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Old 12-30-2008, 11:08 PM   #46  
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Interesting topic.

Eat less, move more, repeat. That is the KISS principle/solution.

However it's not always that simple.

My DH is one of those skinny guys who could have the worst diet in the world, but as long as he's working doesn't gain an ounce. Me on the other hand, can't do that.

My mother has spent most of her adult life being morbidly obese. She has lost weight, with WW and a few years ago when she was diagnosed as non insulin dependent diabetic she lost weight. She was actually starting to look good. But, she has this mental thing, she just can't live without that pshycological fat. For some reason her fat is her insulation from the world. She got all the way down to a size 18 and my sisters and I were so proud of her, but it freaked her out! She could see her collar bone, and her hands were just so bony and on and on. Needless to say, she gained back about 75 pounds. I did see at Christmas, she's lost some again, but she doesn't look good. I think the lifetime of obesity is finally taking it's toll.

And since I'm in the mood to make a long post.....I work for a veterinarian and we deal with "fat" pets all the time. Older dogs, overweight, arthritis, etc. When we tell owners dog/cat needs to lose weight. Owners freak out.

OMG, feed the dog/cat less?!?! Actually take the pet for a daily walk? We CAN'T do that! Well ok, then spend the money for the pain meds. OMG! That stuff is expensive! Yeah, it is.

Because of my mothers struggles, my sisters and I try very hard to keep our weight and diet reasonable. We don't want to be diabetic, have gall bladder surgery, heart surgery, like Mom. It's not an easy task. We all struggle, we talk to each other, and thankfully, even thought we don't do it all the way it should be done, we are doing better than Mom.

For those of us who struggle with our weight and food issues, I really feel it is no different than those who battle alcohol, drugs, depression, and many other issues.

It can be made to seem simple, but it really isn't.

Anyway, thanks for listening!
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Old 12-30-2008, 11:21 PM   #47  
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Janelle - keep in mind that some pet owners (and, I'd suspect, people) do everything "right" and their pets don't lose weight. Just as some people need unconventional approaches or lose slower than others, so do some cats/dogs!

Says the girl whose cat was on diet food per the vet's explicit instruction, with NO extra food, no treats, for three years, and gained 2 lbs. Just saying that sometimes the owners really DO try.
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Old 12-31-2008, 03:14 AM   #48  
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lol mandalinn!! I have an obese cat too
i just want to say that i thoroughly enjoyed reading this post!!
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Old 12-31-2008, 09:21 AM   #49  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mandalinn82 View Post
Janelle - keep in mind that some pet owners (and, I'd suspect, people) do everything "right" and their pets don't lose weight. Just as some people need unconventional approaches or lose slower than others, so do some cats/dogs!

Says the girl whose cat was on diet food per the vet's explicit instruction, with NO extra food, no treats, for three years, and gained 2 lbs. Just saying that sometimes the owners really DO try.
_______________________________________________

mandalinn,

Just wanted to say, that "you told me so," when I talked about putting the fat cat we adopted onto a diet. We did assume that the previous owner had been feeding her a lot of junk (since she knew what french fries were and has an obsession for all things potato).

ChubChub did lose almost 2 lbs very quickly on a low calorie food and very low calorie treats, like bonito flakes (the entire jar which lasted for months, has maybe 25 calories, because the fish is shaved so thin. Each "treat" was like a tiny piece of fish-flavored tissue paper). Because she has arthritis, we also give her a daily glucosamine/chondroitin treat.

While the 2 lbs came off very quickly, she gained back about a half a pound for no apparent reason, except perhaps winter. Like my husband and I, winter slows us down a bit because of increased joint and muscle pain, and it seems to do the same for ChubChub. Once it started getting cold outside (even though the temperature hasn't changed all that much in the house), she had more difficulty moving around, and wanted to sleep more.

The less we feed ChubChub, the more she sleeps and the harder it is to get her to play. I think that's true for me too, because if I eat too few calories, I'm exhausted all of the time, and can barely stay awake.


I know our vet assumed we were overfeeding our last cat KeeKee. She wasn't very overweight, as she was only 8 lbs, but the vet wanted her to lose 3/4 to 1 lb. I think the vet assumed that because we were fat, she had to nip any tendency to overfeed in the bud. But when KeeKee got suddenly very ill and we had to take her in to the vet (we learned she was in cardiac arrest, and she died the next day), after the xrays, the vet (a different woman in the same practice) told us that the cat wasn't overweight at all, she was actually a bit underweight, but had been retaining fluid because of the heart defect she probably had all of her life.

Maybe if we were thin, when we told the first vet "but she hardly eats," she would have believed us and maybe even would have found the heart defect - or maybe she still would have assumed that she just was seeing a mildly overweight cat. The second vet did say that cats hide cardiac and many other health problems very well, because unlike dogs, cats rarely overexert themselves. When they're not feeling well, they might rest more but otherwise don't change their behavior much.
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Old 12-31-2008, 10:04 AM   #50  
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The best thing you can do to help a cat is to play with it, get it to do some activity. Even if they only lay on the floor and bat at a cat toy, it helps them. They're not animals that need to exercise except in bursts, but they do benefit from those bursts now and then.

