I'll warn you, this is a bit of a vent. I'm so flabbergasted. Let me just start by saying I don't like how everyone hops on board and says kids have ADHD just for being kids. Just because a kid acts out or is excitable doesn't mean he has ADHD.
That being said, we've been having behavioral issues with my son, who will be 6 in May. The issues range from him being destructive to not listening at all to terrible anxiety, and a few other things. It's been hard because he goes goes goes ALL THE TIME. It's hard to keep him occupied, and he's always been that way, but for the past year or so it's gotten exponentially worse. He's been kicked out of Karate class because he can't sit still when they need to. They tried working with him one on one, but he still couldn't sit still and became frustrated. He liked the idea of karate, but couldn't sit still. If they were doing something, and he wasn't distracted by the cars outside, he was ok. His teacher last year said he was one of the more hyper, distracted kids in class, but stopped short of saying he had a problem. My husband and I, and hubby's parents, were sure it was just him being a kid. But he's getting more and more out of control and nothing we do stops it. He seems visibly frustrated when we tell him to do something 10 times. If we tell him fine, we'll do it, he tells us NO! he wants to do it (like cleaning his room) but then he gets distracted and the whole process starts over. I mean, there are times that he has SO MUCH energy that he just runs and screams at the top of his lungs. He's not doing it to be bad, you can tell that he's just ready to explode! He runs on high all the time. He hums or whistles or makes loud noises almost ALL. THE. TIME. We will tell him to stop making the noise, he will for a few seconds, and without even thinking about it he does t again. He'll literally be staring off in space, making some loud humming noise, and seems shocked when we tell him to stop. We try to keep him busy and occupied, but with him, if he isn't sleeping he's GOING.
I have ADD. I wasn't diagnosed until I was 26. All through school I was called lazy, stupid, "spaz," spacey... I remember AGONY on days where we had to sit and take notes. Not just because we had to sit and write. I remember feeling like screaming. My head would be pounding and I was ready to lose it by the time class ended, and the only thing on my paper would be doodles. I was ALWAYS in trouble for talking, doodling on my papers and not finishing things. My mom would make fun of me because she'd ask me to go get something from another room and I'd bring back something totally different from what she'd asked for. She'd say I had lots of "book smarts" but absolutely NO common sense because simple things seemed difficult for me.
I don't want that for my son. I also don't want him labeled, or diagnosed with something if it's just him being a kid either. People have told me he's hyper because he's a kid, that he's doing this because of that, and that because of this, and it just seems like a LOT of excuses and reasoning to explain his behavior. He had an appointment with a psychologist today, who said based on his past behavior and his behavior there (which she said isn't enough for a diagnosis) she's almost certain he has ADHD. She said it would take more than one appointment, and input from his teachers and others. He has a referral for psychological testing and testing for ADHD. They're going to test his IQ as well.
I limit his intake of sugar, he doesn't drink pop. We've cut out artificial colors/flavors and white flour, but he's still bouncing off the walls almost every minute until he goes to sleep. I don't want to be one of those people who automatically jump for a reason behind their kids rotten behavior and slap them on meds. In fact, I don't want him on medication at all for right now. He's only FIVE!!
I feel guilty, what if he inherited it from me? Or what if I'm just a crappy parent? I've been on the verge of tears since the appointment.
I just wanted to say that I never once brought up ADHD, or my own ADD until the end of the appointment. I didn't want the doc to be swayed into thinking any one thing.
Last edited by Pint Sized Terror; 10-11-2010 at 08:12 PM.
idk how your state's education system works, but i know that in PA, a kid can technically have a "developmental disability" until they're 9. not sure if ADHD is included in this, but the theory is that they might kindof just grow out of it, so why give an unneccessary label? I mean definitely don't take my word for it (i was a special education major in undergrad, but i'm currently in grad school and don't have my books with me to look it up, but you could find the information online) but if the label is what you're worried about, that might be an option for the next couple of years.
p.s. your little boy sounds just fabulous. of all the personalities out there, i'd take alot of energy any day
How is his sleep and how much time does he get outside to be wild? I think a lot of kids just do NOT get enough sleep and outside time. I've seen those two things totally turn kids around.
