When I first found these boards a few months ago I was thrilled at the prospect of finding other like minded people who had had "the talk" with themselves. I read every post in every thread. Now...I pretty much keep to the 100%, maintainers, and Daily chat. Since my focus is staying 100% and OP I pay attention to the long haulers who know what they are talking about. Every now and then I will read a thread that has in interesting topic, like this one. But just like the diet having a narrow focus, so to is my reading of these threads. I read what I know will support my journey.

On a side note, a long talk with my coach yesterday yielded a similar discussion about these boards. He was dismayed at how many people are varying the protocol and then complaining about lack of results.

That is a problem...and not fair to IPers...the stuff that is customized belongs in one place...not the stuff that follow protocol.

That's a lot like making the homeowner sleep in the garage....

Three CHEERS!!

I was not defensive in my post. I was actually standing up for "free speech" on these boards, so to speak. If you don't like what someone posts or dislike a particular thread, don't feel compelled to respond to the person who offends you. You're not going to be able to control the content of the boards/threads or what any given person posts, so why stress yourself about it? Why not just read the boards that you enjoy (ie 100 %'ers) and move on? There are a lot more worthy causes in the world for you to put your energy towards than trying to control what is posted on an internet diet board.

It would be nice if that was respected but very often postings in the daily chat are about what plans for the weekend include...esp plans to eat with friends or family and the word cheat is often seen. It's not the "food" that bothers most...or triggers someone to go do something(that is absurd)...it is that once you have had that chat with yourself...you don't want to have to entertain the convos of those who have NOT had the chat. And they just seem to pop up ..holidays esp seem to open the door to telling all.

That is why the 90% thread was created...but look at how often that is NOT where this stuff appears.

Not offended...but most of the problem posts are NOT where they belong...on the 90% thread!!!

Good luck trying to enforce that!

Not a matter of enforce...I'd go for quiet respect. It speaks volumes.

I have no problem with people who slip and are having a hard time getting back to 100% - I admire their dedication to trying to turn it around and get back at it and will encourage them to do so.

I have no problem with people who make a decision to eat off plan - go for it if that's what's right for you and you are armed with all the information and know the consequences. I may give reasons about why I think it's a bad idea, but in the end everyone makes their own decisions.

What I do have a problem with is people passing out information that is contrary to IP protocols with the "I do it and am losing so it must be fine" attitude and when anyone dares to point out that it's not OP they get defensive. I see lots of people who regularly don't follow the protocol, are losing and are happy with it - more power to them! But most of them don't put forth the idea that it's okay to do so. They just quietly go about their business and offer support to those who have slipped, need help getting over a hump or just general support.

That said, this forum is for people who are following or trying to follow IP. So it stands to reason that responses are geared toward pointing out what is and is not the protocol. People who get defensive because they say they plan on cheating and don't hear "it's ok" but rather "here's why it's not a good idea" really need to look at why they are even trying IP. And I'm not talking about those who say "I'm going on vacation and really want XYZ" and listen to what's being said in response.

In the end we are all adults and responsible for our own actions. Around Christmas time I quit reading the daily chat because it was full of "well, it's the holidays and this only comes around once a year so I'm going to eat it." It made me sad that people were setting themselves back for something that will taste the same next year as it did the year before without ever thinking maybe they could skip just one year for the sake of their health.

This board is where we come to get support for following the IP diet - not to learn how to cheat. I KNOW how to cheat on a diet, I'm really, really good at it!

I don't think anyone is trying to "enforce" anything. We are trying to discuss . . . that is the whole point of this thread.

From reading this discussion, it seems to me that there are two camps: the 100%ers and the less-than-100%ers, defining the less-than-100%ers being those who believe that they can stretch the rules of IP, plan to eat off-program, etc. (I am not including people who occasionally "slip" in that group.) The less-than-100%ers seem to believe that they have a right to post their plans, their philosophies, and their views without any commentary from the 100%ers. Isn't there a place for that already? On the 90% board? If such remarks are made in the wide-open space of the forum, why are the 100%ers not just as free to offer their views and commentary on such posts and in the same place?

The problem with offering personalized variations on IP in the wide-open space of this forum is that it is highly confusing to many people. Even I, who have been on this plan for over a year, experienced doubt of my own understanding of the current plan when returning here and seeing such liberties being taken and being discussed as if these are regular and usual. Speaking for myself first, MANY people do not have an IP coach. MANY people get their information and IP protocols here. That is why so many of us long-timers are concerned that the information stay clear (or "clean").

This plan is difficult. My first couple of weeks on it, I thought I might just die. God forbid (is that "religious language?" well, sorry, because that is how I talk) that I had been doing it incorrectly but in good faith. To go through all of that and then not have it work correctly would have been agony. When you have your first small loss, you need the peace of mind, knowing you are doing the plan correctly and that it WILL work, in order to keep with it. When it becomes unclear what is OP and what is not, you increase the risk of people misunderstanding and not adhering to IP correctly, getting frustrated, giving up, and even possibly quitting. The thought of that could make me cry, because I truly do believe that this was my last chance. Had this not worked for me, I would have resigned myself to a (short) fat life. I believe that is all we are trying to do -- keep the info as it pertains to IP clear and absolutely correct -- for newbies, for people who can't afford a coach, and for people who just don't have the energy to have to double-check each and every single thing posted in this forum all day long.

