[Pinkhippie]

Sometimes this thread is like my personal therapy session: I hope no one minds.

Thanks beachbreeze for your list suggestion. It worked like a charm. I wrote down what I needed to do and did it one at a time. I also retroactively made a list and wrote down and crossed out everything that I had done. It was quite the list.

Now here is something funny, I realized as I went along and got things done that I wasn't feeling any less anxious. It occurred to me that I was doing what I used to do with food and weight with the cleanliness of the house and what I needed to get done. Focusing on something else as the source of my anxiety. As I scrubbed my kitchen sink, I realized the true source of my anxiety. It is SO dumb but it actually involves food in a weird way.

To try to make this short: My dad and his wife are vegan. Like kind of high brow everyone else is eating an early grave vegan. I also have a big history of always trying to please my dad and make him proud of me/approve of me etc. Ever since he and his wife went vegan I cook vegan meals if they come over even if they are not eating with us, just if they will be over during any meal time. I got lots of vegan cookbooks, I even went vegan for a while. I haven't eaten meat in front of my dad except once and I felt like he was horribly disappointed in me the one time I did. ( I know, issues) They are coming over to celebrate one of my daughters birthday's tomorrow. They volunteered to pick up pizza. They asked what I wanted on the pizza and I was honest and told them that the kids and my dh like cheese and pepperoni.(which by the way was hard to do but my dh wanted pepperoni) They told me they were going to get a pizza without cheese on a whole wheat crust for themselves but would pick up what I wanted. I swear I could feel the disapproval dripping down the phone line. It could be my imagination.

I have been working really hard on just being me and to stop trying to get my dad's approval especially since I will never have it in the way that I want but the closer the date to the "pizza party" approaches, the more anxious I have been. Am I going to eat pepperoni in front of my dad? Are they going to make comments? How terrible will it be to eat that pizza while they eat their whole wheat crust no cheese pizza? Will they think I am a terrible mother letting my child eat pepperoni? will they make my children feel bad for eating what they are eating? Typing it out I know it sounds RIDICULOUS. But, as soon as that occurred to me I realized it was the true source of anxiety. Not that I had to get the house spotless before they came over.

So, thanks for listening to my blathering. It does help to type it out. What a small silly thing to be this anxious over. Well, at least now my house is nice and clean.

[pattygirl63]

I was reading some posts by Wannabeskinny some other successful Intuitive Eaters yesterday on another thread here on 3fc and I identified so much with a lot of the things y'all said. It has caused me to re-think IE.

Some of you know me because I've posted here before and shared the fact that until I learned diet, I was a "natural" Intuitive Eater. I've tried and tried to get back to eating Intuitively, but I just couldn't get that stupid "Diet voice" out of my head. I was always thinking things like "I have to eat at least 3 meals" even when I was not hungry, etc.

Well something interesting happened last month. DH and I took a trip. I was beside myself because I knew I could NOT follow my diet on this trip for 2 weeks as we would be eating a lot of meals out while traveling and then we would be eating in other peoples homes etc and I would have no control over choices of food.

Finally I made the decision to just eat Intuitively and just do my best. Boy was I amazed at what I have learned from this experience. I couldn't weigh for 2 weeks because I had no scales. I was shocked when I came home and weighed and found out I had lost a little over a 2 lbs. I've been home about 2 weeks, I have really struggled trying to get back on a low carb or low calorie diet and I gained 3 lbs the first few days. I did manage to lose 1 of those lbs, but I have have really fought to hold on to that 1 lb loss.

After reading Wannabeskinny wrote and thinking about it, I realized that the experience speaks volumes for me. It makes to me that since I grew up a "natural" Intuitive Eater before they had a name for it, that IE is the way that I should be eating too. So I have made the decision that since IE is "normal" for me that I Just need to learn how to develop that way of eating and let it become my eating lifestyle again.

I don't think I will be tempted to eat loads of junk foods while learning to eat Intuitively because I never ate them when this was my normal way of eating. And to my surprise, I didn't crave or desire junk foods during the 2 weeks on vacation. It was available. We had a birthday party for my 91 yr old Daddy and my sisters had had a sandwich tray, veggie tray and dessert tray made locally and they added loads of chips etc. My first thought was "oh no" carb city. But later after I got home and thought about it, I tasted a little bit of everything even the birthday cake, but it was only a few bites. Never had that feeling of wanting eat loads of junk. I really did. And that is the way I did the whole trip. I think it is beause I also have learned that I have always liked eating more healthy foods than junk foods. Although I do admit that I do have some snack foods that I do like occasionally.

