Food Talk And Fabulous Finds - Anyone know if this is true?

I read in a nutrition book that cooking sprays such as PAM, etc. have just as many calories as butter and that the reason they say zero is that a "serving" is about a 1/4 of a second spray. I looked on my cooking spray can and it does say a serving is 1/3 second spray... not long enough to spray out any calories. Just curious as to whether anyone knows if this is true... or I guess I may need to do some serious googling to find out.

I've always heard that too. I think that because we spray it, we use less and therefore less calories and fat. It stands to reason, anyway. I use the olive oil spray because even though it's less, if there is any fat in there, at least it will be the "good" fat.

Yup, it's true. Here's a cut & paste article on a related subject. I can't post the link directly because I don't think it would be a 3FC's-friendly link, since it links to other diet sites, message boards and advertisements.

Hannaford's Butter Flavored Cooking Spray is palinly labeled "For Fat-Free Cooking" on the can. The problem is, the serving size on the nutrition label is so ridiculously small, that the calories per serving works out to 0.

A serving size is a 1/4 second spray. Ridiculous! 557 servings in a 6-oz can. I know there is fat in the product because the first ingredient listed is Canola Oil. I just wanted to know how much fat.

I called Hannaford's 800 number and was only able to get a little more info about nutrition, but still nothing useful. They referred me to International Home Foods who manufacturers the product. I called IHF and spoke to a gentleman who was able to give me some reasonbly useful nutrition info. He told me to multiply the servings per container by .266 to get the number of grams of fat in the entire can. After a few more questions he also admitted that, yes, the spray is 100% fat.

After doing the math, it works out that a single 6-oz. can contains 1333 calories and 148 grams of fat! The entire can accounts for 139 seconds of spraying time, which means (roughly) more than 1 gram of fat per second of spray! I think it's high time the nutrition labeling gets an overhaul. There are too many loopholes which allow manufacturers to deceive the consumer regarding nutrition content.

In this case, they told me that because it is an aerosal spray, legally they can list the serving size as 1/3 of a second. This flies in the face of common sense. I've been using butter spray to flavor my popcorn for years. No more.

If you use a LOT of cooking and butter sprays then sure, the calories are going to add up. But I've personally never worried about it. I mean, in either case, it's got to be a little bit better than using straight butter or margarine. That's the way I've always figured it. But I agree, food labels can be very deceiving.

I read in a recent article (in a doctor's office so I don't remember the magazine) that calculated the "average" person's use when coating a 10" pan, - about 3 seconds of spray - came to about 25 calories.

Thanks for the good responses. Yes it is probably still low compared to other stuff but I will not buy any more of it because I consider it totally dishonest advertising and labeling.

Thanks for the good responses. Yes it is probably still low compared to other stuff but I will not buy any more of it because I consider it totally dishonest advertising and labeling.
lol, well, we can't just stop buying stuff because of misrepresented advertising. If that were the case, we'd be chucking an awful lot of products.

It's up to us to be smart enough to read labels carefully and, in some cases, figure it out for ourselves. We shouldn't have to, but... such is life.

I do agree, however, they could do a lot better. 1/3 second of a spray? Come on. Who the **** stands there and counts 1/3 of a second?

I just advised a friend to stop using butter and use pam. Umm.....well 25 cals is still not bad.

Like I said, it's better than using butter or margarine. I've been using cooking sprays and butter sprays for 2 years. I don't think it's hurt me, lol.

And to add, you're gonna have 'hidden' calories all over the place. That's a given. I'd much rather use cooking spray than oil or butter.

Misti,

http://healthletter.tufts.edu/issues/2004-04/asktufts.html

Question:The Nutrition Facts label on Pam cooking spray says it contains no calories. But how can that be? It’s made with canola oil.
Answer:There are no calories in a 1/3- second spray of Pam, but to cover a 10-inch skillet you need a 1-second spray, and that contains 7 calories, as it states elsewhere on the can. You’re still cutting calories dramatically though, since a teaspoon of oil poured from a bottle (also in about a second) has 40 calories; a tablespoon, 120 calories.

It's kind of like splenda, there are no calories or carbs for the serving size but if you use it in more significant amounts, there are definitely calories and carbs.

I have a Misto sprayer. I fill it with olive oil and pressurize it and spray it. I just like knowing exactly what's in it.

