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Phase 4 Guidelines??

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Old 11-28-2012, 02:31 PM   #1
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Default Phase 4 Guidelines??

OK, so I got Phase 3 figured out but I cannot find any definite guidelines for Phase 4. I would like to have similar guidelines to follow for Phase 4 meals as I did for Phase 3 breakfasts with a macronutrient breakdown for each meal or at least daily - does such a thing exist?

As well where do nuts and cheese fit into Phase 4? They are my favorite snacks. In some diet plans they are considered fats, in some proteins, but whatever it is I need to be able to know where to fit them into my life.

I'm also kind of sad about the separation of fats/carbs. Does that mean I am never allowed to have home-made macraroni and cheese for dinner or a ham and swiss cheese sandwich for lunch?

I was really looking forward to a soup and sandwich for lunch, and I love a slice of light swiss cheese on my sandwich.
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:24 PM   #2
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What I can answer with certainty.
P4: Breakfast is just like P3
P4 Lunch is carbless (you can have two servings of fats i.e. cheese, salad dressing)
P4 dinner is fatless and has slow carbs (whole wheat pasta)
On your fun day you can mix Carbs and Fat (that's also when I have homemade mac & Cheese, pizza etc.)
Snacks: Serving of cheese, fruit, nuts etc.

Hope this helps I'm sure others will chime in!
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:26 PM   #3
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You may have already seen it, but the most thorough explanation/guidelines I've seen about Phase 4 where offered by jwdesselle in this thread.
Phase 3/4 questions-please help
Scroll down until you find jwd's post and download the document called 'Phase 4 Overview Nov 12.pdf'. I don't think it's as concise as what you're hoping for, but it is useful.
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:36 PM   #4
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What I can answer with certainty.
P4: Breakfast is just like P3
P4 Lunch is carbless (you can have two servings of fats i.e. cheese, salad dressing)
P4 dinner is fatless and has slow carbs (whole wheat pasta)
On your fun day you can mix Carbs and Fat (that's also when I have homemade mac & Cheese, pizza etc.)
Snacks: Serving of cheese, fruit, nuts etc.

Hope this helps I'm sure others will chime in!
My Coach said you can switch around Lunch and dinner - that's what she does - she keeps her dinner what she calls "IP Friendly" so she can have a sandwich or chicken wrap for lunch if she wants. A lot easier when you are working.
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Old 11-28-2012, 04:09 PM   #5
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I've been doing a lot of reading about Phase 4 to get myself mentally ready, and from what I can tell, the Maintenance phase doesn't have you tracking macronutrients in the same way you do for Phase 3 breakfasts. I've seen that some people find what their "sweet spot" is for calorie range, but beyond that I think we just follow the fat poor/carb poor rule of thumb, and veggies are unlimited.

The thing I'm getting tripped up on is whether there's gray area on the fat poor/carb poor rule. For example, if I have lunch of salad with a small amount of chopped apple in it (carb) but cheese and dressing on the salad, is that still "carb poor" enough to be a viable lunch option?
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Old 11-28-2012, 05:03 PM   #6
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I've been doing a lot of reading about Phase 4 to get myself mentally ready, and from what I can tell, the Maintenance phase doesn't have you tracking macronutrients in the same way you do for Phase 3 breakfasts. I've seen that some people find what their "sweet spot" is for calorie range, but beyond that I think we just follow the fat poor/carb poor rule of thumb, and veggies are unlimited.

The thing I'm getting tripped up on is whether there's gray area on the fat poor/carb poor rule. For example, if I have lunch of salad with a small amount of chopped apple in it (carb) but cheese and dressing on the salad, is that still "carb poor" enough to be a viable lunch option?
Phase 4 Breakfast CAN be mixed macronutrients but doesn't have to be. The calorie range will be up to you, maybe start at the items you know were a Phase 3 400 calorie breakfast and cut back or amp up the serving sizes or add or eliminate a food group.

For the salad lunch: the classic Phase 4 rule would say no to the apple. My coach has suggested you can bend the rule a little, for example a small amount of apple but not an entire apple would be OK. I have nuts and (unsweetened) coconut at lunch which do have carbs with their fat.

For the carb dinner: the sheet said something like hold it to a tsp of extra fat (but arguably fattier meats/fish are OK) so if I want a couple of shakes of parmesan or a tablespoon of avocado at dinner, I do.

Your other choice is to consider it a "slip" -- once in awhile you have the whole apple at lunch or the ham and cheese sandwich. You're not blowing off the whole concept but are just having one item outside the rules. Just follow the rules for the next meal/snack and keep with your normal Phase 4 (no Phase 1 needed). If you start doing it every day and there is a consequence on the scale, well, you'll have to stop.