And so now I've added the "move more" part of the saying!

BTW, both cats and people can experience weight gain as the weather gets colder. This is an adaptation to winter survival, and it's not just for bears...

Jay
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Old 12-31-2008, 10:16 AM   #51  
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Heh. One thing that's helped our cat is having another cat move in next door. The racing from window to window ... and up and down the stairs ... as she frantically tries to watch "her territory" is not only amusing, it's helped her drop 1/2 lb in the last couple of months.

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Old 12-31-2008, 10:54 AM   #52  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoChick View Post
Heh. One thing that's helped our cat is having another cat move in next door. The racing from window to window ... and up and down the stairs ... as she frantically tries to watch "her territory" is not only amusing, it's helped her drop 1/2 lb in the last couple of months.

.
Ahhh, that's what's missing from my routine. Someone chasing me around my apartment. Sorry, I blame it on my cold.
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Old 12-31-2008, 12:01 PM   #53  
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The only way to get our cat to exercise, IS to play with her. Otherwise, most of the day, she lays in a heap on the floor on her back, with her front legs tucked up on her chest and her back legs spread out quite shamelessly (in the middle of the floor of course, so you get exercise stepping over her). She looks like an otter (when they float on their backs) so we sometimes call her otter cat or otter girl. If you call her, she doesn't even get up, she'll turn her head in your direction. She even watches tv like this (yes, she watches tv, though I don't know what she sees), and in fact will lie facing away from the tv, tilting her head backwards to watch (I think because it requires less effort. To see over her belly facing the tv, she would have to lift her head higher in a bit of a "crunch" move to see the tv). That she doesn't mind watching upside down makes me think that she sees movement, not the actual picture.

But, when we first got her she ignored toys completely not only if they were lying on the floor, but if we tried to get her to play (even feathers on a string, which I've never known a cat to be able to resist) and she would ignore it, and I swear shoot us a "you've GOT to be kidding," look. She wouldn't even respond to moving hands under a blanket. She would take no interest, or at best look mildly interested, but wouldn't actually move (she was totally Gargfield).

In fact, she wouldn't move from the center of the floor if you walked up to her. She'd lay there expecting you to step over her, and if you nudged her with your foot to move, she'd growl (not just a crabby meow, and actual growl), and you actually had to push her with her foot to get her to move.


After she lost a little weight, she was a lot more interested in playing, and in toys. Although her "favorite" toy, is the stuffed catnip toy she came home with. There's an elderly lady that makes them and donates them to the humane society. The toys about 8 inches long and 2 inches in diameter, so it's a pretty big toy, but she doesn't really "bat" it, she carries it like a very oddly shaped kitten, and sleeps hugging it, so we call it "dolly." So we still have to play with her to get most of her exercise in, but if we restrict her calories too far, (or on days like today when the weather is bad and she seems to be aching), she reverts to looking at us like we're crazy when we try to get her to play.

She does love batting plastic soda bottle caps, so we leave a few on the floor, because it's the only "toy" she'll really play with herself (at least until shiny mousy entered the house). The bank gave us a "free" cat toy of a tiny red sequinned mouse, and we thought she'd ignore it, but she loves it - I think because it's red like the bottle caps and shiny. If spends more than 10 seconds with either the bottle caps or shiny mousy, we know she's feeling really good.

We brought her a fat stuffed gray lamb I found in Bath and Body Works for $2 after Christmas. It's bigger than toys most cats play with, but we rubbed some organic catnip (from a gourmet shop we shopped in the same day we bought lambie) into the lamb's fleece. It's only a little bit bigger than dolly, and dolly is getting a bit ratty, so we were hoping we could transfer her attention from dolly to lambie (but as with substituting anyone's favorite teddy, the replacement is never the same).

Last edited by kaplods; 12-31-2008 at 12:05 PM.
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Old 12-31-2008, 12:31 PM   #54  
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Hi, I may be the only dissenter here- but I eat a lot more-
A lot more vegetables, a lot more salads, a lot more yogurt and berries, just a lot more of foods with volume and not a lot of calories. I can eat a half cup of ice cream and then go back to finish the pint. Or, I can eat a plateful of salad with tuna and pickles, and be full for hours.
When I was eating a lot less food, it was a LOT more calories and it seemed as if I was always hungry. Besides not feeling as energetic.
So sometimes, it would be "eat a lot more-with better choices".
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Old 12-31-2008, 12:48 PM   #55  
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Eightc -- that is a really good point. I make salads that are the size of serving bowls these days. I think I'll change my mantra to "Eat less CALORIES, move more"

Our cat is 16, she NEVER moves anymore. My husband keeps wondering if she ever goes to the bathroom...since I clean the box, I know she does... She will still, however, get up and even be bouncy for one of those little laser pointers (Not the real ones, just a mini flashlight so it cannot harm her...) that makes a little light for her to chase around the floor. Unfortunately, she is going blind, apparently, in both eyes from detachment of her retinas. We might never have known this, as cats are SO good at adjusting to loss of eye sight, except we moved the furniture for Christmas and she bumped head on into the legs of one of our chairs. While she can still see well enough to to see the light, she cannot see it as well as she used to. She, however, is a Devon Rex and weighs about 5 lbs. so being overweight has never been an issue for her... As our dog is 10 and is going deaf, I live in an interesting world of geriatric pets with disabilities.

