Support Groups - DESPERATE HOUSEWIVES #16 SuNdAy!

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01-16-2005, 10:11 AM
Welcome all to a thread full of wonderful women taking on the responsibilty of raising a family and trying to take care of themselves too. We look forward to a new day with members, new and old! Please feel free to jump right in and say hello!

Here is a little bit about who we are ...

MichelleRae: Michelle sahm to Taylor 8-25-01 & Teagan 10-13-03 Married 2 years to Zhaun. Plan I'm following is a combined WW and South Beach Diet.

Spryng: 24 y.o. married 6 years. Kids- Ava 4, Bubba (aka Joseph) 3 & Tanner 1. Currently on ww, hit goal in April.

Mompen: Penny 24 y.o. Happily Married & SAHM Momma to three active boys, Hunter 5, Nicholas 4 & Andrew 19 mo. Taking what I learned from WW & South Beach is my way of life.

Sydsmom: Kristin SAHM to Sydney 09-27-01, married almost 2 years to wonderful dh Began Weight watchers mid-July

Cindi: Mom to 6 boys & 1 mean girl. Plan.. No diet for me! Portion control, exercise & lots of water (most days)

Chubba: Geri..Mom to two boys, Will (3) & Tony (1)..married for 4 years to a great guy..following Dr Phil most days!

Crystal: 27 yo sahm of 3 almost 4. Alisa 6, Ally 3, & Andrew 22 months. Due Feb 1st. Married 9 years, live in Texas & homeschool. My plan, when on it, counting calories & exercise.

Ricci sahm to two boys 4 and 5, married 7 years, doing ww

Jill: SAHM of 1 daughter, Bayley, born 9/19/03. Currently trying to lose some of the baby weight I gained with her & need some extra support to help me do so.

Melissa: SAHM of 1 girl (4) and 1 boy (2). Currently watching what I eat and exercising 4-5days a week.

Deana: SAHM of 3 boys and 1 girl. Counting calories, exercising, and drinking lots of water.

Chris: SAHM of Tiana, Kayla and Nicole: ages 11, 5, and 2. Married for 5 years. I live in Billings, Montana. I'm a rheumatoid arthritis sufferer and trying using WW Flexpoints to lose weight

Gretchen, wife to Matt, Mom to Sean (15) and Jeremy (11). Just starting out with no diet plan except reduced calorie. I'm also a Curves lady!

Roxy, married (21yrs) 4 boys, and 6 girls, have to get serious after last baby. Doing the low-carb thing, drinking lots of water & more exercise

Stephanie, sahm of 2 boys Timothy(7) and Jack(3) and a new baby girl, Ella(8 months).

01-16-2005, 10:13 AM
Morning Ladies.....

I'm scared to get on the scale today and face the music :(

I did so well all week and then I blew it yesterday.....

Anyhow, Good luck :goodluck: on all the weigh ins today! Come on ladies! :) :)

Be back later, gotta get ready for church! :) HAVE A GREAT DAY!

01-16-2005, 11:21 AM
Hi ladies. Just wanted to check in and say I'm still here. No action. I'm staying home today because I want to and because it's cold outside. Anyhow, I'll try to check in during the day. Hoping to get a nap and maybe get some laundry done. Otherwise, I'm just gonna hang out.
Hope everyone has a great day and good luck to all you weigh ins. TTYL

01-16-2005, 11:38 AM
Good morning!

Hey Penny! You all are doing so well on your challange! I think that is so great! Don't be afraid to step on the scale, if you did good all week then one slip up shouldn't matter too much. Not unless you ate like a whole pie or something! :lol: Did you have fun at your wedding yesterday?

I found out something interesing this week. I am very sensitive to nutrasweet!
I was drinking DietRite (splenda) and then switched to Fresca( nutrasweet) for awhile cause it's not so sweet tasting. I really slowed my weight loss down, I felt bloated, plus I had little headaches. Talked to my R.N. and she recommended NOT having nutrasweet while pregnant, nursing and then she said you really should avoid it anyway. More and more studies are coming out against it. News to me. The same is not true of Splenda, that seems to be much safer. Although let's face it, only in moderation, because it causes the zippies! Now therein lies the crux of everything, right? Moderation! Now if I'm not mistaken Gretchen can't tolerate Splenda. Has an adverse effect on her. I suppose that's why ONE diet doesn't always fit all either. I can't eat alot of carbs because I want more and more! I am starving all the time and never satisfied. I remember one Saturday I was good all day, not hungry...satisfied and we watched a video. Well they made popcorn. I didn't want it. Then I said to myself, just a taste...then a handful...then I just grabbed the bowl and hunkered down. I wasn't hungry! I was like an addict! Maybe that's why I can't tolerate alcohol either. ???? I don't know. Hmmmmmm. I'm just doing some reflective thinking this morning because it's cold and I didn't want to take the little ones to church the morning. So I'm practically by myself.