I also have learned that I didn't always want a "whole" meal some times I just want a few bites (more like a snack) whether healthy or junk foods. That is another nice thing about IE is I don't "have" to eat 3 meals unless I'm hungry plus I don't "have" to think about food all the time.

I probably will mostly lurk here, but just had to share my experience with y'all. So glad to find that IE really does work and that it can and will work for me again.

[jensassy]

@beachbreeze2010: Awesome intro - thanks so much!!! I'm so glad you are here!

@Pinkhippie: that is awesome that you waited on breakfast and had the euphoric reaction to it!!! I am also an anxiety eater and also cannot eat in extreme stress. I'm glad you are aware of this about yourself. Can you do a brief time out and ask yourself why you are having anxiety? what would be some solutions for it other than eating? who can you ask for help? Part of my "growing up" homework is to deal with the feelings, figure it out, get to the bottom of it. You totally got this. *SHOOT* you just updated that you worked through it!! yahoo for you! I'm leaving my post for others to read... way to work it out!!!

I was supposed to meet a friend for lunch today and then she cancelled. I had been looking forward to this for a while and was very bummed out. Not only did I want to see my friend but I wanted to go to the restaurant too! So, I picked out a book and went by myself. it was awesome.

[nelie]

PinkHippie - I'll say this from my perspective as a vegan. Sometimes vegans get disappointed in general if someone who they believe understood veganism enough to go vegan, goes back to being non-vegan. I don't think it is _you_. My mom was vegan for a while and still flip flops between vegetarian/pescatarian. I understand though it is her choice and I am proud of the progress that she has made. She still makes me vegan food when I visit

Now about the pizza... I have to say that for one, if I wanted someone to eat a vegan option of something, I'd offer to buy something that is easily vegan. In the US, that is not pizza. I'd never personally offer to pick up pizza for anyone and the idea of having a pepperoni pizza in my car and paying for it... I couldn't do it. I wouldn't mind being at a pizza party and people eating it because that is their choice.

Anyway, I'd say if your parents buy you a non-vegan pizza, that is more than most vegans would do. I'd eat your pizza and not worry about what they think or what you think they think.

[Pinkhippie]

Thanks Jensassy. I realized I am pretty anxious in general and I need to figure out how to manage it. I guess i was sedating myself with food. I mean I have read in several places how carbs raise your serotonin and actually make you feel better. So, that makes sense. I guess I really need to start meditating or something. Man I hate meditating. It makes me anxious.

Nelie: Thank you for the perspective from a vegan. I didn't go vegan publicly, I don't think my dad ever knew. I just showed an interest and a knowledge in veganism. I was vegetarian for over half my life but no cheese or eggs was too hard for me. I also find at this time that I can't do ANY food rules for myself, even if they are for health reasons. I did just pick up a copy of the happy herbivore to check out as I still like to eat vegan when I can and when the mood strikes me. Anyway, I talked to my dh about it and then I actually talked to my dad's wife and I realized I was overreacting. They are excited to come over and celebrate my daughters birthday and you are right, the fact that they are willing to pay for and pick up pepperoni is a big deal. I think my stepmother was just thinking out loud about what pizza they were going to get. She is kind of flighty/spacey in general. Or at least that is the impression she puts out there.

Thanks everyone for your perspective and help. It has really been invaluable to me.

[Locke]

I suffer from pretty bad anxiety- I've been diagnosed with generalized anxiety disorder and panic disorder. One of the reasons why I've become so overweight is that food calms me down. I've been medicating myself since childhood. I really started putting on weight when in fifth grade I moved to a different school. When no one would play with me at recess I'd just eat and eat. I'd steal money or food from my parents to take to school with me so that I could eat/buy sweets. I also stole food from school. Yep, I was quite the little criminal and it was all so I didn't have to feel anxiety related to change or my home life.

These days I practice meditation and mindfulness in order to get through anxiety. I talk to myself a lot. Instead of avoiding painful or negative feelings I try to face them and solve the problems that cause them. It's one day at a time but it's getting better.

My best friend got frustrated with me the other day. He's the person I go to when my world is falling apart. He got angry about something I did and said "when will you learn to stop hurting yourself?". I told him that three years ago- a year before he'd met me - I was a raging alcoholic. I could barely keep down food, didn't work, barely went to school. My body was covered in big ugly bruises because my liver had begun to fail. I had been drinking 12-18 drinks a night for a few years. I had no clue how to see to my needs or feel my feelings. I wouldn't solve any of my problems I'd just drink them away.

