I hope you all realize by now that there is no "quick" way to lose weight. At least not a long term way. If you want to lose water fast, then go for it...but what's the point???
To be blunk....America needs to get off its corporate *** and WORK...and I mean PHYSICALLY work. You can't take a pill and lose. You can't eat grapefruits all day and lose. Der. If there was an innovative way to lose weight easliy...don't you think the rate of obesity in this country would go down??? Don't you think it would be all over the papers and on the evening news??
The only way to lose weight is to expend more energy than you take in. Do the math.
On, and don't even think about Dr. Atkins or the Zone. I don't care what Hollywood says. Any educated dietician will tell you that you can't cut carbs out of your diet - why? Because your body gets its glucose from carbohydrates. Why do you need glucose? Oh...well it's the sugar your brain prefers to function with. Otherwise you undergo ketosis...and trust me that is bad because in order for this to happen your body starts to feed off of its muscle. So if any of you are on a low carb diet...think again.
Dr. Atkins wants nothing but your mula.
I'm out here....
07-16-2001, 10:04 AM
Well, Mel, I definitely think you may have an opinion on the subject....LOL.
I happen to be in agreement with you.
It's very difficult for anyone who's been overweight for a significant amount of time NOT to want the quick fix. I mean, obviously, these methods work....and they work fast. The problem being, in order for them to KEEP working, you need to maintain the diet. Who wants to eat only meat for the rest of their life? In addition to being incredibly boring, it's incredibly unhealthy.
I think for people who are not signifcantly overweight and want to quickly lose a few pounds to fit into that perfect outfit- it's not a problem. BUT, for anyone seeking a permanent, significant weight loss, it's a bad way to go.
I'm speaking from experience. I've tried everything...and I mean EVERYTHING. All meats, no carbs, shakes, pills, etc.
I finally went to Weight Watchers- kicking and screaming, I might add. This has been the ONLY plan to work for me. AND, I've had a permanent change in my mentality. I make healthy choices and don't feel like I'm missing out. I WANT to work hard and make my body better.
I've been on the program 16 weeks. I've lost 30 lbs, 2 sizes in my pants, one size in my tops. (I was at 30/32 top and 26/28 pants).
I can't say enough about the program. It's healthy, it's real, it's WORK, but it's giving me back my LIFE.
Anyhow....here, here! Get rid of the money making schemes and let's get back on track with real, honest to goodness work. We work so hard in so many areas of our lives.....let's work hard for OURSELVES now!
07-16-2001, 12:14 PM
Woo! I absolutely agree. The sad thing is, I spent at least 8 years pushing aside any real diet plan, because the results did not come "quick enough" for me. Nothing I tried (pills, quick fix plans) got me down more than 10 pounds. The truth is, with Weight Watchers, I've lost pounds more quickly than with *any* of the so-called "quick fixes." Had I tried WW 8 YEARS AGO, I would have spent my teen years at a healthy weight! I've learned from all of this not to put off something because it seems like too much work or the results will not come quick enough. Even if it takes me two years to lose the remaining 60 pounds I have to lose, I will be able to look back two years from now and say "Wow, I'm so glad I don't look or feel the way I did when I was 23."
07-20-2001, 05:07 PM
Excuse me, but I most definitely do NOT agree that low carb diets are EVIL!! At present I'm on WW and feeling pretty good, but I have been on various low carb plans at different stages of my life and to be perfectly honest, I have never felt more energetic, alert and just plain alive than I have while keeping my carbs to under about 30 grams per day. That is definitely NOT cutting out carbs entirely. I don't know where the critics of low carb get your information but it can't be from reading the books. While following the Atkins plan I ate lots of low carb vegetables, including cabbage, swiss chard, asparagus, green beans, cauliflower, spinach, mushrooms, artichokes, in fact every vegetable that on WW has no points can be eaten on the Atkins plan. Even some fruit is allowed, such as berries and canteloupe and, as the weight comes off, you are allowed to add in even more.
On another low carb plan called The Carbohydrate Addicts Diet, you eat low carb for two of your meals and then are allowed a "reward meal" in which you can have any high carb food you want as long as it's equally balanced with low carb veggies and a protein. This meal must always begin with a large salad.
