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LWL #148 Week of 3/29 - 4/4 2004

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Old 03-29-2004, 09:41 AM   #1
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Default LWL #148 Week of 3/29 - 4/4 2004

Oh my goodness! Oh my goodness!!! It's 9:45 EST and no one has started a thread for the week! Woo hoo! That means I get to do it for the first time! hahahaha...it's the little things that make me happy. Hopefully I did the title name right.

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Old 03-29-2004, 10:22 AM   #2
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Well, daughters B day party went well. Next day had relatives over for lasagna and cake for my D's and S-son's b-days (my SS bday was last week).
Well, today i am FUMING. i should know if i invite my mother-in-law over that she'll end up staying the entire weekend!! She stayed over night and was here all day yesterday! and when she is here, my husband and step son treat me like crap. My husband had an entire day to paint the baby's bedroom, but instead of just getting it done, he moaned and whined to his mommy all day about having to do it and only ended up getting 1 coat of paint on 3 walls of an 8x10 bedroom! I on the other hand, cleaned out the entire garage by myself (you couldn't even walk through there it was so dirty and cluttered- my husband and step son's doing) without anyone having to nag ME, meanwhile my mother-in-law is doing my husband's laundry that he is supposed to do every sunday, and then at 5pm she's announcing how great of a job my husband did by finishing 1/4 of the project of painting the room, and whisks him away to Home Depot so they could go shopping. And when i go to take a shower, i find all the wet paint rollers and brushes, sitting there in the tub. He said he would put another coat of paint on the bedroom when he got home from home depot, well that was 8:30pm and instead he watched TV and then said he was too tired. so the baby had to sleep with me last night because her room is in shambles, indefinitely.

Sorry, i'm just venting, it's better than spending my time plotting revenge. I just decide my husband is sleeping on the couch untill he finishes his chore. AND, mental note- do not allow mother-in-law to spend the night ever again. Well atleast i managed to dig out the weight bench from underneath layers of boxes and garbage and junk, so now i can start my weight routine again, at home. No time today though, gotta be somewhere at noon.
-E
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Old 03-29-2004, 10:45 AM   #3
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Good News!!

One and a half pound more gone!!!! :

YAY Monday!

E - I think you need to have a talk with your DH. How he treats you is total doo-doo and you shouldn't have to put up with it.

I hope that everyone has a great productive Monday and don't forget the coffee!

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Old 03-29-2004, 10:46 AM   #4
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Hi all,

That bites Elasky. Perhaps you should have buried MIL in the garage.

Where is everybody? Waiting to hear about the weekend, Dip, the wedding JC, and EVERYTHING else from EVERYBODY else.

I am proud to say that I am down on the scale for 5 straight weeks!!!! I got in all my workouts this past weekend as well as getting to the gym this a.m. However, I couldn't finish my 30 minute track run today. My right quad started killing me and my leg sort of collapsed. I didn't fall, but after a few more laps it really started hurting so I stopped before I did real damage. That depressed me so my back and abs workout wasn't as good as it could have been. I will try to re-work those areas in with another body part this week.

I am at the weight / size that I get to before I fall off the wagon. This is scary to me. I can fit into most everything in my closet now and the scale is down to 155. My goal is another 20# loss and to be too small for what's in my closet. I hope I don't blow it. Having a routine that leaves my evenings free is working for me so far. The biggest problem I see as the days get longer is that I won't get to bed in time to get up at 4AM. I better get my life/house more organized and QUICK before the time changes. If not, I'll be in big trouble.

My weekend was cool - spent Saturday night at an arcade playing old and new video games. Man I love Ms. Pacman. It was GREAT!
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Old 03-29-2004, 01:37 PM   #5
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I have a question, I would have asked on the new BFL thread, but it has been closed now. Question is Mrs. Jim mentioned a plan called "BFFM" what is it?

Thanks
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Old 03-29-2004, 01:58 PM   #6
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Good Morning y'all!

Babysteps: BFFM = "Burn the Fat, Feed the Muscle" - it's an ebook by Tom Venuto that we've discussed in the past at length. One of his articles is quoted on the "Articles Worth Reading" sticky at the top of this forum. Many of us here have read BFFM, and have found that while he's not really saying anything NEW (kinda how Dr. Phil has said "he didn't reinvent the wheel" with his 7 Keys book) he lays it out very nicely indeed. He doesn't give a structured diet/exercise program in the book though. And his diet suggestions don't work for everyone - I know that our Mel had problems trying to implement his suggestion of bringing up the carbs. Dip and some others here have also read BFFM, and can give you their opinions. Venuto's website is at fitren.com if you want to check it out - he has a pretty informative e-newsletter.

