[marlu]

By these forums? I sure as heck do. I've posted about my past eating disorder and my current struggles to lose weight without falling into old bad habits. I've posted about how hard it is to maintain a balance between eating enough calories to fuel me through a very physical work day and low enough calories to shift the scale downward. I've posted about how upset I was to learn that it took me over a year to lose a whopping eighteen pounds.

I can't say I haven't gotten replies to my posts, although not many. Some replies have been very supportive (Thank you RockinRobin, Sockmonkey 70, Meg and NightingaleShane--there are others who replied with support but I can't remember your user names right now, sorry.) Other replies have been very negative ( including some from a moderator) and have made me feel that, even though I'm still a good 15 pounds overweight and have bulges and flabby spots galore I have no right to be lurking on 3fc, let alone posting.

I tried posting on Featherweights but I felt unwelcome there because I consume more daily calories (have to because of the job) than most of the regular posters there think are right and proper.

Sorry, right now I can't function properly om 1200 calories a day. I'd quit my job ( a major reason for my high calorie intake) which I hate anyway, but I can't afford to.

Sheesh! I realize now why the pro-ana websites are alive and flourishing, though I know I wouldn't be welcome there either: there's literally no other place for the small people who need to lose weight to go.

Some posters have said I have a healthy BMI (23). Maybe , but I prefer the old system that allows 100 pounds for five feet and five pounds for each inch over. Under that system I should weigh 105 pounds. At that weight I would have a BMI of 19. That would be very close to a five seven person weighing 135, BMI 21 (as at least one prolific poster is) or a five five person weighing 125, BMI 20 (at least one poster of that height has listed that weight as their goal).

But I haven't seen any threads or posts (and I've been reading this website off and on since its very beginning) that tell them that those are unreasonable goals or that they are fine as they are .

Generally a lot more support on this site is given to the heavier people even though it's common knowledge that weight comes off with more difficulty the lighter you are. The attitude towards the smaller folks has often ranged from indifferent to downright hostile . ( A while back someone called anyone under 140 pounds a "stick insect", while another forthrightly declared that if a lighter person posted their struggles and asked for sympathy she would not respond.

I guess I was foolish to think that this site supported anyone who struggled with weight issues.

Guess I was wrong.

I'm rambling now so I'm going to stop. I kind of get the feeling that at best, no one will reply to this post and at worst it will ban me from the website.

But I'm mad enough not to care right now.

[need2loseinGA]

Marlu I am sorry you feel this way. When I first started this journey and this site there was a few times I felt ,well, frustrated with responses. That is until someone (and I forgot who) told me that you have look over things posted that don't apply to you and take the things that do apply to you. Or something similar to that. Once I got past that and got a diet plan worked out for me then things got easier.

But I also do wanna say that this is a message board. When you post on any board you have to take the good and the bad. Not everyone is going to completely agree with everything said. The things that are negative in ones eyes has to be over looked or else ya'll go nuts.

I hope you stick around. I have read several of your posts but have not replied to a lot of them. Some people have given you some great advices. And I hope you stick around for the guidance that can be gained here.

[JayEll]

Gosh marlu... I don't know what to say!

If any moderator has said things that you feel are very negative, then you can send a PM about it to Suzanne 3FC or Meg. Moderators are just people like everyone else, and if one of them is out of line, the 3FC admins need to know about it. Please include with your PM a quote of what the mod wrote.

You do have a unique situation--you have a very active, physical job, so you do need to consume a lot of calories--and your weight is in the "normal" range already, even though you'd like to lose more (which would still keep you in the "normal" range). So because of your unique position, you may not find many members who are just like you.

On forums like this and many others, there is no control over what members may say, other than the rules the admins set forth. As I said above, if you feel as though any member, mod or not, has disrespected you, then report it with a quotation.

Staying here is voluntary--if you're not getting what you need, then you don't have to stay... but I hope you won't give up on 3FC. This site tries to provide helpful information, and the members all want to see each other succeed. I think if you try some other sites, you'll find that many of those members are not as polite as folks are here.

I remember many of your posts, and if I have said anything that has made you this angry, I truly apologize.