I hope everyone had a great Saturday yesterday! Our pageant on Friday was so adorable! The little children sang off-tune and were sooo cute. The older children did a remarkable job! Steven played Handel's Messiah on the piano, doing a very good job. Of course, I taped the whole thing. Holding Marty (who was grabby and fussy) and trying to get Celine to sit still and not kick the camera. I only got one headless person and ran out of tape, at the last song with two lines to go but it turned out okay! Well, I better leave some room to post for the rest of you :lol: so I'll be back later.

Are you crampy today Crystal????????


01-16-2005, 11:41 AM
Hi Crystal!
Soon.....! Have a restful Sunday!

01-16-2005, 01:37 PM
Hey girls! Well today was weigh in day and I was at 209! Thats 3 lbs lost this last week! woo hoo!! My picture is up on the MLW site :)

I hope you all have a great day!

01-16-2005, 02:10 PM
Hi ladies. I'm actually getting alittle depressed because I'm getting desperate to have this baby. I always get miserably ready at the end, but I've never been this desperate. I've been reading on natural ways to induce and I know that she'll come when God says she's ready and I even prayed earnestly to God to let it be today. I don't want to take anything, herbal or not and then sex comes up as a great inducer. I'm sorry to say, but I don't want that either. I'm too uncomfortable and miserable.
I'm actually sort of bored too because we're just home with nothing to do. I'd go walking, which can help but it's like in the 40's out there and I don't want my kids out in it.
I guess I'll just hang in there and let it happen as it happens. My kids are driving me nuts, I actually thought that going to the hospital would give me a break from these kids, isn't that terrible? Has anyone ever been this depressed and miserable to actually go into labor?
I didn't mean to go on and on about it, sorry.
Michelle, wtg on those 3 lbs. gone.
I've got to feed my kids some lunch.

01-16-2005, 03:13 PM
Well Crystal, sounds like you are close! I certainly have the reputation of becoming a grouchy ol' mama bear when I'm near the end! Yes, the hospital sounds tempting, but those people won't let you rest either! Every two hours, temp. blood pressure and check! I would have liked to rest more there too! I just wanted my own bed. Mention the depression to your doc. because it might intensify after the birth. You don't need to be a weeping new mother when you should be happy. Sometimes it all feels very frustrating and overwhelming at first. Do you have help? Do you have at least 1 weeks worth of meals in the freezer? Can you have someone babysit so you can rest whenever you want? Do something you can do right now that will get your mind off of being miserable. Make out your birth announcements, just address the envelopes without putting all the info inside that would save time. Plan some fun sibling things for the other children so they will be excited for "our" baby to come home. You sound very,very close to me. Hope this is over with soon. I feel for ya!

01-16-2005, 05:30 PM
Hello ladies!
We actually made it to church today then went to my Mom and Dad's for awhile. My Mom (bless her heart) usually buys bagels to have for lunch, but I can't eat all those carbs and calories, so today she made some soup. It was yummy, too! I've been eating a lot of soup lately since it's so cold here. (nothing like what you ladies in Minn and Montana are experiencing,though.. brrr...!!!)

Penny - good luck on the weigh in. I know you've probably already done it, but good luck anyway.

Michelle- 3 pounds! That is awesome! Good job!

Crystal - Hang in there. I remember feeling the way you do. Now that I am not having anymore kids, that pregnant feeling is such a distant memory. The kicks, the hiccups, even labor and delivery. Then when they are babies they are so sweet. You are blessed with this baby. I know that's not much consolation. Try to focus on all the joy you will have when you finally see the face of this baby. I agree with Roxy - don't forget to mention the depression to the doctor.