To me, the first things I'd check would be diet, exercise (meaning outside time) and sleep. I'm obviously no expert, but those things have made a huge difference in some families I know well. Less tv does wonders as well.
Good luck. I always made ok grades and tested into gifted classes, but I could never ever figure out how to settle down and focus. I was out of college before anyone suggested that I might have some inattentive ADD issues. Who knew. If a "label" can get your child some help or help YOU know how to help him, it doesn't have to be a bad thing. Meds aren't the first or only options.
You're a good mom. You're checking into the possibilities. Your son will be fine.
I know you definitely do not want a label for your child, and I'm completely with you on not wanting to medicate unless it is absolutely the last option.
As someone who worked in special education for over a decade, and with a brother in law who has ADHD, I can assure you that the label doesn't stick. If your child needs special help in his classes, they are not allowed to note that on his final transcripts when he leaves high school. My brother in law spent his entire high school career in remedial classes, getting special help, and graduated with a 4.0. He just received his AA degree and transferred to a four year to finish his degree. Sometimes kids just need a little special attention and a different approach to learning.
Remember, while all the specialists have your child's best interest at heart, only you know him best. Follow your heart and your instincts. You sound like a GREAT mother, and having a child who is complex may be a challenge, but it is nobody's fault.
He gets a lot of play time. He spends as much time as he can outside riding his bike and playing in the dirt. :P I'd say he spends at LEAST an hour, hour and a half outside every day, weather permitting. On the weekends we can barely get him to come in for meals! We walk to school as long as the weather allows, and sometimes walk in the evenings. He plays with his sis and our 2 dogs, and watches very little TV. He's like me, he can't stand to sit and watch something unless it's really interesting! (I contribute that to my dislike of TV in general) He does like to play video games (Lego Batman, Lego Indiana Jones) but that's only on the basis that he keeps his room clean, homework done and does his chores. He gets to play a couple of times a week, usually on the weekend, mainly because he's so bad about getting chores done and picking up, but if I'd let him he'd play for hours and hours every single day. It makes for a good reward item. He'd rather spend what time he has between school and dinner outside, and there's no video games or TV after dinner, with some TV exceptions occasionally. After dinner is family time, bath time, book time and bed time, in that order. It's been that way since he was an infant. Bedtime is 8:30 every night, though he sometimes stays up later on the weekends if we're watching a movie or something. I wake him up in the mornings at 6:45 when I get up. On the weekends I don't wake him, and he sleeps until 8.
His diet is the same as mine. We've cut out fast food, processed food and chemical-filled food as much as possible. That's been for the past, oohh.. 2 months or a lil longer. He's never been one to like candy, or even sweets really, and both kids are more likely to pick sliced mangoes over a slice of cake. Seriously. A neighbor was actually offended when my son refused to drink kool-aid and asked for some water instead. It's hard to get him to really sit down and eat a meal, and even as a toddler he was a "grazer" and would eat a little then run off and do something else. He'll sit through a meal as long as we keep reminding him to take his plate out when he's finished. He knows that once he takes his plate out, he's done, so he understands he needs to sit back down and eat. He eats and eats and eats, but runs and runs and runs, LOL, so he's always been lean. As a toddler, his pediatrician accused me of not feeding him because he was so small (I'm not huge, yanno) and made me document everything he ate and how much for a week. Then she said there was no way he ate all of that. He's just very active.
I'm not a medical expert, so I can't tell you for sure, but I have a nephew with ADHD, and he is very much the way you described your son. His behavior got progressively worse until the only option was to put him on meds. When he was 3 and didn't get his way, he would lay on the floor and just scream and scream and scream. It was amazing to me. When he went to school, he could not focus on anything. The teacher could not keep him in his chair, and he would wander around the room. Of course, unlike your son, he was defiant towards everyone, too. If you asked or told him to do something, he would do the opposite just to spite you. If you threatened to spank him, he would stick his tongue out at you.