Jay

[ann1]

I am sorry you are feeling so unsupported. I actually agree with the whole 5 ft should weight 100 lbs and then 5 pounds for every inch after. As you can see, my goal is to weigh 99. I am the same height as you. I am much, much bigger than you though. I think a lot of heavier people are very jealous of people your size. I know I am. But I can definitely understand your frustration and I hope you stay on the site. I eat 1300 calories a day (when I stick to plan) and work out 1 hour to 1.5 hours at least 5x a week. I have a very sedentary job though so the first part of my exercise plan basically just makes up for me sitting down all day. Best of luck to you!

[CountingDown]

I agree with maalisse. I am one of the folk that responded to your first post. I certainly did not intend for my comments to be negative in any way.

You are correct in noticing that most of the members here are much larger than you are. I haven't worn a children's size 14 since I was 10. Thus, many of us can't relate to your struggles and don't feel that we have any insights for you.
The maintainers that have responded to you have tried to help you realize that the number on the scales is just that - a number. It doesn't mean anything. It doesn't matter if your weight is 122 or 115 or 110. You mention that you have a physical job, which means that you probably have quite a bit of muscle weight. Thus, the formula that you are using could put you at a weight that is too low.
Have you had a true BMI test? Or are you using charts? If you are using charts, they are not always very accurate - they are only a guide - not to be taken as gospel.

In any case, your goal weight is something that you set - and only you and your doctor know what is right for you. I hope that you do find a path that will help you reach it in a healthy way. We all want you to be successful

I hope that you will go back and re-read some of the answers we have posted and that you "hear" the love and concern for you that I do when I read them.

[marlu]

Actually JayEll you are the moderator who made me feel I don't belong here.

Here's the quote, " You aren't someone who has a "weight problem" as we usually think of it here."

[JayEll]

marlu, I think the key phrase is at the end, don't you?

Most people who come to 3FC are obese or overweight. Not that many are already in the "normal" weight range--but some are. That's all I meant by what I wrote, and I stand by it. No insult was intended. If you have chosen to take it that way, well, so be it. I am sorry for your anger.

If you would like to discuss this further with me, how about doing it via PM?

Jay

[ennay]

I tried posting on Featherweights but I felt unwelcome there because I consume more daily calories (have to because of the job) than most of the regular posters there think are right and proper.

Really? I am surprised at this. I posted quite frequently on Featherweights and I was at the time aiming for 2300 calories a day. Sure, there are a majority of featherweights who find that 1200-1300 is what they need for them, but I never once had anyone tell me that my 2300 wasnt right and proper for me.

The only thing I have seen is concern over your desire to jump from 1800-2100 calories down to 500-800. I agree, with you that if your current job has you slightly losing weight (18 lbs in one year was it?) at your current intake that going to 1200 would be too low.

I think you have misunderstood the nature of most of the responses to you. People here will respond out of caring and concern, but no one will support attempts to unhealthily lose weight.

At some point those of us in the featherweights category always have to look at our desire to lose more weight and give an honest and fair evaluation as to how much of our weight struggle is healthy, how much is real need, how much is simply desire, and I think all of us at somepoint need to consider the question "am I an accurate judge of my own weight" Many people are not, I dont 100% trust my own judgement so I have some checks and balances in place.

I have struggled with binge eating. Which is why my focus is on removing the binge behavior, not the weight.

Several of your posts have seemed (it is always possible to misinterpret) to have been written from a point of desperation. While frustration is common, in order for weight loss to be healthy and permanent a rational approach has to be taken. Some of the responses to you were to encourage you to take a more rational approach.

If you are going to see any response that does not 100% agree with you as an unsupportive environment, well then...

[Suzanne 3FC]

Marlu, I've been going over your past threads and the many replies provided by members and moderators, and everyone appears to have been very supportive. I can understand that you are feeling frustrated with your weight, and you may have taken some comments the wrong way. JayEll wasn't insulting you at all, her reply was meant to be helpful in the context of the discussion in which it was made. We know you must feel badly about your weight, but it can be hard to help you when you turn down everyone's suggestions .