I simply don't know how you can be so judgmental when it's fairly obvious that you've never tried low carb. More and more doctors are recommending that woe for their patients who have a problem with carbo binge eating and people with both types of Diabetes. My blood sugars have never been more level than when I followed a low carb plan. The only reason I'm not on one now is that I just don't lose weight that way anymore which is why I'm back on WW. Yep, back to thinking about food all the time because the increase in carbs has triggered my insulin which makes me feel hungry all the time. I'm trying to adjust the WW plan so that I have more protein and less carbs, but I still don't have that wonderful freedom from constant, nagging hunger that I enjoyed on the low carb woe.
I'd respectfully suggest that you not knock it until you've tried it and please, quit throwing around words like "evil" :devil: for heaven's sake. It's only a diet!!
07-20-2001, 05:39 PM
I, myself, am not knocking "low-carb"- I'm knocking "supposed quick-fix diets." I'm currently cutting back on carbs some, but at one point in time (only lasted 5 days!! ;-), I cut out carbs completely, thinking "Woo! I'll lose weight so quickly!" Well, I love carbs, and I could never go without them... but, with WW, I am following the "lower carb" plan (from the Week 6 book), and I've found the right balance for my body.
07-20-2001, 05:40 PM
I read this post earlier and wasn't sure to be amused or upset. After giving it a bit of thought I had come back to respond. Linda, you took the words right out of my thoughts!
As with any woe the plan will restrict certain food types. Restricting your carb intake NOT eliminating is the key word. I know many that are combining lowish carb eating with the WW plan for varying reasons but the most common I hear is the structure of the WW plan makes them feel more accountable.
Finding the right and healthy eating plan for one self combined with excercise will obviously affect our physical being. It's very obvious that adding back into ones regular eating plan those "forbidden" foods that trigger late night cravings or binges will definately tho slowly start adding the extra weight again. That truth does not limit itself to any one eating plan. Just as taking supplemental pills can and usually do have the same affect.
I do agree with the statement of not caring what Hollywood thinks. Neither do I !! I do care what my doctor thinks, what my blood results reflect and how I feel. After many years of eating low fat with low loss, I discovered low carb. It was wonderful being able to not starve myself, to feel energy, to lose the headaches and fatigue and the pluss side was that I was losing weight and inches. My blood results were improved and I maintained my goal weight for over six years....effortlessly I might add. It was not until I reached my 40's, put on a couple of pounds and the doctor gave me an eating plan which basically put me back on low fat and I put on much fat. My fatigue, headaches, etc., returned. Then I found this site and went back to low carbing. I do not follow Atkins, but a LC plan that allows me not to be the least bit deprived of healthy foods or favorite foods on a daily basis. Why? Because LC and my body chemistry agree with one another and it is the best way to go for me.
I am curious where your attitude and comments come from regarding the LOW carb woe. Have you read Atkins? The Zone? Protein Power? Schwarzbein Principal? Dr. Kellers two books?
I am glad that your woe is working for you whatever it may be.
07-20-2001, 07:30 PM
Well said Linda and Mama J!! I came here to speak up but hey, you said everything and better than I could! Usually try to avoid these debates but.... I agree--there is NO quick fix--but we do call this a "WOL" sometimes--Way of Life. I would never speak to criticize someone's eating plan, especially to the point of calling it "evil". I do low carb and LOVE my fresh veggies--doc says go for it. I also combine walking and exercising to help reap the benefits. I guess I am just saying lets remember that this is a "support" board.
07-20-2001, 11:05 PM
0My sediments exactaly. I have been doing l;ow carb for almost a year. this is not a quick fix. Every time I try to go back and eat regular I find I am uncontrolled when the sugar passes my lips. It is as I am a alcoholic and can not stop at one doughnut, piece of cake ot small dish of macaroni. I am like an alcoholic who can not go into a bar. Would you tempt me if I was one by bringing me in a bar, If I was an alcoholic? NO. I have learned my limits and I know that low carb is the way for me. Am I lazy and not wanting to get off my but and workout? NO NO NO!!!