I know everyone is not alike, but I have 2 boys (6 and 10) and they are not that way. They are boys, but they are not constantly go, go, go! We sit down to eat together. They stop when I tell them to stop. They seem lethargic compared to their cousin.
As far as you being a bad parent, that is ridiculous. You are obviously concerned about your child. I know he is young, and he might grow out of this, but I think you are doing the right thing to have him tested. I would find a doctor that will work with you when you tell them you are opposed to medication. I hate medicating a child. That said, sometimes it is what works, you know?
I hope your next appointments bring some resolution for you and your family.
I nannied for kids with ADHD and a lot of the symptoms you describe sound very familiar. Being that you have ADD, there is a good chance he has it too, even though it manifests itself in different ways in girls and boys.
I definitely think you're approaching this the right way by getting him tested. Please make sure you get opinions from at least 2 experts. The kids I knew were diagnosed at an ADHD clinic and while one of them was a rather "obvious" case, I always felt the other was diagnosed b/c - well, they make more money off people who have it, right?
IF your son ends up having it, it doesn't necessarily mean he will end up on medication (I agree that 5 is SO young for that). There are many things you can change in your parenting that may have an impact. For example, the tests for the older kid showed that she was a visual learner, rather than an audio learner. So instead of telling her "go upstairs, put your PJs on, brush you teeth and go to bed" (she would get upstairs and forgot what she was supposed to do), we started writing checklists that she could carry around. There are a lot of good books out there - I recommend reading some of them.
If he does end up needing medication, it's also not the end of the world. You're giving him a chance to live a "normal" life b/c most likely he's just as frustrated as you are about not being able to focus. He's probably a smart cookie and it wouldn't be fair to not allow him to reach his potential. Just make sure you're really paying attention to what the meds do to him (our doc gave us a journal where we had to record what she ate, how she felt and acted). When we experienced with Ritalin, the poor kid turned into a zombie. She didn't argue or talk all the time (which was nice), but she became lethargic and finally told us that nothing was making her happy again - obviously we took her off immediately. Medication doesn't make your kid perfect. It will still be a lot of work, but you are doing so many things right already (diet, little TV, going outside), I'm sure you'll swing this thing too!
I agree with getting him tested, and getting multiple opinions.
But I also want to stress that many, many symptoms of ADHD can be controlled and managed without pharmaceuticals. Here's WebMD's take on behavioral techniques for children with ADHD. He's nearly stradding age groups, so I've included both sections.
Quote:
Behavior Management Strategies for Preschoolers (Age 5 and Younger)
To help younger kids with ADHD, try these behavior management techniques:
* Provide a consistent routine to the days and structure to the environment. Let them know when the routine is changing or something unusual is going to happen, such as a visit from a relative, a trip to the store, or a vacation.
* Give your child clear boundaries and expectations. These instructions and guidelines are best given right before the activity or situation.
* Devise an appropriate reward system for good behavior or for completing a certain number of positive behaviors, such as a merit point or gold star program with a specific reward, such as a favorite activity. Avoid using food and especially candy for rewards.
* Engage your child in constructive and mind-building activities, such as reading, games, and puzzles by participating in the activities yourself.
* Some parents find that using a timer for activities is a good way to build and reinforce structure. For example, setting a reasonable time limit for a bath or playtime helps train the child to expect limitations, even on pleasurable activities. Giving a child a time limit for chore completion is also useful, especially if a reward is given for finishing on time.
Behavior Management Strategies for Children Ages 6-12
Behavior management strategies for older children with ADHD may include:
* As much as possible, give clear instructions and explanations for tasks throughout the day. If a task is complex or lengthy, break it down into steps that are more manageable, keeping in mind that as the child learns to manage their behavior, the steps and tasks can become more complex.
* Reward the child appropriately for good behavior and tasks completed. Set up a clear system of rewards (point system, gold stars) so that the child knows what to expect when they complete a task or refine their behavior.