You also state your DH says you are the right size because you fit into smaller size clothes, but you are upset because of the number on the scale and think it should be lower. My heart goes out to you there, because numbers can be so misleading. You have a job where you work very hard, and maybe you have more muscle on your body? You could still be very small and just the right size, since a 125lb muscular woman can be smaller than a 125lb woman with little muscle and more fat. Maybe it's time to step back for a little while and not worry about weight loss. As long as you are maintaining your small size, then you are probably just fine. Avoid the scales at all costs, and try to enjoy being able to fit in those smaller sizes.

[kaplods]

I've posted here several times about the distinction between agreement and support. If you believe they are the same thing, then you are going to find a lot of what people say here unsupportive. We're each unique with different perspectives, and we don't always agree, and part of the true support that is offered here, is not expecting people to pretend agreement when they don't agree. We get enough of that in the "real" world where instead of disagreeing with us, friends and family will agree to our face and just talk about us behind our back - now that is being unsupportive.

I've found in my own life, both here and in my day-to-day life, that when I feel unwanted and unsupported, it is usually more about me and how I interpret people's actions than their intent. True empathy is very difficult for most people. If they do not share your experiences, they often cannot relate very well. What appears to be lack of sympathy is just lack of understanding, or disagreement. Neither of which really have anything to do with support. We come here to share and to learn. When people disagree with us, that is learning too. It makes us rethink our position, and either be persuaded to their point of view, or recommited to our original beliefs.

From the way you initially posted, I would have thought the moderator had said something like "you definitely in no way shape or form have a weight problem, what are you crazy or someting to be posting here?" I would agree that would be an unsupportive and unproductive comment, but the way she said seemed very supportive to me. She didn't even disagree with you, just expressed her perspective.

I will admit that I do not have much frame of reference to be able to sympathize well, or even understand "featherweights." I haven't weighed less than 150 lbs since grade school (as in 4th or 5th grade). It's hard for me to relate to someone fretting over a few lbs, when I would be happy to weigh twice what they do. I try to put myself in your position, and I just can't. That doesn't mean I think you don't belong here, or that I don't have something to say that might be of value to you (at least if you can see disagreement as much a form of support as agreement, as I do).

[10Again]

I'm sorry you are feeling bad about this site and yourself. I've belonged to a few message boards and it can sometimes be difficult to interpret the meaning of the words when you don't hear the tone. For me personally, I am new to this site and I used to be 115-120 pounds (in high school and early college), and I wanted to lose weight. I DO remember that feeling and I'm sorry you are feeling that way now. It's not easy to lose weight then, and it is not at 200 pounds. We are all dealing with our own demons and are doing our best to support each other. I hope you will stick around and keep posting. It's always good to be reminded people get frustrated at any size.

I've found in my own life, both here and in my day-to-day life, that when I feel unwanted and unsupported, it is usually more about me and how I interpret people's actions than their intent. True empathy is very difficult for most people. If they do not share your experiences, they often cannot relate very well. What appears to be lack of sympathy is just lack of understanding, or disagreement. Neither of which really have anything to do with support. We come here to share and to learn. When people disagree with us, that is learning too. It makes us rethink our position, and either be persuaded to their point of view, or recommited to our original beliefs.

Well said, kaplods. This applies to so much more than just the 3FC message boards!

[walking2lose]

Marlu, I do feel badly that you are upset and feeling unwelcome. I don't like anyone to feel brushed off. However, I do agree with Kaplods that may be misreading some of the posts as unsupportive when the posters did not mean to convey that. You have been receiving lots of support, and frankly you seem to be overly nitpicking the comments you perceived as negative. Why not focus on the good and ignore the bad?

And also, I am going to be perfectly honest here, and I hope you will not take this as criticism. It is simply my observation. About a month or six weeks ago, you started a thread - it was called something like 'I just don't understand.' You expressed a lot of frustration about feeling hungry all the time while trying to stay below 1800 calories. You asked for advice on how to possibly trim some calories and at the same time stay full enough.

I happened to be in a chatty mood, and I wrote 2 fairly long responses to you. In both of them, I expressed a lot of support and sympathized with the hunger issue. I also made helpful and healthy suggestions as to things you might try tweaking with your daily menu. Several other posters also offered LOTS of SUPPORT and lots of ADVICE. I believe this thread went on for at least 3 pages.