Tiki - WTG on the scale and keeping up the progress! You know I'm having the same problem - going to bed before 9 to get up at 4 am? I do enjoy watching the sun come up from the gym windows though...but once the days grow even longer, I'm going to want to be OUT and ABOUT until it gets dark.

This weekend was TOTALLY awesome - Saturday Jim and I drove up to the Santa Rosa All-Arabian Horse Show and had a great time cheering on the 'home team' and helping out in the sidelines. Then Sunday was GORGEOUS - spent a good part of the afternoon with Dakota and then went on a late-afternoon walk with my baby sister. Of course you'll notice that HOUSEWORK is not mentioned here which means that naturally our apartment is ankle deep in acculmulated cat hair!! Sheesh. Someone needs to invent a cat vacumn like the ones they use on horses, of course no self-respecting cat would get within 25 feet of a running vacumn...ai yiyi!
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Old 03-29-2004, 04:56 PM   #7
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That cat vacuum has already been invented. I saw it in a pet supplies catalog that I receive. However, I can't imagine any cat (undrugged) standing still for the process. I think even my declawed purr-ball would try to kill me if I tried to use it on her.

Yesterday pooch and I went for a long run, and I think we're both getting too old for that. She flaked out for about 5 hours afterwards, and my back and knees are killing me What makes it worse is that I rearraged my split so that today was leg day. Worst leg day in history I felt like an incredible wimp, but I barely made it home awake. End of running- it's low impact for me from now on.

Hey Tik! Congratulations on the scale being down. Wohoo! Getting there If you have head problems approaching a particular scale number, why not put it away for a while? (From one who always has had problems!) Be careful running on a sore quad, you could set yourself back for a while.

AAB- You're on fire! Sounds like you are doing great How are you managing to eat clean in the land of beer and sausages and potatoes?

Where is everyone? Cindy? JC? Jen? Meg?

Hi Babysteps!

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Old 03-29-2004, 05:15 PM   #8
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It has been indicated to me that starting a Body for Life/Eating for Life thread anywhere on 3 Fat Chicks would be splintering off from the LWL thread and breaking down the cohesivenss of LWL. Is this the general consensus? Other diet groups (WW and South Beach Diet come to mind) have threads w/out taking away from LWL. LWL has been a great place for me for a long time, I know there will always be something for me to learn here. On the other hand, I don't always feel comfortable posting here and therefore post other places as well. I would very much like to see a place where people wanting information or wanting to make comments about BFL or EFL could do so without being limited to LWL and could in fact enjoy a thread devoted to that diet specifically. I don't think people that enjoy posting here are going to stop and I don't think people hearing about BFL for the first time someplace else would not eventually make there way over here for valuable information. Obviously it isn't going to happen on this page, but is it so horrible to have that as an option, say under General Diet Plans? At the risk of being cut off again I would like to know if I am alone on this and should drop it as an idea that everyone thinks is bad or if my feeling on this has some validity.
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Old 03-29-2004, 05:51 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ledom
It has been indicated to me that starting a Body for Life/Eating for Life thread anywhere on 3 Fat Chicks would be splintering off from the LWL thread and breaking down the cohesivenss of LWL. Is this the general consensus? Other diet groups (WW and South Beach Diet come to mind) have threads w/out taking away from LWL. LWL has been a great place for me for a long time, I know there will always be something for me to learn here. On the other hand, I don't always feel comfortable posting here and therefore post other places as well. I would very much like to see a place where people wanting information or wanting to make comments about BFL or EFL could do so without being limited to LWL and could in fact enjoy a thread devoted to that diet specifically. I don't think people that enjoy posting here are going to stop and I don't think people hearing about BFL for the first time someplace else would not eventually make there way over here for valuable information. Obviously it isn't going to happen on this page, but is it so horrible to have that as an option, say under General Diet Plans? At the risk of being cut off again I would like to know if I am alone on this and should drop it as an idea that everyone thinks is bad or if my feeling on this has some validity.
Question: Why would you feel that LWL is "limiting"?

As you know, this forum originally started as a Body for Life forum. Many of us here started out on our bodybuilding journey through BFL, and some of us, I'm sure, are still doing the program. Many of us have gone on to other programs or have always 'done our own thing' i.e. splits and nutrition. What about the people who are not doing, or have never done, any 'formal' plan - where do THEY go? We all learn so much from what everyone is doing - and there is SO much overlap between all the plans - it comes down to what Meg calls the 'holy trinity' of cardio, weights, and clean nutrition.

