[tricon7]

Seems like I read someone once say on this forum that when on a high-protein diet (like Atkins), ketosis isn't required to burn all the fat one is ingesting? Seems counter to what I've read of the diet.

I'm not advocating the diet long-term - just considering aspects of it.

[JohnP]

Ketosis is one of the least understood things around this forum.

You can go and read the wikipedia entry about ketosis and follow up with the wiki entry on ketogenesis but the long story short is this.

You're in ketosis when you have a high concentration of ketones in the body. Ketones are created as follows:

"When the body has no free carbohydrates available, fat must be broken down into acetyl-CoA in order to get energy. Acetyl-CoA is not being recycled through the citric acid cycle because the citric acid cycle intermediates (mainly oxaloacetate) have been depleted to feed the gluconeogenesis pathway, and the resulting accumulation of acetyl-CoA activates ketogenesis."

Ketosis has nothing to do with fat loss or fat gain. You can gain fat while being in ketosis. Everything else being equal - the energy equation is not affected by ketosis.

You can lose weight or gain weight on the Atkins diet it simply depends how many calories you eat.

[Kimorea]

Hi all

[tricon7]

Originally Posted by JohnP

Ketosis has nothing to do with fat loss or fat gain. You can gain fat while being in ketosis. Everything else being equal - the energy equation is not affected by ketosis.

You can lose weight or gain weight on the Atkins diet it simply depends how many calories you eat.

I'm not sure what the point of the Atkins diet is if one still has to count calories to lose weight (essentially). Seems like I remember about eight years ago when I was on this diet eating beef patties with cheese all the time, and I did lose a fair amount of weight - beyond just depleting my glycogen stores and such.

[JohnP]

Originally Posted by tricon7

I'm not sure what the point of the Atkins diet is if one still has to count calories to lose weight (essentially). Seems like I remember about eight years ago when I was on this diet eating beef patties with cheese all the time, and I did lose a fair amount of weight - beyond just depleting my glycogen stores and such.

The reason you lose fat is always calorie restriction. That doesn't mean you have to count calories to do so.

For example you don't count calories on Atkins. Most people by eliminating carbs will lose weight because protein and fat are very filling. There is only so much meat and cheese most people can consume. Calories are restricted by following the rules of the diet. The reason you lose weight is still calorie restriction, it just happens by another method. Some people will still be able to over eat on Atkins, and not lose or worse will gain.

[Unna]

JohnP - I agree with the simple idea of calorie restriction, but I think there is much more to the puzzle, which includes satiety and hormones (particularly important for females).

For example, I was eating about 1500-1700 cal. half a year of the "normal" diet, was regularly jogging, but completely stopped losing around 75 kilos. Calorically that makes no sense. And if I went up in calories, I kept inching toward 80 kgs...... I felt like I had no control.

However, now I'm eating much more everyday 2000 - 2500 cal. (high fat/moderate protein/low carb), have stopped experiencing blood sugar swings, and am continually gaining lean body mass and losing fat. This also gave me the energy and confidence to take up heavy lifting. I'm now around 70 kg. and the scale keeps inching down, in a healthy, slow manner (I started eating low carb in January of 2012, then began nutritional ketosis as an experiment in November).

Anyway, I find I feel my absolute best mentally and physically on nutritional ketosis.

I agree that weight loss definitely has to do with calories - it is one side of the story - but its not the whole story.

Especially not for women.

Although I wish it were - I would have reached my goal weight a very long time ago if it were only about calories in-calories out.

[JohnP]

There is no doubt that not all calories are created equal, nor that people will feel quite different depending on their macronutrient breakdown.

The point regarding calories is that an energy deficit is the reason we burn fat off our bodies. NOT because of restricting carbs.

[CabernetKitty]

This is older, but hopefully people are still reading:

It is all about calories. If you were living off of Marshmallow fluff, but only had 1200 calories of Marshmallow fluff all day you would lose weight. HOWEVER, this is what I'm wondering:

If you deplete your glycogen stores and you are taking in extremely limited carbs AND you are watching your overall calorie count, would you burn body fat faster than somebody eating a high-carb diet with the same number of calories?

[Nora52]

I would say definately. If I eat sugar / carbs it keeps my Insulin sky high. If Insulin is high it is near impossible to lose weight. Cutting the calories just slows down the metabolism. Eating the right sort of fat and protein, and keeping carbs low is the only thing that works for my IR. Watching the calorie content then helps as well but it tends to happen naturally as the appetite decreases with the lowering of Insulin peaks.