Well, I just skimmed back through that thread and here was the rub for me. You either ignored or totally shot down nearly every piece of advice offered to you. I suggested eating several (maybe 4?) egg whites instead of whole eggs (just as filling way less calories). You ignored that. I suggested using lower calorie whole wheat wraps instead of bread. You ignored that. I remember Allison suggested trying open faced sandwiches and also omiting the cheese. You responded that your cheese was already low calorie and open faced sandwiches are hard to pack. You just kept shooting down ideas, never thanking anyone or acting appreciative in ANY way for the effort to give advice and support, even though it might not have been advice that you liked.

Now I could have gotten hurt/upset that my responses were TOTALLY ignored (you never responded to me on that thread, though I commented 2x), or I could just get over it (which I did). I guess somewhere in the back of my mind, though, I did remember your name, and I knew that no matter what anyone said to you, it wouldn't be what you were looking for.

I think you can still find 3FC to be a very valuable place IF YOU LET IT BE. Be open minded, develop a bit of a thick skin to the random insensitive comment, and focus on the positive aspects of this site.

As far as forums, I mainly post on featherweights, and there are a few teeny tiny people on there and no one is telling them they don't belong. Maybe you could give it another try.

[kaplods]

I have to admit sometimes when I read a post I think the tone is "nasty," "rude," or "condescending." And I would even bet that occasionally that was the tone that was intended, but for the most part my own internal editing added the nasty bits. If I reread them and assume (even if I have to pretend) a concerned, pleasant or even emotionless tone, the post has a whole new meaning.

When I first started posting here I did notice that sometimes I would get no responses to a post, and wondered if I was being deliberately ignored. For the most part, I think when that happens it's just a case of people reading the post thinking they have nothing to add to the discussion. Although I have to admit there are a few people here who I will avoid responding to or even avoid responding to a thread to which they've posted. It isn't that I have anything against them, or don't want to be a support to them, it's just that I've noticed through experience that these people tend to severely misinterpret whatever I say. When I'm being uncharitable, I think that they are just determined to interpret everything (or at least everything I say)negatively, so I don't respond. When I'm in a positive frame of mind, I realize that my point of view may just be so different from the person's that my point of view isn't helpful to them, and I may still decide not to throw my two cents in when I think it isn't going to be welcome.

And on the other hand, sometimes I love a good debate. It isn't lack of respect or support, it's just that the best way to know what your beliefs are sometimes is having to defend them.

[SoulBliss]

I am sorry you feel unsupported. I think it is ironic that you were offended by a very fair, truthful and carefully worded statement made by JayEll-- she has been so supportive of so many on this board (including you, from all I have read).

Perhaps your frustration with your weight, those last few, stubborn pounds, has led you to be hypersensitive about this issue. I can relate, even though I am on the other end of the spectrum, as a woman who needs to lose 100 pounds (or more).

Originally Posted by kaplods

And on the other hand, sometimes I love a good debate. It isn't lack of respect or support, it's just that the best way to know what your beliefs are sometimes is having to defend them.

I agree. I like to discuss things, like to make sense of things, discuss and explore ideas until I can see them from many perspectives-this has been interpreted as "negativity" or "argument" by some and that is sad to me.

[GatorgalstuckinGA]

I am sorry you feel this way. I personally havent really seen this issue and i do post on many different boards. I spend most of my time in the 30something area but visit daily the general and wt loss area. I personally have seen most people be supportive and helpful. I know many who are now "stick" thin as you put it. I have seen many ppl here who offer suggestions to lighterweight people who are concerned about their current weight. And alot of the advice given is to help support people and try to make sure some of these people don't get so bad that they do resort to crazy measre to get to that "desired" weight. Now sometimes that could me misinterpreted by the person seeking advice since they want to be that specific number. But they are trying to get them to realize that their weight is doing well. And on the computer, you do loose a lot of tone and empathy. But i personally have never seen someone degrade someone for being to thin. There may be support/advice that those "thin" people don't understand..and misinterpret. But everything i've seen so far here is nothing but support for the members. Most people here feel that everyone is here for one thing....weight loss. Weather its 5 or 200 lbs....we're all after one goal. And i personally do not feel that people are not supportive here. I'm sorry you feel that way. But if you feel that way...i'm not sure if you will ever find healthy support/advice that you can believe. Because most people here do not support unhealthy weight loss...but definately support all healthy/safe weight loss