[QUOTE=It's kind of like splenda, there are no calories or carbs for the serving size but if you use it in more significant amounts, there are definitely calories and carbs.
[/QUOTE]

Very correct, in fact, cup for cup, splenda has more calories than sugar does... At least with the baking blend and the brown sugar blend... and they don't taste near as good as the real stuff does either.


Those misto sprayers are great... I'd much rather have a few more calories of a natural product than the chemicals that are in the cooking sprays.

Very correct, in fact, cup for cup, splenda has more calories than sugar does... At least with the baking blend and the brown sugar blend... and they don't taste near as good as the real stuff does either.


I've not used the baking blend or the brown sugar blend, so I can't comment on that. But the plain old splenda has 96 calories per cup compared to 774 for a cup of sugar, so it is a big difference. I like the taste of Splenda, but my husband agrees with you. :)

lol, well, we can't just stop buying stuff because of misrepresented advertising. If that were the case, we'd be chucking an awful lot of products.

It's up to us to be smart enough to read labels carefully and, in some cases, figure it out for ourselves. We shouldn't have to, but... such is life.<<<


I can if I catch them. <G> And this is blatant deception to the point of being an outright lie. :) There are a LOT of companies I have ceased to do business with. And I certainly DO read labels and figure stuff out for myself. My can is not PAM but a different brand and it does NOT say it has calories. Yes, DUH, it has canola oil so obviously it does -- so color me stupid on this one :rofl: -- but it is still way too blatant deception for my taste.

I HAVE chucked a lot of products as well as fast food places, etc. You won't find a Lean Cuisine or other processed crap in my house. :)

Buy their lies if you want... yes, there are some things we just accept... we all decide where to draw the line. Since I am trying to eat mostly non-processed foods anyway, this is just one more that will "go" for me.

And Linda, butter or margarine are not the only options. :) Tammy, great idea about the mister -- exactly what I will do and as you say, I will know what is in it. Maleficint, I agree... I am going more and more natural and I don't want the chemicals either!

Misti: Why not eat healthy and use olive oil? I switched to using that because it works just as good and it has GOOD cholesterol. 1 Tablespoon can cook anything. Besides, with all the non stick cookware out there today, you don't need anything most times. I'm with the other ladies who choose healthy over calories. Ten years down the road you may read that something that was in those sprays, now cause cancer or something else oughful. Why take the chance? Those misters are great also.
Norma

I am loathe to sacrifice precious calories to cooking oil, so I've learned to cook with a lot less oil than I did before.

I use an olive oil spray. If I just need a thin non-stock coating, I spray a little on the pan, then use a paper towel to spread the oil over the entire pan and wipe off the excess at the same time. I use this same method when coating a baking pan. This way, if I held the spray button down too long, I've wiped off the excess anyway.

If I need more than just a thin non-stick coating, I usually pour 1/2 tsp to a full tsp of olive oil in the pan. With a non-stock plan, I rarely ever need a full tablespoon.

- Barbara

I could be wrong, but I seem to remember buying another butter spray brand a couple years ago that gave a more informative disclaimer about cumulative calorie counts (I think it was the Weight Watcher's brand). In fact, I think it listed the calories for both a 1/2 or 1 second spray for cooking, which was 0 calories, and a longer spray to use for seasoning popcorn.

Whether they've changed the labeling since, or I've got the wrong brand, you might look at the other sprays and see if any are more upfront about the calorie count.

I once read, at least ten years ago (though the FDA regulations may have changed since) that any product with fewer than 5 calories per serving, can list the calorie count as 0. So a diet soda that lists the calories as 5 or 2, may have the same number of calories as another soda that lists the calories as 0.

You may find a brand that seems to use more accurate standards, or at least cautions against "overspraying" as my store brand does (it doesn't really tell you what the danger is, but I've always assumed it refers to calorie count).

I will definitely check the labels on these sprays next time I need them, but I'll probably keep buying the cheapest brands or the brand that contains only pure olive oil, as it's easier than trying to measure out 1/8 of a teaspoon (4 - 5 calories) of oil.

Norma, actually I do eat healthy and use olive oil for most stuff. But for some things I really don't like the taste. But actually I use very small amounts of any of that kind of thing... you can "fry" most stuff with water or broth, and I fry very little anyway except maybe an egg now and then.

In any case I have been wanting to break the cooking spray habit anyway. I do use the spray on popcorn, and olive oil just won't "cut it" for that. :) Colleen, I am sure you are right that there are probably other brands that are more honest about the calorie count, but I would really like to use this time to just break away from it completely to avoid the chemicals.

