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Changing calroies due to more weight training?

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Old 07-17-2008, 01:48 PM   #1
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Default Changing calroies due to more weight training?

So i posted this over in the calorie counters forum. but someone suggested i ask the ladies over here which i thought was a great idea.

I started my journey in march. So far i have lost 30lbs which i am very happy about. Since i started calorie counting i have been at 1600cals a day and have had great success with it. When i first started i was working out a lot with weights. Then my workouts slowed down a little. The past 3 weeks i have kicked up the exercise quite a bit. Not outrageous or anything more than a lot of people. I went from workin gout maybe 3days a week. day1-yoga for 60min day2&3-15min warm up 45 min weights

Now i am working out 5-6 days a week. Most days consist of 40-60min cardio and 30-45min weights. This does vary a little, but its pretty accurate. I have lost only 1/2lb in the past almost month. I know plateaus happen and im not freaking out about it. I was just wondering if you all think i should stay at 1600. Try going lower or adding a little bit? Oh yea i am 20, 5'5 and 214lbs if that helps any. Thanks!
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Old 07-17-2008, 02:12 PM   #2
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Have you taken any circumference measurements? Have you been tracking bodyfat% in anyway? How have your clothes been fitting?

There are many ways of tracking body composition changes other than the scale. In fact the scale, while the easiest and most widely available, is probably the worst in tracking bodyfat composition as the scale treats water, fat, and muscle equally.

It's impossible to say what you should do with your calories because going strictly by scale weight we have no idea if you have plateaud, are retaining water, or have actually managed to build muscle at the same time as losing fat. The advice most definitely would be different if we knew you lost 1.5 lbs of fat and gained a 1b of muscle than if we knew you lost .25lbs of fat and lost .25lbs of muscle. In the first case, you would be doing great. In the second case, you would not be doing very well and would need to change something. According to the scale, however, both cases would be treated the same.

If you are not tracking in other ways than the scale, you really should start now. If you have been tracking other ways, give us that valuable info and we'll see if we can help you workshop your plan.

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Old 07-17-2008, 02:24 PM   #3
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I wont be able to check my emasurements for another week or so. I have to do it at a specific gym location. I can never do it right. Clothes havent been getting any loser lately and i dont know of anywhere i can get my bodyfat measured. The ladies at the gym dont do it. Every once in a while they have someone come in but the last time i missed it.
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Old 07-17-2008, 02:35 PM   #4
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If you haven't already, I would try interval and/or circuit training. Overhaul your cardio routine.

This is just my personal opinion and I probably shouldn't say this, but I would also drop my caloric intake for a week just to see what happens. But I wouldn't go lower than 1200-1300. At the very least, I would change up how I'm taking in 1600 calories. Do you know your fat/carb/protein ratios?
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Old 07-17-2008, 02:44 PM   #5
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Well, at you height/weight/age, 1600 calories is already about 200 calories below your BMR and less than 8 calories per lb of bodyweight, so I would be very hesitant to lower calories any further.

Your activity level is great, so I would have to say that if the scale has suddenly stopped moving and your clothes are about the same, it is probably water retention/bloat. Or it could be some hormonal stuff going on. Perhaps one of the ladies would have some insight on that.

The only thing I would change at this point, would be to maybe up the intensity a bit. If the cardio is low-intensity steady state, move to moderate intensity steady state. If it's already moderate, then move to aerobic intervals. If it's already aerobic intervals, move to HIIT.

On the resistance days, try to reducing rest times between sets and/or lower the reps but up the weight but keep the total number of weight lifted either the same or higher.

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Old 07-17-2008, 02:47 PM   #6
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Trust me on this, unless she has actually had her BMR checked (and not estimated), there's no guarantee that she's burning 1800. Those figures are rough estimates on what should happen. They are not very accurate. I personally do BMR screens as a part of my career and it's extremely rare that a female is burning 1800 at her basal rate.
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Old 07-17-2008, 02:57 PM   #7
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Maybe you are privy to some information other than what is in this post. But you are recommending that she drop to as low as 5.6 calories per lb of bodyweight. I'm not willing to do that from an internet post. Before I suggest to anyone, especially someone who I know from one internet post, to drop calories that low, I would have them see a physician. Hey, I'm just responsible that way.

However, if you are a medical professional and are more familiar with her case, then you can make those assessments.

Also, she is still a good deal from goal, so when she plateaus again at 5.6 calories per lb of BW, what are you going to do next?