I wish there were some more baby steps to ease into Phase 4. Maybe Phases 3.1 thru 3.9 before we get to IP 4.0?
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Old 11-28-2012, 05:17 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by slow2lose View Post
My Coach said you can switch around Lunch and dinner - that's what she does - she keeps her dinner what she calls "IP Friendly" so she can have a sandwich or chicken wrap for lunch if she wants. A lot easier when you are working.
Since you can have carbs and fat at breakfast you can have yummy combos. Bacon, egg and cheese on toast anyone?

There's really no black and white sheet explaining P4. You have to try to find out what works for you. Check out the maintenance thread too. There are tons of folks who have gone through it who can answer any specific questions you have. But generally it's a really gray phase, which is hard for some (including me) to enjoy. I like to follow instruction (as with P1)...Maintenance is great! Don't get me wrong. It's life and it's just about figuring out (within IP guidelines) what works and what doesn't.
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Old 11-28-2012, 07:12 PM   #8
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That's a big help! I'm still several weeks away from maintenance, but I am trying to absorb everything I can going into it. Thank you so much!
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Old 11-29-2012, 09:16 AM   #9
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So, I'm thinking that a serving of whole wheat pasta mac and cheese would be good at breakfast? Maybe with bacon? If it fits the guidelines...
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Old 11-30-2012, 10:42 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by slow2lose View Post

As well where do nuts and cheese fit into Phase 4? They are my favorite snacks. In some diet plans they are considered fats, in some proteins, but whatever it is I need to be able to know where to fit them into my life.

I'm also kind of sad about the separation of fats/carbs. Does that mean I am never allowed to have home-made macraroni and cheese for dinner or a ham and swiss cheese sandwich for lunch?

I was really looking forward to a soup and sandwich for lunch, and I love a slice of light swiss cheese on my sandwich.
If you are still interested...

Yesterday, my coach said that nuts and cheese are to be counted as fats (pretty much what I thought). Furthermore, she said that dairy is really counted as a fat, too (but of course count the protein grams in with your protein). Has anyone heard any different?
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Old 11-30-2012, 12:06 PM   #11
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So, I'm thinking that a serving of whole wheat pasta mac and cheese would be good at breakfast? Maybe with bacon? If it fits the guidelines...
LOL I think that might be pushing your luck
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Old 11-30-2012, 09:11 PM   #12
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If you are still interested...

Yesterday, my coach said that nuts and cheese are to be counted as fats (pretty much what I thought). Furthermore, she said that dairy is really counted as a fat, too (but of course count the protein grams in with your protein). Has anyone heard any different?
Nuts I can see as a fat, but cheese and milk depends on whether it's fat free. Fat free greek yogurt is a protein to me, not a fat. Same with low fat cheese. More protein than fat.

I went to some online calculators that were recommended by a friend and also myfitnesspal app. I plugged in maintain my current weight and it gave me a breakdown of daily suggested calorie count, and fat, carb, and protein. I know that IP likes less than 140-150 total carbs a day, and 1/2 my body weight in protein, so I am planning on those gms instead of the calculator. But the calorie guideline is on target.

I start P4 TOMORROW!!!! Woohoo!!!! I am soooo ready for unlimited veggies and any veggie I choose!!! But I will mostly do P3 with a little modification X 5 days, Fun day X 1 day, then P1 day. Rinse, and repeat! For life!
Have a great weekend, peeps!
Ken
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Old 11-30-2012, 09:22 PM   #13
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I start P4 TOMORROW!!!! Woohoo!!!! I am soooo ready for unlimited veggies and any veggie I choose!!! But I will mostly do P3 with a little modification X 5 days, Fun day X 1 day, then P1 day. Rinse, and repeat! For life!
Have a great weekend, peeps!
Ken
Congrats Ken! You made it!!! Sounds like a pretty good plan that you have in place.
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Old 11-30-2012, 09:30 PM   #14
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Congrats Ken! You made it!!! Sounds like a pretty good plan that you have in place.
Thanks, Fitgirl!!! I'm proud of myself. I lost the healthy weight Ken after quitting smoking 21 years ago, and it feels good to find him again, and lose the pre-diabetes, high blood pressure, and sleep apnea!! Couldn't have done it without the support of great folks like you and the others here at 3FC!!!
Have a great weekend and thanks again!
Ken
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Old 11-30-2012, 09:35 PM   #15
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Thanks, Fitgirl!!! I'm proud of myself. I lost the healthy weight Ken after quitting smoking 21 years ago, and it feels good to find him again, and lose the pre-diabetes, high blood pressure, and sleep apnea!! Couldn't have done it without the support of great folks like you and the others here at 3FC!!!
Have a great weekend and thanks again!
Ken
Wow...that is amazing!! I bet you feel fantastic!

I've just started phase 3 today...so I'll be seeing you in the maintainer's thread soon!
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