Depression and Weight Issues - Ups & Downs Support Group: December 2013

12-01-2013, 05:58 AM
Hello Everyone! If you have been following along, this group started at the thread "Looking for Support Buddies." We formed a nice little support group and decided on the title Ups & Downs. This is the new thread ~ the first listed under this title. :) If you just found us, :welcome3: to the group! I hope you will join in so we can keep the support flowing. If you found your way here from the original thread, thank you so much for following us to our home. This is our space. Please write as much or as little as you want about your own personal Ups & Downs on your weight loss journey. We can only learn from each other if everyone is willing to pitch in and post something. My sincere hope and prayer is that each person who joins the group will take at least one positive thing out of it and also contribute at least one positive thing to the group. There are so many resources out there for weight loss help, and I want this to be a positive, supportive, peaceful place where we can come together and help one another along this road of Ups & Downs. We decided on this title since the weight loss journey is often filled with ups and downs, and because life ~ especially life on medication ~ is full of ups and downs. Let us hope for more Ups that we can share, but also prepare for and support each other through the Downs! Anyone who is willing to be a positive support for others and/or is seeking such support is welcome here. :)

12-01-2013, 06:23 AM
Fi (Fiona W)! I am so relieved and happy to hear that your traumatic experience of sitting around the Thanksgiving dinner table was in the past!!! I am sorry that you experienced it at all, but I was thinking, "Wait, I thought she wasn't going to her sister-in-law's dinner. What happened?!?" Thank you for that clarification. I am sorry to hear that you experienced such a profound sense of loneliness on Thanksgiving day when your husband was away at the gathering. It sounds like you have some insights as to why you were lonely, though, which is great! I also think it is good that you identified and acknowledged what you were feeling in the first place. Often, that is the first step. Did your husband enjoy the gathering? Did you tell him about your loneliness while he was away? Just curious. You don't have to answer that if it makes you feel uncomfortable in any way.

Chelsea (CDubsGotGoats): Did you find us here and how are you doing? Congrats on not overdoing it on the pizza the other day!!! That is wonderful progress and that's what it's all about! Thanks for sharing! ;)

lilturtle: I sure hope you find us here and continue to join in. I want to support you during your potential lapse in medication. How is that going, BTW? Any new developments or sources of help? Hugs to you! :hug:

shr1nk1ngme: It sounds like you are doing well! Your yams and sugar-free pumpkin dessert sound yummy! :T I hope you were able to get back down to low-carb eating again the next day. Either way, I hope you find us here and join right in! :)

seabiscuit (Amy): Are you still around? I hope so! Please tell us more about Overeaters Anonymous. I have been curious about it for awhile. Do you think it is helping you?

ladyrider: Are you here? Please post, if so! We care about you, too! :hug:

CrystalClear: How 'bout you? Did you find us here? I hope you will join in!

These were the people that had posted at the original thread. If you just found us, PLEASE POST and tell us a little bit about yourself! You are a member of the group if you are willing to post and be a positive support to someone else. You will be glad you did! ;)

12-01-2013, 01:41 PM
Hi Believe-

I'm still here! I was away for a few days and I am under the weather. I like OA, I have a sponsor and I go to meetings. It is a twelve step program, there are face to face meetings, online and phone meetings. It is not a diet, it's a way of living. I think OA is helping me, I like it.

Take care.


12-01-2013, 02:39 PM
seabiscuit: I am so happy that you are still with us and found the new thread! I hope the others make it over, too. OA sounds great! I have thought about finding a group near me, but I am afraid to commit to it. That is one reason I started this group. I need the support of others, but don't really want to join a face to face group right now. I hope we can be a nice supplement to your OA group. Please feel free to share any insights that you learn at OA with the group. Thanks for posting! :)

12-01-2013, 04:31 PM
seabiscuit: I am sorry to hear that you are not feeling well. I am just now getting over a bad cold. It is that time of year. :getwell:

Fiona W
12-01-2013, 07:14 PM
IBelieve— Yeh, my husband knows I was lonely on T-Day, but I'm not sure he gets what an enormous effort I'm putting into this weight loss project and binge-free project. I'm trying to do it one day at a time, but I've been reading so many good books about how to get free of emotional overeating, it's a strain on the brain. This afternoon I had some severe depression symptoms, but they got better after the sun set: that's typical for me.

Anyway, it's great to see the new thread up and running! Thanks for the work you've done to make this a good place to come and support each other!

12-01-2013, 08:04 PM
Hi Believe-

Thank you for your kind words and get well wishes. I am feeling better but I am a bit tired. I want to try to not overeat, well I have been trying, sometimes I do better at it than others.

Have a good night.


12-02-2013, 02:03 AM
Fi: Happy that you have jumped onto the new thread with us! Sorry you have experienced some depression symptoms today, but happy to hear that they did subside. Interesting that you typically feel better once the sun sets. I tend to get sad when the sun sets. I'm not crazy about the dark. I guess we all have our own unique emotional patterns. Please share the titles of the good books you are reading about emotional overeating. I probably have some of them. I tend to strain my brain with all of the information in self-help books, too. But every little kernel of knowledge helps in this difficult journey we are on. I can relate when you say that your husband probably doesn't understand how much effort you are putting into your weight loss and binge-free journeys. I feel the same with my husband. Since my body is still carrying all of the excess weight, it appears that I am not trying, but I am working on the inside of me right now, which might be the most challenging part of this whole ride. I need to get right on the inside, though, if I am going to be able to make the changes I need to make on the outside. I need to work on loving myself enough to make myself and my health a priority in my life. Since I have so much baggage from the past, this is not an easy task! Although I have come a long way, I still feel like I have quite a bit more work to do on the inside. Hopefully, I will be able to tie it all together one day soon! I will NOT give up on myself. I just won't! BTW, congratulations on 10 days of NO emotional eating!!! That is awesome!!! :bravo:

seabiscuit: I am happy to hear that you are already feeling better! Hope you get your energy back soon. Thanks for posting! It is great to have you here. ;)

CDubsGotGoats, lilturtle, and shr1nk1ngme: How are you? Please post as soon as you can ~ if only to let us know you found the new thread. Hope you are all okay.

Have a great week, everyone!!! :)

12-02-2013, 10:23 AM
Hello :) Long time Depression section poster, I have been on WellbutrinXL for years now. I gained with Lexapro and still felt suicidal so obviously that was not working for me, and made the switch to Wellbutrin about 7 years ago.

I find I can easily, so easily let myself slip into a down mode just by negative thinking, and I can fight it, depends on how much oomph I am feeling. Generally pretty content but terrible self-image and always, always comparing myself to others.

I can't seem to get down to goal, I just eat too much, and the wrong things; I do work out almost every day though.

I know Seabiscuit and Ladyrider :hug: and am looking forward to getting to know others here :)

Fiona W
12-02-2013, 01:01 PM
Well, I've had enough of this depression: my shrink told me to call him if I continued feeling bad, so I'm doing that today. Ever since I got off the Effexor, I've really been dragging. If it were "just" blue moods and low energy, that would be one thing, but I experience even moderate depression as physical pain, like a cleaver jammed into my chest. If I were feeling that right now, no way could I be writing this posting, but I tend to do better in the mornings and evenings: afternoons are my h*** times. Anyway, please don't fret over me: I have hope that between my shrink and me, we'll find a solution.

Holly— 'Nice to meet you! That is SO cool you are a biker chick: I bet your ride is gorgeous! I love candy-apple red.... I know what you mean about the negative thoughts tending to drive down one's mood. You're probably long since familiar with the concepts of cognitive-behavioral therapy, but I'll just say that I got a lot of help from David D. Burns's Feeling Good (, because it enumerates all the different forms of distorted thinking during depression. I also got the book of his that's a workbook with exercises you do: just following the practice of writing down my negative thoughts, identifying what types of distortions they were, and then challenging them, on paper, with positive statements, was really a life-saver for me, back in the 1980s when I had my first big episode. Even all these years later, when I have a negative thought, I try to say, "That's a depression thought of type X or type Y," and then detach myself from that thinking.

IBelieve— Speaking of detaching oneself from unhealthy thinking, the book I read just a few days ago that has the potential to be a real game changer for me in the area of emotional eating is Kathryn Hansen's Brain Over Binge ( (You did ask what I'd been reading... =grin=) Hansen's personal story of being severely bulimic w/ exercise purges is quite different from my own of rather more restrained binges w/o purges, but nonetheless I am very excited about her simple but powerful technique for how to stop binging once and forever. I don't want to spoil it for you by giving a lame summary: if any of y'all suffer with having strong cravings for unhealthy foods, you owe it to yourself to read this book. Hansen writes very well and really takes you deep into that moment when an urge for emotional/compulsive/binge-type eating is upon you, and tells you what to do in order not to give in.

Amy— I hope you keep telling us more about your experiences with OA. I've never been to one of their meetings, but when I was first trying to get a handle on my emotional eating, I found the concept of abstinence to be very helpful. Except instead of calling it "abstinence" I called it "taking a vacation." I took a long vacation from my Big 3 trigger foods (cookies, candy & donuts), in which I pretended that they were out in the world somewhere bothering other people, but they couldn't bother me because I was on a sailboat (see my ticker) having a grand old time, with no cell phone or any other way to reach me. I was astonished by how much easier that was than my previous pattern of "whiteknuckling" through protracted battles with my urges to overeat. I'd be curious to hear about your experiences with abstinence, or whatever else you've learned from OA that has been helpful.

12-02-2013, 01:36 PM
Hi, Just a check in to let you know that I found the thread! I will get on later to check on how everyones weekend went, and share how mine went as well.

Thank you all for checking on me!!!

12-02-2013, 03:28 PM
Holly (VermontMom): Welcome to the group! I am so glad that you posted here. I feel the same as you described about feeling generally content (after years of working on my depression) but having a terrible self-image which tends to drag me down. I am working so hard on myself that I drive myself (and my family) crazy half the time, but I am determined to improve my self-image and self-esteem so that I care enough about myself to lose this excess weight. Neat that you already know seabiscuit and ladyrider! I hope that you will enjoy this group and get something positive out of it. You add to it just by posting. Hope to hear from you again soon! ;)

Fi: So sorry that you have been dragging and battling depression, but happy to hear that you are calling your shrink to do something about it. That is a wise move. Hope he will be able to provide some relief for you. BTW, you are worth fretting over and I am concerned about you, so please let us know how things go for you. I just want you to feel better! :hug: Thank you for yet another book title for me to explore. It sounds like I need it, but I have others to read, too. Would you put this book (Brain Over Binge) before the other 2 you recommended earlier or suggest reading those first? [I already have the other 2 you mentioned. Just need to read them.] I appreciate all that you share with the group! :)

Chelsea (CDubs): Thanks for checking in! Happy to know that you are still on board! ;)

lilturtle and sh1nk1ngme: YooHoo!!! Are you still with us? I sure hope so! Waiting to hear from you! Hope all is well with both of you. :hug:

ladyrider and CrystalClear: Hope to hear from you as well!

Food has gone pretty well so far today. I still need to exercise. Will aim to check in before bed. Sending my best to all of you! Please post when you can. :)

12-02-2013, 03:41 PM
Hi there!

Fiona- I am glad that you and others are interested in my experiences with OA and the OA program. I had over 90 days abstinence before, at times it did feel like white-knuckling but I think I was better off without a lot of the foods that were causing me trouble. I am struggling to get abstinent again but I am refraining from a lot of the trouble foods, and I feel so much better without them. I ordered some AA materials, one of the books came today. AA and OA are very similar because they are both twelve step programs and they both involve refraining from substances. I wanted to go to my OA meeting today but I have a cold so I stayed home. I like the online meetings, they are very supportive.

Holly- Welcome to our group! :)

Take care, everyone. HUGS!


Fiona W
12-03-2013, 10:01 AM
Well, I called my shrink yesterday. He and I decided together that I should try going back on a low dose of Effexor. He says he has another patient who's on both Cymbalta and Effexor, so it's not totally unheard of. Sometimes I think I need more meds at higher doses just because of how big I am!

It will be at least a few days before I see if this change makes a difference, but already I feel more hopeful, just that we did something.

IBelieve— In response to your question about whether you should read Kathryn Hansen's Brain Over Binge ( before your other books, I'd say it depends on whether you identify yourself as a binge eater. Do you get intense cravings for unhealthy food? Do you have episodes where you eat more than you usually would in a short period of time, feeling out of control as you do so? Do you do this out-of-control eating in secret and/or alone? Do you have feelings of shame &/or disgust afterwards? Those are the characteristics of what's called Binge Eating Disorder (BED). I only just recently realized that I do have BED. What Hansen's book is enormously helpful for, is learning how to say "no" to those urges to binge.

'Wishing everyone a happy Tuesday... I hope y'all will all check in every day, if you can, for support on your weight loss project! =smile=

12-03-2013, 10:38 AM
Fi: I found The Emotional Diet book, by Bill Cashell, last night and dove right in. When I got to the part about seeing myself through another's eyes, I chose my son who died shortly after birth. As I saw myself through his eyes and read the meditation in the book, tears began to flow freely. What was so profound for me was that I was able to feel my goodness (through my son's eyes) and cry for myself about some traumatic things I went through in my past. This was so good for me to experience, because I have a lot of difficulty connecting to my own worth and sadness for myself and the little girl I was. Even in therapy, I can discuss the way I feel without really connecting to the emotions and truly feeling them, so this was very cleansing and helpful for me. Thank you so much for recommending that book. I noticed that I had read part of the book back in 2010, but never finished it. I think at the time I wasn't aware that I was truly a food addict. This time, I am committed to reading the entire book and doing the exercises in it. I think the book is going to be especially helpful to me in my quest to FREE MYSELF from my obsession with food. It is especially helpful because it refers to online tools that can be used as a supplement to the book. I am excited for what lies ahead in the book and for the continued healing to come! Such a great resource!

I am so happy that you are already feeling hopeful since you have worked out a plan with your psychiatrist. There is no shame in going back on a low dose (or even more) of Effexor if that is what your body needs to function at optimal mental health right now. Relief is just around the corner! Hang in there! :hug:

Amy: Please tell me about the concept of abstinence from OA. I am confused about it. I have some OA books, but I never get too far in them because I struggle with this concept. I think I am equating abstinence with NOT eating at all, which is obviously impossible. Any light you can shed on it for me would be helpful.

Waving hello :wave: to everyone else! Please post when you can!
Here's to a great day! :)

Fiona W
12-03-2013, 09:52 PM
IBelieve— That's great you had such a healing experience in response to Bill Cashell's book! I think it has a lot of wisdom in it, and I keep it handy so I can re-read chapters from time to time.

I had a really rough day: lots of depression pain, in the afternoon especially. But I'm still hopeful that the change in my meds is going to sort things out. It may take a while, though. I'm still on plan with Atkins, and I did my leg exercises.

12-04-2013, 01:28 PM
Hi All, sorry I haven't been able to really post much lately. I have been checking in and reading the thread though, and it sounds like there has been some good progress in spite of the holiday :)

Believe: Thank you for holding this thread together, and it is wonderful to hear about your cleansing experience. I hope that it continues to reinforce love for yourself and to give you strength.

Fi: I am glad that you are feeling a little better since working with your dr., and way to be on track with your diet, exercise, and... YAY day 12!! Especially since you have been feeling so down, that is a great achievement and something to be proud of. Keep hanging in there, you have a great inner strength that I admire.

I had a really bad day yesterday. Went to the my appt. with my new doctor, since my other dr. retired and I didn't get any notification, and he is great but I gained 4 pounds(need to update my ticker) and because of some stuff at work I am feeling pretty sensitive, so it kind of equated to my feeling frustrated and disappointed in myself. Got my eating back on track yesterday from the holiday, and while I don't feel done with my baking for the season I am going to invest in some disposable pie pans so that I can get them out of my house more quickly with no obligation to follow up to get my pans(can you tell where my big weakness is???). Something else frustrating is that the nerve problems that I have been experiencing, and thought had kind of gone into remission, have come back full force and are causing a lot of pain.
Anyway, over all I am feeling ok, but need to give myself a kick in the butt to keep on track and keep working on JOYFULLY eating my FUEL foods so that I don't have such bad urges to eat sugar...

I am extra glad to have you all here today.

Fiona W
12-05-2013, 12:19 AM
Just a quick note: I'm on plan, still somewhat depressed, but not as bad as yesterday.

Oh, and last night I had my first serious test of the anti-binge technique I learned from Kathryn Hansen's Brain Over Binge. I got angry about something. Anger is the hardest emotion for me to just live through and not stuff my face with sweets. So I got a bigtime craving for cookies. But I was able to separate myself from the voice that was demanding cookies, and stay in control of my actions. =whew= Hansen says that once she mastered the technique, it took about three weeks for the urges towards emotional/compulsive eating to get less and less persistent, and about nine months for them to go away completely. I am SO psyched to give up this behavior for good!

12-05-2013, 02:20 AM
Hello Fi And CDubs and Everyone! I swear I posted a message to you both this afternoon at about 3:45pm :comp:, and now that I come back to check in, it is gone. :?: I had to finish it quickly, because I had to be somewhere at 4pm, so maybe I hit a wrong button or something??? Odd..... Anyway, here goes another attempt!

Fi: So sorry to hear that you had a really rough day the other day. :( I am happy to read the update tonight, though, that you weren't as bad today. HOORAY for you for resisting that binge for cookies when you were angry!!! That deserves a healthy happy dance!!! :broc: I just love those dancing veggies! ;) Seriously, though, for you to be able to separate yourself from the voice that was demanding cookies is a huge accomplishment. Interesting technique! Yet another lesson learned ~ and put into practice ~ from a self-help book!!! I love it! :D

CDubsGotGoats: Wow, sorry to hear that you had a really bad day yesterday, too! :( That must have been hurtful and confusing that your old doc retired and they didn't give you any sort of notification. That seems odd, but I am happy that you like the new doc. Don't fret too much over that 4 pound weight gain. You will have that back off in no time! Sorry for whatever is bothering you at work, too. It sounds like you have a lot on your plate right now. Hang in there and please keep posting whenever possible (but please don't feel guilty or bad if you just can't; I understand). I do think it helps! Plus, I am thankful to know when someone is going through a difficult time, so that we can be here for you for support and encouragement. I also like to keep people in my prayers, so I am sending hugs and prayers your way! :hug: Good that you got your eating back on track from the holiday. I think I have, too. What a relief! I am also sorry to hear that you are having some nerve problems that are causing you a lot of pain. :( Do you know the cause? That can be scary and, yes, frustrating! Darn! I hope tomorrow is a much better day for you! :)

lilturtle: I am so worried about you!!! :( Please ~ if you happen to be reading along ~ please post and let us know how you are doing!!! We haven't heard from you yet on this new thread, I don't think. I hope you find us and that you are okay. You are in my thoughts and prayers! :hug:

Waving hello :wave: to everyone else! Please post with an update about yourself and let us know if you are feeling Up :D or Down :(.

Today (Dec. 4th) was my 47th birthday. I would normally say (and feel like) "YIKES!" :eek:, but I have decided that this year is going to be a great one for me! I will be healthier next year at this time. I just feel it in my bones! One big sign of PROGRESS for me is that I scheduled a workout with a personal trainer today. In the past, I always avoided strenuous or unpleasant things on my birthday. This year, when the trainer said, "How about Wednesday, December 4th, at 4pm?" I initially responded with, "No, that's my birthday." Then, upon further consideration, I said, "You know what?!? I will give myself the gift of a workout on my birthday! Sign me up!" :D So I worked out with Cheryl today at 4pm ..... and it felt GREAT!!! :carrot: The facility where I go is called "GoodBodies." That title would have scared me off, but I found the place on Angie's List and it got great reviews. I really love it! They have awesome Cybex strength-training equipment and lots of treadmills, ellipticals, etc, and the trainers seem really knowledgeable and down-to-earth. I had started with a guy who I really liked prior to my foot surgery in July, but he took on another job along with the personal training, so his hours are limited now. I actually prefer a male trainer, but they encouraged me to go with this lady (who is actually training my handicapped daughter, too), and so far, so good! I was very reluctant to start back up with the training, but I am so glad that I did!!! I really need the professional assistance and accountability right now. I figure that if I am working out for an hour, I want to get the most from that time, and they really seem to know what they're doing. Okay, I am rambling and it is late, so I will wrap it up here. I had a great day with my family. Met my hubby for lunch, went to a Christmas performance at my daughter's school tonight, and then out to a nice dinner at a local fish market. So, for the moment, LIFE IS GOOD in my world!!! :goodvibes

12-05-2013, 06:39 AM
good morning, and hey IBelieveInMe2, it is nice to read such positive posts from you, real nice energy :)

when you say you drive your family crazy with your own self-image problems, do you mean, as you might verbally speak of your anxiety over it, and they try to reassure you? Just wondering how it goes with you . With me, my DH will compliment me, and I'm sure he means it, but I'll say something negative about myself, which frustrates him I guess, because it appears that I'm not placing value on his opinion? sigh.

Yesterday I would have said my mood was DOWN because of a silly comment first thing in the morning that I took too seriously, and let it put me in a downward spiral of bad thoughts. I fought it and salvaged half my day, made myself get out of bed and took my birthday gift money and went shopping, and wow got a beautiful Calvin Klein coat and a Steve Madden handbag both marked down over 50% so I felt fabulous :D I almost NEVER use shopping as a 'feeling better' cure but it worked this time.