Progress happens. It's slow and painful, sometimes so slow you can't even see it happening. But it does happen if you work at it.

[jensassy]

@Pinkhippie: remember the 1 minute meditation? 5 counts breathe in, 5 counts hold it in, 5 counts breathe out. Do this four times to get to a minute meditation in. It is the only meditating I can handle. I also learned a new technique that I do in the car when I get upset from Gabrielle Bernstein's book called "Miracles Now" - it's words with finger touching (stay with me!!):

When you touch your index finger to your thumb, say: PEACE
When you touch your middle finger to your thumb, say: BEGINS
When you touch your ring finger to your thumb, say: WITH
When you touch your pinkie finger to your thumb, say: ME

I can get going really fast when I'm driving and something nutty happens - it's weirdly calming and I'm not sitting cross legged somewhere trying to calm my monkey mind which to me is almost impossible sometimes... This book is really awesome I'm finding for helping me reduce stress and anxiety. I'm all into "tools" and "actions" - this book gives it to me!

@Locke: you've come a long way baby!! Keep on going!!! change is slow but definitely steady if you keep at it like you. YOU ARE THE AFTER PICTURE!

[Palestrina]

I go on one little trip and all this wonderful stuff happens while I'm away.

Nelie, thank you for the article. I totally needed that. Someone is always throwing in my face that IE is bunk and although I know what it has done for my quality of life it's nice to know that it's being tried and found true.

Pinkhippie, ugh that pizza story is driving me crazeee! Food is not love. That is not the type of connection and acceptance you should be seeking from your dad. If there is something missing from your relationship with him it will need to be addressed in an a real way, not with food. Isn't that exactly like a diet? "If only I did xyz then abc would happen". Nobody's affection should be dependent on control. Sit and think through the worst - what if you are the pepperoni pizza and your dad told you he was disappointed in you. What would you say to him? Have fun with this question and please hate your answer

Beach breeze I love your life story. Thank you for sharing, you are so right about no such thing as linear progress!

Locke you inspire me beyond words. Hug!

[Palestrina]

Originally Posted by pattygirl63

I was reading some posts by Wannabeskinny some other successful Intuitive Eaters yesterday on another thread here on 3fc and I identified so much with a lot of the things y'all said. It has caused me to re-think IE.

Some of you know me because I've posted here before and shared the fact that until I learned diet, I was a "natural" Intuitive Eater. I've tried and tried to get back to eating Intuitively, but I just couldn't get that stupid "Diet voice" out of my head. I was always thinking things like "I have to eat at least 3 meals" even when I was not hungry, etc.

Well something interesting happened last month. DH and I took a trip. I was beside myself because I knew I could NOT follow my diet on this trip for 2 weeks as we would be eating a lot of meals out while traveling and then we would be eating in other peoples homes etc and I would have no control over choices of food.

Finally I made the decision to just eat Intuitively and just do my best. Boy was I amazed at what I have learned from this experience. I couldn't weigh for 2 weeks because I had no scales. I was shocked when I came home and weighed and found out I had lost a little over a 2 lbs. I've been home about 2 weeks, I have really struggled trying to get back on a low carb or low calorie diet and I gained 3 lbs the first few days. I did manage to lose 1 of those lbs, but I have have really fought to hold on to that 1 lb loss.

After reading Wannabeskinny wrote and thinking about it, I realized that the experience speaks volumes for me. It makes to me that since I grew up a "natural" Intuitive Eater before they had a name for it, that IE is the way that I should be eating too. So I have made the decision that since IE is "normal" for me that I Just need to learn how to develop that way of eating and let it become my eating lifestyle again.

I don't think I will be tempted to eat loads of junk foods while learning to eat Intuitively because I never ate them when this was my normal way of eating. And to my surprise, I didn't crave or desire junk foods during the 2 weeks on vacation. It was available. We had a birthday party for my 91 yr old Daddy and my sisters had had a sandwich tray, veggie tray and dessert tray made locally and they added loads of chips etc. My first thought was "oh no" carb city. But later after I got home and thought about it, I tasted a little bit of everything even the birthday cake, but it was only a few bites. Never had that feeling of wanting eat loads of junk. I really did. And that is the way I did the whole trip. I think it is beause I also have learned that I have always liked eating more healthy foods than junk foods. Although I do admit that I do have some snack foods that I do like occasionally.