* Bear in mind that as your child gets older they will be more sensitive to how they appear to others and may overreact or be unduly ashamed when they are disciplined in front of others. It is important to have a plan for appropriate discipline for misbehaving that does not require carrying out in front of others. Setting up a specific consequence for a certain behavior is probably the best method of providing consistency and fairness for your child.
* Communicate regularly with your child's teachers so that behavior patterns can be dealt with before they become a major problem and before the teachers get overly frustrated with the situation.
* Always set a good example for your child. Children with ADHD need role models for behavior more than other children, and the adults in their lives are very important.
If you've made behavioral modifications, had a consistent routine for a while, and he's still struggling more than he can handle, you may opt to try a medication at that time. I agree, too, that if a child really needs the medication, it can really improve symptoms and help eliminate frustrations, especially combined with a consistent program of behavior modification.
As for the guilt, well, feeling guilty for any possible genetic link is just silly (do you blame your parents for your ADHD? Grandparents? Great-grandparents?), particularly because you can't help the genes you're born with. And as for being a bad parent, I need to echo the others - you're paying attention, you're looking to get him help when it appears that he needs it, you're looking for resources, you're not blaming him for the behavior (though again, blaming you ain't so great either)...I could go on and on...all examples of GOOD parenting.
So take a deep breath, get the evaluations out of the way, and create a routine that'll support your son in getting his needs met.
My son is six and has pretty severe ADHD. He behave(d) a lot like you describe your son.
We did a lot of therapy and behavior management techniques with him but at the end of the day the kid was so frustrated at school we had to try something else. He's a sweet well behaved wonderful (BUSY, Curious, hyper) little boy but on Concerta he's the same little boy who is able to sit still long enough to do his homework without intervention. He tells me he feels so much better. He's less frustrated. He has impulse control. It's wonderful. I was like you at first... didn't want to medicate him. I fought it hard. But after seeing how different things are for him now I wouldn't change my decision to finally get him that kind of help. When it got to the point where HE was personally struggling and suffering with everyday stuff at school, we had to step in.
It's different for every child, of course... I just wanted to give my experience with the medication side of it. It's definitely not all evil. My son is doing wonderfully with a little help from his RX .
ETA: within two weeks of starting concerta my son went from claiming he couldn't read and needing tons of special intervention to being in the top reading group!! It's like it unlocked his potential for things he already knew but couldn't express. It absolutely blew my mind! He used to come home from school with all sorts of incomplete work etc and now he's the first in class to be done! It's amazing.
ADHD can be tricky to deal with, but, if he does have it, with proper management (medication or otherwise) he will live a completely normal and productive life.
You mentioned that he was in karate- but have you looked into other sports? I highly recommend something like soccer for him- it's exceptionally physically active, and moves very quickly to keep his attention. Team sports are also great for kids with attention difficulties because it helps them to form bonds and helps enforce discipline and structure.
Definitely keep as much structure as you can for your little guy, keep a consistent schedule and posting it can be helpful. So can task and chore charts. Make sure that when you speak to him, especially if you are asking him to do something, that you make full and direct eye contact.
While I understand your hesitation about medicating your child, don't be afraid of it if it's the right thing. I wholeheartedly agree that kids are often medicated unnecessarily. However, for the kids that need it, medication can literally be a lifesaver. I have volunteered at a camp for years with teenagers. Every single year some idiot parent decides that their kid should take a break from their meds for camp (stopping and starting these medications suddenly can be disastrous. Please don't do it) I distinctly remember a conversation I had with one 14 year old girl whose mother made that decision. I knew her outside of camp as well, and she was just awesome. At camp, a totally different kid. She was miserable. She couldn't focus, kept getting into trouble (adhd is marked with impulse control issues as well) and told me "I feel like I am crawling out of my skin because I can't get my body to match up with my brain" For her, her meds weren't something that she was ashamed of, they were just a fact of life and something she knew helped her feel better.
You're not a bad parent. Your son may have ADHD, but it doesn't change who he is. As long as you're proactive about helping him (which it sounds like you are) he will be just fine. Good luck!