Oh and belated Happy Birthday IBelieveInMe2, and so great that you chose to work out on your b-day! Mine was the 2nd, I'm 53 so a few years on you.

Hello to everyone else!

12-05-2013, 03:10 PM
Hello VermontMom! Happy to see a post from you. I drive my family crazy because I am always reading self-help books and talking about what I am learning about myself. I guess you could say that I am a bit obsessed with my self-esteem right now, but it takes constant vigilance for me to catch my own negative thinking and turn it around. My hubby doesn't like it when I talk negative about myself. My kids don't see why I need all of the self-help books. Thankfully, we have raised them with great self-esteem, so they don't get why I don't already feel good about myself. My handicapped daughter, who has way more self-esteem at the age of 14 (despite her handicap) than I do, says that I should read some novels instead of all of the self-help books. I say I like and need my self-help books! :lol:

Sorry your mood was DOWN yesterday because of a "silly" comment early in the morning. Good for you for fighting that downward spiral and salvaging part of your day. PROGRESS!!! Oh yeah, shop therapy works for me often! ;) Hope you had a happy birthday! We are almost birthday buddies! :D Let's make the coming year our best yet!!! :carrot:

Fiona W
12-05-2013, 03:41 PM
Say folks, I've been reading what promises to be a very useful book for those of us struggling to lose weight. It came up because in another thread we were talking about the problem of going off your diet plan, the later in the day it gets. The book is The Willpower Instinct by Kelly McGonigal ( According to the author (a Stanford psychologist who teaches a very popular course on how self-control works and how to get more of it), the more stressed & tired you are, the more likely you are to eat impulsively.

That may sound totally obvious, but what's interesting about this book is that it explains why stress & exhaustion undermine your self-control, and offers some surprisingly easy ways to fix the problem. They include:
• making sure you get a good night's sleep (at least 7 hours uninterrupted)
• taking moments during the day for a brief period of relaxation: it doesn't have to be a nap, it can be just 5 minutes during which you relax your body completely and breathe as deeply & slowly as possible
• doing 5-10 minutes of meditation in the morning: nothing fancy, just sit comfortably, completely still, eyes closed, concentrate on your breathing, and each time your mind drifts away from your breathing, pull it back & focus again on inhale, exhale, inhale, exhale...don't worry about the fact that your attention drifts, just pull it back to your breathing over & over again
• at least 5 minutes of being outside and in motion—walking, gardening, playing with your kid or your dog, any kind of outdoors activity

All of those suggestions have been shown in repeated experiments to improve function in the part of your brain in charge of self-control: the prefrontal cortex (located right behind your forehead). So even if you just do one of them, daily, you'll be better able to stay on your diet.

I'm finding this book fascinating, so I may report back with more info from it...

12-05-2013, 07:39 PM
It will be at least a few days before I see if this change makes a difference, but already I feel more hopeful, just that we did something.

I sure hope you see a change for the good, SOON.

and real sorry to see that you suffer from actual pain from depression. I have seen that as symptoms, but I am lucky I do not suffer from that.

And I'm very impressed at how many books you and IBelieve read, on self-help!

IBelieve, I also do NOT like or embrace darkness, our electric bill must fund the town :D I have the brightest bulbs I can find, and have most of them all on in whatever room I'm in. Thank goodness my DH and son don't mind. Something that helps me also, is my string of white lights that I have around the window by my bed, it's draped by sheers; but with a timer, so the string of lights go on about 30 minutes before I'm supposed to get up in the morning. And they're so pretty ;)

Fiona W
12-06-2013, 01:40 AM
Tonight I've been beseiged with cravings for sweets. I'm eating macadamia nuts and trying to ignore the hubbub in my head. No binge behavior, just Zevia soda and macadamia nuts.

I hope I don't have to go through many more nights like this before the urges to binge die down and go away. This feels like giving up a powerful drug. I was a bigtime emotional eater for nearly 50 years, and this is the first time I've tried to give it up completely. I guess it's not surprising my brain is kicking up a fuss.

I'm trying not to fight it... just letting it roar without acting on the urges...

12-06-2013, 04:38 AM
Fi: You are so strong!!! Just think ~ 14 days.....nearly halfway to your mini goal of 30 days without a binge!!! YOU CAN DO IT!!!!!!!! :cheer2::broc: I am so proud of you for resisting the sweet cravings that attacked you earlier tonight!!! (I am writing in the middle of the night. My pups frequently wake me up to go out at this time....... :dz:) Macadamia nuts sound like a yummy substitute for sweets! :T Great choice! You are so right that after nearly 50 years of emotional eating, your body is going to fight you tooth and nail and THINKS it's going to win the battle........ BUT: it is being introduced to the NEW Fi who RESISTS that unhealthy behavior!!! :fr: Look out world, Fi isn't messing around this time!!! :cb::carrot: Dr. Judith Beck says that every time you RESIST a negative behavior, you are strengthening your resistance muscle (and weakening your giving-in muscle)!!! That is fantastic!!! :D I enjoyed your summary of The Willpower Instinct, especially the fixes to the problem of impulsive eating. Makes sense, but it is difficult to follow through with all of the "fixes!" It gives us something to aim for, though! Wow, you are cruising through these self-help books WAY faster than I am!!!!! :lol:

12-06-2013, 05:01 AM
Fi: You are so strong!!! Just think ~ 14 days.....nearly halfway to your mini goal of 30 days without a binge!!! YOU CAN DO IT!!!!!!!! :cheer2::broc: I am so proud of you for resisting the sweet cravings that attacked you earlier tonight!!! (I am writing in the middle of the night. My pups frequently wake me up to go out at this time....... :dz:) Macadamia nuts sound like a yummy substitute for sweets! :T Great choice! You are so right that after nearly 50 years of emotional eating, your body is going to fight you tooth and nail and THINKS it's going to win the battle........ BUT: it is being introduced to the NEW Fi who RESISTS that unhealthy behavior!!! :fr: Look out world, Fi isn't messing around this time!!! :cb::carrot: Dr. Judith Beck says that every time you RESIST a negative behavior, you are strengthening your resistance muscle (and weakening your giving-in muscle)!!! That is fantastic!!! :D I enjoyed your summary of The Willpower Instinct, especially the fixes to the problem of impulsive eating. Makes sense, but it is difficult to follow through with all of the "fixes!" It gives us something to aim for, though! Wow, you are cruising through these self-help books WAY faster than I am!!!!! :lol:

Holly: You are cracking me up about lighting up your whole town!!! :lol: Anything to avoid the darkness!!! I love the string of white lights idea around the window by your bed! Sounds peaceful and soothing.

I had a definite UP today! While my daughter was working out with our trainer at the gym, instead of just watching her and waiting, I chose to walk on the treadmill for 35 minutes!!! :tread: I am working on walking without holding on to the grips, and I walked for 20 of those minutes (in 5-min. increments) without holding on!!! :D It felt great and I am really proud of myself for doing it!!! It is definite PROGRESS for me, who usually avoids working out, especially when I don't HAVE to. It is amazing how much harder my core has to work when not holding on. My trainer says I'll burn more calories doing it that way, which makes sense. A huge DOWN for me was going to the funeral home for my good friend's husband, who had a stroke 2 and 1/2 weeks ago..... and died the other morning. :cry: I just feel so bad for my friend. They had been married for 32 years. I cannot even imagine how she must be feeling right now. Anyway, I had eaten dinner prior to going to the funeral home, and ~ after our visit ~ I felt really hungry again. Some of it might have been real hunger, since I ate the modest meal right after working out. But, after eating an Arby's roast beef sandwich (after the fun hm), I still felt hungry..... this time for chips or something crunchy. I realized at that moment that my "hunger" was definitely emotional. I hate to say that it didn't stop me from downing a small pack of Cheetos when we got home 45 minutes later (fun hm was way across town), but at least I was aware of what I was doing. Next time, I will RESIST the urge to munch and crunch when it is just emotional hunger!!! Or, looking back now, I could have substituted baby carrots for the Cheetos. Oh well, we live and we learn, right?!? ;)

Well, since it is the middle of the night and I need to leave for the funeral (also way across town and it is freezing rain right now; my part of Ohio is in the midst of a winter storm warning) early in the morning, I better get back to bed!!! I know that this interrupted sleep is a negative behavior, but I just LOVE being up in the middle of the night because it is so QUIET and peaceful! :tired: Anyway, hope everyone gets their weekend off to a great start! Talk to you tomorrow! ZZZZzzzzz....................... ;)

12-06-2013, 05:45 AM
hi everyone.

i just finished reading all of your posts and all i can say is wow. ;)

i will tell you a little about me. i am in my 50's (55 actually) and i have quite a few serious health problems. i am a jp teacher but i had to retire early because of illness. i got insurance (a huge amount) and my super, and spent it all! :o

fortunately i paid off all our bad debt. so we own our cars, furniture, etc. no more credit cards for me. i can't be trusted! i am working on saving now, and being very careful with my money since i'm on a disability pension. :p

well one problem i have is anxiety. it is treated well with cymbalta. i have had periods of deep depression because of my impossible situation but i will draw strength from, well nelson mandella would be an appropriate idol, yes? :) i also have oa. lucky me.

now i sleep too much. all afternoon. the rest of the time i'm sitting at my imac! i worry about all that, constantly. feelings of guilt. i wish i could stay up. i'm so bored though. i must do something. i know this. tomorrow i could set a little goal, yeah? :)

i have pain, nerve pain in my foot and leg. it's from surgery, i had neuro-surgery, twice, 2 years ago due to a brain tumor that decided to appear on my brain stem. non-malignant, i'm good now really. except for wobbly walking, pain, chronic fatigue etc., i'm lucky to be alive. i nearly wasn't here. :?:

anyway, i am on the intensive phase of optifast VLCD diet. i've lost 14 kilo's and i'm very happy about it. i hope to lose 27 more. in usa talk, that's about 30 pounds lost, 59 to go, approx.

that will do for now i think. oh congratulations to everyone for taking the steps to BE HERE. i appreciate your journeys…take care now, xxx, saraphin. here's my ticker factory ticker in aussie speak LOL :dizzy:

Fiona W
12-06-2013, 10:04 AM
Let me start by sending out a BELATED HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!! to both IBelieve and Holly!! I hope there's still a bit of a birthday glow on these days....

saraphin— 'Looks like I get to be the first to welcome you to the Ups & Downs group: lucky me! =smile= It's nice to have an Aussie on board. I have several Aussie friends that I've gotten to know through the international mail art community, and they are all stellar people. I, too, am in my 50s (58) and retired early due to illness (Bipolar Disorder). My husband got severe treatment-resistant depression and anxiety, and lost his job last fall, so now we're both doing our best to live on disability. Say, saraphin, I have a suggestion for you, if you are bored and would like something engaging to do with your time: ( Swap-bot is a large community of people all over the world who enjoy sending and receiving mail—yes, I mean real physical snail-mail. What you do there, after registering and writing up a profile about yourself, is sign up for swaps: A swap can be as simple as sending a postcard and receiving one, all the way up through various crafts such as mail art, collage, papercrafts, needlework, knitting, sewing, even writing, you name it. When I started at swap-bot in early 2010, I just signed up for postcard swaps—a postcard from your home town, one about the beautiful sights in Australia, as simple as that. With time, I happened to get into collage and mail art (see link at bottom of my sig), so those are the kinds of swaps I mostly do now. It's all very protective of your privacy: no one else except the person assigned to send something to you ever sees your mailing address. And the community is so friendly, with lots of swaps open to newbies and a forum where you can ask any questions you have. (Or you could always send me a msg here on 3FC and ask...) It can be a real boost to the spirit to receive friendly mail in one's mailbox, not just bills & junk mail! And it can be as little or a lot time-consuming as you wish: there's zero pressure to sign up for any more swaps than you feel comfortable with. There's even a section of the site (called a "group") for swappers with mental health conditions.

IBelieve— Thanks so much for the enthusiastic support: I really really appreciate it. I ended up turning on our set of the complete Beatles on "shuffle" (random songs) on the stereo, and fell asleep on the couch listening to the Fab Four—not a bad way to end the evening! That sounds great about your workout on the treadmill: those core muscles are so important. I plan to join a gym when I get down about a hundred pounds or so. For the time being, I do daily non-weight-bearing leg exercises to keep my knees in good shape. I plan to start walking soon...And about those suggestions from The Willpower Instinct: you don't have to do all of them, silly. =grin= Just pick one and try to incorporate it into your daily routine: meditating for 5-10 minutes in the morning, before you start your day, will get you the most "bang for your buck," in terms of increasing your "I will" and "I won't" power.

Holly— Your lights around the window do sound nice! I love putting strings of little white Christmas lights in various places around the house. They're somehow both peaceful & cheerful at the same time. But I have to beg to differ with you and IBelieve on the subject of darkness: I also like spending time in the low-stim environment of a completely dark room. I had an abusive childhood, and darkness was the only place I felt completely safe, because my parents couldn't see me. So I often meditate or listen to music in the dark. Say, please tell us more about your Biker Chick identity! Do you ride every day? Do you belong to a club? Can you fix your ride, like minor repairs, yourself? Have you ever read Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance? What a terrific book that is...

Chelsea— I was so sorry to hear about your bad day at the doctor's office! What kind of nerve problems do you have, if you don't mind telling us more about them. On the subject of "Fuel Eating," Brooke Castillo (in her book If I Am So Smart Why Can't I Lose Weight?) recommends that 90% of your eating should be Fuel Eating, which can certainly be very pleasurable, and 10% should be Joy Eating—those foods, like chocolate, you go for simply because of how wonderful they taste in your mouth. The last thing you want to be in is a deprivation mindset, because deprivation leads to reactive overeating &/or binging. So maybe you should try incorporating a candy bar, or whatever it is you enjoy most, into your daily food plan. Just an idea...

lilturtle— I, too, am worried about you! You haven't checked back in with us since Thanksgiving, a meal you were worried about in advance. I hope we see you soon, girl! =smile=

Amy— Can you tell us more about abstinence, what it means to you? What exact foods are you abstaining from? Does abstinence help you not crave those foods? Just curious...

Well, that's more than enough palaver from me today. TGIF, everyone! Get your mindset in place to have a terrific weekend, one you'll look back on, come Monday, and be pleased with...

12-06-2013, 01:53 PM
Sorry I haven't bee around. I ran out of my meds last week and ended up in the hospital on Monday. I got out yesterday and they got me my meds for the month. My diet has completely sucked the last two weeks. I need to update my ticker. I had lost more but I don't know if I gained any back. I'm going back to low calorie. I did better on that then Atkins. Things are kind of stressful right now. I'm trying to get into out patient treatment and fighting with the insurance company.

12-06-2013, 05:10 PM
lilturtle: I am so, so very happy to hear from you!!! Thanks for posting. Sorry that you ran out of meds and ended up in the hospital. Been there and it sucks! :( Glad to hear that you are out already, though, and that they are getting you meds for the month. Things might be stressful for you now, but at least you will get your meds to help you function better through everything. Sorry that you have to battle with the insurance company. I hope that you find a quality outpatient facility that will help you get back on your feet. Understandable that your eating hasn't been good during this difficult time. Just do the best you can. Baby steps. Be patient with yourself. You are in my prayers!!! Sending a BIG HUG!!! :hug:

saraphin: :welcome3: I am glad that you found our group and posted here. Sorry for my ignorance, but what is a jp teacher? Not sure what "jp" stands for. Sorry that you are dealing with serious health problems. My advice to you would be to take little tiny baby steps toward better health. Can you walk? I think you said that you walk "wobbly." If you could manage to take just a very short walk each day ~ like maybe down the street and back; then you could EVENTUALLY and GRADUALLY increase your time and distance. Just focus on getting SOME movement into your day for now. It would help your anxiety and your depression and your overall health so much. Maybe you could write about your guilt feelings in a journal. That has been very helpful for me, especially when I can't manage to do much else. Just write freely and uninhibited.......whatever comes to mind. Write, write, and write some more. Pour your feelings out on paper. It will help! That is great that you have lost about 30 pounds (USA talk)!!! :bravo: How did you manage to lose that weight? Best of luck to you with the rest of your journey! ;)

Fi: Thank you for the belated birthday wishes! I am feeling more hopeful this year than I have in a long time, so all is good! Why not join a gym now, if possible? You certainly don't HAVE to wait until you "lose a hundred pounds or so," do you? I would think that a good trainer could work with you to lose THAT weight, too. If they are good, they will meet you right where you are NOW and help you to make progress. I figure that, since they know what they are doing (more than me), I will get the most out of my hour workout this way. And you are never "too big" to be at a gym. That's where you need to be....... working on your health....... if you are super big. Anyone who would judge you for your appearance obviously has not been there, so the heck with 'em!!! Do it for YOU!!! ;) You crack me up about me worrying about doing ALL of the suggestions from The Willpower Instinct at once!!! :lol: I told you that I have an all-or-nothing approach to things, didn't I?!? And, yes, I am silly in that way!!! Well, I'm kind of silly......period! ;)

CDubsGotGoats: How are you today? Please write when you get a chance, if only to let us know you are okay..... or not. We care about you! :hug:

Hello to everyone else! :wave: Hope everyone is doing well! :)

12-06-2013, 11:00 PM
Hello ladies, yes I found the thread. Haven't had much to post about lately. Weight going down slowly but steadily, busy busy busy time of year, but NO DRAMA! (This is a GOOD thing!)


12-07-2013, 12:35 AM
good evening chicks! wow this thread is active, that is great!!

Welcome to saraphin! very glad to have you here, hope you can find some comraderie and happiness here :) very sorry to hear of your physical pains. And that you can find an activity to keep you from feeling bored.

IBelieveinMe - that is kewl (my word for cool) that you had an UP moment at the gym!! congrats on your treadmill progress! but how sad at your friend's loss, poor lady.

Fi, aw, thank you for the b-day wishes, yes, still a glow due to my coat and handbag purchases :D Very glad you got through the tough white-knuckling-state of getting through a craving. Yay you!

how sad it was to hear you speak of the peace of a dark room, to hide from your parents :hug:

i LOVE to talk about motorcycling :D My DH and I belong to United Motorcyclists of Vermont, I'm vice president in fact, and will prob be elected Prez this February, if I don't chicken out, lol. We raise money for scholarships, collect toys for the Shriners Hospitals, Visiting Nurses Assn, and other charitable organizations.

I ride to work almost every day from late April or early May, through November, my commute is almost 50 miles a day of beautiful Vermont countryside so that is pretty fun!

We have taken long trips to get to rallies in South Carolina, New York, and Ohio; and the farthest I've gone on a bike is to the Arch in St. Louis. You can't tell from looking at me, that I'm a biker chick , lol, except for the blond hair, no tats (yet) and I dress pretty conservative, until it's biker time :cool: then it's time to cut loose!

I'm afraid I don't know how to fix my own ride, I'm very happy letting my husband or the shop do it :devil: I would be so proud if I could, yet I don't really apply myself to learn.

thanks for asking about my passion :D

shr1nk1ngme - yay to no drama!!

lilturtle, that is scary to think of ending up in the hospital, sorry about that.

Hi to everyone else! I have off Wed. and Thursdays, and work weekends, so today was my Monday, ugh. Oh well!

12-07-2013, 04:40 AM
i'm tickled pink to know you are caring enough to post real posts to little me, (no so little, really, but i am underneath!)
it's great to read your posts, so invigorating in a way.
yes, vermont mom, this thread is way active - i'm having trouble remembering everybody's name, and your individual stories. i know you are a biker chick. that's easy. and so kewl. LOL . wow and you ride a 1300 cc! how can you even pick it up? i love bikes but they're scary. my son rides a 500 suzi. he likes it. yellow. very cute. your red one sounds hot. i drive a corrolla! lol:carrot:
ibelieveinmetoo your little pic's are so cute…how do you get those? do i have to wait a certain number of days for that also?
fiona, wellwell i LOVE your swap-bot idea! yes i do! i'm headed there soon thanx:dizzy:
hello to shrinkingme and lilturtle, greetings from oz.:hug::hug::hug:
hey everyone, choose to be HAPPY tonight (it's already saturday night here so you've got time to get happy lol)
i read recently about CHOOSING happiness, so i'm doing it.
my husband is so sane, also he makes it easy for me. he is pretty much happy all the time!!!!can you believe it? i feed off his mood a lot. he smiles at me ALL the time….lucky me!:p:p:p

we are about to settle down for a night in front of the telly as usual, which i'm perfectly HAPPY about. we never go out. i don't want to anyway. i've already been everywhere!. we used to go out all the time but now we find it SOOOOO comfortable at home!

um ibelieveinme, jp is junior primary. little ones, 5 - 8 years old, i teach at school. well i used to until i stopped haha. but i hated it in some ways anyhow. waaaaaay too much stresss. oh god it was dreadful for that. but i miss the children.

i LOVE being at home now with my dogs and house and garden though. and my husband quit his job far away to be close to me and to take care of me so he's here a lot too. he just does some casual work. it's so beautiful, us. i adore him and he loves me too. so that's us. we have a few friends and a great family…2 great families in fact.

tell me people, what is DH?

BFN, saraphin :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy

btw, thank you for your lovely welcome, vermontmom etc., i'm very happy to have found you. i'm just manoevring my way around this site so excuse me in advance if i make too many dumb blunders BAHAHAAA ;) until later xxx

12-07-2013, 08:10 AM
saraphin - thanks for your nice post telling us about yourself! what a lovely person your husband sounds like. And your home life sounds too comfortable to want to leave, also! In your garden, do you plant vegetables, or just flowers?