I at 41 years old and almost 200 lbs (5'2") have started running almost 2 miles every other day, I weight life every opposit day. I m taking bellydancing lessons, I just came back from a 3 mile rollerblading ride, and I ride my bike almost every day. So am I looking for a quick fix???? I have only found the energy to do this while on low carb. and BEFORE I lost my 50 lbs that I have already lost I never had the energy or enthusiasm to do it otherwise. but now???? I am applauded by my Dr. for the work I am doing and my new found activity. I have lost 50 lbs and my cholesterol has droped from 220 to 180 in 2 months and holding. my good cholesterol is stable and my bad lowering. Is this a quick fix? No.
I am not going to tell anybody that what they are doing is wrong. How ever you re able to lose weight is great thzat is the desired result. If someone comes to low carb and are doing thigs wrong then I will correct then amd make sure that they are getting the correct info, and watching their health. It is not something that should be done without knowing what you are doing. I agree with that, but to say that it is dangerous and unhealthy N0 It is not if done correctly. Yes I know of people who have had problems on it but they are not doing it correctly. The plan is not a high protien but an adequate protien diet. The funny thing is that all the body building magazines are recomending cutting much of the carbs from the diet, not all mind you but most.
read all the facts before you make such a general statement. I do realize that most people here are not familiatr with low carb and that they hear only the dangers of them and are told that the weight can come off quickly. Well ask most any of the low carbwrs, it is not a quick fix and it is not a easy diet it takes planning and work to make it. It is not a choice for most of us, but done out of neccesity. as our health is in jepordy with out it. And we do watch what we eat and we do eat very good nutricious diets. We just watch the carbs not eliminate tehm completely.
07-21-2001, 12:11 PM
The first thing that went through my mind when I read your post was, Dr. Atkins doesn't have a DIME of my money! I know that there are alot of quick fixes out there, trust me, I've tried them all. It seems that the plans where you have to BUY everything would be the scams. Don't you think? I didn't buy Dr. Atkins' book, I don't buy his "supplements" and I don't buy his products. But I'm still living a low-carb life right now and I have never felt better.
So, what you call a scam, may be simply the fact that those plans don't work for YOU!! It does work for LOTS of other people though :dizzy:
07-23-2001, 06:05 AM
I could be wrong, but doesn't a "low carb" diet advocate foods which are low on the glycemic index scale? i.e. brown rice? Are you allowed brown rice?
Because if you are allowed foods low in refined sugars, but which are still carbs, it sounds perfectly healthy to me.
But if you are to avoid ALL carbs, you will die.
07-23-2001, 09:51 AM
I have read Protein Power, the Zone, and Dr. Atkins. My opinion is that Protein Power is the healthiest of the 3. Dr. Atkins is way too restrictive, and puts you at a higher level of ketosis than the others and for a longer period of time. Bacon,fried eggs, and steak are okay, but shouldn't be eaten all day for any amount of time alone.
When you do follow the plan in full, you eventually are allowed to have plenty of veggies, but drowning them in butter is unhealthy for anyone also. I have blood sugar problems, and aquire gestational diabetes when I am pregnant, and still think Dr. Atkin's is way too restrictive.
The Zone and Protein Power are much healthier and liveable.
I am a carb lover, but follow a low calorie diet that includes carbs. The thing to remember carb addicts is if you eat them. make sure you eat protein with them! I can sit and eat a whole cake or half a dozen donuts, and am starving soon afterwards, but if I eat a small dinner roll or rice with a meal that includes protein, I am satiated for much longer.
I cannot eat a bowl of cereal or a Pop-Tart for breakfast alone. I have a blood sugar surge, and am hungry in an hour. I eat an egg and a slice of light toast, or toast with a little peanut butter, or something like this to make sure I have protein at each meal.
So while I beleive Atkins is not healthy, I also beleive stuffing yourself with only breads and pastas is not either. I have also found it helpful for carb lovers to choose certain carbs-whole wheat bread, rice, ect. over pastries and white bread.
07-23-2001, 12:24 PM
Adding fat (olive oil is healthy) to starches does the same thing as adding protein - it lowers the glycemic index. But that ain't on my diet!