Thanks so much guys. My husband and his family are telling me it's just him being a kid, and my husband is upset that he's "already" labeled as something. I feel like it isn't just him being a kid though. I can tell he feels out of control sometimes, like he can't contain himself, and that frustrates him. It frustrated me when I was a kid and teen.
I'm planning to talk with his teachers to see what they think. My son and I talked last night and he said he would feel better with a chore chart and behavior chart so he could physically SEE how he was doing and what he needed to do.
I know he's a smarty. He's always been way ahead. He knew his colors before he was 18 months, speaking in basic sentences (where daddy go?) at 8 months. His pediatricians told me he's always been about a year to two years ahead of where he "should" be. I remember when we first moved here, he was between 2 1/2 and 3, we had gone to the zoo and had to have our picnic in the car instead of at the table, and he clearly told the gate guard, "Hi! Your picnic tables are dirty, so we transformed our car into a picnic! You might want to clean the tables so other people without cars can eat." The guard's face was hilarious.
He's having trouble reading, though. They start learning "popcorn" words, small words like the, a, I, him etc... but we'll go through his words and within 30 seconds of going of the same word 4 times, he'll forget it. He knows all his letters and numbers and can write them. He loves to count and loves addition and subtraction problems too. Things like puzzles frustrate him, but he likes doing them. He likes learning about how things work and can tell you how a car's engine uses gas to go.
It's funny because even though I have ADD, I always tested as above-average intelligence. My friend's husband has ADHD, and is VERY intelligent. So I'm not worried about how smart he might be. But I think part of his issue is not being mentally stimulated enough.
I never did well with the flashcard/"popcorn" word drills. I did eventually learn all of those words, though, by reading books that were on topics I REALLY enjoyed. Do you think you could point out those popcorn words in a book about, say, car engines? The great thing about those words is that they're in EVERYTHING you read, so the material you use to teach them can be highly individual. Read with him about things he finds really awesome and interesting, and integrate the learning part by asking him to identify words as they come up.
Some kids are just not meant for drills...they never worked for me. But you can do things to make them more fun. Here's a teacher who has taken popcorn words and put them onto powerpoints with lots of motion and color. Maybe those would keep his attention for practice better?
My nine year old son sounds a lot like your does. At least when he was 4,5, and 6. He is very energetic and has a short attention span but is very smart. When he was about to start kindergarten I remember telling his dad be prepared for weekly principal visits with him! Fortunately, it never ended up being like that. He has always been full of energy running around and screaming just for the heck of it. He is my 2nd child so it was hard for me to understand or deal with when it first came about because my 1st child was the complete opposite. He has never been diagnosed with anything and I have never pushed the issue with the pediatrician or school for a diagnosis. I figured as long as he can focus while he is at school he will be fine.
He has never been in trouble at school but at home there are days when I can feel my own frustration and his. When he does some uncontrollable behavior that I can't understand and he gets in trouble for it he says things like "I am such an idiot"!
The things I have noticed that work are one direction at a time, if he is cleaning his room I will give him step by step directions for instance pick up all the laundry and when he completes that he comes and tells me and I give him another step. It can be frustrating because I sometimes think he is 9 I shouldn't have to give such direction but it works. As far as the energy, he never had the attention span for karate he plays football which for 6 months of the year is my saving grace. It is fast paced enough for him and stimulates his mind so he can focus not to mention he loves the game so much. He has played tackle football since he was 5.
Like I said no problems at school but he will come home from school and tell me it took so much energy to be good at school today I can't contain myself any longer. Hey, if he can get through the day with the self control I am happy to be the one to deal with it rather than the teacher. When he started Kindergarten he had a harder time learning words and such so he was enrolled in a class before the actual school started to help him with it, he was in there for about 4 weeks before he had caught up to the other kids. Don't hesitate to ask the school for some additional help with these things. I honestly think he needed more personal attention to get it and once he did he has been at the top of the class each year.