DH is "Dear Husband"...some people will also write "DD" "DS" for Dear Daughter, Dear Son; SIL is Sister In Law... :) In fact, here is a whole long list of acronyms frequently used here and on the web. :)

It is OK not to know everyone's name, sometimes we have the time to study each person's post and write something personal; sometimes it is all we can do just to say "Hi to everyone" and that is OK too!

I applaud you for choosing happiness!! sometimes I know it is not possible but if one can, wow that is uplifting and I agree it is what I need to do many times to force myself into positive thinking.

Oh and my big bike...if it falls over, I just stand there looking helpless and usually some big strong person, usually a fellow biker, comes to help me :rofl: I try very hard not to let that happen, though; last spring I tried to get my bike out of the garage but I got stuck in a mud puddle and couldnt even put the side stand down, so I sat on my bike for AN HOUR until my son came home to help me :rofl:

The little pictures at the end of one's post, you do have to wait a certain number of days, being a 3FC member, before being able to post those.

Well, Hi to everyone :D I have to get some cookies together for a Christmas sale our Fire Dept. Auxiliary is doing this morning; I can't participate by attending because I will be at work, but I always make cookie bags for the sale. Yes and I eat them too, sigh! don't even want to talk about my diet which I am never on!
have a great day! :cool:

12-07-2013, 03:38 PM
Hello Everyone! I am in a hurry to write because my hubby and I are taking off for an overnight to an out-of-town concert! I can't wait, except that I think we will miss the OSU Buckeyes -vs- Michigan State Big Ten Championship game, which is a major bummer! We are HUGE Buckeye fans!!! :D I am hoping the bar where the concert is has TVs, so we can catch part of the game, too. Either way, we will have a blast! :D We have a 17-y-o son and a 14-y-o daughter, and we rarely leave them, so this is much needed time alone! ;) Anyway, I will check in again Sunday evening.....if I'm not too hungover! :lol:

shr1nk1ngme: So happy to hear from you and that you found the new thread!!! No drama is a good thing and slow but steady weight loss is better than where I NONE! :(

VermontMom: Great to hear from you! Your biker adventures sound so kewl :lol: and it sounds like you do some great work for charity. That is awesome! Thank you for welcoming saraphin so warmly and taking the time to write so much to all of us. You are a wonderful addition to our group! :D

saraphin: Looks like you figured out the little pics/smilies with your post! Aren't they so fun?!? :) You can use them when you hit "reply" but not if you click on "quick reply." Keep 'em coming! I love them! :D That is wonderful that your hubby is so good to you! Your relationship sounds a lot like mine with my hubby. We are very blessed! :love: Please keep posting. You are a great addition to the group, too! :hug:

Fi: As VermontMom mentioned, that IS so heart-breaking about you finding peace in the dark as you hid from your parents as a child. :cry: I know what you mean, though, about the dark being peaceful, too. Even though I prefer the light, sometimes I love being in my home in the middle of the night........ where it is PEACEFUL and QUIET. You might have noticed that I have written some of my posts at that time. Not good for "adequate sleep," I know, but I do enjoy being up in the middle of the night ~ all by myself ~ at times.

Okay, ladies, I am off to pack my bag for my overnight and then we must get on the road. Until tomorrow night............... stay strong and positive everyone! :goodvibes :wave:

Fiona W
12-07-2013, 04:38 PM
I probably shouldn't ever post in the afternoon, but I just gotta say this: my diurnal rhythm sucks. Even when I'm not depressed, I'm not good for much between about 1 PM and 6 PM—at least not predictably so—but when I'm depressed, as I have been for a few weeks now, afternoons are Misery City. In the past few days, since going back on a low dose of Effexor, I'm been great in the mornings, great in the evenings, but in so much damn pain in the afternoons, it just isn't funny.

And I can't trust anything I think in the afternoons, because my thoughts during that time period are just a long dreary parade of despair, corruption, ugliness, might as well crawl in a dark corner and die—you get the picture. For example, on the topic of my weight loss project, in the mornings I'll think, "Hey, it really looks like I'm making progress: staying on Atkins, feeling a little smaller, 15 days of no emotional eating, soon I'll increase how much exercise I'm doing—not bad!" But now, because it's the afternoon, I'm thinking, "The diet isn't working, I'm probably stalled, I'm horrible & fat & slothful, and I always will be, so what's the point?"

But I know for a fact that once the sun sets, I'll be back to, "Hey, doin' pretty good here, even stickin' to the diet during a depressed phase, let's turn on some music and dance!" Isn't that ridiculous? It's so frustrating, losing a whole third of my waking life, not being able to trust my own thoughts.

All right already: I'll stop this pity party. I'll go back to lying on the couch under a big thick quilt, moaning and hating myself.

Sorry, y'all. I love reading your postings, I really do. Thanks so much, IBelieveInMe2, for putting this thread together. I hope you enjoyed your concert. What band did you see? What kind of music? (Say, any chance you could give us a name to call you? It doesn't have to be your real name, of course. Names are so much more friendly than handles.)

12-07-2013, 06:41 PM
:phi everyone, just checking in! :carrot:

fiona i read your thread and i am so sorry you are feeling so blue all afternoon. i sleep all afternoon so what's worse? yours i think. maybe some sunshine would help you? i kow that's the last thing you want to do but maybe if you just get up and drag your quilt to the letter-box , and just MAYBE you could sit out there for a bit? :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy:

sorry. do you even HAVE any sunshine? come over to oz. we've got sunshine going for free here! :):):) i hope you're smiling at that! :p:p:p

take care everyone, well done for posting, it's cathartic to let your feelings go - i'm here. :-) :hug::hug::hug:

12-07-2013, 07:52 PM
:):):)oh, ps…thanx for welcoming me into your group. thanx also for the replies today and yesterday. answering a question ( i forget who asked me…maybe you, holly?) i grow vegetables AND flowers. tomatoes and petunias and impatiens and pelargoniums atm

also, ibelieveinme, we are blessed, too. and the little pic's are soo sute. they brighten up olur posts don't they? :):):)

:hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug::hug: :hug::hug:

12-08-2013, 04:30 PM
Hi Everyone,

I am back from our little mini get-away. Although Ohio State lost their big game (we WERE able to watch it on tv at the bar), the concert was so much fun and we had a blast dancing and I even rode the mechanical bull at the bar! :cb: :lol: It was so nice to be with just my hubby for the evening and overnight! :love:

Fi: I so wish there was something that could help you get through your afternoons better. We need to come up with some solutions! Have you asked your doctor about it? Could you take some med in the afternoons that would take the edge off of your pain and depression? I take Klonopin as needed for extreme anxiety (like when going to a large and/or difficult social event) and it just takes the edge off of my heightened feelings of anxiety. I wonder if something like that would help you in the afternoon. :?: What you are describing sounds awful! :( Or, at least, is there something you could take to help your physical pain in the afternoons? Have you found anything that is helpful?

The musician we went to see was Phil Vassar. He is a piano playing country/pop guy. Super sweet guy and it turns out he was staying at the same hotel in the little town as we did. He walked in as we were waiting for a cab to pick us up to go to the concert! It was pretty funny. He is an awesome performer! Very talented! Much too talented to still be playing in the little bar where we saw him. I have seen him in concert lots of times and met him several times, too. He is one of my all-time favorite musicians! I play the piano, too, so I am an extra big fan of his! :)

saraphin: Great to see you continue posting! The smilies are a blast!!! :D So happy that you found us here! :hug:

:wave: to everyone else! Please post and let us know how you are doing!

12-08-2013, 04:46 PM
:hug: hi everyone

thanx again for welcoming me, ibelieveinme and others! :hug::hug::hug:

as you can see, i use metric measurement. for imperial calculation, you simply multiply by 2.2 that easy. 2.2 pounds per kilo. i always remember that. :):):)

i'm doing ok, except for the pain i woke up with, but i took my med's early so it will abate soon enough. :p:p:p

i'll stay here at my i-mac for a while though, drinking way too much coffee. ;););)

bfn :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy:

12-08-2013, 04:52 PM
Hi Believe-

Abstinence is the action of refraining from compulsive overeating and from foods that cause trouble, such as binge and trigger foods. A lot of people in OA have food plans/a plan of eating and OA suggests certain ones in the pamphlet Dignity of Choice. Some members see a dietitian/nutritionist and I am seeing one in a few weeks to help with the food plan and guidance. It's recommended that OA members have sponsors who are members that have a lot of recovery and have a lot of experience with overeating. I am currently working on having a healthier relationship with food, not overeating or under eating. I used to binge but I don't bring a lot of the unhealthy foods home, sometimes I do eat them outside which isn't good, I want to work on that.

Take care. OA has a website too:

HI to everyone else, I hope that others here are doing well!


Fiona W
12-08-2013, 09:41 PM
I have a prn (Geodon) that takes a bit of the edge off. Had another very rough day: pain started around 10:30 AM and as of now, 8:30 PM, it has not yet stopped. I'm sorry to be such a lousy person on this thread. I see my shrink in person on Wednesday.

12-08-2013, 10:10 PM
Hugs to you, Fiona. I hope that you have a better rest of the night. You're NOT a lousy person!


12-09-2013, 01:54 AM
Amy: Thank you for the explanation of abstinence. It really helps me understand it better. I think I would try to be too all or nothing if I attempted "abstinence." Maybe that is just me misunderstanding the whole concept, though. My biggest problem is doing away with the binge and trigger foods. I do try to avoid them, but they are in the house sometimes for other family members. I know I should eliminate having them in my house at all, but I want to learn to deal with the temptation of them being here since that is the reality for our household long-term. I have been doing much better lately avoiding my trigger foods. I just feel more motivated at the moment, which is something you just can't force, so I am thankful for the extra motivation for now. I hope and pray that it lasts!

saraphin: Thank you for the conversion formula from metric weight to pounds. That always confuses me, so it is good to know the conversion. It is actually pretty simple............. IF I have a calculator around! :lol:

Fi: I sure hope and pray that by the time you read this post, your pain has subsided. It just sounds so agonizing and I wish there was some way to get you relief. Please discuss this with your doctor at your face to face appointment on Wednesday. You have GOT to get some help for the physical pain you are experiencing!!! (I know that is often easier said than done, but I am really worried about you.) Be persistent and specific about your needs. Does he know how much pain you are in? Listen here now missy, YOU ARE NOT A "LOUSY PERSON"...... on this thread or anywhere else!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That is just a negative thought from the big bad devil :devil: trying to get you to give up!!! Don't pay any bit of attention to those negative thoughts!!! That is called "stinkin' thinking" and you need to ignore it!!! You are a worthwhile person, and you have already helped me in many ways in my weight loss journey by what you have shared in this group! You matter and your contribution to this group matters. I named it Ups & Downs for the very reason that I want members to feel free to express how they are really feeling, rather than feeling like you have to always post positives. Any of us who are overweight know very well about all of the downs that we experience. Please keep posting and don't worry how often you are down. We are here to help each other right where each of us is NOW in the journey! :hug: Please hang in there and discuss all of your feelings and pains with your shrink on Wednesday! He has to know how much you are suffering in order to adequately help you. Please also keep in close touch with us during this difficult time. I think it will help! BIG HUGS to you!!! :hug: :hug: :hug:

Hello :wave: to VermontMom, shr1nk1ngme, lilturtle, CDubsGotGoats, and everyone else!!! Please post when you can with an update about yourselves. I am listening and I care.

12-09-2013, 02:11 AM
BTW, Fi (and anyone else who wants to), you can call me Kathleen. ;)

12-09-2013, 01:46 PM
Hey everyone, sorry I have been off line! We have quite a bit of snow and cold, and my plate has been very full taking care of all the animals. Been eating ok, but have been feeling pretty down over the last week. Not a lot to report on right now, but I should have some time to really catch up with everyone tonight.


Fiona W
12-09-2013, 05:53 PM
Kathleen— Thanks so much for your name, and for all the suppor!

I'm hanging in here after a very rough weekend, depression-wise. I got in touch with my shrink, and we both agree that going off the Effexor wasn't a good idea, so back up some more on that med and hoping for the best. I had a small cup of my husband's muesli to help me sleep last night, but that doesn't count as emotional/binge-type eating. He's being really sweet to me. Right now he's gone out grocery shopping for me since I needed seltzer and cream (for my coffee) and the kind of turkey lunch meat I like. I'm really tired from all the depression pain. Last night he made me an omelet with smoked salmon and onions—almost as good as a bagel.

Thanks everyone else for all the support, too. I'm just too tired to write anymore today. Hang in there, Chelsea!

12-09-2013, 11:50 PM
Fi - so sorry you have had a tough, painful time!! :hug: and NO LOUSY PERSON words from you, missy :D

Kathleen - your weekend sounded great and you are too kewl to take a ride on the mechanical bull :devil: it's not that easy, is it! :rofl:

cDubs - what kind of animals do you have? (goats I assume?)

Hi saraphin, seabiscuit, and others! :wave: :hug:

I'm so glad that I haven't had a long depressive day in a long time. and I'm thinking back to last week, when I let myself get bothered by something minor and went back to bed but then made myself get up and then had the great shopping experience.

I've had a minor problem with a co-worker, she thinks that I should give some of my hours to her, and has vehemently talked to others about it, this is not a rational request and she is not always rational herself, sometimes she just ups and quits, then comes back; but the boss condones this so it just goes on. Anyway, I was dreading some days working with her, knowing that she is resenting me, especially that she is tiny and cute :rolleyes: well for heaven's sake she is also 21, I just can't let myself compare my body to a 21 yr. old! And her up and down behavior is just so upsetting to the workplace. You just don't know 'who' she will be that day. She obviously needs help.

I guess this girl is my only worry for now (besides my constant worrying about my appearance and weight) so I am pretty lucky I guess.

have a good night :hug:

12-10-2013, 04:08 AM
Hello Friends! Just a quick check in, since my dogs woke me in the middle of the night...... again! :yawn: I walked on the treadmill at the gym again today while my daughter worked out with the trainer. I walked 16 of my 40 minutes not holding on, and tonight I have the worst back pain. I assume it is because not holding on kicked in my core muscles that are....ahem.....very weak. I feel sore and fatigued all around my midsection and back. I work with the trainer in the morning and will get her opinion. Anyway, I bring this up because I imagine that the pain is similar to what Fi feels every afternoon with her physical pain from depression. It is agonizing for me right now. It makes me sad to imagine Fi feeling this way all the time. I so hope you can get some help with the pain at some point, Fi! I hated to hear that you had a very rough weekend, depression-wise. Some kind of relief just has to be in store for you soon! It sounds like your husband takes good care of you, too, which is wonderful! You deserve it! :hug:

Chelsea: I, too, am curious about what animals you take care of! Goats?!? I just love all animals, so I am very interested in hearing all about it. ;) I am sorry to hear that you have also been feeling down this past week. :( Hope things begin to look UP for you, soon!!! :angel:

Holly: Your image :rofl: is very accurate of me once that mechanical bull started to move! One big lunge to the side and off I went!!! :rofl: At least I lasted long enough to get a hilarious photo out of it. :D Your coworker sounds very immature and yes, like she needs some help. Sorry you have to put up with that crap! It must be difficult to maintain good spirits at work in her presence. Sounds like you are handling things pretty well, though. Just do your best to ignore her tantrums :tantrum: and petty behavior. Why in the world does she feel entitled to your hours anyhow?!? That is just weird! And the boss condoning such behavior as her ranting to others about it and quitting and coming back is just enabling and crazy! THAT would drive me insane!!! :crazy: Good luck working everything out! Glad you feel comfortable enough to post about it. I hope venting here helps just a little. :hug:

Well, I must get back to bed! Hope everyone else is okay! Please post when you can with an update! :wave:

12-10-2013, 08:56 AM
good morning, and just needed to note, Kathleen you are incredibly empathetic and supportive; and are able to show those feelings through wonderful writing :carrot: It is one thing to be so caring for people, and another gift to expressively put into words what you want; and you do both :) I do have people who care tons about me, but I don't always get what I feel is proper attention to my current rants :devil: I thank you so much for providing that to me!!

Yes my boss totally enables that behavior, because he doesn't want to have to hire someone else :?: Like I said, if she is my biggest worry right now, I'm on Easy Street.

LOL at your description on the bull! and congrats on doing part of your treadmill work without holding on..but real sorry about the pain! can it be relieved with ibuprofen or anything? Hope the trainer can tell you how long to rest/recover..because I will totally encourage you to continue on with that!! I do know having core strength is vital for everyday functional strength. I will be your cheerleader :cheer2:

Hello to everyone else :wave: hope everyone has a great day :) I am especially psyched because today is my Friday, I have Wed. and Thursdays off so I just need to 'get through' today. take care! (and watch out for ice, i slipped and fell on my side yesterday, at work, yes, that same boss does not sand the driveway)

*edit to add - I can slightly explain the co-worker feeling entitled to my hours...I work at this job from early November through late April, then I go to a different job, early May through October (have been doing this for over 10 years). This young girl was hired to fill in for me, knowing that I do return!! but she decided she didn't like those rules :rofl:

Fiona W
12-10-2013, 10:00 AM
Kathleen— I don't know if this will help you on the treadmill or not, gal, but I used to get lower back pain from walking until I learned a couple of tips: One is to contract your abdominals as you walk, continuously, because they will help support your spine so your back doesn't have to do all the work; and the other is to bend way forward, from the ankles, as you walk, so that your hips are carrying your upper body weight instead of it rocking back onto your lower spine. If you do both of those of those things, you should notice quickly that your back is less stressed. There's a really good book called Walk Yourself Well that I learned those and other tips from.

12-10-2013, 04:53 PM
Hi! Haven't checked in for a few days. My real name is Trish by the way. I am trying to get back on track with my diet. At first i just watched my calories, then I did Atkins. I hated Atkins. Now I am just trying to watch my calories again and pay attention to carbs. I've been back on my meds for a week now so there is some progress there. I have been having insurance problems getting outpatient treatment. It is frustrating. I need therapy to deal with some of my issues (including my weight and eating). I'm trying to hang in there. It has been a bit of a roller coaster the last couple weeks.

12-10-2013, 05:16 PM
Hello Support Buddies!

Holly: Thank you for your generous compliments. :o Empathy and writing about my feelings are two of my stronger suits, learned from experience. I appreciate your sentiments. ;) My pain was relieved some with over-the-counter meds. Then I got a massage today (weekly gift from hubby) and it really helped! Thank God! I was really feeling it from engaging those obviously weak back muscles! I will continue with working up on my times NOT holding on while walking on the treadmill, but my masseuse recommended working up a little slower than I have been, which makes better sense. That gives me little goals to aim for, which will keep my treadmill time interesting and fresh. Enjoy your Wednesday and Thursday off!!! :)

Fi: Thank you for the awesome tips for me while working on NOT holding on during some of my treadmill time! Makes sense and I will definitely try your ideas out next time I walk, along with working my times up more gradually. That should do the trick! ;) I love that you love self-help books as much as I do!!! :D I hope your Effexor is beginning to make a difference and that some of your pain is subsiding. I think about you now in the afternoons, and wish you well. Please let us know how your appointment with your shrink goes on Wednesday! Hoping and praying for some relief for you!

Trish: Happy to hear that you are back on your meds. Thanks for checking in! I hope that you will be able to get the outpatient treatment/therapy that you need. As you know, it is so important to your mental and overall health. I hate dealing with insurance companies! Wishing you the best and sending a BIG HUG!!! :hug:

:wave: Hello to everyone else! Please post an update when you can. Thanks!

12-10-2013, 08:28 PM
hi friends,

i am sorry to read so many stories of pain ,but by far, fiona, yours is the worst i think. what is depression pain, love? is it headaches? :(:(:(

i have severe nerve pain and i take methadone, lyrica and cymbalta - that also is for anxiety. i am stable atm. :):):)

i use mind control for my nerve pain because there is not a really good solution. i go THROUGH the pain and ignore it. "it's only pain" i tell myself. :o:o:o

i must get on my dreamill now actually, even though my foot hurts so much. it's ok. i just walk THROUGH it and i'm glad when i finish! :p:p:p

my weight has plateaued AGAIN (4th time in 14.5 kilo's) for TWO WEEKS. i'm stuck at 85.4 kilo's. :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy:

that's 187.88 pounds. you know there are calculators on you computer…just google one. unless you want me to convert for you. i don't mind really. especially since it's usually the SAME. aaaaarrrrgggghhhh. :^::^::^:

bfn, saraphin xxx

Fiona W
12-11-2013, 12:42 AM
Well now I'm confused. I was extremely depressed this afternoon and also craving carbohydrates—not cookies, just carbos—like crazy. So I broke down and had two generous helpings of my husband's muesli (mostly oats w/ a few raisins and a bit of added sugar). Then I took a nap and woke up... all better! No depression! The transformation was amazing!

So I started reading online about the whole neurotransmitter issue with people who are on the strict Atkins very low carb diet. 'Turns out that some people—especially women, especially people with a history of mood disorders, especially people prone to getting really low in the afternoon—in other words, me—are prone to getting depressed on Atkins. Not everyone, just a few people who are more "carbohydrate dependent."

So it's possible that the past 19 days of no binge (i.e., carbo-loading) behavior on my part may have set me up for this depression.

Or not. It may just be that the adjustment in my medications finally kicked in.

I'm quite tempted to add back in about 50 grams of carbs, around noon each day. What do y'all think? Will I still lose weight?

