRY ~ I'm so glad that you are doing better now. Now that paragraph says more about a high-fat diet, than just dairy products. Now, we are not advocating eating high-fat diets per se, or high-fat dairy in copious amounts either -- well, I know I'm not.
I also eat a lower-fat diet -- I eat butter rarely, maybe once a year; low-fat meat all the time (removing skin & all visible fat), 1% or 2% milk; 10% cream only occasionally. My yogurt is lower or no fat simply becuz I eat the one I like, and I'm watching the sugar too.
For me, the biggest exception is CHEESE: I eat regular cheese (in measured portions) simply becuz the low fat ones are like rubber with no taste at all, or they have some weird flavor that I haven't quite put my finger on yet ...
Overall, I wouldn't say that I eat a lot of dairy though, but I think we have to remember what the original question was. OP just wanted to know if we ate lowfat or nofat verses regular fat dairy products.
Thanks for sharing your experience though; it was interesting to read, and once again, I'm glad you have recovered from that ...
Thank you for the kind words. I see you are from Ontario, Canada I spent about half my childhood in Ontario. I lived in a suburb of Buffalo, NY just across the Niagara River. Moved permanently to Florida 2 1/2 years ago.
To answer that original question I now eat predominately low fat or non fat but on occasion will have regular butter or regular American style bacon instead of my regular turkey bacon. I pretty much only use non fat cheese and find that when melted the flavor greatly improves. Milk I split the difference and use 2% because that is all my wife will drink. I don't use enough milk to justify buying a 1/2 gallon of skim. (quarts are almost impossible to find in this part of Florida)