I am one that doesn't think medication is always necessary but if it is then do whatever is right for your child. I have a sister that has two kids, that have been diagnosed with adhd. One of them I can actually see and understand the other was never looked at by a psychiatrist to definitely diagnose my sister just filled out a questionnaire which she knew the answers to at the pediatrician's office and got her a prescription. So I am always really leery about doctors and what the prescribe to children.
Boys are a handful and a lot of times very energetic! Some days can be trying others can be exhilarating either way I love my son just the way he is and wouldn't change him for the world! By the way never ending movement until he is sleeping has been him since the day he was born and he still does it. When he is eating I have to remind him to sit down with his food because he will pace as he eats, when he watches tv he will actually throw the football while he does it!
I am a special education teacher for 3 to 6 year olds, and am working on my Master's as an Educational Diagnostician (a person who evaluates and assess children with suspected special needs).
I think you are doing a wonderful job by getting several opinions and wanting to learn about different treatment options. It is your choice to put him on medication or not, but I would like to say that behavior interventions/counseling/medications often go hand in hand--that is to say that a pill is not magic. Just because Junior takes medication, it doesn't mean his ADHD goes away like magic. Sadly, some parents (not you) think that is what happens. When medication is used (again, I stress it is not for every child), it usually helps the child become for open to suggestion and behavior interventions. I would never advocate using medication for ADHD, unless the entire family was involved and trained in behavior interventions and some type of therapy. While medication can be very helpful to some children with ADHD, behavioral interventions can be just as important.
I'm not trying to push you either way, because the choice is yours. It sounds like you are doing great job in a very stressful situation. I wish my students' parents were more like you.
I raised my nephew from the age of 9 ~ he was diagnosed ADHD early in life and I will say he was out of control ~ took medication sometimes....and sometimes his parents took it for/from him (one reason why I raised him) ....
When I took custody of him he was not being medicated. He had a lot going on in his life unstable...and my brother, his daddy had passed away from drugs...his mom is ...well I'll just say not a good influence....
He was a lot of trouble at first and I mean a lot. I assumed it was because, and he said so, that it was because he wasn't being medicated. So we put him on what had been his regular routine when he was doing well on it. I didn't really want him on it but at the time we were told it might be needed. It worked for a while but then he said he didn't want to take the medicine because it made him feel bad...I talked it over with our doctor (nephew was present for some of the talk) and we agreed to try w/o medication. It was a battle at times I have to tell you....he just would not do his homework....would not calm down....but we worked at life w/o drugs.
It was very hard for me to tell if he was being bad on purpose or just out of control naturally....but I worked and worked with him...was on the red line with his teachers and we worked through it....I have to say right here almost all of his teachers did not want him to be medicated.
Anyway for the next 4-5 years, I just kept doing what I felt was best at the time...some things worked... some didn't....when he was at the end of his freshman year in high school he asked me to put him back on his medicince. We talked, he said "Uncle Gary I just can't focus on my school work or my sports without it"....
we went back to our family doctor....he took nephew in private, came back to me and said he was a classic case of a kid needing it. He was put on a low dose of adderall...to be taken only on school days. It really helped him. From that point on I knew if he was messing around or if it was his ADHD...or so I think.
Anyway, I left it up to him when to take his meds...at that age he knew how he wanted to feel. He really just winged it....
I was always in contact with his teachers and coaches and we all just kept doing what we felt best for him...and he worked at it too and used it as an excuse to mis-behave too
I want you to know there is hope
My nephew has just finished his 2nd year in The United States NAVY and is doing quite well in his schooling....always top 3 in his class.
I hope you are able to have a TEAM of people that care about your child as I did for my nephew
My son might have ADHD, but he's only 5 :(
He'd rather spend what time he has between school and dinner outside, and there's no video games or TV after dinner, with some TV exceptions occasionally. After dinner is family time, bath time, book time and bed time, in that order. It's been that way since he was an infant. 
He knows all his letters and numbers and can write them. He loves to count and loves addition and subtraction problems too. Things like puzzles frustrate him, but he likes doing them. He likes learning about how things work and can tell you how a car's engine uses gas to go. 