12-11-2013, 02:15 AM
Hello all..i found this site looking for help to lose weight. I am a fat vegetarian with bipolar and a recovered alcoholic. I quit drinking over 7 yrs ago and learned i had been self medicating for years. Since then my bipolar has progressed to chronic severe depression and some psychosis...yippie. and now i am 100 lbs overweight which greatly effects my mental and physical health.

I look forward to this journey. Today i am emotionally stable and hope to find support and motivation through following Your journeys. Many blessings!

Fiona W
12-11-2013, 03:19 AM
You've come to the right place, Becca, if you're looking for support on your weight loss journey and if you have issues with ups & downs in your mood. Wecome on board! Your avatar is beautiful...

12-11-2013, 02:43 PM
Fiona...that is interesting about carbs and depression. I'm going to look into that more. I didn't do well on Atkins. I'm back to jut watching my calories. I want to start eating smaller meals/snacks spread out throughout the day instead of one big meal and a late night snack.

Fiona W
12-11-2013, 04:24 PM
I'm so busy trying to catch up on the the things that I had to let slide during my depression, I don't have time for a long posting, but I just wanted to say: Wow! Adding in one muesli meal at noon has completely dissipated my depression pain, and I feel like a whole new woman. 'Turns out there are a lot of issues involved in the effect of insulin on serotonin in the brain, but I won't go into all that. But I do really appreciate all the support and concern from you folks here on Ups & Downs: they have been a comfort during my recent dark hours.

Trish— (Thanks for your name: I love the name Trish!) That's interesting that you didn't do well on Atkins. I felt like I was doing well physically, but obviously my emotional state really cratered, and I couldn't figure out why I kept craving carbos—not sweets actually, but things like whole wheat, oats, bran. My psychiatrist, whom I saw today, is well-versed in principles of Chinese medicine, and after hearing my detailed description of my depression pain (which is mostly in my chest), he said an earth element food, such as complex carbs, would be the suggested remedy. Anyway, Trish, what you say about dividing your daily allotment into several small meals makes a lot of sense. And CONGRATULATIONS on your 46 lb. loss so far! That's a lot of weight you're not havin' to carry around anymore! =smile=

12-11-2013, 06:41 PM
hi everyone :hug::hug::hug:

well well so much to take in. carb-loading? i think i've been doing some of that and i do agree there must be some sort of relationship because i get anxious and my DH says "have you eaten anything?" he knows me. when i eat, i feel better. not necessarily carb's though because i have avoided all carb's (hard to believe) for 13 weeks! :o:o:o

fiona...i'm relieved you feel better now. i don't know what to suggest here. i think do what your WHOLE body tells you. you'll have to decide for yourself. :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy:

i just changed phases with my diet program and i'm JUST on the RED GRAPH LINE to reach my goal weight by the date i set (may 22). :):):)

still no carb's though. but i'm going to start eating 1 small fruit a day. after NO fruit for 13 weeks - that will be something! also i used to eat 5 fruits a day before when i was enormous so um…WRONG. :(:(:(

becca - welcome :hug:

thanx kathleen and trish, for your names! :hug: :hug:

trish - do hang in there…we are your friends here :hug:

hi holly, cdubs :hug:

look! i had a whoosh! :carrot::carrot::carrot:

12-11-2013, 09:16 PM
Wow, it's great to see so much action on this thread today! Thanks to those who posted. I had a rotten day, but I finally have a chance to just sit down and relax a bit, so it just got better! ;) The day started well. Hubby invited me to meet him for breakfast, which was nice. Afterward, I went shopping for workout pants and jeans. BIG MISTAKE!!! After trying on a bunch of jeans, I was thoroughly disgusted and depressed about the condition of my body. :o Old familiar sizes didn't fit anymore, so I am obviously getting bigger. :cry: I had been feeling good about working out consistently recently and getting started with a trainer. I am not good at waiting to see results. I want instant gratification. So when I found out my old size didn't fit, I could have sobbed right there in the store. The negative thoughts began attacking my mind, and I fought like crazy (in my mind) to push them away. I kept thinking to myself, "You are taking steps to make things better. Keep it up and it will pay off." But the negatives just flooded into my consciousness and I felt like.......... I'll just say it............. a fat pig. :cry: I am trying very hard to treat myself better and I know that my inner child doesn't like to be called names like "fat" or "pig" so ~ at the same time ~ I felt ashamed for thinking that. Shame on top of depression = not a good combination. Anyway, I did manage to find some bigger pants that will work for now, so at least the shopping trip was productive. Next, I went to a sporting good store to look for XL workout pants that weren't too long, since I am short. I had to settle for capris, which are almost full-length on me, so that will have to do, but I barely fit into XL sweat pants. They didn't even carry "women's" (above XL) athletic tops. I asked the lady, "Aren't big women like me the ones who really need workout clothes?!? Why don't they make big workout clothes???" She said that she gets asked that at least once a day. Anyway, I will probably look online for some athletic shirts that might fit me. Then, I went home and ate a quick healthy lunch, but felt even bigger. I had to go to my dermatologist for an annual check-up (because I've had basal cell carcinomas). I didn't want ANYONE looking at my huge body, so I thought about cancelling the appointment. Well, thank God I didn't, because I had a small, suspicious looking red spot, which he scraped off to biopsy and then froze the area. He said it looks like a superficial basal cell (precancerous) carcinoma. If it is only precancerous, as he suspects, I won't need to do anything else. If it comes back as cancerous, he will treat things differently (probably cut more out and get another biopsy). I am not too worried about it, but it is just one more damn thing to think about and my mind is already fried! :( Then, I had two more places to be after picking my daughter up from school...... and finally, I am home. Just trying to process the day and still keep from feeling defeated in the weight category. I am really struggling to let the positive thoughts drown out all of the negative ones that still threaten to bombard me now. :dizzy:

rocketbecca: :welcome3: to our group Ups & Downs! So happy that you posted. I hope you will find support for your weight loss journey here. Congratulations on not drinking for over 7 years ~ one day at a time!!! That is so awesome!!! My brother is a recovering alcoholic with 23 years sobriety. I am so very proud of him. I hope you are proud of yourself! I am also diagnosed bipolar. Have only had one typical manic episode years ago, but I think that my mania is often exhibited in agitation and irritability. I went through a LONG period of depression years ago, too, after the death of one of our newborn twins and finding out our next child would be handicapped. After many years of therapy and several medications later, I am at a much better place in my life. I still struggle to function and be productive on a daily basis, though. My weight skyrocketed when I got on anti-psychotic meds, and I am still struggling to get the weight off. Somewhere in there, I became addicted to food, so that is a problem for me now as well. I currently have a lot on my plate, but I am determined to lose this daggone weight once and for all. I was thinking today that, rather than thinking about losing 75 pounds, I am going to approach this as losing 5 pounds 15 times. That feels a bit more doable to me, I think. Regardless, I am NOT giving up on myself. Today was a setback/relapse for me in my thinking, but I am working on my thinking tonight. I will get back in the swing of things soon. I also plan to walk on the treadmill after I write here, so that should help me to get refocused.

Can you tell us a little more about HOW your weight has affected your mental and physical health. I feel the same, so I am just curious about your perspective. You don't have to answer that if you aren't comfortable with it. No pressure intended at all! Just interested in your story! ;) Again, thank you for posting. I look forward to getting to know you better! :hug:

Trish (lilturtle): I think it is a great idea for you to focus on eating several smaller meals/healthy snacks throughout the day, rather than one big meal and a late-night snack. It will be good for your metabolism to know that food can be counted on, so that it won't go into starvation mode. Let us know how that goes for you. I sure wish you the best! Any luck with the insurance company for outpatient therapy yet? I think that is critical for you, too, so be persistent! ;)

Fi (Fiona W): Wow, what a breakthrough you have had about depriving your body of carbs. So interesting! I am so happy that you may have realized what was causing you so much pain, so that you can avoid it in the future. I say TRY the 50 grams of carbs around noon each day and see how it affects your weight, if that is what you are inclined to do. You can always decrease the amount of carbs or stop if you find it makes your weight go up. Maybe you just need that "in the meantime" while the Effexor kicks back in. Trial and error, I say! You know you best, though, so follow your gut and/or ask your doctor. How did your shrink appointment go today?

saraphin: I am so sorry to hear about your severe nerve pain. That sounds awful! :( Better for your weight to plateau than go up, as mine keeps doing. You will get back to losing weight when your body is ready. We can't force these things, unfortunately! You are so strong to just force yourself THROUGH the nerve pain and the foot pain on the treadmill. That is very difficult to do. I wish you could get relief!!! Do you think you have fibromyalgia? My mother-in-law had it and my sister-in-law has it, so I know that it causes a lot of pain. I am just curious if that is what you might have, too. :?: I am not trying to scare you; just trying to help. I hate the thought of you just having to ENDURE the pain! :( Do the meds you are on help at all?

Hoping to hear from Chelsea (CDubGotGoats), Holly (VermontMom), and shr1nk1ngme soon! How are you ladies?

Fiona W
12-12-2013, 10:20 AM
Kathleen— The words "fat pig" should go into the same garbage can as "lousy person": never to be used again!! Never! =smile=

12-12-2013, 11:07 AM
Kathleen - so sorry about the crummy shopping experience!! we all have gone through that I guess, it is sucky :( and those damn self-defeating thoughts!! I'm glad that you consciously tried very very hard to knock those thoughts out, during the crisis. and OMG at the test results, but so glad you are keeping on top of it!

Fi - very wonderful that you made that carb-related discovery , to help you so much!

Trish - Hi :wave

sapaphin - YAY to your whoosh!! :cheer2:

welcome to rocketbecca!

I feel pretty good, however I did spend most of the morning yesterday in bed; not particularly sad or anything, just no ambition to get up! (geez I did the same thing last week too) Today is my second day off of the week so I do need to get things done today that i put off yesterday. And I stripped the bed as soon as I got up, for laundry, so i would not be tempted to fall back into bed! haha tricking myself! :devil:
:hug: to all

12-12-2013, 01:13 PM
Hi everyone!! I'm doing pretty good mood wise (maybe getting a lil hypomanic). The inurance company is still giving me problems for treatment. I am not doing good on my eating small meals yet today. I've been up for a little over an hour and I haven't eaten yet. I thought I would get some tasks done first but I am really hungry. I might go grab an apple here in a minute. Starting in the new year I am going to add exercise to my routine by going to the pool and walking.

12-12-2013, 03:17 PM
Hi Everyone!

Its late, but WELCOME Saraphin and Becca!

Fi- I am glad to hear that you are starting to feel better in the afternoons! I also hide in the dark. Something you may consider for an afternoon pick up is a light box. They come in different price ranges, and sometimes insurance will help cover the cost. They are especially helpful through the winter when we are not getting enough sunlight; Do you take a vitamin D supplement? My new doctor also recommended incorporating flax into my daily diet, he said it is also very helpful for depression. You have been so helpful and encouraging to me! All of the information that you have provided have helped me to change the way that I have been thinking about food, and your collages have inspired me to start working on art projects again!! It has been YEARS since I have been motivated to art. I hope that your afternoon snack and your med adjustment continue to help you feel better, and remember any time you feel lousy about yourself that we all feel GREAT about you! Always thinking good thoughts for you.

Kathleen - How great that you got to get out of the house and have some personal time with your hubby :) We don't have kids but we do have a room mate right now, and it is amazing how nice it feels to have some time just for the two of us. How great that you have been able to do more of your treadmill work without holding on!! That is great progress! Shopping is so hard, I always avoid it as much as possible for the same reason. BUT I am so impressed that you are still able to keep your perspective from becoming immersed in the "stinkin thinkin" (that is one of my favorite phrases) and that you are able to remember that it is a process that will take time. Another thing to keep in mind is that as your muscle develops with exercise, you may gain weight before you lose some. But it is good, your body is just becoming more able to support itself, which will in the long run make it easier for you to lose the weight. Keep the good thoughts!!

Holly - Your garden sounds wonderful! I am so excited to put in my garden in the spring. I am sorry about your co-worker, she sounds like a brat. Way to keep a good perspective :)

Trish - I am so happy to hear that you are thinking of eating smaller meals more often instead of just one big meal. Smaller meals will also help to shrink your stomach so that you will feel full and satisfied more easily. Something that is really important when trying to eat less overall is breakfast!! If you eat a little oatmeal(or whole wheat toast, some kind of *complex* carb) and a protein, then you will probably feel better until lunch, and won't feel like eating so much later in the day either. You are still in my thoughts, I hope something works out with your insurance soon.

Overall I have been doing ok, but have been feeling some anxiety pains in my chest and a little pre-panic feeling behind my eyes, but they haven't been to severe. It has been giving me really terrible acid reflux though, which I haven't had in a while. My upset stomach has been encouraging eating, which is not good, but it is also not working to stop the heartburn and sick feeling any more so I have kind of stopped wanting to eat for the most part. I am kind of torn about it, because the celexa really helped my anxiety but it also caused a lot of weight gain and also destroyed my intimate life with my partner. I don't want to increase my dosage again since it stopped treating my depression a long time ago, and I like my new med better. I think I will try prilosec again and see if it helps my stomach out. The anxiety I will try to deal with by getting back into a meditation and breathing routine that worked fairly well before. If it continues to increase I guess I will talk to my dr. about finding a different med.

In other news, my nerve problems are carpal tunnel that recently has been much more painful with full hand numbness sometimes going up to my shoulders, and waking multiple times a night, and also at least one pinched nerve in my back that come from a long ago injury. Occasionally I have sciatic pain from when I was hit by a car, but not as often now. It takes something pretty physically stressful to set that off.
Holly, Kathleen - I raise goats, meat rabbits, and geese and in the spring will be bringing home some chickens and two kinds of ducks, one for meat and one for eggs. I also have plans to get a sheep when some pasture space opens up at my neighbors in a few years. We also have two dogs(a pyrenees mix, and a heeler mutt) and two wonderful kitties, and one scorpion. I share a garden with my neighbor, and am learning to butcher my own meat(my animals are well cared for and treated humanely, and I love each and every one of them!), grow and preserve my own food, make my own soap(everyone can have some when I get it down, if you like) and cheese, and am really excited to sustain myself and my family with minimal outside purchases. As with weight loss, it is a process and will take time but every step is a little closer.

Sorry for the rant :) I really feel blessed and joyful about the life that I get to live right now, and in spite of my depression sneaking in and weighing me down occasionally.

Good, strong, thoughts to everyone!

12-12-2013, 06:07 PM
thank you for your posts everyone, i have had a lovely time here, with you, and coffee. cdubs what a marvellous life you have! i too love animals and i would have a lot more if DH would let me LOL

already we have 3 dogs and a cat who lives in the garden shed. i'm no good with biurds. we can't have anything else because the dogs are so protective of me, well, you see, they justy about kill anything that tries to come into our yard! LOL. :carrot::carrot::carrot:

we have a lovely garden and io'm not that well, so DH pays for a cleaner each week for me as it is. i have to do NOTHING> what a life eh? :hug::hug::hug:

DH said all he wants is a 'healthy wife' so all i have to concentrate on is getting better. nice huh? :):):)

so i losing weight and DH is thrilled along with me.

except today. grr . my scales are the problem. grr. :mad::mad::mad:

thewy put me BACK UP TO WHERE I HAVE BEEN FOR 2 WEEKS> grrr. grrr. :devil::devil::devil:

not happy. :mad::mad::mad:

thasnk you for your kindness, tyhough, people. i get so much from reading about your lives anfd from sharing my life. thanx again.

who was it that recommended swap-bot for me? was it someone from here? i forget and i so want to THANK them for my new hobby. it's brilliant.


12-13-2013, 12:19 AM
Today was a better day. Started with an 8:30 am workout with my trainer. Then did a bunch of errands, went to hubby's office Christmas luncheon, and then out with friends tonight to celebrate our birthdays. Busy but fun day! I am exhausted right now, but I just wanted to be sure to check in before I go to sleep! Tomorrow we are headed to Cleveland to get my daughter fitted for new AFO (leg) braces, so we will be gone most of the day. I will check in tomorrow evening. Until then, wishing everyone well and waving hello! :wave:

Fiona W
12-13-2013, 01:26 AM
I had a surprising moment in the Co-op grocery store today: I was waiting for the office to approve my exchange of Familia muesli w/ sugar added for the kind with no sugar, and just as they handed my box to me, I realized that I had been standing right next to the basket of my favorite huge organic cookies, and hadn't even given them a glance. And I knew that's where they were always located, on the shelf in front of the office, because oh boy, I used to binge on those puppies: I used to buy like half the basket at once. I just can't believe it, how quickly my binge behavior has gone away...even with my adding the carbos to my diet, I only think of them as a daily serving of muesli, not anything else!

saraphin— Gosh, you're such a sweet woman: I really smile when I read your postings! Sorry to hear about your scale problems: that's why I only weigh myself once a month—I just can't take the effect it has on my mood any more often that that. Yes, that was me who recommended swap-bot to you...I'm so glad you're starting to swap! Before you know it, you'll be making crafty-type things, even artworks. There are so many welcoming swaps for beginners at any kind of project. But the mail itself is what makes it so much fun. =warm grin=

Chelsea— Thanks so much for your cheerful support, and I am thrilled to hear that my collages have inspired you to get back into making art! I look forward to your posting links to your work some day. That carpal tunnel stuff doesn't make it easy to use your hands, though: I know, because I have been there! I first got on the Internet back in the 1980s, and my very non-ergonomic computer setup meant I had bad carpal tunnel in both hands starting in 1990. I eventually got the height of my keyboard lowered and even bought a wonderful split keyboard, which helped a lot. But you know what finally solved the problem for me? I got the carpal-tunnel-release surgery done in 2000—the non-invasive kind where they go through a tiny incision in your wrist. I got my right hand done first, then my left, and I swear to you, I have had zero problems ever since, even after 10 years of nerve damage. And no scars whatsoever. I know it's a big step—I was scared myself—but you might want to think about it. Oh, and thanks so much for your tips about the light box and Vitamin D: I have a light like that, and it's even set up on a table, but I fell out of the habit of using it when I got my iPad. I also have some Vit. D that I'm not taking—duh! I do try to get in the sun when I can, but the DC area isn't big on sun in the winter. I'll go for the light box and the Vit. D starting tomorrow, and I'll read up on flax.

Trish— The trick with eating those small meals is to eat when you're just a little bit hungry, and then stop when you're just a little bit full. One book I read suggested that you learn to rate your hunger on a scale from 0 when you're neither hungry or full, to -1 when you're just barely feeling some hunger sensations, all the way down to -10 when you're extremely ravenous. And similarly you rate your fullness from +1 when you have just a teensy bit of fullness in your stomach, all the way up to +10 when you're absolutely stuffed to the gills. The book said you should sit down for a small meal, even just an apple, when you're at -2 level of hungry, and then stop eating when you're +2 level of full. I find that I tend to eat more from -3 to +3, but I'm still learning the technique. If you're only a little bit hungry, you'll be able to cut up the apple into slices and put them on a plate, and you'll find that it's easier to stop when you're just a little bit full that way. It takes some practice to learn how to stop and put the rest of the food away for later. Good luck!

Holly— I know what you mean about those days when you can't even lift a finger. If you work hard, gal, you may need that one day a week that's completely blotto. Thanks so much for all your kind supportive postings during my depression! Praise be to the Goddess that it was only a short one, and that I was able to listen to my body when it said, "Don't binge, just have a serving of complex carbs—right now, if not sooner!"

Kathleen— I don't know whether you've already found all the workout clothes you need, but I have an online recommendation for you: Junonia ( They've been specializing in all kinds of different athletic and casual apparel for medium-sized to larger women for quite a few years now. I'm a satisfied customer! At least pick up the phone, call 'em, and have 'em send you a catalog. Say, I really appreciate your empathetic postings during my depression: they made a serious difference. As for my appointment with my shrink, well I already mentioned—to Trish, I think it was—the interesting bit: after hearing my description of my depression pain, which starts in my chest right under my breast bone, feels like hot coals, and eventually radiates out my arms & legs like a raging fire, my shrink said that according to Chinese medicine, the recommendation would be to add more complex carbohydrates to my diet. Amazing, huh, that my body said it wanted muesli?! I feel so fortunate to have a shrink who's versed in both Western and Eastern techniques. It's also possible, of course, that adding back the Effexor did the trick, but it happened so dramatically, and immediately, after that bowl of muesli, I'm convinced that the change in my diet was responsible.

Gosh, it's late...I need to go take my nightly stab (usually unsuccessful) at getting to sleep at a reasonable hour...see y'all later!

12-13-2013, 01:41 AM
Wow i never expected anyone to notice my post. I try hard to be invisible. I dont wear colorful clothes. Ive given up on makeup and nice shoes. And i was such an outgoing girly girl. So yeah my weight has a major impact on my life and mental state.

Im going to be honest. I was one of those perfect skinny *****es throughout my 20s. I lost pregnancy weight quickly both times. And...i openly made fun of fat people. They disgusted me. I always thought they were just lazy. Why cant they put on some running shoes? Yeah i was mean.

I mention this because of my alcholism recovery. Lots of people dont understand that putting down the bottle requires more than just least it did for me. So i think my weight problem is probably similar. And my bipolar / chronic depression is closely tied into all of it. Now i am the ugly lazy fat ***. I am that chick walking down the road that has "a long walk." I have come to hate looking in mirrors. I have one pair of pants and only a few shirts. I am embarrassed to go clothes shopping. An ugly person like me dpesnt deserve nice clothes..maybe when im pretty again..
This is the sort of crap that rolls around in my head all day every day. I am ashamed. And..that is how my weight and bipolar effect my life. Pls dont feel sry for me. I just hope that if anyone ever feels the same they can see that i too suffer and it is a disease poisoning our minds.