I also have learned that I didn't always want a "whole" meal some times I just want a few bites (more like a snack) whether healthy or junk foods. That is another nice thing about IE is I don't "have" to eat 3 meals unless I'm hungry plus I don't "have" to think about food all the time.

I probably will mostly lurk here, but just had to share my experience with y'all. So glad to find that IE really does work and that it can and will work for me again.

Welcome welcome. I'm so glad you were able to find trust in yourself. Trusting yourself around food is very freeing. If we're not always worried about the far the carbs and the calories we're worried about the scale or the pedometer or the food log or the pants that won't fit. We believe that if we do not subject ourselves to harsh controls that we will not have the wisdom to choose the right foods. But you trusted yourself and enjoyed yourself and saw that the world did not implode. That's great to hear

... Though I am a little curious as to what I said that made so much sense to you no am normally viciously hated around the other threads for my ridiculous IEing.

[Pinkhippie]

Locke you have come so far! I have definitely been medicating myself with food too. Practicing mindfulness is a great tool for dealing with anxiety and I need to remember that too.

Jensassy, thank you for the meditation reminder. I am going to copy paste that and put it somewhere that I can look at it. I tried it and I did feel calmer. I love being able to meditate without sitting cross legged trying to focus on nothing.

Wannabe: were you a therapist in your past life? No but seriously you have this amazing way of just cutting right to the quick of an issue and showing it to people. You are SOOOOOOO right. I am trying to seek acceptance and connection with my dad through food. ( or lack of it) Looking at it with the scenario you described above was really helpful too. Thank you.

I realized that this issue may be mostly in my own head. They came over, the pizza place got their order wrong and put cheese on their pizza. They ate it anyway and shared it with me and it was delicious. It was veggie and with cheese it was scrumptious. (Even if they had a non cheese pizza, or I had eaten the pepperoni it would have been fine too) We had a wonderful time. They brought amazing cake and salad and we all had a great time. I knew in my rational self that it would probably be fine but I guess I have issues from childhood or teenage hood or something. I think it did really help me to identify the cause of my anxiety before they came over though. I do feel foolish for being that worried about it though. Hopefully I learned something for the future.

[Palestrina]

Originally Posted by Wannabeskinny

Sit and think through the worst - what if you ate the pepperoni pizza and your dad told you he was disappointed in you. What would you say to him? Have fun with this question and please share your answer
!

Pink I'm surprised you could garner any meaning from my jet lagged brain in what I wrote. I fixed a couple of typos in the above sentence. I'm glad all went well with your dad and you enjoyed your time and your pizza too!

Things are tough for me here. I'm visiting my parents in Greece and I'm having a difficult time adjusting to the time and getting my IE practices in order. My mother triggers diet the diet mentality in me. My body image has taken a nose dive since my arrival. I'm feeling uncomfortable in my own skin even alone in the dark in consumed with thoughts of inadequacy. I've been here 2 days already and she has not made any comment on my appearance which for her means there is nothing nice to say so she says nothing. I'm very uncomfortable and feel like I am a disappointment because she is very thin, fit and fashion forward.

The food and hunger stuff is being sorted, I may be restricting a little for various reasons. Being in someone else's home can be awkward as far as snacking and mealtimes go. People here eat a cookie and coffee for breakfast, lunch is at 2pm and dinner is at 9 or later. It's extremely difficult to adapt to it and snacking on my own is met with disapproval. My mother is one of those "do you really NEED to eat that now?" type of mothers. The scrutiny is heavy. My husband ran out to get some staples for us and I asked him to pick up ham and she intervened "that's not necessary, I really want you to try not to eat that stuff while you're here, it's unhealthy and nobody should eat it." Of course I feel like crying. Her snacks are bread and cheese and fruit - I don't really like cheese and bread I'm ambivalent about and fruit is something I eat when I want it I can't eat it as a snack if in craving something else. Now I feel horrible about the ham like in being disapproved of all the time.

She also wouldn't let me leave the house with the outfit I had on today and made me change. Now I feel horrible in both those outfits and I didn't bein that many clothes with me. Lunch today came so late that I was hangry and irritable and moody and didnt want to eat what was being offered anyway but I has no choice.

I really hope I survive this, I'm feeling restricted and controlled and scrutinized and these are a recipe for disaster. Sorry for the rant, I haven't felt this fat in months.

[jensassy]

Oh Wannabeskinny! This sounds like a vacation from h-e-double hockey sticks.

First off, your mother sounds like a GEM. Not everyone is small, skinny, and fashion forward. She sounds like a control freak and a negative word that they wouldn't publish (think Germans in the early 40's). I do not do well with that either, come on, who are we kidding? No one would.

Have you tried having a conversation with her about what you're doing and trying to achieve in your life? Sometime I think that people, especially parents, really do not know what they are doing or how they are acting unless someone tells them. My husband had to 'go off' on my parents once for me since he could visibly see what they were doing to me as I shrunk into a corner one time.

I know this vacation is necessary because come on you want your son to get to know his grandparents and other family. I get that, it's important! but how will you survive? will thinking that your mother is special needs help like it helps me with my parents? can you stand up to her and say, "thank you for your opinion, but this is what I chose to wear now" and move on? Will you tell her about IE and your disordered eating and how you want to change and not be tortured by her or your eating?

This is BIG stuff so maybe this trip it is small steps that you feel comfortable with OR maybe you pack it up and go stay at hotel where you have more freedom over your schedule? Just some thoughts.

Please keep checking in - we're here to help!

[quietstorm970]

Hi Everyone,

I am new to this area and I am finding that IE is the only way for me. I am sick of dieting, counting calories, and carbs. I managed to loose 50 lbs with just eating clean but eventually I binged and gained 25 lbs back. I am tired of fighting food and I do realize that I have a long way to go but I am just sick of food being my enemy. I am tired of punishing myself.

I am also in OA and I was just telling a sponsor that my goal is not to restrict. I just want a better relationship with food. That is all. I don't hate sugar or carbs. I don't hate "healthy" foods either. I am only now in OA to work the steps and for fellowship. I cannot abstain from sugar or any food. It does not work for me. Thankfully my sponsor lives that lifestyle so I have support.

Anyway I am halfway through the book brain over binge but I just cannot finish for some reason. I cannot relate the the author sometimes and I think she oversimplifies why we binge. I get what shes saying but its not that easy in my opinion. He method will not work for me 100%.

I am doing a challenge with my coworkers and they are steering clear of carbs and sweets but I told someone today that I had cake and mac n cheese last night and I feel no guilt. I did ask myself after I ate it how did I feel and I think I ate too much cake because I was really satisfied after a few bites but I will learn. My coworker was starving for bread this morning and I though about how diets make us suffer and torture ourselves.

I have finally received my copy of intuitive eating and I am so excited because now I know what I want! This is where I belong.

[Locke]

@pinkhippie

I totally relate to the vegan story. I was vegan for a while, too. One of my good friends has been so awesome helping me come out of it. Every time I'd say something like "I'm going to eat brown rice, mushrooms, and broccoli, no oil" he'd say something like "I'm going to eat a corn dog. Because they're delicious." It sounded dumb at first but the point is that eating should be fun. It should nourish your body and honor your taste. Pepperoni pizza is delicious! Whole wheat pizza with no cheese is just... joyless, unless you like that sort of thing (which I doubt people do). I sincerely, truly doubt that there are people out there who eat whole wheat pizza without cheese because it tastes better than normal pizza. That sort of sacrifice is what makes people who are healthy vegans (or any sort of health eater) miserable to be around.

@Wannabe
Dear lord that sounds awful. Have you explained to your mom that you are a grown woman who is perfectly capable of making fashion and food choices for herself? I would lose my eff'in mind if I was in the situation. Here's what I would do about your mom getting in your business- don't give a f#ck about it. Seriously. Don't care about what your mom says or thinks. If she says something about your outfit or what you're eating just say "thanks for the tip" or "hmmm, I'll think about it". Then just wash your brain of it. I'm pretty sure my parents are narcissists and what they do sounds alot like what your mom is doing. I just learned over the years to stop caring.

Not giving a d@mn about what other people think is not an invitation to do whatever you want regardless of the consequences or input from others. It's doing whatever you feel is the right thing to do and knowing that it is 100% your choice to make. Live your life. What's the worse thing that could happen if you don't change your outfit that doesn't fit what your mom thinks is right? Will she throw a fit? Will she refuse to go out? Will she weep, gnash her teeth, rend her clothing, and disown you? Probably not. Don't give into your mom's tantrums. It's really none of her business what you wear or eat. You're a flipping adult.

[jensassy]

Welcome quietstorm970! I've done OA in the past but NONE of them are open to anyone having sugar at all. I hope it works out for you!