I used to eat a lot of carbs because that's what marathon runners do (I've run 4 marathons in the last 5 years). Guess what? I'm a fat marathon (26.2 miles) runner. My best time was Chicago at 5:24 (1999- the year the world record was broken at 2:06). I gradually gained 30 pounds during those heavy running years. I know most runners keep the weight off by going 60-90 miles a week, but being heavy I could only train up to 40 miles a week (or suffer plantar fasciitis and ITB syndrome) and that didn't help me lose.
I tried Body for Life thinking more muscle would help. I became very strong - but still fat. I'm female in case you didn't guess.
I'm on Physician's Weight Loss Center diet now under strict supervision and there is NO runner food: bagels, pasta, rice, potatoes (well, I get 1 piece of diet whole grain bread a day for starches and that's it!). In 4 weeks I lost 13 pounds eating virtually grainless. (Fruits and vegetables allowed, and LEAN protein). All I have the energy for is walking (about 3-4 miles 5 times a week) and light weight training. I know working out is more important for keeping weight OFF than losing it. Calorie counting is #1.
I'm just hoping that this low carb lifestyle will allow me to return to marathon running - a friend of mine on Sugar Busters passed out in a 10K race and almost died from low blood sugar and dehydration.
If I get thin I'd like to run faster not farther anyway. Don't need high carbs for that, but definitely do need some.
07-23-2001, 05:06 PM
I was on atkins, I have to agree, ITS EVIL!!!!:devil: :s: :devil:
hehehehe I was like a yoyo, down a pound, up TWO POUNDS >_< It was awful. I lost 10 lbs(while i was on it, 5 comes back as soon as you go off) after that I either gained or got back down to the original 10, it sucked. so now I just started a low calorie diet. If you need to lose 5 lbs, atkins iz ok, if not, then it's just, NOT!
07-23-2001, 07:30 PM
Rhonwyn, My best friend is dong Weight Watchers and has lost 13 pounds in 3 weeks. She gets to eat bread. Have you ever tried Weight Watchers. I think I would have a hard time not eating any carbs.
07-23-2001, 09:08 PM
SAggy I am italian and grew up on pasta, bread and butter. Infact one of my foavorite foods is macaroni and butter. I did not think that I could go now/low carb. I have to make it an effort to eat some carbs. the best carbs allowed on this diet is the wholesome carbs. like brown rice and grains. the refined sugars are the worst. one of the reasons many people gain weight after the low carb is that they do not gradually allow carbs back in to their life, It needs to be done slowly or the body will see the influx of sugar and start to store it. I agree that atkins is to restrictive but I am only familiar with the ols plan not the new one. and the new PP life plan is even less restrictive. ( I am following PP Old one) I am hoping to get the new book soon as I know there is so much more info. the knowledge that they give and the basis of the low carb plan is great. I do and (they) do admit that low carb is NOT for every one. It is a diet that takes planning and much dicipline. I do not have the ability to stay away from the refined sweets/ carbs unless they are out of my life completely, like I said earlier I am like an alcoholic, of druggie. One taste is ok but I get to the point that I want more and If I am having a tough day I will give in and not stop at a taste. the cravigns are gone now and I do not miss them. I can serv my kids icecream and not take a taste. I hand out the cookies, make the macaroni, have the hamburgers, hot dogs, and salads. ect but AAs the carbs are out of the system I do not crave them till I taste, and like I said if i am hit on a week day I may not stop at the taste of one cookie or spoon iof icecream. I eat plenty of carbs, most are in wholesome aveneus, like veges.
I did have terrible cravings at first but they went away within a week.
If any one is truly interested in atkins, Protien Power, CAD, or any type of low carb come on down and ask any questions in the low carb forum. But please If you are going to come down to bash us.... well I do not bash others. every one is entilted to their opinion. but I would hope that they are well informed before thinking it is fact. I do not mean to sound harsh, but I respect others and hope that I would be given the same respect. I will be glad to help any one understand the diet and guide them to hundreds of web sites that they can get info on and chat with people who are mcuh more sientifically minded that I.