Fiona W
12-13-2013, 10:42 AM
Becca— I'll respond to your posting in more detail later on, but right away I want to say: you deserve some new clothes, girl! You should get yourself at least one new outfit that you look fabulous in, because you are still a beautiful woman. Here's a list of places to go shopping. ( I personally really like Making It Big, but I'm a good bit older than you (I'm 58), so their stuff may be too conservative for you. A lot of folks on 3 Fat Chicks like Torrid. And be sure to check out We Love Your Peaches!

Why am I saying you should get yourself a new outfit or two? Because feeling good about yourself—self-acceptance and self-love—is an essential first step on your weight loss journey. Weight loss is something you will give as a gift to your body, because you love yourself.

We are here to support you in every positive way we can, Becca, during the ups & downs of your weight loss journey. We are not here to feel sorry for you: don't worry about that.

Gotta go... I'll say more later...

12-13-2013, 02:28 PM
Becca- I have had a similar experience, and Fi's advice is GOLDEN! Once I bit the bullet and decided to buy new clothes that fit well and were cute, I felt SOO MUCH BETTER!!! No more awkward lumps or uncomfortable squished spots! Being comfortable and confident in my clothes really helped me feel better in my own skin.
If you know your size, shopping online is really great because there is no fitting room to squish into, no one is watching you. If you are not sure about your size, a lot of online shops have really good exchange policies as well, so if you find something you like, you get a chance to try it on and see how you feel in it.
Beauty is about your brains, your compassion and your choices, not about your size. You are definitely not alone, and you are a BEAUTIFUL woman.

Fi - Congrats on day 21, and BIG CONGRATULATIONS on your mental shift about those cookies! As a fellow cookie monster, that is a huge accomplishment and something to be so proud of! Yay!

12-13-2013, 02:49 PM
Fiona thanks for the suggestion with the ratings. I am going to try it along with going back to keeping a food journal. I can write them both down that way.

Becca I am in recovery too. It was never a matter of willpower for me. I don't really follow a 12 step model but it is something I have to work at every day.

I am still not eating right. I did better yesterday. I ate three small meals sort of spaced out. Not exactly where I want to be. My dinner could have been a healthier choice. Today it is 1:45pm and I still haven't eaten anything. I am rushing to get stuff done and stressed about something. I guess tomorrow is a new day.

12-13-2013, 04:22 PM
So are all of you working to lode weight / be more healthy / feel confident? I mean it all goes together but what are you working toward and how?

12-13-2013, 06:30 PM
Becca: I love Fi's response to you and I wholeheartedly agree with her! It sounds like you have the same "stinkin' thinkin'" going on in your mind that I fight constantly. I have actually become much better at catching myself in the act of treating myself badly. Then, the next step is that I need to restate what I am thinking in a positive way. For example, when I was trying on clothes the other day and thought, "I have been working out a lot and I still look and feel like a fat pig." I immediately caught myself thinking in a way that does not serve me well (I know all too well from so much past experience), so I rephrased the thought in my head, "I am doing what I need to do now by working out consistently, so I am headed in the right direction. My hard work will pay off!" Except, I was being bombarded all at once with tons of negative thoughts, so I was literally sorting them out in my mind and rephrasing things to myself. This was all while I walked around Kohl's. I was in a zone and wondered if anyone could tell that I was having a mental spar with myself in my mind as I tried on athletic shoes and walked through the building. I just want to be "normal" sized again. It makes so much stuff so much easier, especially clothes shopping. I agree with Fiona that YOU DESERVE some nice clothes that fit you well....... no matter what size you are!!! I hope you will consider buying at least one or two new outfits from one or more of those places Fi listed. It would make you feel so much more comfortable in public and just in your own skin, as someone noted. I often think to myself that I don't want to get too comfortable in extra big clothing so that I don't stay at the larger sizes, but ~ whenever I break down and buy stuff that actually fits (IF I can find it), I feel so much better about myself when I go out. I have decided that I am worth investing in at my current size and I will invest in a new wardrobe as I lose the weight, too! It can get expensive, but it is necessary for me and worth every penny. I do admit feeling a bit wasteful and shame myself a bit, thinking that I "shouldn't" have to do this (buy so many sizes of clothes), but I try hard to ignore those negative voices. I took the advice of many people and gave away all of my "fat clothes" after I lost 35+ pounds on Jenny Craig 3-4 years ago ("so that going back to them wouldn't be an option") and I am just now breaking down and buying a lot of "big" clothes again for each season. I feel wasteful to a certain degree, but it just "is what it is" right now. I do not feel sorry for you, but it makes me sad to hear you talking so disrespectful to and about yourself. Have you ever tried writing with your NON-dominant hand to get in touch with your inner child? You might think it is nuts, but I am here to tell you that it works. What I have learned from it (for better or for worse) is that the little girl inside of me is extremely pissed off at me for treating her so poorly. She doesn't trust me and is very reluctant to even talk to me. I forget to do this very often (I think because it is emotionally stressful for me), but ~ when I do ~ I always learn quite a lot. It is helpful for me to know that my inner child is mad at me, because then I know why I often rebel against myself and seem to sabotage myself. Then, I can deal with it. You may want to try it if you never have. If you are interested and NOT familiar with it, I will tell you more about it. Just let me know. Thank you for sharing more about yourself with the group. As Fi said, we are here to SUPPORT you in any and every way that we can!!! And YOU ARE WORTH IT!!! YOU DESERVE TO BE HAPPY, TOO!!! :hug:

Chelsea: So happy to hear from you lately!!! Sorry that you suffer from so much carpal tunnel pain that it wakes you up in the middle of the night! :( It sounds like Fi sure had good luck with the surgery she had for her carpal tunnel. I hope you will at least consider it and talk to your doctor about it. Regardless, good luck in dealing with the pain. That has to be frustrating, too! Happy to hear that you treat your precious animals humanely. They deserve it! ;) I am a serious animal lover!!! I could never pet an animal one day and then butcher it the next. Just don't have it in me. If I saw them die :o, I would most likely be a vegetarian. Feel guilty about THAT sometimes, too! Yep, a lot of guilt swirling around in this busy mind!!! :dizzy: I learned shame and guilt very well from my upbringing, unfortunately. :( It is so difficult to UNlearn it, too. It feels like it pumps through my body and mind along with my blood. That's how embedded in me it is. :( BUT: I have made a lot of progress and I will NOT give up on treating myself better ~ one day at a time! :D

saraphin: It sounds like you are a major animal lover, too! I love it! :D Glad to see you posting. How are you doing today?

Fi: Thank you for the link to Junonia clothing and for posting all of the other "big women's" apparel companies, too! That is very helpful as I search for athletic clothes and cute bigger clothes in general. I love one of the coats I just saw there and might just have to participate in some shop therapy tonight! ;) You are a wealth of information for this group and I really appreciate that you always take the time to list things out for us and post links. You are one thoughtful and smart lady, I can already tell! :) I am so happy to read that your shrink was able to help you with his recommendations. Relief for Fi = HOORAY!!! :D

Trish: Hey, at least it sounds like you are making a bit of PROGRESS in eating more small meals throughout the day. You have mentioned more than once about having been up for hours and not yet eating. I would recommend that you really focus on eating something within an hour of waking up to get your metabolism started and to "break" the "fast" (breakfast) that your body had during the night. This is crucial for weight loss. Otherwise, your metabolism will slow down and go into starvation mode. Not good for your body. Just try to focus on little gradual changes. Otherwise, you might get overwhelmed. Little changes eventually add up to positive results over time if you keep them up! YOU CAN DO IT!!! :D

Holly: How are you? Hope things are well with you! :hug:

12-13-2013, 08:50 PM
Fi, thank you for sharing your experience with CTR surgery. Since this really just started recently, I am hoping to be able to work with my acupuncturist and vigilance to relieve what I am experiencing, but I am really glad to hear that it was so helpful for you. It is nice to know that if it gets to that point I have a *good* option, not just the last option. We get very little sun here in the winter, so our doctors are well versed in ways to get a little afternoon pick me up. North-Western Oregon is one of the SAD-est places in the country ;)

Kathleen, I love animals! My partner has to constantly tell me no... If I could I would rescue every sad critter I came across. It really is hard to process the rabbits since they are so fuzzy, but with how meat is processed in the "industry" these days I have a very hard time eating anything that I can't get from a friend or neighbor or raise myself. This way I know that the meat I get is treated well while it is alive, and free from any hormones/excess anti-biotics/other weird stuff. We always give the animal a little word of appreciation before it goes too :) Were you raised catholic? Every one of my friends who was raised catholic, whether or not the practice still, struggles with unnecessary/excessive guilt. Catholic or not, dropping the burden of guilt is so difficult. I would consider it up there with smoking, and very few people I know that quit smoking ever really quit for good. I love to hear from you that you redirect your thoughts to the positive, it really helps! It is one of my favorite practices and has really helped me through some difficult times. So much of what we do is habit. Keep your beautiful chin up and keep catching yourself when you have those negative thoughts!

Becca, My goals right now are to lose weight, but mostly my focus is on cutting out simple carbohydrates and smaller portion sizes so that my diet consists more of healthy foods and less pie... I am also trying to change the way that I think about food, and exercise more. With the weather as it has been around here I haven't really been on top of it. Trying to get motivated to do more now that the ice is melting off, and eat less warm bread-y comfort food.
Trish, it is great to hear that you are making progress with changing the way that you are eating. Little steps are key to making it to your goal. Have you considered morning meditations or breathing exercises? They can be especially helpful if you wake up with anxiety(I used to wake up with panic attacks multiple times a week). Even 10 minutes a day can help re-direct your mental and physical energy. Maybe it could help get your head in a good place for your day? Keep taking those steps, you are going in a really good direction and we are thinking of you!

Holly, Sometimes it just seems like bed is the best place to be! Some weeks too...Even when you aren't feeling bad, mental illness is exhausting! This last weekend was very bed oriented for me also. That was a good thought to take the sheets off, I'm going to try that :D

So, the last couple of days I have been having a lot of anxiety. I had a good appt. with my acupuncturist today, and I am trying out a new supplement to help out with anxiety. I am still hoping that I won't have to increase my celexa or start a new pharmaceutical. My acupuncturist is versed in herbal and pharmaceutical medicine and treats many other bipolar clients, so no need to worry about dangerous interactions! Hopefully we can get me to a point where I have the energy I need and not the anxiety, so I can continue to work on stopping the celexa. I forget, does anyone else here take bupropion? I will check back through the threads, but would like to hear how it works for you; specifically if you are also bipolar.

Thanks all,

12-14-2013, 10:14 AM
I am so sorry not to have time to address each of you wonderful chicks personally this morning..just it is so wonderful to communicate with you all :hug:

I MUST give a hurrah to CDubs (chelsea?) I am SO impressed that you are able to raise, then humanely butcher your meat, after honoring and loving them. I have always felt like a hypocrite (there's that guilt, haha) by just buying meat all cleanly wrapped up in the store..feeling guilt on how those animals were possibly treated but all I do is are a true being of the Earth that you do that!

that is all for now but I hope all of you can have a good day with minimal if any bad feelings :)

(let's BANISH that stinkin' thinking!!! :p: devil: )

12-14-2013, 09:30 PM
hi everyone' thanks for posting your thoughts and well-wishes. you are all so supportive, yet you need so much support. :hug::hug::hug:

i read all of your posts, carefully, and i pay each word the respect it deserves. although i can't always find the time to go back through and post individually, i do think of everything you lovely people have said! :hug::hug::hug:

now having said that i want to tell you that i have a rule. i learned it from a friend years ago and i have never forgotten it and i think of it often:


got it?

ok then

i have lost another 100 grams..i think i need to buy a pretty dress for xmas day if i can find one, tomorrow. :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy:

and i will remember the rule when iu am trying on dresses! :):):)

yes, i love my pets. they are my children now . now that my real children have grown and are living their own lives. i miss them so much - they are in another city and i don't see them very often unfortunately. i think i will need to go over again soon. like now! :o:o:o

but i will have to let them know that i have no money to give them. one always wants...the other never wants, i just want to give! :carrot::carrot::carrot:


i soo want to go now that i have started to talk about it grrr :(:(:(

i can't afford it though. oh well, what can i do? nothing, really. not since i cut up my credit cards and closed those accounts…the best thing because i can't be trusted around a credit card! lol :carrot::carrot::carrot:

ber happy, you are allowed to choose it you know, until tomorrow friends, saraphin

Fiona W
12-15-2013, 12:35 AM
I feel like I'm coming down with a cold or something, so just a short note tonight. I'm doing great diet-wise, and delighted to be free of emotional/compulsive eating. Comfort and joy, and good health to you all!

12-15-2013, 02:26 AM
Fi: Way to go on 23 days binge-free!!! :cb: That is wonderful! Keep up the great work! ;) I visited the Junonia website and ordered a few more workout shirts and a parka coat! Thanks again for the link! ;)

Chelsea: Yes, you guessed it, I was raised Catholic! I am actually still a very strong practicing Catholic, but my entire notion of God and Catholicism is different/healthier now than when I was a child. I blame my parents, not Catholicism, for the guilt and shame that was passed on to me. Unfortunately, it is now my responsibility to continue to let go of the shame and guilt that piled up over a lifetime. I will get there! :) My husband and I share a very strong faith, which has been seriously tested during our lives together. Our strong faiths have seen us through many difficult times and ~ along with the suffering ~ we have also experienced some serious miracles along the way. :sunny: We feel very blessed that our paths crossed and that we reinforced in one another the best of our Catholic faith. I could seriously write a book based on our experiences!

Holly: Thanks for checking in! Here's to banishing the stinkin' thinkin'...... once and for all!!! :cheers:

saraphin: Congrats on losing 100 more grams! Good for you! And I love your rule to NEVER PUT YOURSELF DOWN!!! :D Thanks for sharing! ;)

Trish, Becca, and sh1nk1ngme: How are you ladies? Please post and let us know!

Fiona W
12-15-2013, 06:25 PM
Oooooo I had a really close call last night on the emotional eating front, but I managed to squeak through with my streak intact. What happened was, my husband Bob and I were talking as we were getting ready to go to bed, and something I was saying about how moderate exercise elevates one's mood got Bob all defensive (because his agoraphobia has him housebound these days) and he more or less bit my head off. Normally I would have protested and we'd have had a chance to clear the air, but right after Bob's outburst, he put his head on the pillow and promptly fell asleep! I mean, one second he was making me feel terrible, and the next second he was snoring.

So I went downstairs all in a storm of feeling treated unjustly (which, I should add, Bob rarely does). I was irritable anyway from feeling like I was coming down with a virus, so I was really mad. Anger, I have discovered in the past few months, is my biggest trigger for having an episode of emotional/compulsive/binge-type eating. And it's especially dangerous for me to get angry on a Friday or a Saturday night, when our local Starbucks drive-through window is open all night long. Even though it was like 2 o'clock in the morning, I could very easily have popped in my car and gone and binged on those big Starbucks oatmeal raisin cookies I love so much, with a vente-size caramel macchiato to boot! I swear, y'all, my right hand had already picked up the car keys before I caught myself. =whew=

So what I did first was to practice Kathryn Hansen's Brain Over Binge technique of separating yourself from the urge to overeat, where you view the urge as what she calls "neurological junk" from a lower part of your brain that you, the person in charge, choose to ignore—not fight, just ignore. That got my head considerably clearer and allowed me to put the car keys down.

And then I quietly and deliberately fixed myself a small serving (1/2 cup) of muesli. Yes, the same magic healing muesli that brought me out of my recent depression. This may sound silly, but it was like that little bit of carbs served as an escape valve for my overheated brain. I ate the muesli slowly, concentrating on every bite, then went to bed.

Now I'm not counting that small serving of muesli as emotional (binge) eating: rather, it was an emergency measure to help prevent emotional eating.

So that's my scary tale of rage running amok... =laugh= Oh, and the virus I thought I had seems to have disappeared.

12-15-2013, 09:31 PM
fiona you are getting clever

i am in a bad way now the day is terrible so far. horrible kids running amok in the service centre, then the boy got my registration preferences wrong which caused me to have the wrong deal on my plates so it's completely stuffed up my xmas present fromDH. (don't ask) my breakfast muck spilt all over the table, the floor, oh gosh, it is not ending so far. i don't feel well.

then the traffic was awful, the mail cost me a fortune, i got hot and bothered. the i madec a huge mistake and rang my son.

well he is an alcoholic and his life is always a mess and has always been - he's 35. anyway he has hjad about 20 jobsb (really) in 18 months and it's never his fault thart he gets fired.

also it's never his fault anything that goes wrong, goes wrong.

also i always get sworn at. he swears at me rather badly every phone call anmd hangs up. the f… word. i upset him so i feel guilty.

it's always my fault for 'digginfg'. i try to help him because he tells me he is in trouble. but i get it wrong and he loses his temper over it. now this is my fault.

me thinks not.

but what can i do? it's AWAYS the same no matter WHAT i say to him, it's wrong. he doesn't show me any respect or love yet he tells me how much i mean to him.

i'm very upset right now.


12-16-2013, 01:53 PM
Not much going on here. Still chugging along. Saturday night I found myself wanting to eat out of boredom. I'm still not doing great with small regular meals. It's almost 1pm and still haven't eaten.

12-16-2013, 02:21 PM
Heya! My name is Gwen and I spent a long time yesterday reading through this thread and looked at links people provided. First to Saraphin, I want you to know that I am so sorry your son treats you that way, it isn't fair and it isn't right. It must be heartbreaking to be blamed for what quite clearly is not your fault. He has a disease and he needs to take responsibility for it. It is like depression however, when it raises it's ugly head thinking gets distorted and twisted. I imagine there may be a place in your mind where you might wonder if what he says is true. It isn't! I used to blame my parents and it was incredibly selfish of me.

Anyhow I see a lot of super smart people on here, seems as if Fi reads three books an hour, lol! And Vermont mom/Cupcake I have been lurking here for over a year and I like your posts. There are many others, but my short term memory is lacking a bit due to my medications.

So I am almost 40, 5 years ago I had a career I loved, lots of friends, was married, with a nice house. That all came crashing down after I was assaulted by a "friend". Long story short, I went through a horrible trial, had PTSD, and lost everything. I became very depressed and anxious and shut everyone out. My ex was a functioning alcoholic prior to this so I suppose in a way I am in a better place. I took my pets and moved home and to this day live with my mom and am on disability. I am agoraphobic. My favorite hobby was reading and to this day I can't read because I am forgetful and have to read things repeatedly.

I am recovering, slowly, and trying to get the 86 pounds I gained since the assault off, at least most of it. Over two years I have lost 34 pounds, as you all know setbacks with depression/anxiety derails weight loss efforts. I've been prone to depression and panic attacks for most of my life, so the trauma really magnified this. My family (mom, dad, brother and his wife and their kids) are supportive and loving, but don't want to talk about my issues. I have no friends. I have a great psychologist and doctor. My disability is up for review and I have to go see some independent psych in a month and I am sick with anxiety. My money goes to paying for expensive meds and to pay my therapist.

So... Sorry for long winded intro, I take things day by day, am in school again for a new career (online) gah it is hard! Wishing everyone a better day.

12-16-2013, 05:21 PM
Gwen: :welcome3: to our group! So happy that you found us and chose to post! ;) I am so very sorry about your assault and resulting PTSD and upheaval in your life. Yes, unfortunately, our bodies show what we are dealing with on the inside, so our weight increases. Very common with cases of assault such as yours. I am also a trauma/assault survivor, so I can relate. It sure sounds like you are a SURVIVOR, though, so keep on keeping on! You did NOT deserve that and it wasn't your fault!!! Happy to hear that at least some of your family is supportive and loving. Isn't it interesting when our loved ones don't want to hear about our "issues?" I always think to myself, "Oh, I am so sorry you have to HEAR about it........ but I LIVED it!!!!!" :p I deal with some of that in my life, too. For the most part, my hubby and kids are very supportive, thank God!!! :love: Thank you for your kinds words to saraphin! Great advice you gave!!! ;)

saraphin: I just want to echo Gwen's sentiment that you certainly did NOT deserve to be treated so poorly by your son. You should have been able to reach out to a family member on a tough day and get support, not more BS!!! That must be irritating! I am glad that you came here and posted. Sorry I was not online last night to support you! Be strong with your son and practice good ol' tough love! He will ultimately benefit from that more than anything else. He needs to take responsibility for his actions and his life, as I'm sure you know. Hang in there and don't take any crap from anyone!!! ;)

Fi: What a VICTORY you had when you resisted binge eating over the snapping from your hubby! My hubby is usually very loving and supportive, but will snap like that periodically, and it is so difficult not to take it personally. I have come a long way, but still find this situation so difficult. Good for you for going to what has worked for you in the recent past, the muesli, rather than that Starbucks cookie! Incredible that you successfully used the technique that you just learned from the book Brain Over Binge, too. You really took it to the next level by putting what you learned into practice at a crucial, trying time. That is some serious PROGRESS!!! YAY FOR YOU!!! :carrot: A few days ago, you were talking about the hunger levels and said you normally range from -3 to 3, I think. Well, I have to admit that I usually eat until I am a 8-10 (or more), which is terrible!!! I get pain in my ribs lately from my stomach expanding and pushing on them, I think, when I overeat. It is very uncomfortable and embarrassing. I have not told anyone, including my hubby, about this (except all of I feel it is just more evidence that I am addicted to food and overeating. So, I am making it my mission to at least STOP eating when I am at a 5, if not sooner! I need to trust that food will be available if and when I get hungry later; that I will be satisfied and that I've had enough once I have eaten a smaller portion of food. Anyway, thank you for sharing that with one of the other members of the group. It was a good reminder for me, too! :)

Trish: Thank you for checking in with us! It is always great to hear from you! Don't give up on yourself!!! Each new day ~ and even each new moment or meal ~ is another chance to get it right. The very first thing you need to do is to eat something within an hour of waking. Try to make that a priority. I know I keep repeating that, but it is so critical to your success with weight loss and getting your metabolism going in the morning! ;) I really want you to succeed and I am cheering for you! :cheer2: GO TRISH!!! :D YOU CAN DO IT!!! ;)

My family is just getting home now, so I must go for now. Hoping that everyone is doing well today! Waving hello to the rest of you! :wave: Please post soon and let us know how you are doing!

