Weight Loss Support - I found this about water - Food for thought




mel67
07-10-2006, 03:30 PM
Was reading the other thread a couple of days ago about water killing someone after a work out. I found this in the most recent issue of Prevention Mags "Weight Loss" issue. You guys may alread know this info, but on page 25 it says this:

"A German study showed that drinking cold water burns calories. Drinking about 2 cups of cold water, no warmer than 72 degrees, used up roughly 25 calories. About 40% of the burn was for bringing the water from drinking temperature to body temperature. Drink a liter a day and you're loosing 5 pounds a year."

I know the other thread indicated that the guy had been working out and drank the water afterwards, so this is not the same thing. However, I found it really interesting, I'd heard this before, but never read it in a health mag or anything. Food for thought.


veggielover
07-10-2006, 04:39 PM
well, generally things that are ingested cold require energy from the body to warm it up to suit your internal environment, but I definitely wouldn't substitute drinking cold water for exercise, only because intuitively it seems so not-effective!

sotypical
07-10-2006, 04:52 PM
I am really confused on how drinking water after exercise kills someone and how that relates to cold water buring calories?


mel67
07-10-2006, 05:53 PM
It doesn't have anything to do with the other post, as I said above (other than water is the issue). I just thought it was interesting, and was sharing. as for water not working, it's already proven water can help wieght loss (not to mention countless other things). My own weight loss increased about .5 pounds a week, when I started drinking the water. Intuitively or not, it does work. I wasn't suggesting it should replace exercise, I was just sharing something I thought was interesting, not trying to "connect" it to the guy who died, it was just along the same lines, because it was water related. Nothing more.

sotypical
07-10-2006, 06:03 PM
ohhh okay, I get it now.

But I agree, I drink 6 liters of water a day and I think it TOTALLY helps with me loss.

mel67
07-10-2006, 06:08 PM
I saw it in somebody's siggy here, don't remember who, it says:
"the more you drink, the more you shrink"

i drink at least 100oz a day, and they're always cold. :)

Glory87
07-10-2006, 06:15 PM
I dislike drinking plain water and don't drink very much - I still lost 1-2 lbs a week. Didn't seem to affect me one way or another. I try to drink a glass of water with dinner and lunch, and I have a few cups of tea during the day, that's about it.

Glory87
07-10-2006, 06:20 PM
Sadly, the "drinking cold water to burn more calories" theory has been debunked :(

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=13560

Although this report is more favorable:

http://www.howstuffworks.com/question447.htm

I love the internet, you can find something to back up anything!

smoochie3
07-10-2006, 06:26 PM
eh... either way I drink water cold.

veggielover
07-10-2006, 07:16 PM
well water is required for the liver to work, so you need to drink more if you expect your liver to be working more.

beforeim35
07-11-2006, 09:24 AM
When I was in labor with my second child and was thirsty, the doctor would not allow me to have ice chips or cold water because he said it would take too much energy to warm it up. LOL, I thought it was crap then but that was because I felt entitled to something cold to drink considering I was in SO MUCH PAIN.

mel67
07-11-2006, 10:40 AM
I can only vouch for myself, and water definatly increased my weight loss. It must be good, it must be a plus, because other wise, i dont think the "weight loss/health folks" would be pounding it at us to drink drink drink. I've read and been to countless weight loss sites, and one of the top mantras was 'drink water'. Whether or not cold water vs. tepid water is better, i dunno. i just know that water itself has been good to my weight loss. not to mention my hair is shinier, my facial skin cleared up, and (ahemm) constipation is not even a word in my vocabulary any more. And it seems that every "theory" we come upon, some where out there, there is another "theory" or study that debunks it. Some studies show it works, some say it doesn't, to the point ya don't know what to believe, and must rely on our own experiences. could be that just every "body" is different. it makes sense to me. really cold water cools down our insides, which in turn need to be heated back up to temp, which requires energy. anywho!! i'm sticking with the water. its good for me :) debunked or not, i've seen the proof in my pudding. I'm down 22 pounds, without a lick of exercise.

sotypical
07-11-2006, 12:18 PM
I just wanted to say something about those stupid doctors not allowing you to drink! When I was in Hawaii and had to have my appendix out I was sooo thirsty! It took me like two days (maybe 3) to go to the hospital and for that whole time all I did was drink water water water! Anyway when I went the hospital and they took my appendix out and I woke up SOOO thirsty I could of drunk a lake. I have never felt so thirsty in my life - I thought I was going to die! I asked for water and they wouldn't give it to me, they gave me this stupid wet sponge in a glass to suck on - I mean HOW GROSS and it only made it worse! Anyway I took the little sip of water that was in the cup and they yelled at me! I was sooo mad :( haha $20k to stay there and I can't even have a glass of water, pffftt! Thank god for travel insurance!

Anyway just thought I would share.

Heather
07-11-2006, 02:07 PM
I can only vouch for myself, and water definatly increased my weight loss. It must be good, it must be a plus, because other wise, i dont think the "weight loss/health folks" would be pounding it at us to drink drink drink. I've read and been to countless weight loss sites, and one of the top mantras was 'drink water'. Whether or not cold water vs. tepid water is better, i dunno. i just know that water itself has been good to my weight loss. not to mention my hair is shinier, my facial skin cleared up, and (ahemm) constipation is not even a word in my vocabulary any more. And it seems that every "theory" we come upon, some where out there, there is another "theory" or study that debunks it. Some studies show it works, some say it doesn't, to the point ya don't know what to believe, and must rely on our own experiences. could be that just every "body" is different. it makes sense to me. really cold water cools down our insides, which in turn need to be heated back up to temp, which requires energy. anywho!! i'm sticking with the water. its good for me :) debunked or not, i've seen the proof in my pudding. I'm down 22 pounds, without a lick of exercise.