Like I stated before that there are many people who do not do the low carb thing correctly and they are the ones that get sick and everyone hears about. If done correctly and with the proper supervision it can be very health. As with any diet. The most important thing is to follow a plan and use the plan for life. we all are changing our life, and the way we eat. the point I am making is that this whole thing is a support forum and we should be supporting each other not criticizing others choices.
Ronwyn... I am low carb and have been faithful for 3 months. I am on week 7 of my BFL and lost about 6 lbs, and lean mass up about 10lbs. You may just need some more time to get the energy level up. It sounds like you are definatly doing a low carb of some kind. We have several people on the board that are taking in higher carbs that most, and are doing great. I think that you need to give the muscles a few more weeks to get up to the energy level that you would like. It will get there soon I know you want it today ,be patient. just do not stop the exercise. that is the most important thing you can do right now.
07-24-2001, 05:35 PM
"Why do you need glucose? Oh...well it's the sugar your brain prefers to function with. Otherwise you undergo ketosis...and trust me that is bad because in order for this to happen your body starts to feed off of its muscle. "
Actually, that isn't entirely true. If your body doesn't have glucose readily available for the cell function ATP (the generation of energy within the cell..what makes your engine go) from carbohydrates, it will use the next available source. Fat is easier to use than protein. If you've got plenty of that hanging around, your body will use that. You only burn your own muscle when you cut your calories so low that your body has no other choice. Ketosis *isn't* bad if you are drinking enough water to flush your kidneys.
Do *your* math, or better yet, your biology.
Taking in less than you are expending can mean taking in less carbohydrates. As we seem to agree, glucose is needed (or is what's prefered, actually) for cell function and the process of ATP. If you aren't burning as much energy as you are making, it turns into fat. Cells will use carbohydrates first, fat next, so it DOES make sense to eat fewer carbs.
Guess what? I'm not on low carb. I just happen to have actually read the books and tried to understand it a little. I've also studied more than I'd like to on animal cell function and structure. I don't do low carb because I don't like to eat that way and know that I won't be able to stick with it. That DOES NOT mean it doesn't work for others. Why judge someone else's diet? Why not do your own thing, be happy with it, and try to be happy for the success of others?
No, not all dieticians and doctors will tell you low carb is bad. More and more of them are seeing that for some, this way of eating is a great improvement to their health. I *personally* know several people who have done this and seen amazing improvements, verified by bloodwork and relief of physical symptoms.
Bottom line is, as hard as it is for people to loose weight, why are you bashing ANYONE's success?
07-24-2001, 06:54 PM
Thankyou for undeerstanding and your support.
07-25-2001, 11:09 AM
I've been following this thread since it was started and I have to say the replies are very well written! I'm impressed because everyone has been so nice.
To say a certain diet is evil is going a bit far, considering all the information on the boards about Low-Carbing.
Personally, I lean toward WW but I'm interested in limiting my carbs and am doiing some research on that.
Evil?!!! Oy vey!
07-25-2001, 04:47 PM
Deana it is so refreshing to read from someone who actually knows what they are talking about! My doctor suggested low carb eating to me and following his instructions I tried it. I began to read everything I could get my hands on about it (You name it I have read it! ;)). I have lost over 70 pounds and I feel GREAT! I wish my doctor had told me about it when I had just 10 pounds to lose and not 70! BP perfect...bloodwork perfect...weight PERFECT!
low carb evil? :devil: I think not! I'm living proof. :smug:
Low Carb Living (for over 2 years)
07-25-2001, 05:48 PM
hi That Girl and Tippy,
that Girl I am so impressed that you have done so great. congrats! what a wonderful thing to reoprt. I know you have posted with us before and I have not seen you in a while. I am so glad that things are going welll with you.
Tippy there is a thread uncer the lowcarb support titled low carb and WW. You may want to check it out. Linda is the guru there and has been doing it for a while. you may want to check with here and see how she is doing. I strictly follow low carb but will be adding more carbs as my weight training is getting more intence and have to increase my intake of cals. I chose not to use fats for that but healthy carbs. I can connect you to the low carb website for Protien Power if you like. www.eatprotein.com there are many very knowledgable people there. there is many web sites out there. I hope that you find the information. any questions come on down and post a thread and we can answer most anything.