I lurk at other forums and I have seen what happens when there is splintering of a group into different plans - it becomes very combative, defensive and argumentative, where everyone thinks that the particular plan THEY are following is THE RIGHT ONE. Kind of like politics or religion in a way. (That's why this forum does not endorse any one plan or program.

I was just going through some of the VERY old posts here in LWL. The weekly thread used to be titled "BFL" then "BFL/BB" then just to Bodybuilding (for one week), then to our current Ladies who Lift.

A year ago I wrote this post:

Quote:
This is *NOT* strictly a Body for Life board - this board started as a small BFL thread a couple years ago, but if you read the posts you'll find that the VAST majority of us here are doing other plans, centered on weight training - which is why I asked Suzanne to change the name of the forum, and ultimately to move it out of Diet Plans and next to the Exercise forum, which is really where it belongs IMO.

In fact, many of the 'regulars' (and I'm including the many new folks that have signed on recently - hi y'all ) have been following the bodybuilding lifestyle for quite some time now and (myself included) LOVE this way of life and enjoy finding new challenges for themselves rather than getting to a 'goal weight'.

I maintain that BFL is a wonderful way to get started in weight training but there are many other plans out there that incorporate the same principles of weight training, cardio (or not!), and balanced eating of healthy clean foods as a permanent lifestyle change - whatever 'clicks' with an individual is ultimately what works for them.

Just wanted to put in my two cents here...and not make this an ongoing debate about who is right or wrong. Again, we all need to make our own choices...
And as I stated to you earlier today via PM:
Quote:
I feel (and so do the other moderators I've discussed this with) that if we begin to splinter off the support group by WOE, then we will lose the cohesiveness of the group as a whole, which has made LWL so supportive for so long. As I stated, we're all traveling the same path with clean nutrition, strength training, and cardio as the nucleus.
Ledom, if you want to start a thread at General Diet Plans about BFL, of course you're free to do so (I never said anything about forums outside LWL), but here at LWL the policy is not to endorse any one plan over the other...we're all in this together, supporting and helping each other. We are all on the same path using the same tools, albeit with different tweaks.

And incidentally, the original Body for Life basic startup info (written originally by our own Susanje) is STILL available in the Basic Bodybuilding Info sticky here in this forum...

There's my two cents on that topic...
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Old 03-29-2004, 06:28 PM   #10
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Why do I feel LWL is limiting? Well, Karen I just do. That isn't a crime, every thread can't be everything to everybody can it? Dynamics change, peoples interest change, proof positive is the fact that this thread started as one thing and ended up as something else. Does it have to stop evolving?

quote from the PM you sent me
"If you want to start a thread at General Diet Plans (or discuss it at your "The Plan" thread there), then that's your perogative, of course - however, I feel (and so do the other moderators I've discussed this with) that if we begin to splinter off the support group by WOE, then we will lose the cohesiveness of the group as a whole..."

I took that to mean it was a bad thing for me to start a thread elsewhere because it would somehow threaten this thread.

I am not a person who enjoys confrontation - I am not enjoying this. On the other hand, having a thread I started so abruptly curtailed makes me wonder what is going on. Am I being blackballed here? That thread could have died a natural death if no one was interested, or it might have taken off into a whole wonderful new conversation.

I think you may have to worry that there would be a group that isn't entirely happy posting here and would like an alternative. I have received several PM's indicating just that. But, that is not my purpose at all in wanting a BFL thread. I was drawn to this thread initially because it was BFL and I was sorry when it changed. I was in the minority and I didn't say anything. Now I see a resurgence of interest, mirrored by my own resurgent interest and that is why I started the thread. I think it would be much less devisive if it were on this page than another page, but then if it isn't welcome it isn't welcome.

The thing is Karen, I know what you think. I am interested to know what other people think. One of the things I have always appreciated about 3fc in general was that there seemed to be a place for everybody and there wasn't a lot of censoring going on with the exception of hatefulness, foul language or advertising. I believe it will stay that way despite you or me.
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Old 03-29-2004, 06:40 PM   #11
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Just thought I would offer an opinion on this. I think a thread for BFL is a good idea, I think people who are just starting out doing the same plan would have much to share. I also think if someone was just starting out on BRX or any other they should be able to start a group. I dont think there is anything wrong with having a thread for people doing a particular program. If not then why have a whole section here devoted to lifting, if in fact all it is really is a weekly thread? Anyway, thats my opinion. I also think new people may find it less intimidating to post on a thread with folks just starting out on the plan they are, rather then post on this weekly thread where it becomes a lot of personal, life stuff, not always about lifting. Also...gosh I hate to say, but, I think it, so here goes.....its a bit clicky here, in that, you all have so much history, and are so well established in your way of life, it feels hard to elbow in so to speak, especially when you are new and weak. Dont yell at me for sharing how I feel, ok, just appreciate that Im honest. Hope I did not offend.