Anyone on here is free to find their own way and their own ways of doing things, but trouble comes when those personal "ways" get posted and discussed as if they are OP. That's all. For crying out loud, I think each of us, having been heavy enough to find our way to IP, have been very humbled in that aspect of our lives. No one is judging anyone for finding their own way. They are just trying to offer the very best information and guidance in regard to IP as they know it.

Now, I am a 100%er. I learned that about myself this weekend. I have never felt forced to define myself before, but all of this emotion and "tone" has made me think carefully about it. I was never completely comfortable identifying myself as a 100%er because I use alternatives and have never been to an IP clinic. However, I DO follow the plan to the utmost of my ability and fervently believe that that is the way to go for me. I cannot believe that anyone on this forum really has a problem with me saying that and sharing that, right? Mutual respect and posting in the appropriate places is all anyone is asking.

One more thing . . .

On the "tough talk" and "lectures," etc.

I get what some of you are saying. I felt that way a couple of times in the beginning, too. The first time I posted "only" in front of a weight loss, I about had my head handed to me. I didn't like it. The first time I whined out loud, fully expecting everyone to participate in my pity party, I was embarrassed to find that no one attended. I didn't like it.

Know what?

That was the best thing this group could have done for me. Have you ever been anywhere else where people cared enough about your success to let you dislike them while they delivered the truth? I haven't. Heck, Weight Watchers makes an entire meeting out of people whining and crying and confessing and receiving "forgiveness" (imo). They make a sport out of finding a way to eat "anything you want," when the real work of permanent weight loss is reckoning with the fact that, if you really want a healthy body, a box of 1 point fudgesicles is not going to work; get used to it.

This group does its best to snap you out of that. It worked for me right quick. Yes, I spent a few days mad at a few ladies here -- the same few that I can now say I have learned the most from.

As I near maintenance, I have news for everyone -- turns out, the game is all mental. Your time on IP is best spent practicing "best practices" as 65 terms it, getting comfortable with it, and also toughening up in regard to the harsh realities of getting and keeping weight off. This group was willing to let me be uncomfortable at times while they withheld the enabling I craved. That, I believe, is what 65 is saying will not be found most anywhere else on the internet. I grew up and I toughened up -- and now I can do that for myself. That, above all . . . even more than the protocol sheets -- is the most valuable thing I have received in this forum. I would like to be able to offer that to everyone who crosses our 3FC-IP threshold, because I wouldn't have made it without it.

--climbing down now . . . because I really do have other things to do today . . .

Have a good one all!

Wow, so unless you are 100% on program 100% of the time you are not welcome on any thread except the 90%er. How sad for these forums.

I come here for support and ideas. My work/school/life schedule makes it impossible for me to be 100%/100%. By that I mean I can't always eat 2 cups of veg and 8% of protein for dinner. Sometimes I have to eat 4 cups of veg at lunch with my protein in order to get it in.

And I would like to hear from other people with similar struggles. I don't post in the 100% thread because that doesn't define me everyday.

I guess I should just go hide in my pantry with my 2 year old Peeps and Candy Canes and hang my head in shame. But I won't, because what I am doing is working for me.

I think several people have bent over backwards to make a distinction between "making it work in a pinch" (and/or a slip) and recreating IP altogether. It's becoming exhausting and has an air of game to it at this point.

Not everyone wants to be whipped into shape by strangers on the internet. Also, I don't think everyone who cheats and admits to it is asking for forgiveness on the forums. I think it's a mistake to assume that everyone who cheats wants an a*^ kicking or to be corrected. There's a respectful way to "correct" someone or to help someone get back on track. The stern, sanctimonious approach doesn't go over very well with most people, but I think most are afraid to stick up for themselves. I guess we're going to have to "agree to disagree on this one."

I think it's pointless to try to "clean up" the boards when every day multiple people will post the types of things you don't like to see. Have fun trying to force 100's of people you don't know to be 100% or get off of the boards. I think it would be better to focus on your own progress or maintenance instead of policing these boards and providing unsolicited or unwanted discipline to people who deviate from IP.

It's very ironic that people who aren't even on IP consider themselves 100% OP when they are not even using IP products. I know people are successful on alternatives, but get off of your high horses because it's impossible to claim you're 100% OP on an IDEAL PROTEIN forum, when you're not even doing IDEAL PROTEIN! The protocol says to use only Ideal Protein products and that anything not on the sheet is not allowed. If you're not following the IP protocol sheet, you're not even close to 100% OP. You're "testing the limits" of ketosis just as much as the people who deviate. There is such a bunch of hipocracy and self-righteousness on these boards by certain people it's unreal.