12-16-2013, 06:01 PM
ibeieveinme2 thank you for you beautiful post. and gwen thank you for your supportive words. yesterday i wanted to be nurtured. i realised i forgot to take my med's yesterday morning. huge mistake.

and i haven't been eating until lunchtime lately . so i take your advice that was meant for someone else. sorry i'm stil not 'withit' yet to remember who said what and when exactly on this page even! i'm so dopey.

sorry lovely people. i'll tell you what though, as a group, you are so knowledgable and insightful, you help me every day. thank you thank you everyone on this forum

vermont mom, lilturtle, fiona you are all great friends to me. i must try and commit your avatars and post to memory. by the time i get to the foot of the page i have scroll through again to see who said what-when!

now we have gwen, another clever and helpful friend to welcome into our little group. i will get better, bear with me.

still losing yah!!!!!

12-16-2013, 06:06 PM

here we are

Fiona W
12-16-2013, 08:31 PM
Well, I'm discovering that I still have some learning to do about this whole muesli-for-depression thing. Last night, at 4 AM, I had another little episode of being angry (never mind what it was about), so once again, I had a measured serving of muesli to help myself deal with it. So far, so good. Then, come noon, after sleeping way late, I had the bright idea (right...) of skipping my noon serving of muesli, because, I figured, I'd already had my "potion" for the day. Sure enough, as the afternoon progressed, I got more & more down, until, about 4:30 PM, I was in genuine depression pain. All of a sudden (duh!), it occurred to me that there was a reason why I'd chosen noon as the time to eat my daily muesli: because of my diurnal pattern of feeling worse in the afternoons. So I got up and ate another 1/2 cup serving, and sure enough, about an hour later, the depression had gone away. I'm not going to make that mistake again!

I also noticed, in looking back over my daily mood tracking, that the sugar-containing muesli I had initially discovered was so helpful, was subtly, but more, effective than the non-sugar-added kind I've been eating in recent days. (Both kinds are Familia brand: mostly rolled oats, with just a few bits of dried fruit in them.) I don't really want to have the sugar-added kind available to me, since I tend to overeat it, wheareas I don't do that with the non-sugar kind. So tomorrow, I'm going to go get myself some raisins, so I can add a handful of those to my noon serving every day, and get more of an insulin pulse that way. If you're restricting your carbs, it's the insulin that supposedly helps one's mood (at least according to current theories), much more than the carbs per se.

Meanwhile, I have the issue of what would be the best way to deal with my anger episodes. I can get angry any time of day or night, depending on when there's a trigger for it. I think what I'm going to do is go back to an old dieting standby from the days when I lost 107 lb. on Jenny Craig: dates. I think a few dates, which I have no history of over-consuming, would be a more effective "emergency" sweet to have on hand for when I get angry, and that way I wouldn't have the muesli I need on a daily basis mixed up in my mind with what I need occasionally for when I get angry. Plus, a few dates are lower in calories than a serving of muesli, which I'm having with cream (because cream has almost no carbs).

I'll let you know how that goes. By the way, for those of you who are experimenting with letting your feelings hang out instead of stuffing them away with food, I highly recommend keeping a journal or some kind of tracking of your mood states, with notes on what foods you're craving or what foods you eat in response to those moods, and how those foods are or are not helpful. According to a book I've been reading—Robert E. Thayer's Calm Energy: How People Regulate Mood with Food and Exercise (—the most common states people "medicate" with food are anxiety, loneliness, boredom, anger, and depression. (I listed them in order of a mnemonic I made up: AL(L) BAD.)

There's lots of good stuff in Thayer's book, almost all from studies of human beings (not rats). One study I found especially interesting. We've all heard that moderate exercise elevates mood, right? Well they did surveys of people signing up for new gym memberships, asking them what were their reasons for joining the gym. It turns out that the people who had never had a gym membership before listed weight loss as their #1 reason, whereas people who had previous experience with using a gym listed mood regulation ("makes me feel better, improves my moods") as their #1 reason. Both groups also listed things like body shaping, fitness, overall health. Both groups included all sizes & shapes of people. Isn't that interesting, that the ones who had already tried out exercise were so much more aware of how it improved their moods?

12-17-2013, 02:13 AM
ibelieveinme2 - thanks for the wonderful welcome! I am glad there are other survivors here. Thanks for making me feel at home :). It has been a very slow recovery, I guess as one gets older it becomes harder to bounce back. I just ordered a safety whistle so I can feel more secure when taking my dog on walks in my immediate neighborhood. I am quite paranoid! It took me several years to go out on my own and I am not as consistent as I should be. Lol, I totally agree with your assessment about how family can be supportive but not supportive at the same time. I am extremely grateful my mom has opened her home to me, I know she has a tendency towards depression. We are quite the pair!

Saraphin - I am glad you are feeling a bit better today, and remembered your meds. I have so many darn meds it is hard for me to forget, sigh. However, when I do forget it doesn't take long for me to get wonky! I have horrible days as well, I am glad you had a chance to write to get it out.

Fiona - I love hearing about all the books you read! The reason for joining a gym thing is so true. When I manage to go it is with my dad (have to have a safety person with me when I go out so I don't panic). I used to be a gym rat primarily
to relieve stress in a very high stress work environment. So, now I go to elevate my mood. Another strange phenomenon I know all too well is when you stop exercising for two days or so it is all the harder to start again. I record my mood (just started a month ago) daily with a free website called Moodtracker. It is pretty cool, my therapist can see my daily check ins and it sends an email to remind me to log it. Even though it has only been a month I can see trends immediately. Your muesli experiment is also pretty cool, good for you!

Thanks, hope everyone has a restful evening!


Fiona W
12-17-2013, 12:38 PM
Some folks on another thread were commiserating about how frustrating time-of-the-month (TOM) is, because of the weight you gain. So I replied as follows...

You guys think TOM sucks, just wait until you get past menopause. The post-menopausal body has a low metabolism and all sorts of other unpleasant proclivities. I miss having estrogen coursing through my veins.

Oh well. No one ever said losing weight was easy, not at any age. I recently saw a so-called "inspirational" quote that I think sums it up very well:

Being fat is hard.Losing weight is hard.Maintaining your weight is hard.So pick your hard.

Sorry I haven't responded to y'all individually in a while, but I'm really busy with work—not work that pays anything, just the work I do for fun. Because most of what I do is nonverbal (i.e., art), I think about you while I'm working: Kathleen, Holly, Trish, Chelsea, Sara, Becca, shr1nk1ngme. And hey there Gwen—nice to meet you! =waving hand= (I hope I didn't leave anyone out.) Y'all are a great crew to hang out with. I hope all of you are having some magical holiday moments so far, and will continue to have many more of them over the next few weeks. =smile=

12-17-2013, 02:51 PM
IBelieveInMe2 Thanks for the encouragement. I was on my way here to post how holiday depression is really kicking my butt. I'm not overeating though for the most part. I'm not getting out at all this week. I hate being stuck in my apartment. On Sunday I leave for my brother's for Xmas and New Year's. I'm a bit stressed about that too as my mom will be there and we can handle only about 48 hours in the same house. I'll be there for 11 days. My friend told me to act from a place of love. I'm not totally sure what that means but I am going to try and be helpful and remember to be grateful. I have a lot to be thankful for and maybe if I focus on that things will be better.

12-17-2013, 06:55 PM
hi everyone

i'm stressing because i'm not sure if the present i bought will be one he likes, after that phone call. but we've spoken since and he apologised for losing his cool. (sigh) so all's well.

my other son said, nah, that's fine (about the present).

why am i still stressing?

i have a history of stressful xmases and disliked presents (from me) . i always seem to buy the wrong things for everyone else and me, too, in regards to clothes especially, i always look rubbish. but i transgress.

never put yourself down.

ok. i've got another cute saying for you:

friends are flowers in the garden of life. :hug::hug::hug:

good one , eh? :)

anyway, i'm ok. i am having a cup of tea now, it's early morning, about 9:20 . :p

DH has gone to do some work. :dizzy:

i've got swaps to organise (international). :?::?::?:

and the post office to send the boys' stuff. (presents) i have to wrap them first. dishes. fold the washing, put it away, dreadmill exercise. that's my day. oh, hose the verandah. that's my day. :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy:

interesting to hear about the carbohydrates and exercise. bfn :smug::smug::smug:

12-18-2013, 02:09 AM
Hello Everyone! I was in bed once, and ~ when I woke back up ~ remembered that I had not checked into the group tonight, so I wanted to stop by for a quick hello! Unfortunately, I just ate a box of pizza rolls prior to this post, so I would have been better off staying in bed! :o :( Oh well, tomorrow is a new day, right?!? :^: I started the day off working out with my trainer. I forgot to take my pm meds last night, so had to take them this morning, which always makes me a bit tired during the day. Not sure if that is why I felt the urge to eat more than usual today, but I'll go with that. Hope the urge is gone tomorrow because I just couldn't get satisfied food-wise today. I know that usually means it is emotional eating, so I will go to sleep pondering what was on my mind today that had me craving food all day long.

How is everyone doing with the holidays? Many people tend to get depressed around this time, so I was just wondering how you all are coping. I have an appointment with my psychologist tomorrow. Not sure what I will discuss yet, but it will most likely have to do with my struggles with weight loss. I just wish I could pinpoint exactly what is holding me back. :?:

On that note, I shall return to my slumber..... :yawn: Hope everyone is doing well and staying strong!!! WE CAN DO THIS!!! :hug:

12-18-2013, 09:51 AM
hello! first, :welcome: to Gwen! i'm tickled that you 'know' me a little from my previous posts here. I hope you find this place as friendly and warm as I do, thanks to all who post here.

Gwen, that is horrible about the event that kinda tore apart your life! You are a are strong in that respect. I'm glad you have a safe place with your mother, and your dog :) congrats on losing alot already! and glad you're here :carrot:

Fi, I find it so admirable that you are able to observe 'cause and effect' of food on your system, and your mood, that must be very helpful! (btw, isn't it sucky when our partner takes our head off when we know it is not deserved!) I'm glad it did not trigger a huge reaction. Oh and I'm 53 and in the middle of menopause and for me, the worst are the hot flashes (I'm cold! I'm hot! lol) and that it does seem to be so much harder to lose weight.

Chelsea, I hope your anxiety is better, did you try that other supplement? and you asked about buprioron (spelling?) that is Wellbutrin, correct? I take that, the 300 time release. Been on it for about 4 years I guess and I would be afraid to be off it. I have never even been officially diagnosed; I went to my family doctor about 7 years ago, broke down telling him how desperate i felt in my life, and he wrote me a prescription for Lexapro. Took that for a a couple years but gained about 15 pounds, because I just ddn't care, and still had bad / suicidal thoughts. Went to same family doctor and he suggested Wellbutrin and that has been good for me!

Lilturtle HI and hope you are doing well, with your eating plan . I'm very sorry about your holiday depression; and your anxiety about your upcoming trip. 11 days is a long time to be in someone else's place! Trying to focus on the positives in one's life is good advice from your friend, I try to do that all the time.

Becca, my goals are to be FIT, to me that means no noticeble excess around my waist, trimmer overall, with strong muscles and bones and flexible. Wow I am ambitious :D

saraphin, i was Sooo sad to read of that phone conversation!! You are TOO SWEET to be treated and spoken to in that way, your son was in the wrong but the alcoholism makes people so mean sometimes :( I'm so glad he apologized. and the Friends are the Flowers in teh Garden of Life is beautiful :hug:

Hello Kathleen :) It's only been recently that I have stopped 'hating Christmas' (that is awful isnt it!) It was due to untreated depression; and working retail bakery long hours, and I just did not have time to decorate, and had a horrible cluttered ugly home that I did not want to decorate; guilt over feeling that I did not have a nice home for the boys to enjoy Christmas, resentment towards everyone, all that bad stuff. Thank goodness I am better now!!

I hope I haven't forgotten anyone :o HI to everyone!! how's that :D

If I think of them, I will post later, about some of the crazy people I encounter in my winter job, lol. From Nov. to April, I work in a small convenience store/deli in a tourist town (Stowe - Ski Capital of the East! lol) and the things people funny (and frustrating at times)

today is my Saturday (I have Wed. and Thursdays off) and I have to do laundry and some house cleaning first; then my big job is to pack and deliver cookies to area peeps; I've got hundreds of cookies in the freezer and I will give them to people like the ladies at the bank; hairdresser; car mechanic (HEY they remember things like this when you need an emergency car repair!)

I am proud, that a couple days ago, when my DH had a strange meltdown and lashed out at me ( I KNOW it is because he is stressed from work) that I did not take it personally; I was very calm and said that i could tell he was angry but I knew I did nothign to deserve it, and would not get upset, and he needed to apologize.

Well he didnt apologize, but after an hour or so, he 'came around' and was acting normal again. I asked, 'do we have an underlying problem, that this small argument escalated so badly?' and he said that when I disagree with him, he feels that means I think he's stupid :?: What?! Well I am glad he was able to at least communicate those feelings. He never would have in the past, and I would have immediately thought 'what did I do wrong' and would have cried and felt responsible. Geez...married for 34 years and we're still muddling along :devil:

WEll I need to workout (btw I post regularly at and then laundry, then start packing cookies; and i haven't wrapped a single gift yet, lol. Hey i still have a week :D
take care, lovely chicks!!!

12-18-2013, 01:19 PM
Hello! It is a new day, thank goodness. Yesterday was pretty sad, not sure why, it had a bit of a headache. So I ate badly (I always turn to cinnamon chex, lol. It is full of sugar! I am weird). Hid in bed for most of day. :(

Fi - I love the "pick your hard" quote. Reminds me of my stepsister who is an athlete/personal trainer/wonder gal who is just so nice! She has little sayings she sends me for encouragement. I am not looking forward to menopause!

Lilturtle - the holidays are hard for me too. I always feel like the black sheep in my family. I overspend to compensate, rather ridiculous considering I need my money for meds and therapy. Try to act from a place of love. Hmm, I'll have to ponder that one, it sort of makes sense but is a bit vague! I need serious instructions, lol! I get way stressed going to my brother's house, must take prn meds just to get there.

Saraphin - I too get depressed and stressed before the holidays. This year I got many things done early in hopes of avoiding stress. I even found Christmas shirts so I could make an effort! Putting them on, hahaha, I look ridiculous! Oh well. Trying not to put myself down, but... Could the weight loss fairy bring me a surprise?

Ibelieveinme2 - I have an appointment next Monday with my psychologist, thank goodness. I go every Monday, it is the only place where I feel better! I slept most of yesterday, grrr. Must try to do something today! Hope your visit went well.

Holly - I felt a bit stalkerish admitting I remembered you! I am glad it is ok. I think it was because I admired your goal not to be at a certain weight, but to be more athletic and comfortable with yourself. I am on Wellbutrin XR 150mg and Cymbalta. The cymbalta is stupidly expensive! I tried to switch to zoloft but that was a 6 month mistake. Hope your workout goes well and the present wrapping isn't too much! I have to get wrapping too.

Hope you all to have a better day. I will try to suck it up and not let depression/anxiety derail me from walking and eating right!

P.S. Happy wishes also to Cdubs and Becca!


12-18-2013, 04:02 PM
This holiday is not shaping up to be very good. I'm having relationship/communication problems on top of my normal holiday funk. I just can't seem to do or say the right things, the things I feel in my heart. I think I have cried at least once every day this month. I'm losing motivation with my diet. The good thing is I have at times been too depressed to eat. I am all over the place. This is not a merry month for me. I just want to give up on everything and stay in bed. I can't get an appointment with my doc until well into the New Year either. Outpatient treatment never worked out either as far as therapy. I'm sorry to be so down. I am reading everyone else's shares. I know others are struggling too. I offer you hugs. I sure could use one.

12-18-2013, 04:57 PM
Trish: Sending you BIG HUGS!!! :hug: :hug: :hug: I am so sorry to hear that you are struggling so much right now, but I must say that I've been there. For a 3-5 year period, at the deepest point in my depression, I would stay at home and sleep while my hubby took the kids to his Thanksgiving celebration. I usually managed to make their Christmas celebration..... I think; can't even accurately remember now; I was in a fog. :?: I slept a lot to avoid my life and all of my problems at the time. I avoided my family completely during that time. I was angry about a lot of issues from my past. That has to be frustrating to have communication problems on top of all of that. It sounds like your confidence is way low, too, which doesn't help matters. All I can say is that this too shall pass. One day, you will look back on these days and be at such a better place. I promise!!! :^: If I was able to pull out of it, you can. It took me a long time, but with the help of therapy and meds, I am finally actually looking forward to our holiday celebrations in both families. The only problem is that my hubby's family always has tons of yummy, not-good-for-you food that tempts me so much. I usually indulge, I must admit. This year, I will aim to focus more on the relationships and people there and limit my portions of the bad stuff. I so wish that you could get outpatient therapy somewhere!!! You shouldn't have to go through this alone, which leads me to ask (and only answer if you feel like it): Are you single? Married? I am just wondering what kind of emotional support system you have in place, especially in times of need, like now. Who can you confide in? You can definitely count on us to support you, I hope you know! ;) :hug: That is a start. But you really need someone (at least ONE person) in your daily life that you can confide in and be yourself with. I hope you do have that someone already. If not, let's brainstorm together and find someone who you can reach out to and who can be there for you. Are you spiritual at all? (Again, only answer if you feel comfortable.) The reason I ask is that my faith was my only Saving Grace for awhile, along with my children, which were my reason for living. I was seriously in a bad way. For years! :( Have you tried journaling about your feelings? That is the other thing that saved me back then. I filled journal after journal by pouring out my feelings on paper. Many that I recently found, I bounded with duct tape and finally threw them away. It is time to move on........finally! You will come to that place in your life one day, too. I promise! :hug: Please hang in there and stay in survival mode during the holidays if you must. Just get by. That is all you have to do. Put one foot in front of the other..... one day at a time and even one moment at a time. I will keep you in my prayers. :hug:

Holly: I can so relate to a horribly cluttered home. Our house is nice, but I have so much clutter in every room that it is overwhelming and depressing all at once. That ~ clutter ~ on my body and in my home and on my mind ~ is my main issue right now. I have even hired a professional organizer to help me, but so far I have been unable to maintain my progress from one session to the next. She comes this Friday and is in for a shock! :o I am so ashamed of my clutter and it is a huge source of conflict between my hubby and me (and even my 17-y-o son expresses his displeasure now). :cry: I don't want my kids to be ashamed to bring people into our house. I want their friends to feel welcome here. How did you conquer your clutter problem? I am so interested to find out! Any help and/or tips you (or anyone else) could give me would be so much appreciated!

Gwen: Here's to a NEW day!!! :sunny: I hope you feel better today! I am happy to see you continue to post and join in the conversation. I think we have a really special group here, and I am thankful for the contribution of each and every one of you! :hug:

Hello to everyone else! :wave: I will check in later. Until then, stay strong and take things one moment and one meal at a time! ;)

12-19-2013, 09:01 AM
Trish - I am so sorry you are so down right now :( many many hugs to you! :hug: :hug: :hug: I love all the suggestions and online support that Kathleen suggested, she is a wonderful chick isn't she. I hope so much that maybe today will be at least a little better for you. Sometimes we feel worst right before we feel a little better.

Gwen - oh yeah, I do remember that I had "fit and trim" as my posted goal, I should go back to that, instead of my unrealistic 135 :rofl: Oh and what was I thinking about my Wellbutrin, it is 150 mg, not 300. In fact just called yesterday to reorder, I get it from Canada and the generic is about $78 for 90 days.

Kathleen - we still have clutter, but I got the living room 'liveable' last year. My motivation was a future visit from our son and his girlfriend for Christmas and I just HAD to have a nicer room for us to visit and open gifts. It was a challenge but I had 3 months to do it!

I had to empty an entertainment center that was crammed with stuff. Old stereros and a cassette deck player (my husband is VERY resistant to getting rid of things) hundreds of VHS tapes, books, crap. I wanted to save the had to clear out unwanted books from the upstairs bookshelves. That in itself was a days-on-end job...i took hundreds of books to the Re-Use center. Truly, like over 500.

Then started emptying the entertainment center. So many trips lugging dozens of boxes outside to the car, then to the Re-Use center 15 miles away. And I had to do all of this on my 2 days off, when my husband was not around. Because I know he would not like seeing stuff that he/we bought, getting rid of. But come on, why save this stuff?! But he helped by dismantling the entertainment center, and by getting paint for the living room. Then I got some second-hand chairs which are OK and husband helped with nice sheers/drapes (he used to do draperies) . SUCH a difference! It has helped with my mental state SO VERY much.