Roxy - yep, I can't have Splenda. I am glad I can still tolerate Nutrasweet, but I am trying to cut out some of those artificial ingredients from my diet as much as possible. I still use a little sugar in my coffee and on my oatmeal. I suppose I could save about 50 calories if I switched to Equal, but I figure I get enough of that in my Diet Coke addiction. LOL! You know, I also can't tolerate alcohol. It's weird, sometimes I really crave a glass of sangria or a dark beer, but I always regret it after I drink it. Oh well, my crazy body chemistry knows what's best.

I hope everyone has a wonderful day. I feel really happy and uplifted today. Our pastor gave a great sermon about connecting with people and it really hit home. It's hard for me to reach out since I am basically a shy person. I'm glad to have this group.

01-16-2005, 06:23 PM
Thanks you ladies for your words. The "depression" I'm speaking of isn't really depression. It's just feeling sorry for myself. I have a "thing" with depression. Don't really agree with it and definately don't buy post partum depression. I think with God in your life you can't be depressed. I know, I know. Not many people agree with me on this and I'm not starting anything but that's my view of it all. I'm only "depressed" in which I mean distraught and frustruated with nothing happening. We've got so much going on and I'm ready to get one more thing out of the way to focus on the others. I've been getting bored with my same ol routine and I'm ready for something new.
Anyways, I totally appreciate what both of you have to say to me. I started walking around my house. I have a circle, you know a wall dividing my kitchen from my livingroom so it's a circle. I've started pacing it and it does help something progress, don't really have full contractions, but some kind of cramps.
Okay, gonna get up and walk some more. The kids are looking at me like I'm crazy.

01-16-2005, 07:07 PM
Hi Everyone, I've been lurking around. Having some to do here and that;s why I haven't posted. I just have to say something about your post Crystal. I am generally a happy person, but after Patricks birth and the year and a half to year and a half, I never felt so up and down and seriously depressed! MY husband was so worried about me a few times that he come home from work. He would call and find my crying my eyes out and I couldn't even figure out why. Hormones in your body if they are not the way they should be can cause all kinds of things. like PMS can but much worse and even worse than that for some. You don't expect it, it just is and there is not much you can do about it. When you feel so bad that you wish you would be swept away into the ocean then it's bad. I'm not talking suicide either. Just dissapearing. So please don't say you don't believe in Post pardum depression. You haven't been there and I hope for your sake it doesn't happen to you. IT's like someone elses pain, you can't imagine there physical pain unless you've been there yourself and even then, pain is different for all. And by the way, GOD is in my and my families life and thats how I got through it. Just because god is in your life doesn't mean you don't break a leg or have a heart attack. But he does help you get through it. I prayed every day for his strength to get through the tough time. And I believe that's why I am here today a survivor of Post Partum Depression.

SOrry, I know this was long, but it is a touch subject and I had to speak out on my behalf as well as others who suffer from this Medical condition.

01-16-2005, 07:24 PM
Great post, Melissa. You know God is there to hang onto when life seems to be so hard. (I promise I won't start quoting Scripture, but that's what He says), but He also gives us people in our lives to help us. I know this for a fact.

01-16-2005, 07:44 PM
I didn't mean to step on anyone's toes and I know that everyone has their own thoughts. After Alisa, I did spend a few days crying my eyes out especially when dh had to go back to work and I was going to be home alone with a new born baby for the first time. However, I never thought that to be depression and I do know that you can have those episodes. During my middle trimester with this pregnancy I had some major low times. I finally broke down in the bathroom floor with the door closed and locked and all the kids banging on it. So I've had my times, but I don't like to blame the bad things we do on these mothers that kill their kids and blame it on depression. I don't buy that. I do know people can be saddened and feel lost, I just don't like to use it for an excuse for the things we do.
Again, I'm sorry for saying those things, but we do all have our own opinions.
Well, walking hasn't done much, so now I'm cooking dinner. I'll check in later. TTYL