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Old 07-17-2008, 03:02 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Depalma View Post
Maybe you are privy to some information other than what is in this post. But you are recommending that she drop to as low as 5.6 calories per lb of bodyweight. I'm not willing to do that from an internet post. Before I suggest to anyone, especially someone who I know from one internet post, to drop calories that low, I would have them see a physician. Hey, I'm just responsible that way.

However, if you are a medical professional and are more familiar with her case, then you can make those assessments.
But I'm not giving her medical advice. I gave her personal advice on what I would do to get to the root of why she isn't losing weight right now. I suggested that she temporarily decrease her calories (to a level that is still acceptable for a female) to see what would happen.

And again, those formulas and calculators tend to overestimate the calories needed for an overweight or obese person just as they underestimate the caloric needs of an athlete. It's the same deal as those BMI and height/weight charts. They can be good for references but they don't take into account the entire picture.

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Old 07-17-2008, 03:04 PM   #9
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A couple of thoughts.

When you are lifting weights, your muscles retain water and fluid as part of the "healing" process. It's entirely possible that you are losing body fat but it's not registering on the scale because your muscles are holding on to a lot of water.

Also I've become a big fan of HIIT cardio ... I alternate weight lifting days (3x per week) with HIIT cardio days (2 or 3 a week) and it helped kick me out of a stall.

Finally, I think your calories might be ok, but I'm wondering what your macro percentages are. In other words, how much of that is carbs, how much protein, and how much fat? If you're doing a lot more intense weight lifting, I'd think about trying to fit in more protein.

That's off the top of my head w/out knowing more.

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Old 07-17-2008, 03:11 PM   #10
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Yes, BMR chart can overestimate. I agree. But I don't agree that dropping someone to 5.6 calories per lb of bodyweight is reasonable for any gender. And who mentioned BMI, those charts are useless as they make fat and muscle equals.

Oh, and again, when she plateaus again, what are you going to do, drop her further? You conveniently sidestepped this question.

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Old 07-17-2008, 03:16 PM   #11
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[quote=Depalma;2274336]Yes, BMR chart can overestimate. I agree. But I don't agree that dropping someone to 5.6 calories per lb of bodyweight is reasonable for any gender. And who mentioned BMI, those charts are useless as they make fat and muscle equals.[/QUOTE]


Exactly, lol. The BMR charts actually do the same thing. We agree that muscle is more metabolically active than fat. A 5'6" female weighing 215 with say, 25% body fat would be estimated as having the same BMR as a 5'6" female weighing 215 with 35% body fat.
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Old 07-17-2008, 03:24 PM   #12
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Please stop side stepping the original question. What do you do when she plateaus again at 5.6 calories per lb of body weight?
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Old 07-17-2008, 03:25 PM   #13
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Remember, we are talking about an active person in the real world, not someone in a hospital controlled setting doing a medically supervised VLCD with lesser activity.
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Old 07-17-2008, 03:30 PM   #14
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Quote:
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Please stop side stepping the original question. What do you do when she plateaus again at 5.6 calories per lb of body weight?

I never saw that as the original question...??? Surely you see that I never suggested a long term decrease in calories to 1200-1300. I suggested 1 week just to get a feel on what's happening. I also suggested that she tweak her exercise routine AND possibly reevaluate how she's taking in 1600 calories. Eating the same number of calories pretty much the same way and doing the same amount and type of exercise is bound to cause a plateau. Her body is used to this routine.

Now, please stop side stepping my original advice on a 1 week calorie decrease to see if she could bust her plateau. You responded with BMR and my response was hold on there, she may not be using 1800 as her resting/basal rate to begin with.
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Old 07-17-2008, 03:30 PM   #15
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Quote:

Exactly, lol. The BMR charts actually do the same thing. We agree that muscle is more metabolically active than fat. A 5'6" female weighing 215 with say, 25% body fat would be estimated as having the same BMR as a 5'6" female weighing 215 with 35% body fat.

Right, which is why we go to testing! We don't just assume they are off and drastically cut calories. We get the facts! It's not just cut and then cut some more on the next plateau. When do you stop cutting?

The charts are rough rules of thumb, but when something doesn't jive with the rules of thumb, you either try other things or get checked by a qualified medical professional. Since you say you do this for a living, I would think, that advising to have tests done would be the first thing you do rather than slash calories to extremely low levels.
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