I could only do this, first, because I have no back pain and am relatively strong and fit for my age (except for a sometimes bum knee) and that the Re-Use center takes almost anything, for almost free. And that DH was acceptable, and not totally resistant. His idea of cleaning up, is getting a storage box, and putting it all in that. I .. am .. NOT.. good with that! That is just delaying. I had to clean out my Dad's condo after his death and I don't want our sons to have to go through that.

I'm still not proud of our place, but not consumed by shame. That's pretty big for me :devil:

HI to all others! :hug:

today, after a workout, I will try to pretty myself up :devil: and I will be delivering some of those hundreds of Christmas cookies to two towns. I got the plates and boxes all ready last night and they are already in my car. Co-workers, the bank ladies, my auto mechanic, my motorcycle mechanic, hairdresser...and the guys at the Re-Use center! :)

I did go back to bed yesterday at 10 am after working out :?::?: and slept for 2 hours. Felt very angry at myself for that. I still accomplished lots after that but why do I do that. ? I was not really tired, its' just that bed looks so inviting sometimes .

well I hope you all have a good day!

12-19-2013, 03:31 PM
Thank you both for the words of encouragement. I'm not spiritual persay but I am trying to view this season from a point of for my family, friends and SO. I'm not doing good with my eating. It's 2:30pm and I haven't eaten yet. I ate once yesterday and it was a sub. Sure I was under my calories for the day but that's not healthy either. Ugh....I'm so frustrated with everything. I want to crawl into a hole until after New Year's.

12-20-2013, 02:59 AM
I am the queen of crawling under rocks and into holes. So, lilturtle, nice to see you here with me :). You can call me "Yer Majesty". :cool: I have also developed loads of clutter, but it isn't mine, it is my mom's. So I live in a house (which is under a rock next to my favorite dark hole) where there are bookshelves on every wall, including the halls, and I have to move craftily to avoid all the tchotchkes and furniture. I can't do a darn thing about it. My room holds everything I own in the world, as my ex ran off with everything I owned!

Anyhoo, more seriously, I am truly sorry you are having a rough time. I realize that is an understatement. Keep writing here! I'll be here to listen. I am not really spiritual either, but I have had luck finding peace in the past through gentle yoga or breathing exercises. I am not currently practicing, but the whole coming from a place of love starts from within. So I will attempt to clear my mind and take a step in that direction as well as you through the holidays.

So, me today.... Well, I'm having an ok day. Took NyQuil for my headache, seems to be only thing that works. I will have to go to the doctor as I suspect it might be a sinus infection. Ate well today, had to go out too see the dentist, pretty boring! Not tired at all, this could be a problem. Hope everyone is hanging in there!


Fiona W
12-20-2013, 11:49 AM
Thursday I had a crappy day for physical reasons: thanks to my flu shot, I presume, I didn't get the full-blown flu by any means, but I woke up kind of under the weather and with a truly annoying myalgia (muscle pain) in my right thigh. It was almost as if my right quadriceps muscle got the flu, but none of the rest of me did. It lasted about 8 hours and was the cause of much foul language & irritability, but is all gone now, and I feel back to normal. =grin=

Today (Friday) I have much to do to prepare for Yule, which is tomorrow (Saturday), the Winter Solstice. Bob and I are pagans (specifically, druids), so we don't celebrate Christmas: we celebrate the ancient pre-Christian holiday of Yule in honor of the return of the sun—i.e., the beginning of lengthening days. Starting after sundown on the Winter Solstice, we have a little party with food & drink, and an exchange of gifts. Then, as the evening grows later, we gather around the roaring fire, socialize & tell stories, and so far as it's humanly possible, stay up all night long in what we call "the longest night's vigil." When the sky begins to lighten, we bundle up and go outside to watch the sunrise, cheering and waving and doing whatever else feels right to celebrate the sun's coming into view.

Gwen— It's a little sad to think of you having all your possessions in one room while living in a house crowded with someone else's stuff. Bob and I also live in a house with bookshelves on nearly every wall, but at least they are all filled with books, our own books, a treasured library some 40 years in the making. I hope you get along OK with your mother: even if you do, living with one's mother is always a source of stress. Good luck on a speedy recovery from the headaches & possible sinus infection!

Trish— Something else that might help you get through those 11 stressful days with your family is gratitude. At the end of each day, before you go to bed, sit down and think of three things you are grateful for that day. Most people who do this write down their three things in a journal, but that's not necessary if you don't have a journal you can use. Solid scientific research has shown that a daily practice of thinking about what you're grateful for—which can be anything under the sun that makes you feel good—helps people ward off & recover from depression and cope better with stress.

Holly— I wish you wouldn't give yourself so much grief for listening to your body and sleeping when you need to. You have a stressful job, plus this is always a stressful time of year: sleep is excellent for protecting your brain from developing depression. Good for you, that huge project you undertook last year to get the living room & elsewhere more liveable! I, too, am a generator of clutter like you wouldn't believe. Shall we schedule a special episode of "Hoarders" just for the Ups & Downs Support Group? =laugh= I have motivation to get moving on de-cluttering our house, because sometime in the late spring or summer of next year, Bob and I will be getting a brand-new pair of oriental shorthair kittens. I want the kittens to have furniture to jump up on that isn't burdened with my messes! By the way, I would love to hear some of your stories, Holly, about the funny winter people who come into your store. =smile=

Kathleen— I'm right there with you when you say your clutter is a source of conflict between you and your husband: Bob and I have the very same problem. Some of the mess in our house is Bob's fault, but the burgeoning collection of piles o' books for which we've run out of shelves, piles o' magazines that I need to harvest clippings from for my collage art, art supplies, and various paper stuff like all the mail art I receive, is mine and mine alone. Bob is mostly patient about my very slow progress on picking stuff up, but one time last year he got very angry and ranted at me that "it's like living inside a rotting pumpkin!" That may sound funny in retrospect, but at the time I took it very hard. I'm so sensitive to any kind of criticism about my behavior. Anyway, I am working on the issue and will definitely tell you if I run across any tips that help with decluttering. By the way, i've been meaning to give you a couple of book suggestions on the subject of learning how to eat right. The first is a slender book that is very well-written: On Eating by Susie Orbach ( Orbach is a practicing psychotherapist and the author of a wonderful book you may have heard of, Fat is a Feminist Issue. Her approach is very gentle and wise. After you read On Eating, I also recommend How to Have Your Cake and Your Skinny Jeans Too by Josie Spinardi ( despite its silly title, this is also a wise manual on how to organize your eating behavior so that you lose weight without dieting. (Sorry the link I gave you is to the Kindle edition: there must be a paperback somewhere, but I couldn't find it.) Both of these books will help you with your problem of overeating until you are uncomfortably full.

Sara— I'm sure your present for your son will be fine. If he acts like he doesn't like it, then that's bad manners on his part, and not your fault! I hope your holidays get less stressful soon.

I'm doin' well in general: on Wednesday I made the second of two collages for this week. It's always a good week when I make at least two collages. I'm slower in my productivity than some of my fellow collage artists, but I try my best to keep a steady pace.

Y'all want to see them? Gee, I thought you'd never ask... =laugh= Here they are: trois absurdi-poissons ( and three times three equals nine ( If you scroll down a bit, there's a little descriptive info under each one.

Happy Yule and Happy Winter Solstice to everyone! =warm smile=

12-20-2013, 04:00 PM
I got a call from my brother this morning. Turns out I'm only spending Tuesday through Thursday there. I cried and cried. I'm going to be alone for New Year's and now it feels like they don't want me either. I just want to fast forward to Jan 2nd. I wrapped the rest of my gifts. I ate a half of a granola bar today (it's about 3pm). I just want to stop eating altogether.

Gwendolyn213 I'm trying not to avoid things but I am getting overwhelmed and overemotional. I need a break from feeling for awhile. My thinking is so selfish. I am feeling sorry for myself. Oh, poor me. Many people have it worse then I do.

Fiona I did make a gratitude list a couple days ago. I also made a list of the ways my life is better then a year ago. I am going to try and refer to them.

I need to get myself out of this hole. I just don't know how. I feel useless.

12-20-2013, 05:39 PM
Sorry I don't think I ever posted yesterday. I did read the posts and feel particularly at a loss of words for you, Trish. I hate that you are suffering and so lonely right now and feeling useless. Is there ANYONE in your life who you could reach out to? A family member? A friend? Maybe it will actually be better to only be at your brother's Tuesday through Thursday. :?: Weren't you worried about being there for 11 days with your mom? At least this will avoid THAT happening. Is it triggering you that you will be spending time with your family at all, even if you want to? The reason I ask is that I often get a lot of anxiety before a family event, even though I am looking forward to it. I just kind of never know what to expect, other than dysfunction. And I often leave depressed that things didn't go as I had hoped. I guess I am always hoping we will go deeper in our relationships, but things usually only go so deep with my parents. I worry that I will regret that when they are gone, but my therapist has helped me to see that it might not be my fault. They might not be capable of going deeper. They really don't have a deep relationship with ANY of us 7 siblings. Sad, actually, but true/real. They see things as they want them to be and often deny reality. Very dysfunctional and difficult to be around. How have your visits with your family members gone? Is it fun or stressful or both? Maybe talking/writing about it would help you sort it out. :?: I am not sure how to help you other than telling you that we here at Ups & Downs support you 100% and want you to be happy. If you crawled in a hole until January 2nd, we would care and we would miss you! So please stay out of that hole if at all possible!!! ;) Sending you more BIG HUGS!!! :hug: :hug: :hug: Please hang in there and keep posting! Have you journaled recently? That has always helped me when I feel crappy and in a "funk."

Fi: Yes, our clutter problems sound very similar. My hubby is usually very patient and tolerant (on the surface) of my clutter, but then he will get so sick and tired of it and snap at me. :tantrum: It hurts my feelings so much, too, because I also hate the clutter, but can't seem to conquer it. :( I have been working on this issue for a lot of years now. But, let's both remember that our past does not have to determine our future. We CAN both get more organized in the days ahead...... and we WILL!!! We can do it!!! :cheer2: Thank you for the new book recommendations. I am sooooooooooo tempted, but I am determined to get through some of my current books before I order any more! I am STILL reading The Emotional Diet. I got slowed way down, a bit uninterested, and side-tracked by the Emotional Freedom Techniques section, and I have just been so darn busy and on the go ~ even more than my usual busyness ~ that I have been at a standstill with the book! But I really like all else so far in the book, so I want to finish it. And next will be If I Am So Smart, Why Can't I Lose Weight? I go in spurts with reading my books and I am easily distracted and read things over and over again, so it sometimes takes me forever to finish one book. You, on the other hand, seem to fly through them! ;)

Gwen: That is so sad that your ex ran off with everything you owned! :( That must have been such a traumatic experience for you...... after another already traumatic event. :( You are definitely a survivor!!! Glad that you at least have one room with YOUR stuff in it. I hope you have made it a peaceful haven for yourself, in the midst of your mother's cluttered home. It makes me sad that you are living with your mother's clutter. That is probably how my husband and son feel. They are surrounded by clutter that isn't even theirs. :cry: I am so ashamed!!! :cry: Sometimes, my hubby will threaten to get rid of stuff (when he has had it with the clutter), which causes me tremendous anxiety. He knows that, though, and usually will back off after awhile. I actually want the clutter gone now (which is huge progress for me), but can't seem to keep it under control. I keep bringing more into our house and the kids school papers are endless; and then there is the mail and papers I need to act on at some point in time! It all just piles up on my kitchen counters. :o :( Anyway, I am just sorry that you have to live with your mom's clutter.

Holly: Good for you for getting control of at least one area of your house! I love hearing about the process of how you prepared for your son and his girlfriend's visit and cleared things out. My hubby is the pitcher of things and papers in our family and I am the keeper of them. :o I do think he pitches some stuff when I am out of the house, which I am actually okay with now, as long as it is stuff I don't miss. He has cleared some spaces in our house a number of times, including my "office," but I have recluttered the rooms. :o :( As I mentioned, though, I am working with a professional organizer now, so hopefully I will be able to make ~ and maintain (key for me) ~ some progress! :^: Ahhhh, to not be consumed by shame............ that is a goal for me, too ~ regarding both home and body clutter!!! I will get there when the time is right! :D

saraphin: Haven't heard from you in a few days. Hope you are well. I love the little sayings you share with us! ;) Glad to hear that at least your son apologized for losing his cool on the phone with you the other day. I'm sure your gift for him will be just fine.

Becca: You still around?!? Please post if you are reading along. We care and want to know how you are doing! ;)

Hope everyone is staying calm and allowing yourselves to ENJOY this holiday season! I have to constantly refocus myself and remind myself to take some deep breaths and just LIVE, along with all of the madness of the season. Some days are better than others! ;)

Fiona W
12-20-2013, 11:38 PM
I had a bunch of holiday errands to run today, and I was a little apprehensive about venturing out into the Friday holiday scene. All turned out well, though: people were helpful and upbeat everywhere I went. They were even having a wine tasting at the Co-op, so while I waited for Bob's scrip to be filled at the pharmacy, I got to drink a couple glasses of Pinot Grigio, my favorite white.

My monthly weigh-in is usually on the 22nd, but I'm going to do it tomorrow, a day early, because I'm going to allow myself a bar of dark chocolate at our Yule celebration. I realized today that I don't even care about how much weight I've lost this past month, or if I've lost any at all, because I've just about wrapped up my mini-goal of 30 days of no emotional, compulsive, or binge-type eating. I can't believe how utterly changed I feel, to have that horrible monkey off my back. Cookies & candy & donuts & their ilk are no longer ordering me around and making me miserable. =whew= I have so much to be grateful for!

My best wishes to all of you for a lovely weekend filled with peace, comfort, and joy...

12-21-2013, 12:09 AM
That's great Fiona! :carrot: The mini goals seem to be so important. I don't have any at the moment so maybe I need to develop some.

12-21-2013, 12:48 PM

I see that you have ONE DAY left to meet your mini goal of no binge/emotional eating!!!!! That is AWESOME!!! You go girl!!! :broc: YOU CAN DO IT!!! YAY FI!!! :carrot: We are all cheering for you!!! :cheer2: Pinot Gritio is my favorite wine of all at the moment. I don't drink red wine at all. Just don't like it much. What a treat to have some wine in the midst of your errands! ;) What will your next mini goal be? Mine is secretly losing just 5 pounds. It has been so darn LONG since my scale budged DOWN that I will be happy to just lose 5 solid pounds at some point. I am trying a new supplement soon that my former trainer recommended and I am hoping it can give me some kind of jumpstart on losing weight. It has helped many of his clients to lose weight, especially when their weight loss has been stalled (like mine), so I am trying to stay positive that it can help me, too. It is scheduled to arrive this coming Wednesday-Friday. It is the ONLY supplement he has used and recommended in his entire life, so I have some hope that it might help. :^: It is all natural so he said it can't hurt, so I might as well try it. I need SOMETHING that will get my weight loss going again. It has literally been about 2 and 1/2 years since I've lost ANY weight. :o I am sooooooo ready to be a LOSER again!!! :lol:

Well, I have a ton of laundry and gift wrapping to do, so I must get started. We are going to a 60th birthday party tonight for a great friend, but I will check back in afterward if at all possible. Hope you are all hanging in there and thinking POSITIVE!!! :D Hugs to all!!! :hug:

Fiona W
12-21-2013, 04:16 PM
Well, I lost 3 pounds this past month. And I'm not disappointed, because of what I said in my previous posting. Figuring out my daily allotment of muesli, and how to adjust my non-carb eating the rest of the day so that I'm losing weight more briskly, is going to take a little time. I think that with the new year, I may go to weighing myself once a week, just to do some fine tuning.

Thanks for the cheers, Trish and Kathleen! I haven't decided yet about my next mini-goal. I think I will keep counting the days of being free of emotional eating, but not put them in my sig anymore. It would be nice to get to a hundred days, and after that, to a year. I have to wait and see how my weight loss goes after the new year, and maybe set a weight loss mini-goal.

I really wish I could stay on the Atkins induction phase of less than 20 carb grams a day: I wish it hadn't made me go into that severe depression, because my body was comfortable with it and I wasn't craving carbs at all. At least the few raisins I add to the muesli don't tip me into sugar craving. I'm not eating any sugar whatsoever.

Except for tonight, when Bob and I celebrate Yule! I get a bar of very dark chocolate, one that has a little caramel inside each square. =broad grin= I hope I don't eat it all up at once, that I can make it last for a few days. Happy Winter Solstice, everyone! May your longest night be a warm one...

12-21-2013, 05:49 PM
hello friends!wow that makes about 9 of us here atm so i'm going to try and recall every one. please don't mind me if i forget someone…i have just read through your posts….ah!. they are really good, cathartic in a way for me. :carrot::carrot::carrot:

my boy and i had a conversation recently about another topic (artist stuff)and it was marvellous that we could communicate on another level which is what he wants. we have hobbies in common, so we can talk about it, and that is healing for our relationship. :hug::hug::hug: i feel better about us but i always worry about him like he's a little boy, and he's a man, for goodness sake.

vermontmum you write so much for me to respond to. firstly, hot flashes, yes, i know about it! :hug::hug::hug: it passes love. breathe.

secondly , hating xmas. i know about that too and i'm trying really hard to enjoy it now! :(:(:( it is a GOOD thing. a GOOD thing. a GOOD thing...

DH argument…no, it is not ALWAYS your fault. your DH has trouble communicating. that's obvious, as he didn't apologise and you asked for that specifically. so you can leave it be now that's ok. but that is his way of apologising…being nice and normal. put the words in his mouth next time: "i'm sorry holly". sometimes men need that, like children. because they were brought up not having to talk about their feelings. my DH doesn't admit to HAVING any feelings! ;););)

good for you, delivering cookies, like a little biker elf. haha so cute. funny. :D:D:D

ibelieveinme2, no no no no no naughty pizza rolls!. they ARE there to be eaten though, right? :o:o:o


gwen, i'm on cymbalta, it's very good. (among other things). :(:(:(

i'm shutting down for xmas, so have a nice time of it everyone (i am very busy doing christmassy things, like wrapping presents, shopping, the usual and i need to let my private indulgences go for a few days..:-) )

lilturtle, be safe and keep warm won't you? you will be ok, stay with us. we will look after you. i'm sorry i'll be absent for a few days only, but i'll be wishing you a good xmas from my home. please take care my dear. :hug::hug::hug:

fi, i like the way you talk about food CONTROLLING you., not the other way around as it should be. i will remember not to let sweets/sugar/bread boss me around this christmas too! :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy:

so..until after ,

bfn, love to all here at ups n' downs…(i have not named everyone after all but i wish you good tidings, my dear friends!)
saraphin xxx

12-22-2013, 11:37 PM
Well, I just came from a family Christmas celebration at my parents' house. Lots of people there with 7 children and our spouses, 25 grandchildren ~ some with spouses or boyfriends, and 4 great-grandchildren! We had a good time and lots of food and drink. I am exhausted now. :yawn:

Fi: Congrats on your 3 pound weight loss! Slow and steady is the way to go. And you are learning so much along the way! You are doing great! Hope you are encouraged!!! ;) I hope you had a nice Yule celebration last night and thoroughly enjoyed your dark chocolate! :T

saraphin: You are so right about throwing out my clutter! No, I won't be taking it with me to heaven!!! :o It isn't all clutter, though, but also things I need to find a home for. I am just NOT a good organizer. :( That is why I have hired a professional to help me, but we had to cancel our Friday session after all. So she won't be coming until the end of January now. She gave me some things to work on until then. And I do have lots of stuff to return (which I always procrastinate on) and to go through and to throw away!!! God help me!!! :^: I hope you are getting all of your Christmas stuff done. I am wrapping presents, too (since my shopping is complete), and I realize that I bought way too much stuff for my hubby and kids. Oh well. That is usually the case. I hope they like the things I chose for them! Anyway, I am trying to keep the main focus on the real meaning of Christmas, which for me and my family is the birth of Jesus, our Savior. :)

Trish: I hope you are hanging in there and taking things one moment at a time! You are in my thoughts and prayers! :hug:

Waving hello :wave: to everyone else!!! Hope all is well with everyone! ;)

Fiona W
12-23-2013, 09:29 AM
I have a little Christmas fun to share with you guys. It starts with a poem titled "Nicolas Was" by Neil Gaiman:

Nicholas Was...

older than sin, and his beard could grow no whiter. He wanted to die.

The dwarfish natives of the Arctic caverns did not speak his language, but conversed in their own, twittering tongue, conducted incomprehensible rituals, when they were not actually working in the factories.

Once every year they forced him, sobbing and protesting, into Endless Night. During the journey he would stand near every child in the world, leave one of the dwarves' invisible gifts by its bedside. The children slept, frozen into time.

He envied Prometheus and Loki, Sisyphus and Judas. His punishment was harsher.




And here's the animation of the poem. ( Enjoy!

12-23-2013, 02:58 PM
Thanks everyone for the thoughts and prayers. I went to a family Christmas event yesterday. It went well. I got some nice presents and my presents were well received. The food choices weren't the best. Pizza, cookies and chips. I ate two small pieces of thin and chrispy and had two cookies. No chips or soda. My stepmom who knows I am dieting bought me a box of chocolates. I wonder what she is thinking. I think that no one in my family is taking this seriously. I have already given away the box of chocolates and most of the cookies I was sent home with. Tomorrow I leave for my brother's house two hours away. I will stay there until Thursday. My brother is a little bit more supportive of my diet so maybe there won't be as much temptation.