I got sucked into the debate last week about whether drinking cold water killed someone and apparently offended some people. So, I present the following with some trepidation. I just want to say up front that I am not trying to offend anyone. I'm trying to present information on a topic I am knowledgable (research design and our ability to make causal claims) and welcome discussion on the topic.

That said...

As for the issue of not knowing what to believe, I think that is the experience of most of us! Some of the problems are that much of the time the research we read about isn't necessarily written by someone who knows how to interpret it, and then, if WE aren't experts in an area, it's hard for us to know how to interpret it and what the main issues are.

So I know exactly what you mean! However, I think it's unfortunate, and that some of the problems could be cleared up if we were more educated about how research works and what the limits of research are. I post the information below to help people understand some of those issues and limits.

There certainly is a lot of confusing information out there, not just about water, but about everything! One of the reasons a lot of the information is so confusing is that it is very hard to demonstrate that X causes Y.

I teach research design courses and one of the issues we discuss repeatedly is that the best way to show causation is to conduct an experiment in which you control every variable other than the one you want to study. So, if I wanted to study how water affects weight loss -- and whether drinking water causes better weight loss than not drinking water -- I would gather together a group of people and randomly assign them to conditions in which they drink different amounts of water (the random assignment is critically important, because it allows us to assume our groups are equivalent to each other, except for the amount of water they drink).

Then over time I would monitor their progress. Assuming that everyone actually drank the amount of water they were assigned to (a big problem in a lot of research with people), I could conceivably determine the size of the effect of drinking water on people's weight loss.

Studies like this are logistically difficult, as you can imagine, for a number of reasons, and while they can establish causation, sometimes the groups we study limits our conclusions. If we only studied women, can we assume the results apply to men? If we only studied people on one diet, can we assume it aplies to everyone? If all the participants are under 50, does it apply to people over 50? Etc...

We can also conduct research using animals, for whom we can better control water intake, but again, we don't know how well that research might apply to people.

However, in the absence of controlled research, it is very difficult to make the claim that drinking lots of water causes or increases weight loss.

Let's say you've lost weight while drinking lots of water. But have you also watched your diet? Which caused the loss? Or is it some interaction of the two? In other words, how do we know it's the water that causes the weight loss and not something else we're doing?

There has been a lot of interesting debate about drinking water. On the one hand, we certainly need to stay hydrated to survive, and many of our functions work best when hydrated. Certainly it seems no one advocates NOT drinking water.

On the other hand, it's unclear where this liquid needs to come from. There is a lot of water in many of the foods we eat, especially fruits and veggies, and the diuretic effects of caffeine seem to be less problematic than many claim, meaning drinking caffeinated beverages can provide some hydration. (I can provide some links if anyone is interested, but don't have time right now.)

Why do weight loss/health people advocate water so much? Maybe because in addition to hydration, it also fills us up and makes us less hungry, so maybe any liquid that did that would be helpful. Hard to say.

The conclusion I've come to is this. If you are drinking lots of water and are happy with how things are going, keep doing it. Your success may or may not be because of the water you are drinking, but you're successful, are doing nothing wrong, and that's what's important.

If you are like me and are successful without overly worrying about water per se, and are happy with how things are going, keep doing it. Your success may or may not be because of the water you're NOT drinking, but you're successful, are doing nothing wrong, and that's what's important.

If you are NOT successful at weight loss, and especially if you aren't drinking a lot of water, drinking water might help! Maybe it will help fill you up. Maybe it will do something else... you might want to explore the possibility.

Anyway, I hope this post was comprehensible, and if people did make it to the end (and didn't fall asleep from boredom or get really mad at me), then I thank you for your attention!

Cowgirl
07-11-2006, 04:01 PM
I was also told that water makes you get rid of water. Yeah right. We had one really hot week adn I was drinking lots and lots of cold water. Probably a gallon a day tot he point I felt a little sick and got heartburn. Anyway not only did I not loose weight, I gained 5 pounds and on top of that while I was drinking all of that water I hardly ever had to pee. Now I do know some of that was that I lost it in sweat but as much as I drank and as much water as I retain I'd expect to pee like a racehorse. Well the following week I went back to not fdrinking much and you know I peed off that whole 5 pounds?
Honestly I'm not sure what to make of it.

blues4miles
07-11-2006, 11:20 PM
Well I think water helps you get rid of RETAINING water, not precisely lose weight in and of itself. It's something to do with high sodium making your body hang on to more water than it needs, so when you begin to drink a lot it isn't afraid to let go of its stores.

As far as cold water burning calories, I think it's possible but I don't think it's quite the number they give. As we know, a "real" calorie (not the k-cals we are used to talking about) is the energy necessary to melt an ice cube. I'll bet the temperature difference between frozen water and newly melted water is more than or at least similar to the temperature difference between "cold" (less than 72 degrees) and body temperature (~98 for most). I don't see how heating 2 glasses of waters a mere 20 degrees could compare to melting about 25,000 ice cubes. However, I think water is good for you in so many other ways, and I think the research that has been done on controlled temperatures contributing to some weight gain (AC, or heat, keeping our bodies close to ideal temperature and therefore not shivering off or burning off as many calories over a lifetime) are interesting, so maybe the cold water is something to do with that.

I think Wyllen is on to something with the research! I also think 25 calories burned would be very difficult to measure in a controlled experiment.