01-16-2005, 07:57 PM
Depression does exist and I have it. I had PPD with Kayla and Nicole. Nicole was the worst. I never completely got over it. I too went through the "escape" thoughts and crying bouts and told everyone that they'd be better of if I were just not a part of the family...that I should just leave. I had a ton of days when I'd call my husband at work, crying hysterically, and telling him I just couldn't take care of the kids. My sister had to 'babysit' me! It doesn't matter if you have God in your life or not. He made us fallible and with feelings. God experiences sadness too. Sometimes its harder for others. Our pastor just got back from a 4 week "journey" after he woke up one morning and just couldn't go on. He was diagnosed with depression and extreme exhaustion. My mom is a victim of depression too. SHe is the greatest Christian I know but since my stepdad died...she hasn't been the same. She cries and gets upset easy. Somethings do get overwhelming for reasons not known to us...some are chemical imbalances, hormonal, or situational, etc. We can't control it. Depression is soo real. I'm with Melissa on all this. I've been there too. Everyone is entitled to their own thoughts and opinions...but I sure do NOT wish Post-Partum Depression on anyone. To feel that hopeless is one of the worst feelings in the world.


01-16-2005, 08:01 PM
Okay..I can agree on that oneCrystal. I don't believe that anybody should be harmed because someone is depressed or having a bad day. Even if you are depressed, you still have a conscience and can deferenciate between wrong and right. If its that bad...then a person does need to just walk away. I couldn't even imagine hurting my children, even on my lowest low or worst day. I would leave before I let that happen.


01-16-2005, 08:05 PM
I suppose I should have made myself more clear on the first post. I do believe people can be depressed and sad, I just hate when it's used as an excuse. That's what I meant.
I've got a crying kid and dinner cooking, gotta go.

01-16-2005, 08:25 PM
I agree that it shouldn't be used as an excuse to hurting some. HOwever, I reread your post and it sure sounded to me that you don't believe in depression and to quote "I don't buy post partum depression" I day or moment of feeling sad isnt' depression. It's a period of time of two weeks or more. We all have days were we feel sad or not ourselves, it is completley different from depression which is like that day you had in the bathroom, but one which never stops, it goes on for hours on end in the day with no break or let up and it goes on for days. Please rethink things before posting. I'm sure you didn't mean to upset anyone. BUt obviously things that you think are touchy subjects, should be thought about before posting them. It's like saying people who are raped "asked for it" We know that NOT to be the case. But if it were said, we'd have an uproar. We have to be careful the way we post things. Writing is different then a face to face conversation. You don't always get the emotion or facial expression that says alot. Writing is very different. I guess we know now that's not what you meant, but pleaseeeeeeeeeeee be more careful.

01-16-2005, 09:26 PM
Hi everyone.

Roxy- It is the aspartame in the nutrasweet(equal) that gives you headaches. I have read that it has been linked with causing cancer in test animals. Not really good stuff. Splenda, however, is derived from sugar. And sweet & low is also a good alternative. I have found that Splenda tastes better in hot drinks and the sweet & low better in cold.

I was also a ppd sufferer. It actually started before I had Ella. I just always felt like I was outside myself. I saw what was going on, but felt like things were a dream. I can't really explain. I just didn't fell like myself. I had a few emotional breakdowns, but I mainly just closed myself off from the people around me. I felt like I wasn't good enough. That my kids deserved a better mother, my husband a better wife and so on and so on. After Ella was born things got a little worse, but my doc prescribed something and it was gone in about 6 weeks. It was difficult for everyone in my life especially my husband b/c he works out of town he couldn't be there when I really needed him to be. Fortunately he was able to spend the 6 weeks after she arrived at home. I would pray everyday for God to deliver me out of this trial, but He knows and best and He must have wanted to teach me something through the experience. Or maybe just be able to help someone. God is always with us, but He allows us to go through trials to strengthen our character(think Job).

Anyway, I hope everyone has a great week!

01-16-2005, 09:35 PM
Hi Ladies....

Well Well Well Today sure has been an interesting one ....

I understand you are at that point in your pregnancy where you are miserable... I went through it also. Hopefully Allison will be here soon :)

Congrats on your weigh in today! Awesome!

You too! Congrats on an awesome weigh in!

Hi out there to Roxy and Chris and Grethen!

I am pooped..... Watched two kids today on top of mine and two different ones last night ....... I'm hitting the hay!~


01-16-2005, 09:41 PM
Hey ladies. I'm not going to talk too much on the subject at hand since I have not experienced it but I do know that I have had friends that have had PPD and it was totally out of their control. Everyone is different and we need to keep that in mind.