I have done the "wiping it around with a paper towel" thing too -- good idea, Barbara. I also like just getting a mister and putting my own oil into it.

I can if I catch them. <G> And this is blatant deception to the point of being an outright lie. :)
They're not lying about anything. There probably *ARE* zero calories in 1/3 of a second spray.

Does anyone have any info about these evil chemicals? My non-stick spray can ingredients are 100% Extra Virgin Olive Oil, Soy Lecithin, Water, and Propellant. Seeing as how the propellant is listed last, there obviously can't be much of it in there--is it really that bad? Does anyone know what the propellant actually is?

I dunno...I don't think 1/3 second spray is all too dishonest. After reading this thread yesterday, I timed how long I sprayed my pan for burgers, and it was not even 1 full second (couldn't get all the way through "Mississippi" ;) ), and that was a pan big enough to hold 4 turkey burger patties--after all, it's supposed to be a light mist, right, not spray-painting the pan yellow? I guess if I wanted to get picky about untruthful food labels, I think there are more severe cases that would earn my attention first. How about the peanut butters, fat-free Cool Whip, potato chips, and countless other foods that contain hydrogenated oils, yet say 0g trans fat on the label? All that really means is that there's less than .5g trans fat per serving, but there could very well be .49, so you have a couple servings of these foods throughout the day, and your total of something you thought you were avoiding altogether adds up :devil:

Maybe I'm just a bit more lenient because of my marketing/business background/education. Losing weight is more important to me than sticking it to the man (although I do enjoy pointing out man-sticking opportunities as much as the next person--I just can't afford to avoid every company with a shred of truth-bending--then I wouldn't be able to eat anything I don't grow myself!).

I have never used sprays... I use Becel Light and for 35 calories for two tbsp it doesn't seem that bad to me.... I guess I don't really use a lot of butter in any of my cooking... I think about the only time I use butter is when I fry eggs, and even then its such a small amount.... oh and when I make grilled cheese!

Jill- from what I've been able to tell, it's a chemical that maintains the pressure in an aerosal can, but is practiaclly non existent outside of the can.... I think....

I agree, if I were to scrutinize the contents of every single product I used down to the last ingredient, I'm afraid I would be forced into a life of solitude, deep in the mountains to live off of nuts and berries and bathe in snow. I fear I know too much as it is already.

BTW- hope the Guster concert was good. Did Ray Lamontagne open?

BTW- hope the Guster concert was good. Did Ray Lamontagne open?
It was AWESOME (even though it was an ampitheater on a day with a heat index of 110)--and yes, although I'd never heard of Ray before, so that was new to me. He sounded good, but he doesn't have much of a stage presence :dizzy:

Courtnie, I forgot about actual butter--I use fat-free Promise for 5 calories and 0g fat (err, at least less than .5g) per tablespoon on my grilled cheese instead of non-stick spray.

I agree, if I were to scrutinize the contents of every single product I used down to the last ingredient, I'm afraid I would be forced into a life of solitude, deep in the mountains to live off of nuts and berries and bathe in snow. I fear I know too much as it is already.
Exactly.

Something I've learned in my journey to lose weight is that you eventually relax a little and stop freaking out over every little detail.

Like to Misti, for example... I can appreciate the fact that you want to eat clean. I think that's great. But you've got to stop trashing and bashing every food product you don't approve of. I used to do that too. But I relaxed eventually and you will too, with time. Like the way you bash the Lean Cuisines... yes, to you, they're crap. But some of us DO eat them and we eat them regularly and I don't think it's necessary for you to continually bash these food products. I can't count how many posts there are of you literally thrashing calorie-controlled meals, even to those people who admit they eat them on a regular basis. That's not nice, honey. Just because you don't like them doesn't mean no one else does. It's like a belief in a religion, for example - I may not believe in a particular religion, but I respect the beliefs and opinions of those who do. And I'd never make them feel lousy for holding onto those beliefs.

I respect your opinions, but so many of your posts about food are on the negative side. I'm not saying you're being negative for wanting to stop using cooking spray. That's not my point. That's your right and your opinion. What I mean is you tend to REALLY lash out with your beliefs about food that you don't approve of, even though others are eating those foods regularly.

You're entitled to your opinions just like the rest of us - but don't be so harsh about it and sit there and blatantly call foods that some of us eat regularly CRAP. That's your opinion. And that's great. But respect the opinions of those who happen to like these foods.