Last edited by Schumeany; 12-31-2008 at 12:50 PM.
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Old 12-31-2008, 12:54 PM   #56  
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I dont think it is necessarliy eat less, move more but Choose healthy, move more.
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Old 12-31-2008, 01:02 PM   #57  
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I didn't mean to threadjack! Poor Bob. The only exercise he's gotten lately was when we had dogs visiting the weekend after Christmas...and he panicked so much that he DID run. Of course, he also went completely out of control and ripped off two of his claws at the base.

Normally, he'll only play with toys if they are -right- on him. Like if you put the laser pointer one inch in front of his paw, he'll lift the paw and smack it. Otherwise, he just looks at it, as if he's saying "Interesting. Perhaps if it was closer I'd consider tapping it lightly with my paw".

I actually think I eat more VOLUME also. But fewer calories. Perhaps I should make the distinction!
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Old 12-31-2008, 01:33 PM   #58  
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Great point! I eat an enormous VOLUME of food. But of course they are nutritionally sound and most importantly, low in calories. I eat my salad out of a serving bowl. I very often eat an entire head of cauliflower at a time. And I eat frequently.

But I think we may be talking semantics here. I believe the term, "eat less", really does mean to consume LESS calories. And I'm thinking it pretty much wasn't meant to mean just eat somewhat less ice cream or somewhat less cake in order to lose weight. But that it means to eat healthy. Oh who am I kidding. I don't know what it was meant to "mean".

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Old 12-31-2008, 02:08 PM   #59  
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Originally Posted by rockinrobin View Post
Great point! I eat an enormous VOLUME of food. But of course they are nutritionally sound and most importantly, low in calories. I eat my salad out of a serving bowl. I very often eat an entire head of cauliflower at a time. And I eat frequently.

But I think we may be talking semantics here. I believe the term, "eat less", really does mean to consume LESS calories. And I'm thinking it pretty much wasn't meant to mean just eat somewhat less ice cream or somewhat less cake in order to lose weight. But that it means to eat healthy. Oh who am I kidding. I don't know what it was meant to "mean".
Something I've noticed amongst the maintainers here is that all of you, without an exception (that I can think of), eat not just fewer calories than you did before you lost/maintained weight, but a much higher quality of food. To a woman/man, you all seem to espouse a whole-foods-focused diet with little processed or junk stuff.

But when I look at many of the beginning losers, especially those starting out on calorie-counting, there are a lot of people who are eating 1200 to 1500 calories per day of, well...stuff that's not all that nutritionally sound.

So yeah, I do think there's a common conception out there that the "eat less" part means "eat the same stuff you were eating before, only in smaller portions." And while that clearly works at first, I don't think in the long run it works. If it DID work, we'd see maintainers who were still eating like that; but none of you are, I'm prety sure. I think the concept of "eat the same stuff but less" actually ends up in people getting frustrated and abandoning their efforts, because they are hungry and their bodies are not getting the necessary nutrition.
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Old 12-31-2008, 02:27 PM   #60  
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Warmaiden, I think that is a good point. I've only been maintaining a month, but when I look at food now, I am hunting for nutrient rich and unprocessed. While I have always been an organic produce kind of person, now I am also a local produce, whole grains, good fats kind of person. I don't eat anything, if I can help it, without reading the label first...to see what I'm putting in my body. It is a complete change in how I look at food...not just does it taste good, but is it WORTH eating.

While I have had a slice of veggie pizza -- it is a once a month kind of thing, and it is from a pizzaria that uses all organic ingredients and whole wheat flour in their crust. Even the ham I had for Christmas, while for a special occasion, I bought at a local coop. It had no preservatives in it and it was a spiral cut ham, on the bone, so it was not one of those "squished together, who knows what part of the animal you are eating, hams."

I like to eat volume, it makes me feel full, and I like to eat nutrition that I know makes my body feel like it is getting what it needs...you aren't going to get that eating "less" ice cream or "less" McDonald's french fries or "less" saltine crackers -- even if you eat under your calories everyday. I want my weight loss and my renewed energy to be a forever thing, and eventually, if you constantly feed your body french fries -- even if it is less of them, your body will still be begging you for real food with some nutrition in it...in essence making you feel hungry...and you are going to eat a few more french fries to try and satisfy it, unless you learn to choose better options.

Last edited by Schumeany; 12-31-2008 at 03:41 PM.
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