Anyway onto other subjects. I changed my siggy a little. I took out my mini goal of being in the 130's by my birthday cuz that's not going to happen! LOL And I finally added those 7 pounds onto my siggy that I was denying since Thanksgiving! LOL I really need to get those off. My dh and I are about to go grocery shopping and I am going to start the 1st phase of SBD and hopefully jump start my system and start losing again. I was doing really good for awhile but I got too comfortable and then the holidays hit and the rest was history! My new goal in to be in the 130's by spring break and to my goal weight by the summer sometime. I know I can do it!

As far as the Splenda nutrasweet conversation, I have also heard that nutrasweet causes cancer in animals and my sister is a health major and always tells me to stay away from it. I can tolerate Splenda ok but I can still taste the artificialness of it, but it does fine when I need a sugar fix of some kind. Kind of makes you wonder what's worse, the chemicals in the substitute or the real sugar!

Well I need to get crackin, need to get some dinner then to the store, then back here to do the challenge, need to pound the water in too! I hope to be back later to check on everyone! Have a great night!

01-16-2005, 10:03 PM
Hi Ladies....

Ok I just loaded my pics for the challenge and I saw a couple that I wanted to share :)

Here are my oldest two from the Christmas play... Sorry about the date.. I didn't fix it when I put my batteries in.

My Religion Class today... I only had 6 children today...

Ok here are my kids and the kids I babysat today...

01-16-2005, 10:04 PM
Okay I feel I have to speak up on this matter as I have a history of SEVERE depression. I don't have a great past and I'm not exactly proud of it but I have moved on and I am a better person now for everything that has happened in my past. I moved a lot had to start over and had to hide from people before. I had an eating disorder as a teen even though I wasn't overweight. I was also a drug user and not just pot, I smoked crack cocaine on a daily basis for awhile, it made me feel "better" and it also helped with my eating disorder because it supressed my appetite and made me throw up. I also cut myself, not in an attempt to committ suicide but because the pain made me forget everything else. I'll take pictures of my arms when I get home and post them and you can see how horrible a disease depression really is. I'm now recovered and no longer need to take my anti-depressants but this is a very real disease. I have god in my life as well and I during that time I often prayed to him to ask why I felt like I did, why I couldn't be happy. It's funny because I was a "user" and recluse until I got preg. with Taylor when I found out I was pregnant I got my
sh!t together and stopped it all, I had a baby who needed me to be there for her. I would probably be dead had I not been blessed with my daughter, she truely saved my life. I didn't have a problem with depression again until after I had Teagan, and it was immediate, the next day in my hospital room I started crying for no reason and my doctor was there I was immediately put on anti-depressants and after one month I was okay again.
Believe me PPD and Depression are very real mental illnesses. I've lived the horrors that they can cause. It's hard hearing people say that they don't believe in it or whatever. I'm proof that it does exist, and the sad thing is that there are many many people who are affected by their depression worse than I am.
I'm sorry but I just needed to state my opinion.
I'm going to take a bit of a break from the boards for a little bit. I wish you all the best. I will still be a part of the challenge and will update on the MLW site :)

Have a great night girls!

01-16-2005, 10:19 PM
Let me just say once more that I apologize. My best friend has suffered from major depression and even though she knows how I feel about it she and I are still best friends. Friends are friends are friends no matter what. Each to their own opinion. Nothing is wrong with having different thoughts and opinions on all kinds of situations. Please accept my apology and know that I don't feel like I can be totally honest here at all, although you all are the closest to friends I have. My best friend doesn't have a computer or a long distance phone service so we have very quick and not frequent conversations.
Once again, I'm sorry and I will have to be more careful with what I can say to my friends.
Hope everyone has a great night.

01-17-2005, 01:05 AM
Don't get me wrong, Crystal...I respect you're opinion, even if I don't agree. I don't want any hard feelings between anyone. The important things to me are that I have all of you guys to talk to and that I feel better about myself and my life these days. I had a great sermon at church last night about seeing what God sees in us rather than the imperfections we see in ourselves and others and how that ends up dictating our lives. He sees our flaws and that doesn't change the way that he feels about each and everyone of us. It made me feel a whole lot better. I was in the dumps about not losing this darn old weight, but that's not what makes up all of me. more pleasant things I guess. I did okay with being OP today. I went to my nephew's babtism and then to a family brunch afterwards. Then when I got home we started painting the kitchen and livingroom. We're trying to get everything done this week while my husband is home. We have to paint Nicole's room and the family room. Also finish the fireplace and other misc. projects. Wish us luck!!! :lol:

Good night to all of you. Sleep tight and stay warm if you're in a cold spot....


01-17-2005, 02:54 AM
Hello to all you ladies out there! :) I am home tonight catching up on some stuff on the puter...I wasn't going to post, but I really feel as though I should.

First of All, I think that it is truely a wonderful thing that some of you felt compelled to tell you story of PPD, or depression in general. I know that must be tough to relive those times, and that talking about them brings back painful memories. I am proud to be friends with each and every one of you. Its the human condition, raw, in your face, right here. That is so important to sustain a healthy friendship. Thank you for that ladies. I myself was just a mom with the case of the "baby clues"...what everyone kind of goes through. Cry in the shower, feel overwhelmed. I can say that I feel blessed to have never gone through anything much more serious. I do however read the papers, believe in doctors and have friends and family who have been effected by this disease.......and as of late....had an uncle so badly depressed to the point of taking his own life leaving his family of 6 ( a wife and 5 girls) behind to pick up the pieces. Crystal, I know that you did not set out to intentionally hurt anyone, and I know that you now feel as though expressing your opinions here is not possible. I have a problem however, with you expressing such a strong opinion and feeling as though others should respect it, when your FRIENDS are crying out to you to let you know they care and that they are worried about you, telling you there own stories and revealing their pain to you so that maybe another will not suffer. There is no reason for you to re-coil as though you have had your hand slapped. I think my mom always put it well when she said "if you can't take it, don't dish it".... We care about you and want to give you our honest "opinions" so maybe by some slim chance it would be appreciated and recognized for what it is. God in your life is so wonderful, and as any spiritual person will tell you, it is wonderful to have spirituality in your life to hep you through the hard times. It is so important to find a steady in you life and for most that is god or religion. HOwever, there is no proof that I can find that says, if you believe in God, depression is not an option. If you are telling yourself that, GOD help you. We are all human, and have despair, hopelessness and doubt. God gave those to us. HE know what we would do and what would be said before we ever breathed a word. But we all have choices of how to handle these "Demons". Andrea Yates made her choice. MY Uncle his own choice. Michelle made hers, and Melissa as well. A pastor at my uncles funeral spoke these words so perfectly. " If I were to come to your home and sit with you, then the lights all went out and darkness overtook me. I would fumble around, accidentally breaking your vase on the table....would you fault me for that broken vase?..The answer is no, because sometimes in the darkness we do things that cannot be undone, never the less, that was not our purpose, just merely an accident that occured because of the darkness". That is how I look at depression..its a disease. Ever seen Lord of the Rings...its like Gollum. He was overtaken by the ring. He wanted to do good but in the end, the darkness won and in the darkness is only when he did the unthinkable things that cannot be undone.
Crystal, I hope that it is understood that I am not saying you are WRONG, or that you are depressed, because youa re feeling some of those things. Based on what we know about you, it seems as though you take on a lot of unwanted burden because you feel you have no other choice. You let your husband walk all over you, from such simple things as when and if you get a haircut to what kind of vehicle your family can afford to safely accomidate them. I understand that you feel you should just continue to let "sleeping dogs lie" but I think it is so sad that you think so little of yourself and your needs. Being a mom and a wife is by no means a party. I undstand how you must be feeling right now, there is alot on your plate, and half the time, Im sure we don't even here the half of it. Its not fair though to you as a human being, a person, with opinions, to be set aside or "seen not heard". There is nothing wrong with wanting Allison to be here, or wanting to have a break by being in the hospital to have some relaxing time with your new daughter. I just fear that you are more troubled than you let on most times and as your friend, feel like you should get all of my honesty. I hope that you realize that as your friend, I wish you only the best. I just see some sort of opression that you allow yourself to have, as an unhealthy thing. Again just my opinion.
I hope that you find happiness and understand that we are all here for you. Feeling sad, doubtful, etc is nothing to be sorry happens to all of us. I just pray for you that you might find peace in your head and heart. (((hugs))), Kristin

01-17-2005, 02:55 AM
I forgot to mention to you Penny, that your pics were sooooo cute! The kids look so sweet, I will have to print one off for sydney of Hunter! LOL!

01-17-2005, 08:13 AM
Penny, great pics. Thanks so much for sharing.

Starting a new thread.