Rhowyn have you checked out the body for life web site? that will get you in shape faster that you can believe! they also have a diet to go with it and does include carbs in moderation, but is not the basis of the diet. (this is mostly done by a weight trainer) not a low carber or doc. www.bodyforlife.com there is a thread on the diet thread, you may want to check it out.
07-26-2001, 04:42 PM
I found this thread by accident...but I think the "Diet Plan Gods" led me here!
I for one am on the ATKINS PLAN. When I first started the plan I started a support thread on the low cab site. Mel, (the girl who started THIS thread posted there about the plan being bad. I commented on her concerns to her in a post and asked her which plan SHE was having success on....and she never replied.
My Dr. Atkins support thread got so big...and so many low carb people joined in... that we had it's name changed to low carb support #2 and it continues to grow with each new post by low carbers..(including Atkins people.)
I find it amazing that ANYONE would start a thread........especially one with such SLAMMING toward a plan.......have folks post on that thread with their opinions...and then the thread starter does not RESPOND. Hmmmmmmmmmm.
I personally asked my doctor about the plan and he gave it the thumbs up. He even told me about a doctor friend of his who took off 104 pounds in a year on the Atkins Plan when other plans had failed him over the years.
Dr. Atkins just wants our "mula", huh? Well, let's see. I have spent about $6.00 on Atkins products in 5 weeks. (I bought 3 low carb bars to take on vacation.) Sheesh..the guy is gonna get RICH off ME!
I "borrowed" the book off of a friend who took off 30 pounds in 6 months 3 years ago and maintains the loss by living a low carb lifestyle. (So he made no money off the book from me.)
I take advice from my cousin who lost 40 pounds in 8 months on the plan when the book first came out in the 70's.
I have taken off 17 pounds in 5 weeks and feel great! I am high energy, have had no headaches (the doctor said getting away from caffein and the carbs did that), and never felt better in my life.
I am not hungry and I barely miss my favorite carbs...(bagels and pretzels)
My father started the plan 4 weeks ago and has taken off 20 pounds!
At age 43, and having spent 1/2 my life battling the buldge, I am speaking from the heart here.
NO ONE wants to be FAT! If you find a plan out there, and your doctor gives it the okay, and you feel good on it, and you have success on it, I say GOOD FOR YOU!
Do you have to exercise? Of course...if you CAN! Exercise has done wonders for me! I walk 3 miles a day and feel great both physically and mentally!
Do you have to drink lots of water...OF COURSE!
Flush that system out! Water is great!
Do you have to get REAL with yourself and figure out WHY you are fat........(and I don't mean excuses.......mom is fat, my metabolism is bad, I just gotta have chocolate!) I MEAN WHY ARE YOU FAT??? What is your relationship with food and why?
Do you have to change your lifestyle? In most cases, YES. You gotta get healthy food and use it as fuel for your body not a "fix" for your broken heart, boredom, or hobby!
You gotta love yourself more than food!
You need to make time for exercise and things you enjoy instead of turning to food as a quick fix!
You gotta share and care about others in the same situation as yourself. (If we do not respect eachother....WHO WILL???)
You gotta get on these threads and look for and give POSITIVE support!
07-26-2001, 04:58 PM
I have my own opinions about Atkins but don't want to start a riot, certainly not by saying "ATKINS IS EVIL" in big letters.
But this has really gone far enough.
We are all on our own eating/training plans (I myself LOVE Body for Life and am seeing great results - check our thread out on "Diet Plans" - there's a plug there...). An old maxim is not to ever discuss religion or politics - I guess we should insert 'never discuss a particular diet plan' in there as well.
Enough already, gals and guys! Let's end this here and let this thread gradually vanish off this board...
07-26-2001, 07:32 PM
Glad to see the moderator respond to this thread. It is a shame that 11 days of EVIL went by before doing so.
I highly doubt that with all the looks at this thread it will "vanish off the boards." Many plans (especially Atkins) have been debated for years. Although I would not call it evil as the originator of this thread did.....it remains under debate by many.
Thread such as these allow people to get information, ask questions, and "put their cents worth in."