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Old 03-29-2004, 06:53 PM   #12
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My input:

Had this been a BFL forum, I probably would have stopped posting a long time ago. Not because I wouldn't enjoy the topics of the forum but because I no longer follow that plan. Although that's where I started out, it's not where I ended up. Once I quit the plan, I would have felt hypocritical to post in that forum.

Because LWL is a general weight-lifting forum, I have never felt as if I didn't belong. I find that specificity is limiting. That is also why I have never joined a specific group in this forum that is food related (i.e. South Beach, WW, etc).

Does that mean that other people wouldn't enjoy or benefit from a BFL group? Heck no. Obviously there are people out there who want to join very "program specific" groups. I'm just not one of those people.
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Old 03-29-2004, 06:59 PM   #13
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Babysteps -- of course you haven't offended anyone with your opinion! Certainly some people prefer to post on a thread that deals specifically with a certain diet plan and that's great. 3FC has tons of threads and groups like that. Some are in the WW section, some the low-carb section, some in General Diet Plans and some in Support Groups. Anyone -- even you -- can start a new thread centered on a plan in any of those places.

LWL is a little different. We're kind of the "big tent" for weightlifting and the weightlifting lifestyle. We don't promote (or bash) any plan; many of us aren't doing any formal plan but our own. I've never done BFL or BRX or any formal plan myself but gather so much useful information from the group. I'd hate to lose that sharing of information that we have now.

If you scroll down the page of LWL threads, you'll see our weekly threads and lots of subtopics, like running shoes and goals and delights. What you won't see is subgroups. Whenever we get a new poster who asks about a plan (like BFL), they've always been invited onto the main thread for a special Ilene welcome and everyone's input.

As I said, there's plenty of other places at 3FC for any member to set up a group exclusively for one particular diet plan rather than the general weightlifting lifestyle that's LWL's focus. 3FC is a huge place and there's lots of room for everyone.
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Old 03-29-2004, 07:05 PM   #14
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Other diet groups such as WW and South Beach Diet do have other threads but this forum concentrates on the weight lifting side of our plans and the diet side is extremely varied for everyone. It is our exercise choice which binds us on this thread not necessarily our eating habits. I believe that our diversity makes us stronger, both plan wise and culturally as well.

Ledom if you donítí feel comfortable posting here then thatís cool mate. But I donít see why the thread needs to be split into BFL and non-BFL issues. Also, if you donít enjoy the BFL discussions on this thread then there are literally hundreds of other BFL websites that you could join and discuss aspects of BFL & EFL there. With all due respect I think that part of the reason you donít like posting here is because some people make you feel uncomfortable for some reason unbeknownst to me. You are right on though every thread isnít everything to everyone and neither should it be.

You arenít being blackballed here and I donít know what has happened to make you feel this way. I also think that there always will be a group who that isnít entirely happy posting here and thatís ok. As you said previously you canít be everything to everyone. Should we worry about it? No I donít think so. We arenít politicians trying to get a majority vote here. If I worried about making sure everyone was happy with what was going on I would drive myself crazy.

There is a big difference between censoring and respecting other peopleís needs. I donít think that we censor people here but I do think that we respect the difficult journey that we are all going through and we do our utmost to aid in the journey and not hinder it. If that means being careful about certain issues then so be it, I would rather put myself out to help someone else if it really isnít a big deal to me but it is to them.

As far as confrontation is concerned I think that itís a normal part of life and I welcome it with open arms Ė anyone out there please feel free to criticise me or add to what I have said. I enjoy learning about other peopleís perspectives and also trying to increase my empathetic abilities.

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Old 03-29-2004, 07:10 PM   #15
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Babysteps - I was part of a website once that a lot of people here know about where they split the board up into plans and different areas of lifting such as competition, beginners, BFL, BodyRx etc. The place basically died within a few months and is 10 times slower now than it used to be. The division isolated different groups and so people's interest wained after a while and it came a bit competitive as well.

I really don't want to see that happen here.

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