Fiona W
12-24-2013, 11:43 AM
Hey there folks...I hope your holidays are going well. I'm in my usual yearly slump because of the gap between Yule and Christmas: I get all excited and anticipate the 21st, whereas it seems like most everyone else I know is anticipating the 25th. (Except for my Jewish friends, of course.) It makes me feel strange, out of synch.

Anyway, I'm still on top of things, diet-wise. I reached my mini-goal of 30 days without any emotional/compulsive eating, and the count goes on. Meanwhile, I'm examining my daily calories and my exercise patterns very closely, trying to figure out how to turbo-charge my weight loss, which has been quite sluggish the past two months. I bought a Leslie Sansone "Walk the Pounds Away" DVD, and I'm going to make myself try it out for the first time, either today or tomorrow. Tomorrow might work out well, if I think of the added exercise as a Christmas present I'm giving to my body. =smile=

Trish— Good for you that you were able to negotiate that holiday gathering with your weight loss resolve intact! That's great you gave away the candy and most of the must be relieved not to have those temptations in your apartment.

How's everyone else doing? Anyone out there?

12-24-2013, 12:23 PM
Hello Friends! I just came home from working out with my trainer and errands. It feels so good to have my exercise behind me already for the day. I would never have it done by now if I didn't have an appointment with the trainer! So thank God for that! She is keeping me on track with exercise! :carrot:

Fi: I did Leslie Sansone's "Walk Away the Pounds" years ago and really liked it. Really don't know why I ever stopped. I wish you much luck with it! Stick to it and you WILL get results! ;) Sorry about your slump between Yule and Christmas. At least you know to expect it and why you are in a slump. That helps somehow. It will pass. I am so impressed about you reaching and now passing your goal of 30 days free of binge eating!!! That is wonderful!!! :broc: On to the next mini goal! ;)

Trish: You did so well to give away much of the tempting food that was given to you. Odd that your stepmom bought you a box of chocolates when she knows you are dieting. :?: Sometimes even those who love us can sabotage our efforts (or TRY to; we don't have to let them!). I hope you will enjoy your stay at your brother's house! Good that he is more supportive of your dieting efforts.

Where is everyone else?!? It is pretty quiet around here lately! Busy time of year, I know, but at least post us a quick word (if you are reading along) to let us know you are still around! ;) Take good care everyone and stay strong!!! :)

Fiona W
12-24-2013, 08:57 PM
I'm listening to a rock-n-roll Christmas radio show, agreeably fagged by my nightly leg exercises, thinkin' about how to accelerate my weight loss. Three pounds a month may sound like a nice steady pace, but y'all know I'm aspirin' to something a little faster for the upcoming year. Aren't we all? I gotta get my feet moving out the door more, if only for the effect that it would have to lift up my mood.

My mood got better this afternoon, though: a cold front blew away all the dull grey clouds, and it was clear and pleasant out. I took advantage of the low humidity to spray a couple of my collage postcards with the acrylic fixative that is so picky: whenever the temperature's too close to the dewpoint, it tends to get cloudy with little water droplets.

Way to go, Kathleen, for working out with your trainer! You have a great holiday with your family!

And my warmest wishes to everyone for a very merry Christmas!!

12-25-2013, 08:02 AM
Merry Christmas to those of you who celebrate it!!! I will be busy all day, but wanted to be sure to hop online before my kiddos arise to see what "Santa" has brought for them! ;) They are 17 and 14 and no longer believe in Santa, but they still get excited to open presents Christmas morning. Thank God the wrapping is finally finished! Now, I can relax and enjoy watching their reactions when they open everything up. :love: My favorite part!

Hope that all of you will enjoy the day with family and friends! I aim to focus on the people gathered and NOT on the food, although ~ as I mentioned on an earlier post ~ my in-laws always have such delicious foods at our celebrations. YIKES!!! :eek: I will allow myself to indulge a bit, but will try not to go overboard. Tomorrow is a new day! ;)

Love and prayers for everyone gathered here! May your day be happy and healthy!!! :hug:

12-25-2013, 11:52 AM
Merry Christmas everyone!!!! Santa was very good to me and all is going well.

12-25-2013, 11:35 PM
I ate way too much food throughout the day today. :o :( I start over again in the morning. I need to get very serious about weight loss again.

Trish: So happy to hear that all is going well and Santa was very good to you!!! That is wonderful!!! :carrot:

Fiona W
12-26-2013, 06:07 PM
Well, my big achievement for the day after Christmas is that I took a walk! That's huge for me, because I haven't walked in over a year, because I injured my knee. My knee was a little wobbly and the trail was a little muddy, but I got in a good 30 minutes of cardio. I'm hoping that more exercise will lift my mood, which has been hovering rather more below baseline than I like.

How's everybody else doing?

12-27-2013, 08:41 AM

first, Fi, I think your celebration of the solstice was so kewl! :cool: and I checked out a couple pics of your collages, wow! how big are they ? and congrats on being able to take a walk :carrot:

saraphin, thank you for your wonderful insight on my recent argument with husband, you are right on! and your conversation with your son sounded so great :)

Trish, it is so good to hear that things are going good for you and Santa was good to you :)

Kathleen I am so sorry you struggle with clutter. I feel kinda bad that I would be the pitcher if you and I were in the same house..I really didn't even care that much til I had to clean out my dad's condo after his death and it just made me more aware that, every single thing in the house has to be taken care of by someone, at some point. Onto glad you were able to enjoy a nice Christmas!

I had a great day also! :) We didn't have our get-together til Christmas Day evening, when our younger son and his fiance came over; to join us (DH, older son and I) We had great time first visiting, then digging into the stockings, then gifts.

I used some of my Christmas dough :D yesterday to buy a pair of much needed winter boots, not fancy or fashionable, but Merrills hiker-types, which are warm, waterproof (snowproof) and have amazing tread; just what a Vermont chick needs.

Back to work today, ugh. I know Fi is looking forward to some of my hilarious/horrible customer stories, I must have erased them from my mind cause they're so frustrating :devil: but this upcoming week should refill that void :devil: :devil:

I have been eating EVERYTHING :( but trying not to beat myself up about it.

12-27-2013, 01:36 PM
I am slowly getting back to eating like a normal person again. I always have to watch my portions. It is so easy for me to overeat, especially if I love the taste of what I am eating. This morning, I walked on the treadmill for 30 minutes while my daughter worked out with our trainer and then I worked out with the trainer for an hour. I am exhausted right now!!! But it feels good to know I did all that work and that my workout is done for the day! :carrot: Way to go, me!!! :D

Fi: That is excellent that you got out for a walk, especially since it's been so long since you've done it!!! Definite PROGRESS!!! :broc: Keep it up and it WILL help your mood! :) I always want instant results, but my trainer keeps telling me that it takes time to change your metabolism and body. I need the constant reminders that what I am doing now will matter in the long run. Delayed gratification is a difficult concept for me to practice..... but I am counting on it this time around! ;) Regardless, I FEEL better when I work out, so I guess that is my "instant" reward.

Holly: It is so great to hear from you! You have a good reason to clear the clutter now, so others don't have to go through it later. I need to keep that prominent in my mind when I am working on the clutter. I don't want my kids to be stuck with all my "stuff." It is just so difficult for me to stay on top of it. Plus, I have some old clutter that still needs attention. It is difficult to know which area to focus on first. I keep working with my organizer on the first floor, so that I am not embarrassed if/when people come in the house. But I haven't been able to maintain our progress yet, so we are often going over the same areas when she comes. Of course, with all of the Christmas presents and things to return/exchange, I have even more stuff laying around right now. It does bother me. I want our home to be a peaceful place. It is not when there is stuff everywhere, though. :( At least I acknowledge the problem and I am working on it. Better than denial.
Congrats on your new functional winter boots! And good for you for not beating yourself up for eating too much. It doesn't help. You will get back in the swing of things soon! ;) Hope your first day back to work went well! Keep in touch! :)

Waving hello :wave: to everyone else! Please post when you can with an update or just to let us know that you are still here and reading along.

I am looking forward to positive changes in 2014!!! :D

12-27-2013, 04:25 PM
I have knee problems too Fiona. Even walking is hard. I want to start going to the pool again. I'm a little bit down today. Really dreading new years. I'll be alone.

12-28-2013, 06:35 PM
hello friends!i am here, definitely readsing along.

i also got some gorgeous presents.

but the thing for me was the chocolates and the coconut ice my mum made. oh, god! to DIE for, i'm telling you. NO WAY can i give them away! i had to hide the rest from DH in case he eats them all and i don't have any more for myself! too much. i mean i ate too much. ice cream (at keast it was low-fat, and i only had 1 scoop). and i sti;; ;ost weight this week! i can't believe it!
i have steadily lot ½ to 1 kilo each week since i have been on optifast. yesterday i got back on my dreadmill too. and did 5 minutes. my foot is excrutiating.

fi, tell me how you do the collage. why do you put fixative over collage? i'm making ATC's atm to swap with OS swappers.


love to you all, happy new year if i don't get back (i am so busy)

12-28-2013, 06:46 PM
i forgot to say my chick ticker is for a 5 pound challenge…wish me luck!

Fiona W
12-28-2013, 07:20 PM
This day for me has been a lesson in how I push exercise so far to the back burner of my activities, it falls right off the back of the stove.

I started out this morning with the thought, "I want to walk again today, because I walked for the first time (in a long time) two days ago, then allowed a day of rest for my body to recover from the shock. It's a nice clear day, so let's do it!" So far so good, I thought. Actually, though, my plan was too vague: I didn't set a definite time to take my walk, not even a time of day. Nor did I have walking at the top of my priority list.

And it's ironic, because I started out the day by re-reading the section on exercise in Brooke Castillo's If I Am So Smart, Why Can't I Lose Weight? Castillo is a "weight loss coach," and she was talking about all her clients, the women that is, who are in the mode of give-give-give to everyone in their family, but can't find the time to give to themselves the exercise their bodies need. She describes a woman who, thanks to Castillo's coaching, actually made her husband and children delay their departure on a planned family outing by half an hour, while she got in her exercise for the day. The woman said to Castillo, "I felt so selfish—it was terrible!" Castillo has a good reply to that: "Empty pitchers can't pour out any love."

So I thought to myself, "Well I don't have that excuse, because I don't have a family to take care of. If I don't walk today, it will be because I resisted it for some other reason." Sure enough, though, I've been busy-busy-busy all day long with things I'm doing for other people online. So while I think of myself as not having anyone depending on me—except a husband with treatment-resistant depression, of course (!)—in fact I often get into situations in my work life online, where I'm giving to others. And sure enough, by the time I got my head above water from all the writing I did today, the sun had set, and I'd missed my chance to walk.

With my daily leg exercises, by contrast, I have a definite time slot in which I do them. I eat dinner, then some time around 7 PM, turn on the satellite radio to my favorite rock-n-roll station. I lie on the couch listening for a while, then kick off the quilt and do my leg lifts. They started out because I was rehabbing an injured knee, then continued because I like how much easier it is to climb the stairs, compared to before I started the exercises. I don't even have to consciously think, "I need to do my leg exercises," because the time of day and the music just cue me.

So how can I get my walks in? Do I set up a definite time, either the night before or that morning? Castillo says you should write it out as an appointment in your daily planner, and keep that appointment with the same "I must do this" attitude as for an appointment with someone you absolutely will not let down. I don't know....being retired, I'm leery of making appointments. I'm in a creative mode—go with the flow, see what happens. But that can so easily turn into passivity.

Do any of y'all have similar issues with making yourself exercise? What do you notice about your thought process? Do you have any tips for how to make it happen?

saraphin— All my collages are oversized postcards, usually 6" x 9": I make them on sturdy cardboard, and they need fixative (a clear acrylic spray) because they need to survive the rigors of the postal system. I always write on and decorate the backs, and adorn them with vintage postage stamps plus an artistamp or three. It's called "mail art"! =smile= As for how I make them, I'm not sure I know how to tell you. I have a lot of books bought specifically for the purpose of cutting up for collages—everything from human anatomy to dinosaurs to old-timey pictures of men & women—plus I also clip magazines and junk mail, organizing my clippings in large flat boxes. I usually dream them up in my head before I start cutting out the pieces, but I'm always open to serendipidty, incorporating things that just happen to be there on my work table. Being a collage artist takes a lot of bookshelves, plus a big table, plus space to store all the decorative papers I use for backgrounds. Does that answer your question, or did you have something more specific in mind, like what kind of glue do I use...

12-28-2013, 09:27 PM
thanx for sharing…i'm making ATC's and i've never before done any art projects, so collage is new, even though i'm doing it! sort of. i'm doing doctor who-themed ones atm. cuttings are a great idea for collage. i have only used coloured card so far, and a little glitter, also one print-out from the net. but i am going to grab some books and mags, actually, i have been looking through one of my DH's new mags to cut out a doctor, but luckily for my DH, that particular doctor wasn't in their! so i'll have a look for others.

maybe you and i could arrange a swap. ??

bfn, love

12-28-2013, 09:28 PM
ps i might also look for a can of fixative too. it might help, as you say! xxx

12-29-2013, 01:21 AM
Hello Friends! Today, I slept in very late, but did get exercise in by late afternoon. I have been doing most of my recent walking on the treadmill without holding on, which is major progress for me. I can tell my whole core and body works harder when I am not holding on. My trainer said it is better to go slower and not hold on than faster while holding on, so that has been my goal lately. We have been eating not-so-healthy foods (and too much of it) for at least one meal at my S-I-L's house most days for the past week. I am actually looking forward to getting back to regular, more healthy eating now that the holidays are over.

Trish: So sorry that you are dreading new year's eve/day because you will be alone. Is there anyone who you can at least call and talk to that can keep you company? Do you have any animals? Is there a friend or family member who would spend the day or evening with you? If not, rent a good movie to watch or watch a show on the Hallmark channel to keep you company. Be creative! If nothing else, write in a journal. It will help.

saraphin: Great to hear from you! That is encouraging that you have steadily lost weight on Optifast. Slow and steady is the way to go! Keep up the good work! ;) Sorry to hear that your foot is excruciating! :( Hope it feels better soon!

Fi: At least you recognize that when you push exercise to the back burner, it doesn't get done. That is the first step. I often do the same thing. I aim to get everything else done BEFORE I exercise. I am working on just hopping on that treadmill and getting it done! It is a constant battle for me to keep exercise a priority. I, too, really need to schedule a certain time in my day, but I prefer to do it when the mood strikes, which is often never. So I either do it late in the day or it doesn't get done. I am working on getting consistent with my exercise, and since I started with the trainer, I am doing much better. I hope to keep it up! No, I WILL keep it up!!! :D Do you have a treadmill or other exercise equipment to use when the weather is bad outside? Whenever you can, try to get outside and walk. That is supposedly the best exercise and the fresh air can also do wonders for your mood! You need to find out what works best FOR YOU regarding making it a priority.

Waving hello :wave: to everyone else! Please post when you can! And remember to look for our new thread Ups & Downs Support Group: January 2014 once the New Year begins! ;)

12-30-2013, 12:10 AM
Hello! I didn't exercise today and didn't eat that great. Glad that tomorrow is a NEW DAY and a new chance to get things right! How are the rest of you doing?!?

12-30-2013, 09:31 AM
Hello! i am sorry I haven't been saying hey lately, i have to go to work an hour earlier each day and stay late, and wokring 6 days this week. ugh! i will say hi in more depth sometime. Keep taking one's meds, try to get some fresh air and light everyone :)

Fiona W
12-30-2013, 06:38 PM
I'm reading a great book on...well, it's hard to describe what it's about. I would say that so far it's about how to co-exist peacefully with one's thought patterns—thought patterns about eating, about exercise, about losing weight, about housework, about everything. Instead of being a self-help book, it seems like a book on not needing self-help books anymore. It's Amy Johnson's Being Human ( It's already helping me feel more at peace, and I've only read a few dozen pages. It's the kind of book you want to stop reading frequently, just to absorb what the author is saying. It induces a state of mindfulness, a state of relaxed meditation.

My diet is going well, and I'm still binge-free. I just realized today that while going on the Atkins diet and sticking to it carefully was the cause of my binge behavior—my "storm eating," to use Brooke Castillo's phrase—that's actually not a bad thing. It's like I got all my self-sabotaging eating under one roof—cookie binges—which made it easier to deal with. Once Kathryn Hansen's Brain Over Binge showed me how to get rid of my urges to binge, and I did so, now I feel at peace with the diet. I'm still eating a half-cup of muesli once a day, to keep me from getting depressed, but that seems OK for the time being. I may cut back on that and only eat a quarter of a cup: I'm playing it by ear.

Meanwhile, I have a goal to get my piles of books & papers in the living room tidied up before the new year comes in. Wish me luck!

12-31-2013, 03:40 AM
ha. great reading, friends!. fi, good luck! he he. everyone else, happy new year!. :carrot::carrot::carrot: it's new year's eve here now, 6 o'clock pm. when i was young, i would be getting ready for a big night out but now we just stay home and watch the telly and go to bed, i'm not staying up. no way. i sleep too much to miss out on sleep if you get my meaning. i love my sleep is all. haha lol :hug::hug::hug:
happy new year again to all my online friends and good luck for all there is on offer!.

fi, i like the sound of your collages. i just stsarted to make some 'inchies' so much fun. my first set were doctor who- themed ones of course, but i think i'll do some valentine inchies for my son next to tell him how much i love him. :hug::hug::hug:
even though he gets drunk and blames me for everything that is wrong with his life… :(:(:(
oh well, you get that on the big jobs, so we say! lol :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy:

bfn, happy new year my friends AGAIN :carrot::carrot::carrot:

saraphin xxx

Fiona W
12-31-2013, 10:53 AM
Oh boy! I just weighed myself, and I've lost 6 pounds in the past ten days! I don't see how that is even possible, given that I had chocolate on The Winter Solstice, but my digital scale doesn't lie. I'm so excited!

12-31-2013, 02:35 PM
Well, this will be my last post of the year here. The day started off really well, as I worked out with my trainer and then I did 30 minutes on the treadmill while my daughter worked out! :D :carrot: It feels great to have my workout behind me this early in the day! :) Now, all that is on my agenda is to RELAX and bring in the New Year with my hubby, kids, and a bottle of champagne! :love: :carrot: We are just staying home tonight, but I always enjoy watching the big "ball" fall at midnight on tv. Then, I plan to start our NEW THREAD, Ups & Downs Support Group: January 2014!!! I hope everyone will find us there! ;)

Fi: Wow!!! Congratulations on your 6 pound weight loss!!! :broc: That is fantastic!!! You should be excited about it!!! :D I am very happy for you!!! And you have taken a huge step toward your next mini goal! Good for you!!! ;) Good luck getting your piles of books and papers tidied in your living room! I hope you will also take some time to just breathe, smile, and celebrate yourself as we bring in the new year! :hug:

saraphin: I guess I can already wish YOU a Happy New Year!!! It is probably the start of the next day already for you. Did you make any New Year's resolutions? I am determined to make this the year that I get healthy again! I am already off to a great start, since I've begun working out with a trainer and exercising consistently! :D Now I need to improve my food choices and exercise healthy portion control. It is a constant challenge to pull it all together..... but WE CAN DO IT!!! ;) :carrot: :broc:

Holly: Thanks for popping in to say hello and give us a quick update. Sounds like you are extremely busy with work. Hope YOU will take some time to get some fresh air and light, too, and to just RELAX and BREATHE! ;)

EVERYONE: PLEASE REMEMBER TO LOOK FOR US AT OUR NEW THREAD, UPS & DOWNS SUPPORT GROUP: JANUARY 2014, STARTING TOMORROW, JANUARY 1ST!!! Please take a moment to post to let us know you found us! ;) Have a safe and Happy New Year!!! :)

01-01-2014, 08:54 PM
i'm looking for us! haha sounds funny, doesn't it? no., no n y resolutions here. i'll just ask my DH. nope. none from him either. boring, aren't we? lol :carrot::carrot::carrot:

i am busy thinking about today and my dreadmill. i have to get dressed first ot's only early yet for me. 11.15. sometimes i don't get dressed until lunch time! no reason to, really! lol :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy:

i do my hobbies in my nighty and dressing gown! haha. i'm still recovering from very serious illness i had 2 years ago you see. lots of left over symptoms. brain surgery, 2 dioses, lucky me. i'm left with severe nerve pain, ataxia, heaps of med's to control it all. also i have bad arthritis, bp, hypo-thyroidism, anxiety (who wouldn't?) , i don't remember what else. oh, poor memory! haha. lol. :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy:

i've lost 16 kilo's though, which has helped, i'm sure! :carrot::carrot::carrot:

and i have dicovered some very cool hobbies too!. creative things that amuse me for hours! and i sleep during the day too! :p:p:p

and i have a house-cleaner thanks to my wonderful, hard-working DH. :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy:

love to you all my friends…

i hope this year brings you happiness, bfn, :hug::hug::hug:
saraphin xxx

01-01-2014, 09:41 PM
Hello saraphin! Please look for us at our new thread, Ups & Downs Support Group: January 2014!!! We have moved there for January 2014. We are starting a new thread each new month, so that the thread doesn't get too long. When you find us, please post there and let us know you are with us! Thanks! Happy New Year to you! :celebrate: