She flat out said "SKINNY IS NOT BEAUTIFUL!!!" but I appreciate the optimism on both your parts. I surely could play devils advocate and say "obese isn't beautiful, healthy is" but that would make me an @sshole, wouldn't it? Kind of hypocritical if you ask me.
I agree that the mindset of beauty shouldn't be tied to one size but that's his perogative if he doesn't want to sell past a size 10. I'm certainly not going to lose sleep over it and didn't when I was overweight. What the A&F CEO thinks doesn't define me and if I let what he says get my panties in a wad then perhaps I should be in therapy for self-esteem issues. Opinions of what is beautiful is in the eye of the beholder and always will be. Trying to argue what's considered pretty to someone is about as effective as debating politics or religion, people have their opinion and that's that. The bigger irony is that there's people here trying to get thin yet feel it's ok to make nasty comments about thin people. Well...I'm calling these people out.
Some here at 3FC need to remember that us thin chicks were once fat chicks that have feelings too. Once we become thin doesn't make us any less valid here. We all bust our @ss to lose every single pound whether we're 30p overweight or 300 so lets keep it respectful.
I'm just speaking in general. I have seen quite a bit of skinny bashing between here, FB and Pinterest and I'm tired of it. I'm proud of what I have accomplished and I wish everyone else the best of luck on their journey too.
Peace.
ETA: My "fat" weight wasn't always 155, I was once 174p before joining 3FC.
Its a good thing I dont like their stores anyway. A few years back I went in there with my cousin and it was so loud and irritating just to be in there. And the sticker shock at the prices! It saddens me to hear that there are people who are that shallow. Thank you for the article! I now know to avoid that store when I CAN fit in their clothes.
While I cannot speak for another poster, Vdander24's post originally did not just state "SKINNY IS NOT BEAUTIFUL!!!", but clearly added: "HEALTHY IS !!!" Some can be skinny and healthy, after all. Perhaps it could have been worded better, but what I get from the entirety of the post is that she's tired of skinny being the clear focus of the only be-all end-all ideal. And with all due respect, I realize that this is a very touchy subject from both sides, but I feel like people have to step on eggshells around here to just mention anything even remotely perceived as negative on the subject without being attacked as a skinny basher.
I do see skinny-bashing on Facebook all of the time; I don't like it either! Also all sorts of self-serving validation about being "big-boned" or "curvy" from some to justify their own unhealthy habits and morbid obesity, or claims that people who work out or watch what they eat are supposedly selfish, shallow, and obsessed; it all makes me cringe. Perhaps I don't see the skinny-bashing as much on this forum because I don't peruse into a lot of threads, or perhaps my point of view is simply skewed to be sympathetic to my own experiences. People often skew what they interpret from others based on what they are personally exposed to or they want to see, after all. I also currently experience skinny-bashing in RL against myself through those that knew me when I was a lot heavier, even though I'm still in the obesity category and have a long way to go. I mean, I still weigh over 200 pounds and am currently getting a lot of flack from some about how I'm already "too skinny" and how I'd "look better" and would "be healthier" if I gained some of it back. I know for a fact that it's not said for any concern out of my health or appearance, but as a game of status quo.
I believe what some of us are so sick of getting thrown in our faces over and over again is that we are basically told by not only businesses like this one, but by society in general that we cannot be considered or even allowed to feel pretty unless we are skinny. We cannot belong, we cannot fit in, and we're even less valid as people. So basically don't you dare show your ugly fat @$$ inside an Abercrombie & Fitch because only the cool, hot kids are allowed. The attitude sucks and they're certainly entitled to it, but you'd never see Lane Bryant releasing statements that "skinny b!tches aren't welcome" or ever see their CEO gloating over deeming those outside of their demographic being too unworthy to wear their clothes. I'm lucky in that I'm confident enough in myself to not let any of these kinds of comments from corporations and strangers get to me anymore, but they still hit a little too close to home when it comes from people I see in my everyday life, friends or not.
Last edited by Elladorine; 05-11-2013 at 09:46 PM.
I very very rarely post although I am a daily lurker (love this forum!), but I had to comment here because I so strongly disagree with those who have said upstream that they (A&F) are perfectly in their right to target a demographic of their choice.
BUT, my contention is that "cool/uncool" is NOT a demographic, but rather a social status. It changes in time and place and is entirely the result of social positioning. Cool is just a modern term for a certain type of social superiority. The aristocrats in 17th century France were "cool", as were the whites in 19th century Virginia.
So, for A&F to implement tactics that exclude the "uncool" from their stores because their presence "contaminates" the brand and therefore their profits, is exactly, but EXACTLY the same as people who didn't want blacks to buy the house next door because it would bring the whole neighborhood property value down. I am sure that so many then would have said that they themselves are not racist, but so many other people are that it just makes economic sense to exclude blacks.. which just makes you a perpetrator and collaborator of racism.
From a different perspective, how lame must you think your product is that you need the "superior" to confer their status to strenghten the brand? I mean, the whole point of a strong brand that has a snobbish allure is that IT confers coolness on the purchaser (think Ferrari...) and that's why people - ALL people - want it.
I'm Israeli and I don't believe we have A&F here but man I wish we did.. It would give me great pleasure to very vocally boycott it!
I very very rarely post although I am a daily lurker (love this forum!), but I had to comment here because I so strongly disagree with those who have said upstream that they (A&F) are perfectly in their right to target a demographic of their choice.
BUT, my contention is that "cool/uncool" is NOT a demographic, but rather a social status. It changes in time and place and is entirely the result of social positioning. Cool is just a modern term for a certain type of social superiority. The aristocrats in 17th century France were "cool", as were the whites in 19th century Virginia.
So, for A&F to implement tactics that exclude the "uncool" from their stores because their presence "contaminates" the brand and therefore their profits, is exactly, but EXACTLY the same as people who didn't want blacks to buy the house next door because it would bring the whole neighborhood property value down. I am sure that so many then would have said that they themselves are not racist, but so many other people are that it just makes economic sense to exclude blacks.. which just makes you a perpetrator and collaborator of racism.
From a different perspective, how lame must you think your product is that you need the "superior" to confer their status to strenghten the brand? I mean, the whole point of a strong brand that has a snobbish allure is that IT confers coolness on the purchaser (think Ferrari...) and that's why people - ALL people - want it.
I'm Israeli and I don't believe we have A&F here but man I wish we did.. It would give me great pleasure to very vocally boycott it!
I won't exactly say you're wrong but I also don't think you're right. I don't think it is racism in the same sense but it does leave room for social injustice. But like I said before, the fashion industry thrives on exclusivity, it has always always and forever marginalized people based on their weight. It serves no purpose for me to demand that A&F make clothes in my size because I don't want them to anyway!
Their company is interested in image and revenue and they are well within their right to cater to whomever they want to. They only want skinny dollars, they can have them.
I think (unfortunately) we have to accept that there is a certain demographic that takes pride in being a "candidate" (if I can say that) for A&F clothes. A status symbol. I'm thin and cool, and you're not. I guess at that point, it is up to us (as parents) to at least try and encourage otherwise, although teenagers always have their own stubborn will and will learn the hard way.
Excellent and hilarious point, "From a different perspective, how lame must you think your product is that you need the "superior" to confer their status to strenghten the brand? I mean, the whole point of a strong brand that has a snobbish allure is that IT confers coolness on the purchaser (think Ferrari...) and that's why people - ALL people - want it."
Novangel- I just wanted to say I see your point and you are right to advocate for respect in both directions. Personally, I really admire women who have lost "the" weight, however much...as I imagine it only gets harder the closer to goal you are. I really value the opinions of maintainers/thin people, and I seek to learn from their example. Just wanted to offer some encouragement as I know what it feels like to have "your" group singled out as somehow less than.
This store's refusal to cater those who are a bit larger is disgusting to me.
This stood out to me... As a person who has been overweight the majority of the her life I simply don't care if a store does not sell my size. I don't feel that they must cater to me. I am not disgusted by those that don't; generally I have not feelings either way.
Places like A&F, Aerostople (or whatever it is) , Hollister and the like aren't even a blip on my fashion radar because I feel that they are too full of themselves and that is not how I choose to represent myself.
As far as the CEO he's got his opinion and I have mine. If he feels that way fine but he needs to take a look inside.
I am sort of on the fence with this, I think the company does have a right to target a demographic. I mean that is what Lane Bryant and Torrid have done and before you say the thin people can shop anywhere that is not necessarily true.
There are people who are a size eight but may be chubby for their bone structure and would love it if Lane Bryant sold those awesome spanx jeans in their size or others like that plus size clothes tend to be a little more conservative yet still fashionable which is getting harder and harder to find when you are thin.
You can't say that having a store exclusive to your size is okay but not the other way around without being hypocritical.
Perhaps it could have been worded better, but what I get from the entirety of the post is that she's tired of skinny being the clear focus of the only be-all end-all ideal. And with all due respect, I realize that this is a very touchy subject from both sides, but I feel like people have to step on eggshells around here to just mention anything even remotely perceived as negative on the subject without being attacked as a skinny basher.
Personally, I really admire women who have lost "the" weight, however much...as I imagine it only gets harder the closer to goal you are. I really value the opinions of maintainers/thin people, and I seek to learn from their example. Just wanted to offer some encouragement as I know what it feels like to have "your" group singled out as somehow less than.