You'll relax in time. And no, I'm not saying you'll relax to the point where you'll start eating the foods you disapprove of. I mean you'll relax to where you're doing your thing and letting others do theirs without posting negative comments about their beliefs :)

And editing to say, I'm not trying to offend you or make you mad. I'm just saying I think you need to relax a little. And to be honest, I've been wanting to say this to you for some time now. If I've upset you, it's not my intention. I'm just spouting off some constructive criticism is all because sometimes (Im not saying always) you can get pretty nasty when you start your bashfests on certain foods.

[COLOR=Indigo]It was AWESOME (even though it was an ampitheater on a day with a heat index of 110)--and yes, although I'd never heard of Ray before, so that was new to me. He sounded good, but he doesn't have much of a stage presence :dizzy:COLOR]

haha, i asked because he has had some problems on stage with getting PO'd at loud audience members and stormed off stage and yelled at people and what-not. He is meant for the iPod or the coffee shop in my opinion. I think he was a bad match with Guster (tho I love them both). Anyway, glad you had a good time! :)

back OT....

You're entitled to your opinions just like the rest of us - but don't be so harsh about it and sit there and blatantly call foods that some of us eat regularly CRAP. That's your opinion. And that's great. But respect the opinions of those who happen to like these foods.


I eat one lean cuisine a day for lunch, and I'm sooo glad that we have them available to us, and i'm loosing weight (which is priority #1 to me). i figure on the "crap" scale, one lean cuisine a day, is much better than one supersized #1 meal at McD's anyday of the week thankyouverymuch. Thanks for sticking up for us lean cuisine'ers.

i figure on the "crap" scale, one lean cuisine a day, is much better than one supersized #1 meal at McD's anyday of the week
Very good point--I know I didn't get so fat by eating too many Lean Cuisines ;)

I went through a (brief) period where I didn't want to eat anything with "chemical" or "crap" ingredients. However, I then learned that some of what I thought were "chemical" ingredients (you know, the big long words you can't even pronounce :p ) were actually just fancy words for things like Vitamin B12 or natural preservatives.

Oh, and like I said, for anyone who is worried about chemicals, the only ingredients in my non-stick spray are extra virgin olive oil, water, soy lecithin (actually known to help prevent many serious diseases), and the propellant (which if I'm understanding correctly is really just used to create pressure in the can and is not part of what comes out onto your pan).

Although, I also understand Misti's original point--this isn't really about the ingredients--it's about the deception on the label. And it is frustrating, yes, but almost all companies round their calories (and, for obvious reasons, round down). I bet those 100-calorie snack packs actually have up to 104.9 calories in them ;)

I eat one lean cuisine a day for lunch, and I'm sooo glad that we have them available to us, and i'm loosing weight (which is priority #1 to me). i figure on the "crap" scale, one lean cuisine a day, is much better than one supersized #1 meal at McD's anyday of the week thankyouverymuch. Thanks for sticking up for us lean cuisine'ers.
I love 'em. I like Healthy Choice, too. I'll also buy the Smart Ones now and then.

In fact, I need to stock up again. I'm down to only 3 LC's in my freezer, lol.

I also agree with Jill's post below, about the cookies and stuff. I'm sure every single pack doesn't have EXACTLY 100 calories. But you know, hey, if you're not sure, then give yourself some leeway every day. Like slop on an extra 50 calories a day just for those 'hidden' little evils. Because I'm sure there have been many days I've eaten more calories than I thought I did and other days where I've eaten LESS than I thought.

I don't try and pinpoint it down to an exact science. I go by the averages and estimates. And really, that's all we CAN do.

I love lean cuisines, healthy choice and smart ones! I know it has helped me lose some weight. Plus I use Pam all the time, much better than putting tablespoons of vegetable oil in a pan!

A frozen entree brand I like and take to work for lunch about once a week is called Ethnic Gourmet. It's a line of Indian/Thai/Italian/other frozen dinners that are minimally processed, contain some really healthy ingredients and are YUMMY! Every time I heat one up at work, people gather around asking me what it is 'cuz it smells sooo good. I get mine @ either Kroger or Whole Foods and they're ~$4-5 each. I don't know how that compares in price to the brands mentioned above (although I should b/c my DH brings a Lean Cuisine to work for lunch almost every day!) and since I don't count calories I don't know how things stack up there, either.

I will say that for me, I try to strike a balance between nutrition and convenience in the foods I eat. It's hard to keep at this if it's too onerous/time-consuming. A new WOE is a big part of my life but it's not my WHOLE life. Gotta have some time for other things, right?

I try to strike a balance between nutrition and convenience in the foods I eat.
I also have to add money to the mix--shopping at Whole Foods puts a MAJOR strain on my budget :dizzy:

As for oil sprays, they contain oil, oil contains calories, but they are rounding their calories down. As I understand it, the manufacturers don't even control the labeling really, it is part of the USDA or FDA? I'm not sure. So they say "here is what a serving is for spray oil" and the manufacturer comes up with a number less than 0, so they put 0 on the label.

If you want to do a more natural type of spray, there are spritzers out there that use air and I think you have to pump them but they do work similar to spray oils. I think when I run out of my can of Pam, I may look into buying one.

As far as frozen meals go, I don't do them. I do like to control my ingredients, especially sodium. I also think it is cheaper for me to make my own frozen meals which are basically leftovers of food I make. I take my lunch every day to work. It is usually leftovers. Last week, I made too much of a recipe, so we ate the leftovers and then I made individual frozen lunches with some of the leftovers so I could eat it at a later date.

I don't have a problem if someone chooses to use frozen meals because well that is your choice :) Although I do think if you do it for yourself it is probably better for you and cheaper.

I don't have a problem if someone chooses to use frozen meals because well that is your choice :) Although I do think if you do it for yourself it is probably better for you and cheaper.
Well, I personally don't 'rely' on frozen meals to count my calories for me. I keep them in stock, yes, but most of the time I prepare my own foods. Like today for lunch I had a chicken breast and a potato. Yesterday I had a zucchini and fresh corn on the cob. And both days (well ALL days right now since I have my own tomato garden) I've eaten a whole tomato. The day before that I had mashed cauliflower and baked cod. And I never eat Lean Cuisines for dinner. Those are only a lunch thing. And, as you can see, I don't eat them every day :)

I do eat the "carb smart" SmartOnes and Lean Cuisines--they're just different combinations of chicken, veggies, and flavorings. They each have between 600 and 800mg of sodium, which for me isn't that much. I don't add salt to anything I eat, I rinse all canned veggies before eating, and I don't eat typically "salty" foods (chips, crackers, etc.), so what I get from my frozen lunch is the bulk of my sodium for the day, anyway. I also checked the ingredients on my 3 different meals, and the worst thing I could find was ketchup (contains high fructose corn syrup), but it was waaay down on the list of ingredients. I think if you're smart about the amount of sodium in the rest of your food, I don't really see the evil of these frozen meals. I mean, I wouldn't have a ham omelette, a Lean Cuisine, and hotdogs all in the same day, but if you're smart about it, you can balance it out :) There are even some days when my sodium is very low, and my average daily sodium intake for the week is always well under 3000 (since 2400 is what is recommended for "normal" Americans).

Oh, and I only buy them when they are on sale. I don't spend more than 2.50 on a frozen meal. I figure for that price, it's both cheaper AND more convenient (no driving) than fast food ;)

Personally, I believe it's important to look at processed/whole foods as a full spectrum. On one end is people eating who consider a bologna and "cheese food" sandwhich on white bread, with chips (and maybe some more cheese in a can) along with some "fruit newtons" or a twinkie as a balanced lunch. On the other end is the person who eats only what they personally have grown or raised (and/or bought from others who have done the same).

The vast majority of us are somewhere in the middle. My goal is to keep heading toward the "whole food" end, and away from the "processed" end, but I see myself raising free-range chickens and dairy goats, canning fruits and veggies, and making my own cheese on my little hobby farm only in my daydreams (Sure would be cool though).

The title of this thread should be changed to "Are you a food snob? Can't you just play nice?" LLV you merely said what some of us where thinking.

These last few posts remind me of a former boss I had, who when he saw I was dieting, lectured me on the health benefits of jogging, and juicing (all of those antioxidants you know, apparently he just forgot about all the good fiber he was tossing in the trash). The biggest irony was that he was a chain smoker, his office smelled so bad (even after our building "technically" went no smoking) that I could barely breath in it.

It can be easy to get on our soapboxes, especially when we have the convictions of the newly converted (the biggest social bores are people new to their religion or their weight loss program).

Hey. Leave the juice out of this.


EDIT: And for the record, I am a TOTAL food snob. I didn't used to be, it happened, and I'm not complaining...But I would never ask you to be.

The title of this thread should be changed to "Are you a food snob? Can't you just play nice?" LLV you merely said what some of us where thinking.
Well, to be honest, it's something I've been wanting to tell her for some time now. I really don't mean to sound insulting or rude. Because believe me, I've been where she is now, thinking 'this food' is bad and 'that food' is evil... and you know what? They really aren't. It's our decision as to what food choices we make. And over the last year, I've majorly relaxed about certain things and I'm glad I did. The main reason I said something to her is because I'm seeing ME - about a year and a half ago - in her posts. And I had someone flat out tell me, "Linda, you really need to relax. Stop freaking out over every blasted thing and just go with the flow. Do your lifestyle and enjoy it. But don't put everyone else down because their lifestyle doesn't coincide with yours."

Wow, that was a wake-up and a half. And I sat back and took a look at myself and thought man, I am FREAKY over this stuff.

I had to relax. And I'm only telling Misti that it would be in her best interest to do the same. I'm not saying she doesn't have the right to look out for what she feels is best for her. We ALL have that right. But more times than I can count, she's literally made me feel 'stupid' for some of the food choices I've made. And I'm basically giving her some friendly advice that it's better to just relax about that stuff. Do your own thing. But don't put down others for the things they do.

And that's all I was trying to tell her.

Relax, babe. It's much better for your stress levels as well as everything else ;)

Especially as Americans, we love extremes and hate moderation. Everything is great, or everything is evil. You're either perfect, or worthless, and I think that's why many of us are here. I know it's definitely plaid a key role in my weight problem for myself, and my inability to dig myself out of the whole I've created.

Even now, into this about 15 months or more, I keep forgetting about the progress I've made especially when I "slip or dip," into old habits. Sometimes it isn't even a matter of making a mistake as much as berating myself for not being perfect. If I eat within plan, and exercise, but not as much or in the way I planned, or didn't get all my water in, or any detail I may have overlooked, I can start to feel all superstitious about it.

We throw a lot of superstition and magical thinking into dieting, exercise, and health that doesn't belong there (or in our lives at all, for that matter). It's as though we believe that one small misstep and it will all crumble.

Virtually nothing is as simple as we often try to make it. Factors affecting factors, affecting factors. You take your genetic makeup, figure in every aspect of your physical and social environment, add on every behavior you've engaged in since you were born, every disease, illness, and injury...

As I said before, it doesn't mean nothing matters, it just means you have to pick your battles and be willing to accept a certain amount of risk and uncertainty. Which risks you take, when, and how often, and even how informed you want to be about the risks you are taking, is really is up to the individual.

I think sometimes we forget that part. We get pretty excited about (or feel the need to defend) our choices, and sometimes try to impress them onto others without even thinking, caring, or agreeing whether the choices are appropriate for "everyone."

I know when I get "worked up," I get kind of preachy, and forget that "my way" may not work for everyone (or I get to thinking they should at least ALL try it before deciding against it).

"When I am Queen of the World...."

LLV, you shouldn't let anyone make you feel stupid for the food choices you make. I also don't think you are going to make anyone change their mind on how they view food. If you want let someone know they are being judgemental, that is fine.

All of us are on this website for one main reason, and that is because we are interested in losing weight or maintaining weight we have lost. We want to share our experiences with people as they share their experiences with us.

Most of us also have a alternative purposes beyond losing weight or maintaining our weight loss. Of course not all of us share the same feelings about food, exercise and methods of weight loss. Some people think diet drugs are the way to go, while others thing that heavily restricting carbs is the way to go, others think that following a specific program is the way to go, etc. We all really speak from our own view and sometimes that may conflict with others view but that is ok.

Sometimes there are people that say "why do I need to do that? I'll lose weight without that" and they are true, but some people do "that" because they want to or they think it'll help with their weight loss and their overall health. Some people may state that if it really doesn't help with their weight loss then they don't need to do it. That is fine and I have no argument with that, if their goal is weight loss.

Personally, my primary goal is weight loss but I also have many other goals. My personal goals include trying to eat as healthy as I can eat. To me this means eating lots of veggies, fruits, whole grains, nuts, legumes, lean meats and healthy fats. I would like to eat more organics but I don't eat a lot. I am also cutting out meat quite a bit. This also means limiting the amount of processed foods, fried foods, sweets, greasy foods, etc. These are of course my goals and they aren't everyones and they aren't necessary to lose weight.

Basically, I just wanted to say that we are all different and our goals may all be different and I don't think anyone should be offended by someone else stating their personal goals.

The question isn't being offended by someone elses personal goals. Its being offended when someone else tells you your personal goals aren't as healthy/as important/as well executed as theirs, or implies that they know better than you what your personal choices should be.

This is an issue I've come across multiple times on this board, and I'm trying to learn to let it go and acknowledge that just because something is a good choice for one person, its not one for me. Still, no one likes to feel like their choices are being negatively judged - we're all doing the best we can.

[COLOR=Indigo]I think if you're smart about the amount of sodium in the rest of your food, I don't really see the evil of these frozen meals. I mean, I wouldn't have a ham omelette, a Lean Cuisine, and hotdogs all in the same day, but if you're smart about it, you can balance it out :) There are even some days when my sodium is very low, and my average daily sodium intake for the week is always well under 3000 (since 2400 is what is recommended for "normal" Americans).COLOR]

This struck a chord with me. I think with a standard diet, the frozen meals can appear heavy on the sodium and I have my own reasons for not eating them. One of which, though, is that that is how I choose to control and manage my diet. Example? I am now under 16% body fat. And I have a confession to make... I make my eggs with real butter. Not PAM, not oil, but butter. I have made room in my diet to accommodate this. My friend is a salad dressing person. She can't imagine life without blue cheese. I can reason with this, because my dressing isn't exactly low cal either. I don't eat high sodium foods. I don't eat fast food. My diet is naturally pretty lowfat, so I can have some good dressing on my salad and butter with my eggs. So I certainly agree with making room and adjustments.

And LLV, I'm with you. You should not feel bad for wanting to come to a wonderful place such as this and feel like what you're doing is inherently wrong with every post you make. As much as I believe what I believe and as strongly as I believe them, they are my reasons. I, for some reason, identified with a raw based and whole foods diet. While I admire those that have made this a choice (high raw) for the rest of their lives, I have made adjustments according to what works for me. I got to where I needed to be and feel good from day to day and believe I can do this for the rest of my life (most days). Compared to where I was a few years ago, I have obtained a wealth of knowledge that I feel I am better for. And I LOVE the fact that this place exists and there is a whole section devoted to the discussion of the diet I follow.

And it does not give me the right to wander into a thread about lean cuisines and announce "I stay away from processed crap like that", or other various one-liners. At that point, it isn't about finding support for the diet you are following or even advocating a lifestyle. I'm not sure the intention is the same.

I am thankful for the advice and support I find here and hope it continues- Misti, Jill, LLV, Stevi-rocks, Nelie, you have ALL said things that have resonated with me and helped me find a power within myself and it usually has nothing to do with what plan we're on, but this certainly gave me something to think about....

wow...I see this became quite a topic of interest after I signed off yesterday. On the one hand, I agree with many of the things everyone has said--some extremely valid points have been made; on the other hand, I think some personal, specific messages are better said in a PM than on a public board--isn't that why we have the PM option? :^:

wow...I see this became quite a topic of interest after I signed off yesterday. On the one hand, I agree with many of the things everyone has said--some extremely valid points have been made; on the other hand, I think some personal, specific messages are better said in a PM than on a public board--isn't that why we have the PM option? :^:


Yes-it IS why we have the PM feature. ;)

I am a clean eater for the most part...and I believe that organic products are superior, that plain oatmeal is better than flavored packets, natural peanut butter is superior over most naem brands with sugar and sodium added-and so on and so forth...BUT, on that same note-I think that certain diet products can be helpful if they are not overused. I don't believe that it all has to be "all or nothing".

I think having 2 bags of 100 Calorie Packs per day is too much junk for a reduced calorie diet and that they should be used more sparingly, but I think that they are perfect for throwing in your purse Friday night when you have plans to go to the movies-and want to avoid the large buttered popcorn bucket and the humongo bag of M&Ms that contains 3 servings instead of 1.

I don't eat frozen dinners daily...but I *do* have a few in my freezer. I don't eat them for lunch daily-but my strategy with them is that I use them for extreme cravings that really can't be satisfied in other ways-like the Lean Cuisine egg roll or fried rice entrees. Going to a chinese buffet is an overeating trigger for me, so having one on hand saves me maybe once a month from caving into a craving-and essentially eating 300 calories worth of white rice/chinese, rather than the 1500+ I would eat at the restaurant.